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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3567 Posts |
 Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 00:09:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Steven Schend
quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
I think the time is past due that we at the 'keep start on Forgotten Realms Fe (Fan edition)
Can I be in charge of the Kyriani Agrivar slash fiction board?  
Steven
who had to ask before Wooly beat him to it...
PS: No, I don't really want to do that; frankly, what's being done around here already (the Compendiums et al) are more than solid enough material to count as its own FE...
If it is up to me, you can head up the entire Fan Edition! You would of course need a Nom de Plum to avoid trouble. Hmmm....how about Phil Athlans...Hrast it's already taken....I'm sure we will think of something
Fred of the Blue Wood?? Sounds kinda catchy. |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Mkhaiwati
Learned Scribe
USA
252 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 00:25:45
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From Enworld here http://www.enworld.org/ (some mod can prettify it for me, and maybe PM me on how to do it, too.) It is a recap of what is from Races & Classes.
"The paragon path and epic destiny thing - PrC's are gone completely. You pick up your paragon path at 11th level, and your epic destiny at 21st level. You get those abilities as you level up in addition to your main class stuff, not instead of. Some look like old PrCs, and weapon master, prince of knaves and cavalier mentioned. There are currently 12 PPs and "fewer" EDs. The EDs give big benefits and are things like being the right hand man to a god, undying warrior or calling dragons with a wave of your hand. "
So, Chosen are out, but are replaced by epic level pcs waving hands for flights of dragons? uhhh...
Another comment made a month or so ago about level advancement is that it takes the same encounters in 4e for a character to go from 1st to 30th level as for a character in 3.5 to go from 1st to 20th. No munchkinism here at all.
The more I see of the concepts for 4e, the more I dislike it. This has nothing to do with what happened to FR, but just how the game feels to me. I don't like that style of gaming. |
"Behold the work of the old... let your heritage not be lost but bequeath it as a memory, treasure and blessing... Gather the lost and the hidden and preserve it for thy children."
"not nale. not-nale. thog help nail not-nale, not nale. and thog knot not-nale while nale nail not-nale. nale, not not-nale, now nail not-nale by leaving not-nale, not nale, in jail." OotS #367 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36803 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 01:02:40
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Even though I'm not really familiar with the 3E rules, what I did know of them I liked. I thought it was a very good system, and I didn't see much need to improve it.
These changes I'm hearing about for 4E... I can't say that a single one of them has appealed to me. It's not a case of "That rule sux!"; it seems to me that they're changing stuff just to change it.
How long into 4E do you think it will be before the endless flood of Paragon Paths and Epic Destinies gets going?
Really, I only had two problems with PrCs: a single character could, conceivably, have several (I think three is really pushing it), and there were approximately 192,128,050,226.3 of them.
I didn't want to be a person who refuses to transition over to 4E out of a stubborn loyalty to 3E. But the more I see, the more I think I'll stay with 3E -- simply because it works, and doesn't need all the proposed changes. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 20 Dec 2007 01:03:14 |
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Mkhaiwati
Learned Scribe
USA
252 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 01:52:11
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I am wondering how long till the Immortals supplements comes out!
WARNING: pure speculation and half-remembered stuff follows! I don't remember where I read it, or if it true or just being discussed at WotC, but there is talk that there is a 30 level cap on characters. Either they will be retired, or become demi-gods, or something. How many players will complain there isn't anything for their 30 level PCs, now demi-gods, to do.
aha, here : http://www.enworld.org/index.php?page=4e#general
" Power progression from Races & Classes: "There is 2 or so pages on tiers of power (heroic, paragon and epic). The important part is the paragon paths and epic destinies. They replace prestige classes. They are additional power/abilities, that you can choose once you hit 11th or 21st level.....Epic destiny gives few but very powerful ability. Also it describes how you exit the world (seem like at level 30 you retire). You can become a demigod for example.Epic level game is much about slaying gods and clearing the Nine Hell. In the cleric section they muse about gods being redesigned, and one of their goals is, that they can be challenged by epic level characters."
and on speedy advancement:
"Chris Perkins on the rate of advancement: power level is increasing (although not by a "startling" amount); 20th level in 4th Edition is a little more powerful than 20th level in 3rd Edition. However, you'll reach 30th level in the same time you used to reach 20th level --
"The way character advancement works now, it takes fewer encounters to gain a level, but it takes roughly the same length of time to reach 30 levels in 4th Edition as it takes to reach 20 levels in 3rd Edition. The rate of level advancement is still being playtested, however, so the jury's still out on whether the final game will work this way.
