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Ardashir
Senior Scribe
USA
544 Posts |
 Posted - 02 Oct 2008 : 23:24:44
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Just wondering if anyone has ever actually used this as a background for a character (or allowed it to be used), and if so, what sort of troubles can it lead too?
I figure that while some of Azoun's get don't know their real parentage, they all find out eventually -- and there are almost certainly a few people in the Cormyrean government who know the truth (the servants who placed them) as well as the people who raised them.
Just who if anyone woukd be interested in getting ther hands on one of Azoun's illegitimate offspring? I can see the Fire Knives (for a proxy revenge on Azoun), various conspiracies among the Cormyrian nobility and Sembian merchants ("See, we've got the real heir right here!"), but who else?
Also, what does anyone think of my idea that there are a few Cormyrian Highknights (special agents of the Crown) who keep an eye on the bastards, to see who they deal with... as well as to deal with them should it become needful?
Any input on this would be helpful, as well as whether or not it's been done in any of the novels yet.
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Nerfed2Hell
Senior Scribe
USA
387 Posts |
Posted - 03 Oct 2008 : 01:38:19
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I think you hit a few nails on the head. Basically, any enemy of the Crown would be interested in getting their hands on anyone who could cause political scandal... there's very little chance of such bastards having a strong claim to the throne, but any challenge to the throne means that time, resources, and attention must be diverted to deal with the annoyance when such attention could probably be better spent elsewhere. So yes, Cormyrian nobles that work discreetly against the crown, Sembians for sure, any number of villainous types.
And yes, I think the bastards that known of are watched by agents of the Crown just for the sake of who might try to manipulate and use them against the Crown. There might be few highknights dedicated this, and maybe a war wizard (to keep Vangey informed), but they probably rely on reports from loyal informants who are closer to the bastards... perhaps servants, neighbors, etc. And such people would probably be unawares of exactly why they are keeping an eye on such and such person for this high knight or that war wizard... but being loyal to the kingdom, they probably dutifully watch and inform without asking questions.
Another, less sinister, idea is that the Harpers would also be all over this kind of information, too. Any shift in the balance of power in Cormyr may be of interest, so they may well have spies and informants watching the bastard children as well. |
Some people are like a slinky... not good for much, but when you push them down the stairs, it makes you smile. |
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5055 Posts |
Posted - 03 Oct 2008 : 02:47:20
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Ed has, many a time. 
Seriously: in his library campaigns, run many years back (programs at the public library where Ed worked, wherein players ran characters in a chartered adventuring company, in 13 weekly sessions), Ed on three occasions created parties of adventurers containing one or more (!) PCs who were illegitimate offspring of Azoun. Two of the females didn't know their parentage, but all of the males knew or guessed - - sometimes because of attacks launched at them or offers made to them privately by nobles having sinister designs upon the Dragon Throne.
Neverending fun, Ed says. And yes, Harpers, War Wizards, AND Highknights watch over all known royal bastards.
There are some Ed hasn't revealed yet, who will surprise many Realms fans when (or, ahem, considering the 4e timeshift, IF) their heritage becomes known.
love,
THO |
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Nerfed2Hell
Senior Scribe
USA
387 Posts |
Posted - 03 Oct 2008 : 02:51:09
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quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
There are some Ed hasn't revealed yet, who will surprise many Realms fans when (or, ahem, considering the 4e timeshift, IF) their heritage becomes known.
Does the whole 4e timeshift thing preclude Ed from giving us more detail about the old Realms, or is he just too busy because of all the 4e stuff going on in addition to everything else he's busy with? |
Some people are like a slinky... not good for much, but when you push them down the stairs, it makes you smile. |
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Ardashir
Senior Scribe
USA
544 Posts |
Posted - 03 Oct 2008 : 16:56:45
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quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
Ed has, many a time.
