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Lord Rad
Great Reader
United Kingdom
2080 Posts |
 Posted - 09 Sep 2002 : 22:05:44
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Right, I need to get a few things straight in my head...
Could anyone please help identify ALL the differences between the 2nd and 3rd edition FR. What did WotC change for the new release?
Now I know that the map of Faerun was trimmed, but I cant see exactly what was altered just by glancing over it.
Also, what about the deities? What changed there?
Rad
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Lord Rad
"What? No, I wasn't reading your module. I was just looking at the pictures"
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Mask
Learned Scribe
104 Posts |
Posted - 10 Sep 2002 : 11:46:05
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Bane lives once more!!!!
Fear the Darklord always!!!! |
Nothing is impossible! |
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ArcticKnight
Learned Scribe
USA
169 Posts |
Posted - 10 Sep 2002 : 17:46:43
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As said above Bane was reborn through Xzim, he took back his Portfolios from Cyric (altho personally this is where i get agitated)
ok i have no problem with bane coming back through some plot, but to just take his powers from Cyric like Cyric just gave em up without a fight, just doesnt sound like the Cyric we know. it should atleast be Novelized, that sounds like a monumental problem that would spark a HUGE war between the 2 gods and thier respective followers.
back on track: other then the maps being altered i dont think there was anything else that was changed...I THINK!
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"The man who does not read has little advantage over the man who cannot read."
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kahonen
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
358 Posts |
Posted - 10 Sep 2002 : 19:31:01
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It depends on whether you're talking about the Realms or the way the Realms are played in the game:
Waukeen has returned from the Abyss.
King Azoun is dead 
Dwarves are (for some strange reason) not in short supply any more - it seems now that they are often born with a twin.
Where before there were books of kits which gave PCs advantages and disadvantages depending on where they come from, they now only get advantages.
There are loads of differences which appear to have been justified by time being moved on a couple of years. I've got the 3rd edition Campaign Setting and my attitude is "Not a bad try but I'll stick with what I know".
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king-tiax
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
327 Posts |
Posted - 10 Sep 2002 : 20:25:11
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| The great dwraven famalies grow large. |
My name is Tiax, I would ask yours but I don't care to become aquainted with the dead.
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Mask
Learned Scribe
104 Posts |
Posted - 11 Sep 2002 : 10:23:56
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| I totally agree with you Arctic Knight. It should be novelized. I'd read it. The plot of Bane being reborn through Xvim raises a question with me. I just realized I never learned what portfolios Xvim had. I mean, he was god of what? |
Nothing is impossible! |
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king-tiax
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
327 Posts |
Posted - 11 Sep 2002 : 19:31:34
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| I like things to be novalised, it gives a better idea of things |
My name is Tiax, I would ask yours but I don't care to become aquainted with the dead.
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Rudolf_Weathermay
Acolyte
Belgium
5 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2002 : 11:30:17
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| There are also whisperings that not only Bane survived the time of troubles, but also Bhaal and Myrtul. I don't know of this is truth. Can someone tell me more about it? |
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Arion Elenim
Senior Scribe
933 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2002 : 15:39:06
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Yeah...things are different round here...
In addition to all that my fellow scribes have said, the Elven Retreat is over, the crystal dragons are all but extinct...but what is even more catastrophic, Shade Enclave (the last of the surviving sects from former Netheril) has returned, floating above the Anauroch. Not surprisingly, the Enclave was lured back to this plane by a sudden mass-congregation of phaerimm (magic-eaters whose own wizardly might is something to contend with and who enjoy enslaving illithids and even beholders...)at the desert. We now know that it was the phaerimm who destroyed Netheril (a floating, inverted-mountain city) those centuries ago.
The Harpers, Silverymoon and others (damned near all of the Sisters and the Chosen of Mystra) are battling the Phaerimm...sort of allied with the Enclave to remove them.
The Archwizards of Netheril, whose strength simply dwarfed that of "modern day" mages like the Symbul, Blackstaff and Elminster, are threatening to return as well....