One of the goals of 4th Edition is to make high-level play as fun, balanced, and manageable as low-level play, and to make high-level characters as easy to create and run as low-level ones. Comparing high-level 4th Edition characters to high-level 3rd Edition characters is not an apples-to-apples comparison because they're built very differently. However, there isn't a startling increase in overall power level from a 20th-level 3rd Edition character to a 20th-level 4th Edition character "
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"Behold the work of the old... let your heritage not be lost but bequeath it as a memory, treasure and blessing... Gather the lost and the hidden and preserve it for thy children."
"not nale. not-nale. thog help nail not-nale, not nale. and thog knot not-nale while nale nail not-nale. nale, not not-nale, now nail not-nale by leaving not-nale, not nale, in jail." OotS #367 |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3567 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 03:48:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Mkhaiwati
I am wondering how long till the Immortals supplements comes out!
WARNING: pure speculation and half-remembered stuff follows! I don't remember where I read it, or if it true or just being discussed at WotC, but there is talk that there is a 30 level cap on characters. Either they will be retired, or become demi-gods, or something. How many players will complain there isn't anything for their 30 level PCs, now demi-gods, to do.
aha, here : http://www.enworld.org/index.php?page=4e#general
" Power progression from Races & Classes: "There is 2 or so pages on tiers of power (heroic, paragon and epic). The important part is the paragon paths and epic destinies. They replace prestige classes. They are additional power/abilities, that you can choose once you hit 11th or 21st level.....Epic destiny gives few but very powerful ability. Also it describes how you exit the world (seem like at level 30 you retire). You can become a demigod for example.Epic level game is much about slaying gods and clearing the Nine Hell. In the cleric section they muse about gods being redesigned, and one of their goals is, that they can be challenged by epic level characters."
and on speedy advancement:
"Chris Perkins on the rate of advancement: power level is increasing (although not by a "startling" amount); 20th level in 4th Edition is a little more powerful than 20th level in 3rd Edition. However, you'll reach 30th level in the same time you used to reach 20th level --
"The way character advancement works now, it takes fewer encounters to gain a level, but it takes roughly the same length of time to reach 30 levels in 4th Edition as it takes to reach 20 levels in 3rd Edition. The rate of level advancement is still being playtested, however, so the jury's still out on whether the final game will work this way.
One of the goals of 4th Edition is to make high-level play as fun, balanced, and manageable as low-level play, and to make high-level characters as easy to create and run as low-level ones. Comparing high-level 4th Edition characters to high-level 3rd Edition characters is not an apples-to-apples comparison because they're built very differently. However, there isn't a startling increase in overall power level from a 20th-level 3rd Edition character to a 20th-level 4th Edition character "
Sounds like the redesign is in the hands of a few who were unable to level up quick enough and got tired of waiting to do really cool and epic things!
All I have to say is, if something is not truly earned, then it is not truly appreciated. I just hope they don't go to far. I remember the original Might & Magic on my commodore 64, it was so cool! In like 4 days my party was so powerful that we were killing black dragons and devil lords at will. 3 days or less after that I quit playing it. I had done enough high level acts that they became meaningless. |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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sparhawk42
Learned Scribe
104 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 13:10:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
These changes I'm hearing about for 4E... I can't say that a single one of them has appealed to me. It's not a case of "That rule sux!"; it seems to me that they're changing stuff just to change it.