Seriously: in his library campaigns, run many years back (programs at the public library where Ed worked, wherein players ran characters in a chartered adventuring company, in 13 weekly sessions), Ed on three occasions created parties of adventurers containing one or more (!) PCs who were illegitimate offspring of Azoun. Two of the females didn't know their parentage, but all of the males knew or guessed - - sometimes because of attacks launched at them or offers made to them privately by nobles having sinister designs upon the Dragon Throne.
Neverending fun, Ed says. And yes, Harpers, War Wizards, AND Highknights watch over all known royal bastards.
There are some Ed hasn't revealed yet, who will surprise many Realms fans when (or, ahem, considering the 4e timeshift, IF) their heritage becomes known.
love,
THO
Thank you for your response, noble lady. And let me say, I wish I'd been at that library.
Myself, I was wondering what if any trouble might be roused if it was discovered that a devout Lathanderite cleric was actually one of Azoun's get. Up until that point, he had zero interest in politics (still doesn't have any for that matter), and had mostly occupied himself doing 'good adventurer' things like defeating evil wizards, undead monsters, fiends, etc. He was known as a heroic figure, but not a 'big name'.
I figured troubles could consist of, among other things:
* Ambitious Lathander clerics trying to use him as a figurehead to become Cormyr's state religion, or at least get more influence.
* Worried high clergy of the other faiths investigating his past to see if they can find anything that could be used against him in case of trouble. (Since all he's done has been to sleep around [he's Azoun's boy, all right!] this couldn't amount to much.)
* Other things I've already stated, i.e., Sembians, Cormyrian nobles, and whatever evil conspiracy of the moment is casting eyes on the Forest Kingdom. |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 03 Oct 2008 : 19:27:33
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The B.O.A.!
Once a year, the organization know as the "Bastards of Azoun" holds a convention in Waterdeep (they aren't welcome in Cormyr). They usually wear-out their welcome rather quickly, with their funny little hats and those strange little carts they drive around in.
Last year they invited their 'sister' organization to the festivities - The Daughters of Elminster - and a good time was had by all.  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Jakk
Great Reader
Canada
2165 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2008 : 00:04:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Nerfed2Hell
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
There are some Ed hasn't revealed yet, who will surprise many Realms fans when (or, ahem, considering the 4e timeshift, IF) their heritage becomes known.
Does the whole 4e timeshift thing preclude Ed from giving us more detail about the old Realms, or is he just too busy because of all the 4e stuff going on in addition to everything else he's busy with?
I'm curious about this too... given what we've heard from THO in Ed's own scroll, I suspect that it's just because he's busy. I've stopped asking him questions in his scroll to give him time to catch up. Most of my questions are Cormyr-related anyway, and Garen Thal has been very patient with me as I blunder through what's NDA and what's not NDA. (Thank you Garen!) |
Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.
If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic. |
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Tyranthraxus
Senior Scribe
Netherlands
423 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2008 : 00:52:27
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| This topic gave me an idea. One of the characters in my group was born in Cormyr but given at a young age to Farrish, a priest of Lathander in Freedale (a village about 20 miles east of Shadowdale, discribed in the AD&D starters set), to take care of him. I know it isn't canon but it gave me enough room to tweak it as I saw fit. I'm thinking about making him a basterd son because he knows little of his parents and he has qualities reflecting his "true" heritage, like having a moral code and being a born leader (in my campaign the characters are the lords of Hap though he is the real lord). |
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khorne
Master of Realmslore
Finland
1073 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2008 : 16:28:56
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There are two things about Azoun's children that has always vexed me for some reason. First is the illegitimate vs legitimate thing. I don't like those terms at all! He's their father, whether or not some priest has said some mumbo-jumbo to him and his child's mother in a ceremony, and using different terms for his children depending on which group they fall into makes me snarl.