Oh, speaking of which, Elminster is in Hell.
It might do you some good to pick up the 3rd edition Forgotten Realms Campain Setting tome....it is arguably the BEST gaming/campaign manual in existence...it will catch you up completely... |
My latest Realms-based short story, about a bard, a paladin of Lathander and the letter of the law, Debts Repaid. It takes place before the "shattering" and gives the bard Arion a last gasp before he plunges into the present.http://candlekeep.com/campaign/logs/log-debts.htm |
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king-tiax
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
327 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2002 : 19:50:30
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| I diden't think the Harpers interfeared with things like that, they just chronicled it. |
My name is Tiax, I would ask yours but I don't care to become aquainted with the dead.
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kahonen
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
358 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2002 : 21:45:45
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Harpers are all about maintaining balance. According to "The Code of the Harpers" there are 8 main statements in the Code:
1. Harpers work against wickedness and villainy wherever they find it - but they work ever mindful of the consequences of what they do.
2. All beings should walk free of fear, with the right to live their lives as they wish
3. The rule of law aids peace and fosters freedom, so long as the laws are just and those who enforce them are lenient and understanding"
4. No extreme is good. for freedom to flourish all must be in balance.
5. Whatever it takes a harper will do. Pride never rules the deeds of a true harper"
6. Harpers can spare themselves less freedom that those they work to protect must have - but even a harper must be free
7. Harpers police their own.
8 Without a past, no being can appreciate what they have, and where they may be going.
I think you will agree that of the 8, the battle against the Phaerimm is very well justified by the first 5 of these. |
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king-tiax
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
327 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2002 : 21:56:26
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| Oh right, thanks, I thought they never interfeared, the balance and all that. |
My name is Tiax, I would ask yours but I don't care to become aquainted with the dead.
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 04 Oct 2002 : 18:48:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Rad
Could anyone please help identify ALL the differences between the 2nd and 3rd edition FR. What did WotC change for the new release?
Now I know that the map of Faerun was trimmed, but I cant see exactly what was altered just by glancing over it.
Rad
To get back to the first part of Rad's post. If one is familiar with the Lands of Intrigue and the Vilhon reach, one would notice that a former duchy of Tethyr (and now the sovereign country of Erlkazar) has moved. It used to be due east of Tethyr, behind the Kuldin Peaks mountain range. this mountain range has merged with the Snowflake mountains north of them.
The Omlarandin Mts. that used to be south of the Kuldin's have migrated into the Kuldin's former spot. One can also see this change by the location of the Deepwash. It has migrated northward from its original location on the old maps.
Turmish in the Vilhon Reach has lost a lot of weight. It used to be a much bigger country on the old maps. The changes in the above areas have been made to accomodate the overal changes on the map due to its central location.
One of these other changes is apparent in another corner of the Realms, Mulhorand, Thay, Rashemen. Mulhorand and Thay have moved towards the north on the map. Placing Mulhorand almost directly below Thay. Rashemen has also moved further north and has lost some of its mass.
These are some of the changes that become easily visible when comparing the maps. The Sword Coast, The Heartlands and the Moonsea area, being much better known by the general public, have been left largely alone, and appear much as they used to. |
Edited by - Mumadar Ibn Huzal on 04 Oct 2002 19:00:43 |
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Lord Rad
Great Reader
United Kingdom
2080 Posts |
Posted - 05 Oct 2002 : 10:27:13
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Thanks Mumadar, thats exactly the kind of information im looking for 
Looks like you went through comparing maps with a fine-tooth comb 
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Lord Rad
"What? No, I wasn't reading your module. I was just looking at the pictures"
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 07 Oct 2002 : 15:31:09
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Neah, I just don't want to get lost if I ever find my way to Toril. ;)
To be honest, It just came because my last table-top game was set in eastern Tethyr, on the slopes of the Kuldin Peaks. Suddenly these mountains had changed. That's when I started looking and comparing both maps. There are probably more cuts that I haven't found. The ones mentioned should be more or less the major ones. |
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Matt James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
918 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2009 : 15:31:38
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Rise, long dead thread- so that you may walk freely amongst the halls of Candlekeep once more! *Casts Thread Necromancy Spell*
I love reading old threads, especially when they span a different (real-world) era of the game and setting :) |
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Hoondatha
Great Reader
USA
2449 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2009 : 16:52:11
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Wow. I've heard of thread necromancy, but 7+ years? I think that might be a record...