This is how I feel as well. It just seems that some of the things they are changing they are doing just so they have enough new stuff to justify everyone having to buy tons of new books. Either that or they want to make sure they change everything enough so that it is a completely new Realms.  |
You never fail until you stop trying. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36803 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 13:45:52
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quote:
Originally posted by sparhawk42
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
These changes I'm hearing about for 4E... I can't say that a single one of them has appealed to me. It's not a case of "That rule sux!"; it seems to me that they're changing stuff just to change it.
This is how I feel as well. It just seems that some of the things they are changing they are doing just so they have enough new stuff to justify everyone having to buy tons of new books. Either that or they want to make sure they change everything enough so that it is a completely new Realms.
I'm not talking about the Realms, actually. I still have a single shard or two of hope for that; I've been holding very tightly on to the hope that it won't be as bad as some of the initial comments make it seem.
Rather, I was referring to the D&D ruleset. Other than the endless flood of feats and PrCs, I don't really see anything that needs to be changed in 4E. The things we've been hearing about make 4E sound like some offshoot of D&D, and not D&D itself. D&D Extreme, as opposed to D&D, perhaps. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 20 Dec 2007 13:46:43 |
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Odysseus
Seeker
USA
51 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 15:17:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I'm not talking about the Realms, actually. I still have a single shard or two of hope for that; I've been holding very tightly on to the hope that it won't be as bad as some of the initial comments make it seem.
Rather, I was referring to the D&D ruleset. Other than the endless flood of feats and PrCs, I don't really see anything that needs to be changed in 4E. The things we've been hearing about make 4E sound like some offshoot of D&D, and not D&D itself. D&D Extreme, as opposed to D&D, perhaps.
I think of 3.5 more as an evolutionary dead end. And 4E as a step backward and a step and half forward. If I strip away the fluff from 4E and just look at the mechanics I don't believe it will be incompatible with running realms games.
As to 4E realms , some of rich bakers comments make me optimistic towards the issue of the 4E realms books. |
“Anybody can become angry, that is easy; but to be angry with the right person, and to the right degree, and at the right time, and for the right purpose, and in the right way, that is not within everybody’s power, that is not easy.” —Aristotle |
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sparhawk42
Learned Scribe
104 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 17:43:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by sparhawk42
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
These changes I'm hearing about for 4E... I can't say that a single one of them has appealed to me. It's not a case of "That rule sux!"; it seems to me that they're changing stuff just to change it.
This is how I feel as well. It just seems that some of the things they are changing they are doing just so they have enough new stuff to justify everyone having to buy tons of new books. Either that or they want to make sure they change everything enough so that it is a completely new Realms.
I'm not talking about the Realms, actually. I still have a single shard or two of hope for that; I've been holding very tightly on to the hope that it won't be as bad as some of the initial comments make it seem.
Rather, I was referring to the D&D ruleset. Other than the endless flood of feats and PrCs, I don't really see anything that needs to be changed in 4E. The things we've been hearing about make 4E sound like some offshoot of D&D, and not D&D itself. D&D Extreme, as opposed to D&D, perhaps.
I know I said the Realms specifically but I misspoke (or mistyped I guess). I meant D&D in general, I guess that’s what I get for posting while half-awake.  
From the changes they announced about the way that many mechanics will fundamentally change it does seem to be they are trying to create some kind of offshoot of D&D but I guess we will have to wait and see.
(Oh and I too am holding on to the hope that the new Realms won’t be as bad as it has sounded at times.)
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You never fail until you stop trying. |
Edited by - sparhawk42 on 20 Dec 2007 17:44:30 |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 19:37:00
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quote:
Originally posted by Mkhaiwati
Epic destiny gives few but very powerful ability. Also it describes how you exit the world (seem like at level 30 you retire). You can become a demigod for example.Epic level game is much about slaying gods and clearing the Nine Hell. In the cleric section they muse about gods being redesigned, and one of their goals is, that they can be challenged by epic level characters."
Once again, that can make for an awesome game in a custom campaign setting, but that doesn't mean these concepts (like encouraged god-killing) should be pasted into settings where they don't fit well, like the Realms setting. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 19:41:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Odysseus
I think of 3.5 more as an evolutionary dead end.