The second thing is related. Azoun merrily goes around fathering children and then has nothing to do with their upbringing. Oh well, I guess I just can't stand irresponsible parents. |
If I were a ranger, I would pick NDA for my favorite enemy |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 17 Nov 2008 : 18:16:13
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quote:
Originally posted by khorne
There are two things about Azoun's children that has always vexed me for some reason. First is the illegitimate vs legitimate thing. I don't like those terms at all! He's their father, whether or not some priest has said some mumbo-jumbo to him and his child's mother in a ceremony, and using different terms for his children depending on which group they fall into makes me snarl.
To an extent, I agree with you. It's not a child's fault whether or not their parents happened to be married, yet the child is the one called "bastard" or "illegitimate". I'm glad being "illegitimate" doesn't necessarily affect inheritance anymore in the real world (or at least, it doesn't in my state). If a person is born, they are alive, they are human, they have parents, they are legitimate.
quote:
The second thing is related. Azoun merrily goes around fathering children and then has nothing to do with their upbringing. Oh well, I guess I just can't stand irresponsible parents.
Again, I think you make a good point. To be fair though, from what I understand it's not uncommon for the Crown to give the mother a stipend (although I'd agree that that doesn't necessarily make up for growing up not knowing who your "real" father is, or possibly not even having a father). |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 17 Nov 2008 18:39:35 |
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Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3270 Posts |
Posted - 17 Nov 2008 : 18:49:24
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-After reading the end of "The Swords of Dragonfire" now I know why that rascal has or had so many kiddo's running around.  
-I want to call this thread "The Battlin Bastards of Azoun"! 
BRIMSTONE  |
"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
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Brace Cormaeril
Learned Scribe
294 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jul 2010 : 19:08:50
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I'll be submitting a piece for the Candlekeep Compendium which will detail an alliance between Azoun V and an older brother uncle of his... And how each serves the people of Cormyr in ways only a Dragon could. |
The Silver Fire's Blade: A Novella in Nine Parts, Available Soon, in the Adventuring Forum!
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Edited by - Brace Cormaeril on 17 Jul 2010 05:17:52 |
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Zireael
Master of Realmslore
Poland
1190 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2010 : 11:41:23
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quote:
Originally posted by Brace Cormaeril
I'll be submitting a piece for the Candlekeep Compendium which will detail an alliance between Azoun V and an older brother of his... And how each serves the people of Cormyr in ways only a Dragon could.
Wow, can't wait... |
SiNafay Vrinn, the daughter of Lloth, from Ched Nasad!
http://zireael07.wordpress.com/ |
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2010 : 17:36:23
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quote:
Originally posted by Brace Cormaeril
I'll be submitting a piece for the Candlekeep Compendium which will detail an alliance between Azoun V and an older brother of his... And how each serves the people of Cormyr in ways only a Dragon could.
Just a word of caution:
We know without question who Azoun V's parents were (Rowen Cormaeril and Tanalasta Obarskyr), and we know from canon sources--and I'll confirm from discussions with Ed--that there is zero chance that his mother had any other children before (and, obviously, after) Azoun V, this proposed child would of necessity have to be a son of Rowen Cormaeril only, and not of the royal house (or, at the very least, not of Tanalasta).
Still... I'm very much looking forward to it. |
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Brace Cormaeril
Learned Scribe
294 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2010 : 18:45:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Garen Thal
quote:
Originally posted by Brace Cormaeril
I'll be submitting a piece for the Candlekeep Compendium which will detail an alliance between Azoun V and an older brother of his... And how each serves the people of Cormyr in ways only a Dragon could.
Just a word of caution:
We know without question who Azoun V's parents were (Rowen Cormaeril and Tanalasta Obarskyr), and we know from canon sources--and I'll confirm from discussions with Ed--that there is zero chance that his mother had any other children before (and, obviously, after) Azoun V, this proposed child would of necessity have to be a son of Rowen Cormaeril only, and not of the royal house (or, at the very least, not of Tanalasta).
Still... I'm very much looking forward to it.
