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scererar
Master of Realmslore
USA
1618 Posts |
 Posted - 02 Jun 2006 : 02:28:48
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does anyone know what the release dates are... at least in the states  |
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Kajehase
Great Reader
Sweden
2104 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jun 2006 : 04:59:48
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June 13 last time I checked it on Amazon.
But according to bokus.se (who only deliver in Sweden) I could order it now - and get it within 5-8 days. Judging by what happened when I ordered Power of Faerűn, I'm sceptical, though. |
There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2006 : 22:16:05
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| I wonder when where finally going to see some more MoM stuff, the WOTC site is flooded with Fiendish Codex 1 material...... |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Kajehase
Great Reader
Sweden
2104 Posts |
Posted - 07 Jun 2006 : 23:55:24
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| How about now? |
There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett |
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Swordsage
Learned Scribe
149 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 01:27:59
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This product looks okay - nothing stellar in the FR lore stakes, but solid. I'll wait to see how the whole thing pans out.
The Swordsage |
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scererar
Master of Realmslore
USA
1618 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 03:21:11
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I think this sourcebook will be a very important piece of realmslore, with regards to updates and current events in this region. I do believe a new source book covering this region has been long overdue and much anticipated by realms fans in general.
I still feel like the person in those commercials, waiting outside the store waving my hands, saying open, open, open. I for one will be one of the first to pick this tome up.  |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 05:54:23
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| There was a couple copies listed on eBay yesterday morn... Mayhaps we'll see this tome at our FLGS within the next few days... |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Bragi
Seeker
USA
90 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 06:41:55
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| I sincerely hope that there is some information relating to Phlan in this book. I've been anticipating it for the last 5 or 6 months when I started running the 1e Ruins of Adventure campaign set in Phlan. My group only has the sorcerer's island and the keep left in the adventure. I want to branch up more to the north and run some forays into the Dragonspire mountain area. It would be great if there was a quest relating to the pool of radiance. |
In Pursuit of Better Worlds,
Bragi of Erin |
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Skeptic
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1273 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 06:46:39
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| Sorry nothing on Phlan (I don't remember which designer told it). |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 08:05:18
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| I am still a bit unsure about this one. There seems to be quite a bit of lore, but I wonder how much of it I already have in older products. As I don't use 3rd ed. rules i wonder how much of this book will appeal to me. Guess i will have to wait and see how other scribes react. |
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Eremite
Learned Scribe
Singapore
182 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 12:27:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Bragi
I sincerely hope that there is some information relating to Phlan in this book. (snip)
The table of contents (which is available for download from the WotC website) confirms that Phlan isn't covered. |
Best
E |
Edited by - Eremite on 08 Jun 2006 12:29:37 |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 13:09:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Eremite
quote:
Originally posted by Bragi
I sincerely hope that there is some information relating to Phlan in this book. (snip)
The table of contents (which is available for download from the WotC website) confirms that Phlan isn't covered.
and Phlan's no show in MoM is a big disappointment |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 17:08:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
and Phlan's no show in MoM is a big disappointment
For some. For others, it's a good thing. I fall into the latter category. As I said before, that's one part of the Realms that is forever ruined for me. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Skeptic
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1273 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 17:12:04
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quote:
For some. For others, it's a good thing. I fall into the latter category. As I said before, that's one part of the Realms that is forever ruined for me.
Why forever ruined ?
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 17:12:05
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I just spoke to my FLGS. They expect this book (and that Fiendish one) to be in on Tuesday.  |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 17:13:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Skeptic
quote:
For some. For others, it's a good thing. I fall into the latter category. As I said before, that's one part of the Realms that is forever ruined for me.
Why forever ruined ?
The two Pools of novels I read. They left me hating Phlan. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Skeptic
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1273 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 22:17:22
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
[quote]Originally posted by Skeptic
The two Pools of novels I read. They left me hating Phlan.
Well.. the last one is the worst one
It was Shal's wishes or Bane imprisoning the city?
In my opinion, those novels are in the same league then the Avatar trilogy (Shadowdale, Tantras, Waterdeep) trilogy. They are one on the first FR books I read and at that time I liked them, of course If I was reading them today it would be a completly different thing.
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2006 : 08:00:17
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I would say that the only realms product I would even compare with the first Pool of novel is that horrible attempt at comedy with Volo traveling around the realms. Thank God I cant even remember the title.
I can't help but think that they threw away a golden opportunity to make right some of the wrongs done by the novels and present Phlan in a better light.
That being said, I have noticed that the Pools of books do have their defenders, so tastes vary and a reworking of the area would probably disappoint as many as it satisfied.