Not saying your points aren't valid, but did you need to use WotC's latest marketing "buzzword"?
The creation of roleplaying games has nothing to do with evolution in the scientific sense. There are no "evolutionary dead-ends" here, no mutations going on, no organisms fighting to breed and survive as a species. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3567 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 20:48:42
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quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
quote:
Originally posted by Mkhaiwati
Epic destiny gives few but very powerful ability. Also it describes how you exit the world (seem like at level 30 you retire). You can become a demigod for example.Epic level game is much about slaying gods and clearing the Nine Hell. In the cleric section they muse about gods being redesigned, and one of their goals is, that they can be challenged by epic level characters."
Once again, that can make for an awesome game in a custom campaign setting, but that doesn't mean these concepts (like encouraged god-killing) should be pasted into settings where they don't fit well, like the Realms setting.
Amen to that Sister!! Amen. |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36803 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2007 : 20:50:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
quote:
Originally posted by Odysseus
I think of 3.5 more as an evolutionary dead end.
Not saying your points aren't valid, but did you need to use WotC's latest marketing "buzzword"?
The creation of roleplaying games has nothing to do with evolution in the scientific sense. There are no "evolutionary dead-ends" here, no mutations going on, no organisms fighting to breed and survive as a species.
I get what he's saying, though: they did such a bang-up job on 3.5 that there's little room for improvement. To be able to make the most of a new system, they need to do something more than the 1E to 2E changeover -- and that's why we're getting D&D Extreme, as I am now going to call it (heh, maybe ED&D?). |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 00:41:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
But the more I see, the more I think I'll stay with 3E -- simply because it works, and doesn't need all the proposed changes.
Amen brother! it took you a little longer than me, but then again, maybe you're not an engineer...  |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36803 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 00:59:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Purple Dragon Knight
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
But the more I see, the more I think I'll stay with 3E -- simply because it works, and doesn't need all the proposed changes.
Amen brother! it took you a little longer than me, but then again, maybe you're not an engineer...
I should again like to note that I'm referring to the ruleset. While D&D Extreme (my new name for 4E) doesn't interest me, I am still holding out hope for the 4E Realms. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 04:46:26
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| In time, such foolishness shall pass, and you shall turn fully to the dark side... |
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Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 05:03:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Steven Schend
quote:
Originally posted by The Red Walker
I think the time is past due that we at the 'keep start on Forgotten Realms Fe (Fan edition)
Can I be in charge of the Kyriani Agrivar slash fiction board?
Steven
who had to ask before Wooly beat him to it...
PS: No, I don't really want to do that; frankly, what's being done around here already (the Compendiums et al) are more than solid enough material to count as its own FE...
I agree with Red Walker, Steven and the Sage: the Compendiums are top notch. Moreover, with the coming of 4E and how it will tip the Realms forever upside down, I would feel comforted if Candlekeep somehow strives to remain "pre-4E" in content. Heck, I would even commit to devour (read: memorize/make it official in my campaigns) every issue of the Compendium. And yes, the input of Steven and other FR author in our compendium, and/or as "guiding hands" and "canon checkers" to ensure we stay true and close to our "old canon" would be great! I wholly second Red Walker's motion to start our own FE Realms Edition here at the keep! |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 06:29:01
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| Well, strive is to put it a bit strongly. If there is anything sparking my interest in 4ed. I could allways write it into the Compendium; I havent seen anything saying that we are to keep it to the classical age only. That goes for Candlekeep as a whole. |
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Ranak
Learned Scribe
USA
190 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 09:14:12
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Interestingly enough, according to a new article on Wizards Elves will only live to be 200 years old in 4th Edition. Instead of a long-lived, reflective race, they are now described as impulsive and taking things less seriously because they live to be 200.
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dramp/20071221
I suppose they can explain this away with the spellplague - the magic that kept elves alive is no longer as strong, or is more wild and uncontrollable, etc. So there should not be any serious continuity problems.