Geez, I feel dumb. Rather, the bastard of Azoun I'm referring to would be Azoun V's uncle, a get of Azoun... |
The Silver Fire's Blade: A Novella in Nine Parts, Available Soon, in the Adventuring Forum!
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2010 : 21:26:12
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Although a son of Rowan Cormaeril might be even more interesting.
Call him 'Brace'.
If he is older, it could even be a bastard of Rowen's he never knew about. You'd also avoid the whole Ghazneth parentage thing (which, while perhaps even more interesting, would engender some strange questions). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Brace Cormaeril
Learned Scribe
294 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2010 : 21:38:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Although a son of Rowan Cormaeril might be even more interesting.
Call him 'Brace'.
If he is older, it could even be a bastard of Rowen's he never knew about. You'd also avoid the whole Ghazneth parentage thing (which, while perhaps even more interesting, would engender some strange questions).
I don't think that would be interesting at all, and would really be scraping the 'bottom of the barrel' of fan-fic themes.
But if you *really* want to know more about Brace Cormaeril's heritage... Check out "The Silver Fire's Blade", in the Adventuring forum!
Tag-line: Who is "The Silver Fire's Blade"!
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The Silver Fire's Blade: A Novella in Nine Parts, Available Soon, in the Adventuring Forum!
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2010 : 21:49:05
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True, in retrospect, I suppose a bastard of Azoun is FAR more believable then a bastard of Rowen's.
Good for a fan-fic, perhaps, but not for any sort of mainstream FR lore.
You also just gave me an idea for an adventuring company I may try to squeeze-in somewhere. Just a name, maybe... 'twould be fun. 
Edit: And I continue to read - and enjoy - your story Brace. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 16 Jul 2010 21:50:44 |
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Brace Cormaeril
Learned Scribe
294 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2010 : 22:03:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
True, in retrospect, I suppose a bastard of Azoun is FAR more believable then a bastard of Rowen's.
Considering the vast canon regarding Azoun's philandering, the fact that 'Bastards of Azoun' made *numerous* appearances in Ed's library campaigns, and Hasro/WotC's prestige class "Bastard of Azoun"... I agree, a bastard of Azoun would fit in quite nicely with "mainstream lore".
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The Silver Fire's Blade: A Novella in Nine Parts, Available Soon, in the Adventuring Forum!
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Brace Cormaeril
Learned Scribe
294 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2010 : 23:54:53
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quote:
Originally posted by Zireael
quote:
Originally posted by Brace Cormaeril
I'll be submitting a piece for the Candlekeep Compendium which will detail an alliance between Azoun V and an older brother of his... And how each serves the people of Cormyr in ways only a Dragon could.
Wow, can't wait...
Me neither, Zireal! Now if Alaundo would get around to approving the damn thing... |
The Silver Fire's Blade: A Novella in Nine Parts, Available Soon, in the Adventuring Forum!
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5055 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2010 : 23:56:16
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To treat Markustay's suggestion seriously for a moment:
No, let's not have another "Brace Cormaeril" in Realmslore yet. Please.
I'm not talking about the handle used by a scribe here at the Keep, I'm referring to characters in the Realms.
There already IS a "Brace Cormaeril" - - and his deeds (mostly not yet told in print, but in WotC's hands as unpublished lore, that has been referenced recently at least twice by other designers than Ed) make it highly unlikely that the Cormaeril family would be using that given name much for a few generations.
Far more popular Cormaeril male given names are Aldan, Beliard, Dorn, Elend (though that's never been a first name; it's always been a second or third given name), Galard (ditto what I said for Elend), and Rorald.
This comes from Ed's notes. Damian or anyone, would you like to repost this in the "Everything About Cormyr" thread?
love to all,
THO |
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Brace Cormaeril
Learned Scribe
294 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jul 2010 : 00:01:34
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quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
To treat Markustay's suggestion seriously for a moment:
No, let's not have another "Brace Cormaeril" in Realmslore yet. Please.
I'm not talking about the handle used by a scribe here at the Keep, I'm referring to characters in the Realms.