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2006 : 09:58:41
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| Happens to like the Pools of novels and that's harsh to compare them to Once Around the Realms. :) Okay, well I don't like the forth one but I reread the original trilogy all the time. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2006 : 10:28:37
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As I said, tastes differ, but there is something about this series that just rubs me the wrong way. Then again, I have among my favorites many of the books that are not so well liked, like The Night Parade and Soldiers of Ice.
In all fairness, actually I only red the first of the series, but even the outline of the rest have been enough to keep me away. That being said, although I see your point when it comes to Once Around the Realms, which I agree is much worse than the Pool of Radiance, these two are still the only two FR books I have read that I am trying to forget.
That still doesnt make it anything but my personal opinion and each reader will have his or hers own taste to go by and if you like a book, it does not matter much what I think. |
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msatran
Learned Scribe
USA
210 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2006 : 22:09:53
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Well, my concern is that, after viewing the excerpts on the wizards site, that this book is too DM friendly for it's own good. You all know my opinion about what should and shouldn't be in a book by now, lord knows, I've been a cranky jerk about it enough, but from a pure marketing perspective, I would not have designed the book with nearly so much DM information in the form of statblocks and maps.
Really, guys. We can MAKE that stuff. Map of the Citadel of the Raven? Bonus points. Populating the Citadel sans Semmemmon and Ashemmi? Leave that to the DM.
I would much rather have things like "Malthiir's Master Plan," Red Plume Tactics, Where Manshoon keeps his magic item caches and a general, not a specific idea of what's guarding them, etc. I'm concerned that this book will be way too statblocky after seeing the excerpts.
I mean, really, guys, we can build 13th level Red Wizards on our own, it's not THAT hard.
On the bright side, this does give the book a good pull in for people who DON'T use the Realms but might use some of the maps and encounters, which was probably why Wizards really designed the book this way.
Is the Beholder Lair useful to any DM who needs a good encounter? Probably, all you really need is 3.5 stats for the non-monster manual creature and you're good to go.
On the minus side, if you aren't doing that thinking yourself, are you really learning how to play D+D?
(I'm trying really hard not to give out any spoilers this time)
And I guess, this is really my problem with the game. I really, really feel that the old editions made players smarter, because being careful was not reduced to a mathematical exercise.
In the old edition, if you weren't very specific and careful when you went around the corner, you died to the trap that was there, or took a great deal of damage. The covered pit, the great slayer of the stupid, is now, at high levels, an easy reflex save.
I realize that they're trying to make D+D much more like Final Fantasy and other Anime styled video game products, but somehow, I think this has gone a little too far. Virtually every trap I design now rolls to hit the PC, because it's still a roll vs. AC and not a far too easily boosted saving throw.
So, will Secrets of the Moonsea be good? The answer, I hope, will be yes. But after seeing the previews, will it be as good as Power of Faerun? The answer is likely to be a resounding no. |
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Patrakis
Learned Scribe
Canada
256 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2006 : 02:01:29
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Hi all,
I've been looking at the book for the last hour or so while installing CC3 from Profantasy. I must say it falls right in the kind of book i wanted to get for this region.
You get four cities with new maps for each one, Melvaunt, Hillsfar, Mulmaster and Zenthil Keep. But you've all seen this on the preview on WotC site.
You get a quick overview of each cities, a detailed description of many important NPC for each city, some rumor tables, the laws, the kind of governement, etc. But the book is mainly about locations and encounters or mini quests in or around these locations. The book is full of maps for each on of them. Some guild houses, some churches, some inns, mansions, wizards towers, lairs. You name it. All the short adventures take place in and around the city.
For anyone who plays D&D online, i couldn't help but feel like it was design as in the computer game. In DDO, you get around city sections, talk to npcs and they offer you quests around the city. Most quests take place in buildings around the city. The book feels the same way.
I haven't got around to reading it so far but it feels very new as far as FR product is concern and i must say, it's been a long time since i felt something new coming out for my favorite setting.
All in all, i am very happy with my purchase.
Take care.
Pat |
Dancing is like standing still, but faster.
My site: http://www.patoumonde.com |
Edited by - Patrakis on 10 Jun 2006 02:25:49 |
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Eremite
Learned Scribe
Singapore
182 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2006 : 02:18:15
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quote:
Originally posted by msatran
(snip) I would not have designed the book with nearly so much DM information in the form of statblocks and maps.(snip)
Plus WotC is notoriously poor at producing accurate stat blocks. If I'm going to pay for stat blocks I would like them to be correct. Sorry, not correct, perfect. That said, I probably wouldn't use the stat blocks anyway as I prefer using my own (I have my own format and a preferred power level).
quote:
Originally posted by msatran On the bright side, this does give the book a good pull in for people who DON'T use the Realms but might use some of the maps and encounters, which was probably why Wizards really designed the book this way.
