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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
 Posted - 18 Aug 2010 : 03:15:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
That'd be an angle to allow one to work in some of the nifty psionic grafts from Drak Sun material... Just make them magical, instead, and you've got something really freaky for the players to encounter.
That, or the living symbiont grafts from the EBERRON setting, I think, would be fascinatingly freaky for such a campaign concept. |
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Edited by - The Sage on 18 Aug 2010 03:16:17 |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 18 Aug 2010 : 03:23:22
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Amraz one arm
How about Imaskari descendents - returned from space after spending 3 millenia there. Since they where artificers, it not a long jump too; incoperating once life essence into machines and the like.
Ah, yes. I can see it now. These Imaskari descendants return to Toril, but are now symbiotic creatures, sharing their existence with strange parasitic organisms. Modelling themselves as the gods of the ancient Egyptian pantheon on Earth, they are worshipped by vast slaves armies set to conquer worlds throughout the multiverse in their gods' names. 
Haven't I seen this idea somewhere before?
Hey, just be glad I didn't mention my idea about a four-person adventuring company secretly serving the Harpers out of a hidden base beneath Mount Waterdeep and charged with countering the spread of these "false gods." They travel to worlds beyond via a specialised portal construct, which they originally believed to have been of Imaskari design, but was later proven to have been manufactured by strange celestial beings of pure energy. It's not all bad, however. The adventuring company has strong allies in their fight, like a derivative race of the Oortlings for example, who themselves once masqueraded as the various gods of the Asgardian pantheon.  |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 18 Aug 2010 03:25:03 |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 18 Aug 2010 : 08:52:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
There's a Mars/Barsoom in Oerth's solar system -- Martians (Red, Black, Yellow and White) have been part of D&D since the original boxed set . . .
I cant remember having seen that (I don't own the earliest D&D editions though) do you know where they are mentioned? |
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Kno
Senior Scribe
452 Posts |
Posted - 11 Oct 2010 : 20:24:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
There's a Mars/Barsoom in Oerth's solar system -- Martians (Red, Black, Yellow and White) have been part of D&D since the original boxed set . . .
I cant remember having seen that (I don't own the earliest D&D editions though) do you know where they are mentioned?
http://www.trollandtoad.com/p135372.html |
z455t |
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EltonJ
Learned Scribe
USA
101 Posts |
Posted - 16 Oct 2010 : 14:40:55
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Originally posted by Kno
How would you make sort of a Martian invasion or War of the Worlds scenario on Toril. Are there any D&D creatures that would work and did any kind of alien appearance happen in the planet's history. I've seen the githyanki scenario from Dragon Magazine, they don't appear suitable.
I have read a thread where the Dragon Empire (ALA DragonStar) conquers Toril.
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 16 Oct 2010 : 14:53:30
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
There's a Mars/Barsoom in Oerth's solar system -- Martians (Red, Black, Yellow and White) have been part of D&D since the original boxed set . . .
I cant remember having seen that (I don't own the earliest D&D editions though) do you know where they are mentioned?
Barsoomian creatures feature on the wandering monster tables in The Underworld & Wilderness Adventures; Erac's Cousin's Martian sojourn is described in Dragon #319; there's a reference in Castle Zagyg: The Upper Works; and I think Gary also commented on this online.
Marriors of Mars hath ever 'scaped my clutch. |
Edited by - Faraer on 16 Oct 2010 14:55:33 |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2010 : 13:13:26
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Thanks. Were those only the names or was there ever any game information given about them?
Come to think of it, the Osquib is pretty close to the Martian Rat. |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2010 : 15:58:19
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Very little I can add here, aside from the fact I played in Expedition to the Barrier Peaks with 2 different DMs. I have never run it myself - not my style - but I greatly enjoyed playing in it.
I use a LOT of The Goa'uld stuff for my version of Imaskari, right down to them finding Blackmoor (similar to SG:A) and building an enclave on Oerth (thus creating the Suel empire). I DON'T do the 'pretending to be gods' thing though - I spin that differently.
The way I worked it, the original (AFAWK) worshipers of Aoskar (who was called something unpronounceable back then) were Batrachi, who built a planet-wide series of gate-Temples (which I alluded to in my CKC article). After the destruction of the Batrachi, the Gnollish Empire of Urgnarash spread-out from the Shaar region and discovered the Batrachi ruins in the Raurin Basin. After the fall of Urgnarash (similar to the fall of Rome - fell to in-fighting, decadence, and barbarian invasions), a single survivor-state emerged in the Raurin - the Hataakan civilization. These 'enlightend' Gnolls re-discovered the magic of the Batrachi Temple-Gates and used them, colonizing several worlds of their own (including Mystra).
In their planer explorations they discovered the Pharonic Pantheon, and styled themselves after them (this is where the egyptian-like material from Stargate gets worked-in). It was at this time that they switched from worshiping their original god Gorrelik. Eventually That empire fell as well, mostly do to decadence, artificially wrought (for the most part) by a growing cult of Demogorgon. The 'best & brightest' fled to other planes, and the last vestiges of these once-proud people were chased from the Raurin by Mujhari migrating up from the Golden waters region and the Utter East. They had a brief come-back, when demogorgon allowed Rakshasa to breed with 'his people' in order to create the Flinds, but it was not enough to turn the tide and stem the human expansion.