But this is quite interesting to me, because I've played elven starting characters who were older than 200! In the very least it will make for some truly staggering changes to Evermeet. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36803 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 11:16:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Ranak
Interestingly enough, according to a new article on Wizards Elves will only live to be 200 years old in 4th Edition. Instead of a long-lived, reflective race, they are now described as impulsive and taking things less seriously because they live to be 200.
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dramp/20071221
I suppose they can explain this away with the spellplague - the magic that kept elves alive is no longer as strong, or is more wild and uncontrollable, etc. So there should not be any serious continuity problems.
But this is quite interesting to me, because I've played elven starting characters who were older than 200! In the very least it will make for some truly staggering changes to Evermeet.
What in the name of Lurue is that about? Why is that a necessary change? And what's with the "elven accuracy" rule -- "Reroll an attack roll. Use the second roll, even if it's lower." Yeah, a forced miss is a great way to reflect "the legendary accuracy of the elves". |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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sparhawk42
Learned Scribe
104 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 13:13:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Ranak
Interestingly enough, according to a new article on Wizards Elves will only live to be 200 years old in 4th Edition. Instead of a long-lived, reflective race, they are now described as impulsive and taking things less seriously because they live to be 200.
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dramp/20071221
I suppose they can explain this away with the spellplague - the magic that kept elves alive is no longer as strong, or is more wild and uncontrollable, etc. So there should not be any serious continuity problems.
But this is quite interesting to me, because I've played elven starting characters who were older than 200! In the very least it will make for some truly staggering changes to Evermeet.
I just don't understand this. What in the world is the point of this? Elves that live only about 200 years?  How does this improve D&D on a whole? Are the other races ages going to change? The more I see some of these coming changes the more I keep asking myself one question. Why? I wish I could understand why they are changing some of the things they are.  |
You never fail until you stop trying. |
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Iliana N-letur
Acolyte
Netherlands
13 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 13:19:54
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???
Okay, they now officially lost me. The magic is gone - pun sadly intended. Short lived, mage no longer the favoured class, but a wisdom bonus - that's true, the elves always showed remarkable insight of how their plans would evolve. Oh no: 'deeply felt but short-lived passions'. And that feels right with a Wis bonus how? Luckily it's now easier being an elf: no need to spent millennia working on high magic (what high magic? that's gone to? Think so)
Bottom line, we got seeded from outer space with pods, replacing all creatures in Faerun with look-a-likes.
Sight, and I tried to keep an open mind... |
A small (4'9") moon elf, with odd pale golden hair and startling violet eyes. See her for the first time, there's fair bit of Faerie 'fascinate' involved.
A slightly curved sword and pseudo dragon familiar are never far away. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36803 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 13:41:09
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Keep in mind, folks, that what's true for generic D&D Extreme may not be the case for the Realms. (I hope.) That's why I think we should keep the 4E Realms discussion limited to the appropriate thread, and save this one to speak only of the mangling of D&D changes happening with D&D Extreme. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 15:30:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Purple Dragon Knight
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
But the more I see, the more I think I'll stay with 3E -- simply because it works, and doesn't need all the proposed changes.
Amen brother! it took you a little longer than me, but then again, maybe you're not an engineer...
I should again like to note that I'm referring to the ruleset. While D&D Extreme (my new name for 4E) doesn't interest me, I am still holding out hope for the 4E Realms.
Heh, I have to admit I'm the opposite--I'd definitely try out a "4E core adventure", but I'm not interested in using the 4E version of the Realms setting. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 15:33:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Keep in mind, folks, that what's true for generic D&D Extreme may not be the case for the Realms. (I hope.) That's why I think we should keep the 4E Realms discussion limited to the appropriate thread, and save this one to speak only of the mangling of D&D changes happening with D&D Extreme.
Also, remember that Elves have been split up--now "elves", "eladrin", and "drow" are all distinct sub-types (sub-species?). "Elves" are the woodsy types. "Eladrin" (eladrins?) are the magical types. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 21 Dec 2007 15:34:53 |
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Iliana N-letur
Acolyte
Netherlands
13 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 15:36:41
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Sorry, Wooly, you are correct - I shouldn't have brought up FR relative PoVs in this thread.