That bit with the mountains and Erlkazar moving is interesting, since I still use 2e maps, I hadn't noticed. I'll need to take a look when I get back home. |
Doggedly converting 3e back to what D&D should be...
Sigh... And now 4e as well. |
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Ardashir
Senior Scribe
USA
544 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2009 : 16:55:45
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quote:
Originally posted by kahonen
Dwarves are (for some strange reason) not in short supply any more -
"Dwarves in short supply"?
UUuuuuUUGH! Rotten pun!  |
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Alisttair
Great Reader
Canada
3054 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2009 : 17:26:36
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| Wow....so should we start to compare the differences between the change from 2E to 3E and 3E to 4E??? Might be interesting. |
Karsite Arcanar (Most Holy Servant of Karsus)
Anauria - Survivor State of Netheril as penned by me:
http://www.dmsguild.com/m/product/172023 |
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Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3287 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2009 : 17:30:45
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This thread had a True Resurrection put on it. |
"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36798 Posts |
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Matt James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
918 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2009 : 17:52:47
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*rings his hands as his maniacal plan to show everyone the value of Candlekeep and why edition-wars should not destroy us*
muhahahahaha |
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Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3287 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2009 : 17:55:05
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You are soooo Evil.
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"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2009 : 18:09:05
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| The interesting thing is how few comments were made the first time around. And none of them are negative to the changes. A clear proof that I had not grumbled my way into the 'keep. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36798 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2009 : 18:28:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
The interesting thing is how few comments were made the first time around. And none of them are negative to the changes. A clear proof that I had not grumbled my way into the 'keep.
I know there were complaints, but I never saw nearly as many as I've seen with the more recent change.
Somewhere I've seen a list of all the 2E-3E changes, and it's pretty extensive. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
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Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3287 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2009 : 18:33:53
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I think the shock of Dragon and Dungeon getting cancelled helped. Plus Wizards changing their Marketing to 3 and we are done helped alot. I did come to expect a Realms book every quarter.
I do believe that Wizards should have started producing Realms DDI articles sooner than May, say in December or January. And the changes are pretty intense this time around.
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"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2009 : 20:19:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
The interesting thing is how few comments were made the first time around. And none of them are negative to the changes. A clear proof that I had not grumbled my way into the 'keep.
Yes, there's quite a contrast between the two edition changes.
As a devotee of Kiaransalee, I never object to something being dug up and reanimated - unless it's something that has wronged me. |
Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31726 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2009 : 00:33:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
This thread predates my involvement here!
Strangely, I think this was one of the first scrolls I read here at Candlekeep, after becoming a regular visitor. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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coach
Senior Scribe
USA
479 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2009 : 03:55:20
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LOL, at the half of one page discussion on the changes from 2e to 3e
from 3e to 4e was dozens of pages |
Bloodstone Lands Sage |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2009 : 08:22:05
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quote:
Originally posted by coach
LOL, at the half of one page discussion on the changes from 2e to 3e
from 3e to 4e was dozens of pages
Well, it might just be that some of the irritation had settled by this time. When was the 3ed. Campaign setting published again? |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31726 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2009 : 08:31:13
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
quote:
Originally posted by coach
LOL, at the half of one page discussion on the changes from 2e to 3e
from 3e to 4e was dozens of pages
Well, it might just be that some of the irritation had settled by this time. When was the 3ed. Campaign setting published again?
In 2001. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Differences between 2nd and 3rd edition FR