Then the followers of Ima - a warrior-priest of the Mujhari - discovered a ruined Batrachi-turned-Gnoll temple in the Raurin, after receiving 'visions from god'. This lead to the first kingdom of Imascar, which collapsed (and reformed) after a cataclysmic event that caused the desert to swallow-up their temple-city (it wasn't really destroyed - read Rip Van Wormer's most-excellent Imaskar theory regarding Sigil). This event caused the Imaskari to turn their backs on 'The Gods'.
The second kingdom reformed, this time concentrating on the Elemental magics of their Muhjari ancestors. The arrival of the Shou heralded a new age for the Imaskari, and the Shou added their vast knowledge of Alchemy to the Imaskari magical arsenal. The combination of magical traditions then lead to the era of the Artificer, who created insanely powerful, self-aware constructs (which required unsavory rituals to bind spirits within the devices). It was during this period that the abuse of slaves and conquered peoples became much worse, due to the Imaskari's irreverence for human (or other) life, to the point where they managed to anger many outer-planer entities.
The rest of the story we know. This is why I wouldn't really do a 'Martians' style invasion of Toril - so much more can be accomplished with Gates, and that better-fits FR's theme. In my view, Toril hasn't been 'the victim' of massive interloping, so much as it has become a sort-of planer-crossroads, and many, MANY worlds were both influenced by Faerun, and vice-versa.
And on many of those worlds, the lands of Toril have merely become Forgotten Realms.  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 19 Oct 2010 16:26:49 |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2010 : 19:35:56
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
Thanks. Were those only the names or was there ever any game information given about them?
Just the names -- presumably those wanting more would go to the Burroughs books or Warriors of Mars. 'Space should be passable because it is filled with breathable air . . . Some areas of land could be gates into other worlds, dimensions, times, or whatever . . . Mars is given in these rules, but some other fantastic world or setting could be equally as possible.' More on Oerth's Mars in Dragon #319.
Robilar tried and failed to get to the moon (Dragon #301), and one of the Old School Renaissance modules followed up D&D moon ideas.
You know Oerth is hollow, too? |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2010 : 20:14:48
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The Barsoom Material would shoe-horn nicely with Athas/Darksun. Throw in a little Dune and you got yourself a pretty cool setting (not that Athas wasn't cool by itself - it just wasn't my cup of tea).
I prefer an 'Endless Wastes' region on a more normal world, myself. Not the Steppes of FR, but a true wasteland (like a 'Forbidden Zone' from Planet of the Apes).
EDIT: Much more on-topic then the last: I have always thought of Laroch as having the job of 'Watcher' against an Invasion (planer or spatial). I don't know where I got that idea, but it goes way back to when I first became interested in the Realms. I know he has some great task that puts him above 'the law', and I always imagined it to be something truly epic.
In my mind, I even wrote a short story about such an invasion, with good guys working alongside the bad (imagine Szass Tam and the Simbul back-to-back fighting massive waves of warriors wearing arcanotech armor dropping from the sky (Starship Troopers style). I know, very comic-bookish, buy cool none the less.
We could have some truly moving moments, with certain irredeemable villains sacrificing themselves to save heroes, and vice-versa. Now that would be an epically kewl reboot in my mind.
The war is won... but at what cost?
"Enter the world of the Shattered Realms" --- available summer 2012 |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 19 Oct 2010 20:26:42 |
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Ionik Knight
Learned Scribe
USA
222 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2010 : 20:46:07
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| Where do I sign up for that campaign, Markustay? |
Fools to right of them,
Jesters to left of them,
Clowns in front of them
Pun'd and parody'd. |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 21 Oct 2010 : 11:32:53
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quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
Thanks. Were those only the names or was there ever any game information given about them?
Just the names -- presumably those wanting more would go to the Burroughs books or Warriors of Mars. 'Space should be passable because it is filled with breathable air . . . Some areas of land could be gates into other worlds, dimensions, times, or whatever . . . Mars is given in these rules, but some other fantastic world or setting could be equally as possible.' More on Oerth's Mars in Dragon #319.
Robilar tried and failed to get to the moon (Dragon #301), and one of the Old School Renaissance modules followed up D&D moon ideas.
You know Oerth is hollow, too?
Those Dragon magazines are after my days. How interesting are they if one has no interest in the 3ed. system?
And it has always surprised me a bit that there was never a roleplaying system that simulated the whole Sword and Planet genre, especially in the early days of gaming when Burroughs and such were still commonly read. The only things I can think of is the Krizhna supplement for GURPS and maybe Space 1889.
I should probably ask while we are on the subject. Does anyone here have any experience with the Space 1889 system and now if its any good? |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2010 : 07:05:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
Or use Giff. The hippo look would be just strange enough to make the PC's start going WTF?!