Still, starting from DnD (ToS) I'm kind of missing the fighter-mage. In first it was the only option, in 2nd it was an often taken option, in third you had a number of special PrC's ... and now mage no longer is main option.
Why a wisdom bonus? A charisma bonus I could understand. I do not know if 'Sorcerer' is still a base class in 'Extreme', but shifting elven magic towards sorcery would have been odd, but at least keeping some of the feeling. |
A small (4'9") moon elf, with odd pale golden hair and startling violet eyes. See her for the first time, there's fair bit of Faerie 'fascinate' involved.
A slightly curved sword and pseudo dragon familiar are never far away. |
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Iliana N-letur
Acolyte
Netherlands
13 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 15:41:54
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quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Also, remember that Elves have been split up--now "elves", "eladrin", and "drow" are all distinct sub-types (sub-species?). "Elves" are the woodsy types. "Eladrin" (eladrins?) are the magical types.
... forgot that splitting of race. 
But my point on Wisdom stands. Perhaps even more so. Wood/Green/Copper/Wild (take your pick) elves never were described as 'wise', plus it doesn't fit with the personality description. |
A small (4'9") moon elf, with odd pale golden hair and startling violet eyes. See her for the first time, there's fair bit of Faerie 'fascinate' involved.
A slightly curved sword and pseudo dragon familiar are never far away. |
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Ranak
Learned Scribe
USA
190 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 17:14:20
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Perhaps Eladrin will be the long lived magical elves that live a very long time.
Wooly you are of course correct, Elves were always a bit difference in FR, so that can be picked up in the FR 4ed thread if people care to postulate on the possible effect of these rule changes in Faerun.
quote:
Originally posted by Iliana N-letur
quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Also, remember that Elves have been split up--now "elves", "eladrin", and "drow" are all distinct sub-types (sub-species?). "Elves" are the woodsy types. "Eladrin" (eladrins?) are the magical types.
... forgot that splitting of race.
But my point on Wisdom stands. Perhaps even more so. Wood/Green/Copper/Wild (take your pick) elves never were described as 'wise', plus it doesn't fit with the personality description.
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Aravine
Senior Scribe
USA
608 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 17:58:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Ranak
Perhaps Eladrin will be the long lived magical elves that live a very long time.
Wooly you are of course correct, Elves were always a bit difference in FR, so that can be picked up in the FR 4ed thread if people care to postulate on the possible effect of these rule changes in Faerun.
quote:
Originally posted by Iliana N-letur
quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Also, remember that Elves have been split up--now "elves", "eladrin", and "drow" are all distinct sub-types (sub-species?). "Elves" are the woodsy types. "Eladrin" (eladrins?) are the magical types.
... forgot that splitting of race.
But my point on Wisdom stands. Perhaps even more so. Wood/Green/Copper/Wild (take your pick) elves never were described as 'wise', plus it doesn't fit with the personality description.
the long lived magical elves that live a long time? isn't that stated by the long lived elves? or are they long lived elves that live even longer? |
The brave don't live forever,the cautious don't live at all |
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Aravine
Senior Scribe
USA
608 Posts |
Posted - 21 Dec 2007 : 18:08:58
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| Has anyone seen the D&D 4e video on yuotube? did anyone else find that a little bit insulting? "we made it easier for DM's" why does the corprate world assume we are all complete morons? do we seem like we can't understand how to DM? I mean, come on! this is borderline slander on all DM's using 3.5. "hi. we made a new addition because you couldn't possibly understand 3.5". Am I the only one that didn't just see red but saw a rainbow like in a kalidescope? I'm sorry for ranting, but it felt like they were purposely insulting my inteligence. they are going to have to dig very hard, very very fast to get out of the hole that interveiw dug for them to get me to have interest in 4E again |
The brave don't live forever,the cautious don't live at all |
Edited by - Aravine on 21 Dec 2007 18:09:59 |
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D&D 4e Discussion Scroll