There already IS a "Brace Cormaeril" - - and his deeds (mostly not yet told in print, but in WotC's hands as unpublished lore, that has been referenced recently at least twice by other designers than Ed) make it highly unlikely that the Cormaeril family would be using that given name much for a few generations.
Far more popular Cormaeril male given names are Aldan, Beliard, Dorn, Elend (though that's never been a first name; it's always been a second or third given name), Galard (ditto what I said for Elend), and Rorald.
This comes from Ed's notes. Damian or anyone, would you like to repost this in the "Everything About Cormyr" thread?
love to all,
THO
Is the Brace Cormaeril... in Ed's notes...
totally amazing? |
The Silver Fire's Blade: A Novella in Nine Parts, Available Soon, in the Adventuring Forum!
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5055 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jul 2010 : 00:12:13
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Sorry, can't comment. NDAs are NDAs. I'm just trying to avoid having anyone do a lot of work for the Compendium that's going to be instantly labeled by any Wizards designer (or lawyer) as "non-canon" or "utterly wrong" or some such...so I'm trying to "steer" without giving one word of information more than I should.
However, Brace, feel free to ask Ed in his thread. I'll convey your post to him in the usual manner, and he MIGHT be able (and willing) to say more.
Or not. You'd just have to try it and see . . .
love,
THO |
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Brace Cormaeril
Learned Scribe
294 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jul 2010 : 00:52:41
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I spin a dance surfeit with child-like glee, to know that "Brace Cormaeril" is a 'realmsian' cognomen Ed would choose.
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jul 2010 : 01:09:52
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quote:
Originally posted by Brace Cormaeril
Is the Brace Cormaeril... in Ed's notes...
totally amazing?
LMAO! 
Okay, I found that funny as hell. I actually think I understand (and identify with!) you now.
I literally Laughed-at-loud - Nice one. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Kyrene
Senior Scribe
South Africa
711 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jul 2010 : 08:02:51
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quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
There already IS a "Brace Cormaeril" - - and his deeds (mostly not yet told in print, but in WotC's hands as unpublished lore, that has been referenced recently at least twice by other designers than Ed) make it highly unlikely that the Cormaeril family would be using that given name much for a few generations.
THO,
"mostly not yet told" implies that some of it has. Where may we read what little of "Brace Cormaeril" has been published, if you or Ed know of course? |
Lost for words? Find them in the Glossary of Phrases, Sayings & Words of the Realms
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jul 2010 : 21:12:55
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You know... we hear an awful lot about male bastards of Azoun...
But technically, a female could just as easily be one.
Has anyone ever asked Ed about that?  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Brace Cormaeril
Learned Scribe
294 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jul 2010 : 23:35:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
You know... we hear an awful lot about male bastards of Azoun...
But technically, a female could just as easily be one.
Has anyone ever asked Ed about that?
There is mention of two illegitimate daughters of the Dragon in a post by THO above, but I am not familiar with any other canon reference to female scions of the Forest Kingdom. |
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Dracons
Learned Scribe
USA
299 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2010 : 06:40:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Brace Cormaeril
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
You know... we hear an awful lot about male bastards of Azoun...
But technically, a female could just as easily be one.
Has anyone ever asked Ed about that?
There is mention of two illegitimate daughters of the Dragon in a post by THO above, but I am not familiar with any other canon reference to female scions of the Forest Kingdom.
Tavantra Indimber is a female bastard (bitch...?) of Azoun.
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rl/20061101a |
I love PMs! Please send me a message. Even if its Hi. |
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Dracons
Learned Scribe
USA
299 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2010 : 06:42:01
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| EDIT: She also looks exactly like her father if she pulls her hair back, and is considered a true blood relation of him. |
I love PMs! Please send me a message. Even if its Hi. |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2010 : 07:31:18
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Beard and all? 
Poor girl.  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Advice on the Bastards of Azoun