'Twas certainly Teldin Moore's initial reaction upon meeting Gomja the giff in Beyond the Moons, the first book of the SPELLJAMMER line's "Cloakmaster Cycle." |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2010 : 07:26:38
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| I've used them myself in an inter-world weapon smuggling ring for a campaign I once ran. They were selling gnomish "gunns" (more high-tech arquebuses) to other lands and worlds, with the help of Arcanes. (The Arcanes handled the travel, and the Giffs were the dealers.) One of the best lines I ever had in a game was my hubby's orc-hating dwarf (he thought orcs were behind everything bad) saying "Orcs don't come in blue!" when the smugglers were being described by an NPC..... |
The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.
"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491
"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs
Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469
My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188
Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 31 Oct 2010 : 23:22:03
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Jorkens: We're talking, on and off, about Dragon #287320, with the single-page Gygax/Kuntz articles that contain much insight into the Greyhawk Campaign and early D&D not found elsewhere. Realmswise they include the 'Elminster's Guide to the Realms' series, one of my favourites, which describes locations across Faerūn with fine 2-page illustrations by David Day (and would make a terrific book, one of the few RPG books that would really gain from colour printing). It comes just before the magazine's worst-ever period for covering settings other than the World of Greyhawk. Otherwise, lots of 3E-rules-heavy material, certainly some other good pieces in those issues, which I can't evaluate for you, but for me, so-called 'generic' articles (i.e. not specific to named settings) are at the great disadvantage that, apart from rules adaptations of things (which I don't see as content), they stand by each author's grasp and treatment of the more general subject they deal with and thus compete with everything else ever written on the subject. Apart from DMing advice, etc., they're either so vague as to be useless or so specific they're effectively for a particular setting, just one the author doesn't acknowledge and we know nothing else about. Also, for me, those magazines take up lots of shelf space that I won't have until I get that mansion.
Gary planned to publish a collection of the 'Up on a Soapbox' pieces, whose rights are now owned by Gygax Games (or some also by Rob, I can't remember), which has no evident plans to publish anything.
I never played Space 1999, but I think there's some planetary romance stuff in the Old School Renaissance. Sad that we never got to read a collaboration between Edgar Rice Burroughs and William Burroughs. :( |
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Sill Alias
Senior Scribe
Kazakhstan
588 Posts |
Posted - 01 Nov 2010 : 03:28:22
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| How about using shapeshifters to make something like scrull invasion? They move in covertly, secretly grabbing and placing their agents in place of the most powerful people of the Realms. Maybe dopelgangers? |
You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias
"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 01 Nov 2010 : 03:42:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Sill Alias
How about using shapeshifters to make something like scrull invasion? They move in covertly, secretly grabbing and placing their agents in place of the most powerful people of the Realms. Maybe dopelgangers?
Heh. I've been thinking about a Skrull-instigated Secret Invasion-styled scenario for the Galactic Concord in my current STAR*DRIVE campaign. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 01 Nov 2010 : 05:17:11
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But remember, the Skrulls aren't always the 'bad guys' - like any other decent villain, their 'babness' is situation-appropriate (only badly conceived 2-dimensional villains don't have the depth to have a line they won't even cross).
The Skrulls are responsible for the creation of the Dire Wraiths, and will work with the law of any world when pursuing their query. I have toyed with the idea of using that as a plot-device; having some shape-shifter reptilians (King Kull-style Lizardmen) and dopplegangers, with Doplegangers as the even more evil variant. That was back when I ran GH though, and never did anything with it.
If I were to run with it in FR or my homebrew, I'd make the dopplegangers a type of shifter that was tainted with 'Morphic Blood' (the blood of my yet-unamed Aberrational group, which behave somewhat like Dune's Tleilaxu). The shifters themselves will most-likely be a tainted variant of the Elves (who are VERY similar to Lythari). Ergo, all three forms of shape-changers derive from a common ancestor (the type simply depends on the percentage of morphic blood the being has).
So in that setting, the Shifters would take the place of the skrulls - untrusted themselves, but they would be the only ones who could 'sniff out' (literally) the Dopplegangers 'hiding amongst us'. Sort of a They Live type of invasion-scenario (which was a craptastic movie, but the premise was pretty cool).
I've also enjoyed imagining a Kromagg (Sliders) dimensional invasion. In that story-line, the Kromaggs would have been a badly mistreated group of subhumans from an alternate prime world. Their 'handlers' would have one day just left (sort of like Stargate's Goa'uld), who of course turn out to be the Imaskari (who were called home when the final war broke out). Eventually the semi-primitive kromaggs learn how to use the imaskari technology and use the ancient portal system to attack Toril... by the hundreds of thousands. 
Payback's a bi.....
I have never run a war-time RPG game, but it sounds like it could be fun - very dark and gritty. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Kno
Senior Scribe
452 Posts |
Posted - 06 Apr 2011 : 19:00:55
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| I'm thinking now to make gods of Toril into aliens with highly advanced technology, in the style of Pliocene-exile. |
z455t |
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Martians