I think your analysis is right on the money. The best way to boost FR sales is for the product to appeal to non-FR DMs. Sad that may be but economics trumps art!
I'm really looking forward to the product, stat blocks and all. |
Best
E |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2006 : 03:19:59
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What they fail to release is that the more they pander to more Non FR playing home brewers the more likely the FR is going to is core market.
I bought City of Splendors, Im not interested in Complete Generic City by Sea
This is just another reason why I hate Home Brewers |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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msatran
Learned Scribe
USA
210 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2006 : 03:59:30
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The problem with your argument is that those of us who love the Realms will buy the book regardless of how good or how crappy it is. It could be 144 pages of pictures of Ed Greenwood in a Hula skirt with a one page statement at the end that says
"Ha. Ha. Ha. Everyone! Elminster is secretly an advanced Nalfeshnee!"
And most of us would pay the money JUST TO SEE IT. (Furthermore, this really is a case where NO ONE would be willing to be the only dupe in town.)
Hasbro, and I stress that this is most likely Hasbro, and not Mr. Greenwood, is trying to find a way to design the books that brings the most new people over to the Realms.
But...truth be told...the most effective way to bring new people into the Forgotten Realms is to make them players in your game. Until they see the richness of the setting, they do not care. At all.
More and more, D+D is a beer and pretzels exercise. But that's NOT how it is for most of us here. We're passionate about the Realms and that's why we're here. Heck, Some of us are so passionate about the realms that we're willing to get warnings just to express our opinion, myself included.
And that's why I use this world. Because people care about it. The love is there, in a way that the love isn't there with Greyhawk or Eberron. And sometimes, those of us who are passionate about it will say "That's BS, or That Can't Happen, my players are ten times smarter than this, no NPC would POSSIBLY do something so stupid..."
But this is the problem of too many cooks. Quite frankly, I think Mr. Greenwood should break with Wizards and just publish the d20 stuff on his own. I think publishing the sourcebooks the way they were meant to be published would be more productive for those of us who love the game.
Plus, since I run or have run a total of 15-20 groups in the same Forgotten Realms on and off, interacting with each other over the past 19 years, I have put in WAY too much effort to switch.
I miss the days when the Realms walked in BEAUTY. Now it walks in four page statblocks. |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2006 : 05:17:42
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quote:
Originally posted by msatran
Quite frankly, I think Mr. Greenwood should break with Wizards and just publish the d20 stuff on his own. I think publishing the sourcebooks the way they were meant to be published would be more productive for those of us who love the game.
Castlemorn, if it ever comes out. :)
However, if you meant FR sourcebooks, well he can't since he sold the world to tsr/wotc. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2006 : 05:26:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
Castlemorn, if it ever comes out. :)
Which reminds me... I've got to reply to THO's email.
I'm hoping this CASTLEMORN preview rumor is more than just random web chatter...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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msatran
Learned Scribe
USA
210 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2006 : 05:58:46
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| And Kuje, he sold the rights. If my memory serves, he can easily buy them back for the exact same price he got, and I'm pretty sure he has way more dinero than he did when he made the sale. Come on, this is a man whose appearance at a gaming convention probably costs the convention ten grand. It's like having the President show up for a two hour speech. Public appearances for major game designers like Mr. Greenwood cost conventions big bucks sometimes. |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2006 : 06:14:39
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quote:
Originally posted by msatran
And Kuje, he sold the rights. If my memory serves, he can easily buy them back for the exact same price he got, and I'm pretty sure he has way more dinero than he did when he made the sale. Come on, this is a man whose appearance at a gaming convention probably costs the convention ten grand. It's like having the President show up for a two hour speech. Public appearances for major game designers like Mr. Greenwood cost conventions big bucks sometimes.
I disagree, Ed has said, on more then one occasion, that he really doesn't make that much off of doing RPG stuff, which is why he also works at the library.
Shrug. Even so, he doesn't own the world any more and so he can't publish sourcebooks for FR without WOTC. And I know of a few people who tried to buy Planescape, or other worlds, from WOTC and they declined because of the price WOTC wanted. Imagine what the price would be for FR since FR is still popular and one of WOTC's money makers.
And really, this arguement doesn't belong in this thread. I'm even sorry that I commented on it the first time. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
Edited by - Kuje on 10 Jun 2006 06:50:11 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2006 : 20:17:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
And really, this arguement doesn't belong in this thread. I'm even sorry that I commented on it the first time.
I concur. Let's get it back on topic, and take that discussion to PM. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Mysteries of Moonsea?!?
