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Talwyn
Learned Scribe
Australia
222 Posts |
 Posted - 23 May 2007 : 08:46:25
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When I first loaded up Baldurs Gate way back in 1998 and saw the quote from Nietzdche come up on the screen [see my signature], I knew I was in for something special.
I'd say that the Baldurs gate Series was probably the best FR game [for computer - single player campaign] that was ever released.
It had an epic scope, sweeping story and alternate endings.
The thing I liked the most though, was BG1, where you could pretty much explore a lot of the sword coast area without having to go through the chapters. It was non lineal in that regard although if you wanted to procede with the plot, of course you had to complete the chapters. However, I prefered the way in which the early chapters just let you explore at your own pace. Of course at low levels, it could be dangerous to stray too far from the main roads and there were certain areas that had some quite tough encounters/monsters to overcome.
The characters [NPC's] that you could team up with were also brilliant. Without a shadow of doubt, Minsk the nutty ranger was the most entertaining. When I first heard his battle cry of "go for the eyes Boo!", I dam near fell off my chair in hysterical laughter.
Overall, I'd say BG1, with it's expansion module was probably the best PC RPG made. BG2 was great as well but I found that the "world" wasn't as large as it was in BG1 however the storyline and character interaction was more detailed in BG2, including romances with 3 of the female NPC's if your character was male. [spoiler - the drow Viconia was the hawtie! IMHO that is  ]
In summing up and reading through this, I'm having pangs of nostalgia to play the BG series again...that's how good I think it was.
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Over the centuries, mankind has tried many ways of combating the forces of evil...prayer, fasting, good works and so on.
Up until Doom, no one seemed to have thought about the double-barrel shotgun.
EAT LEADEN DEATH DEMON!
Terry Pratchett
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Edited by - Talwyn on 23 May 2007 08:51:47 |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 24 May 2007 : 00:04:16
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The BG series is so good, to this day many people that I've seen insist it's one of the best RPGs ever made, regardless of setting. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 24 May 2007 : 15:37:36
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Curse of the Azure Bonds - where else can you go into Zhentil Keep for fun - and you get to import your characters from original Pool of Radiance and export them to Secret of the Silver Blades (darn Remorrhazs... I still QQ over that).
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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Ryss Firemaster
Acolyte
Denmark
30 Posts |
Posted - 27 May 2007 : 08:41:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
The BG series is so good, to this day many people that I've seen insist it's one of the best RPGs ever made, regardless of setting.
Indeed. Why else would I be replaying the saga year after year? (Being in the middle of BGII now.) |
"People lie. Online doubly so!" |
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Chyron
Learned Scribe
Hong Kong
279 Posts |
Posted - 29 May 2007 : 07:53:37
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quote:
Originally posted by yargarth
Thank you so much for input, but are there any games you should just not even buy because they are so horrible?
I'd argue that the console games BG: Dark Alliance, BG: Dark Alliance II, and Demonstone (especially Demonstone) were all pretty bad, simply using the FR name and not much else from D&D. But that's just my opinion as I know other gamers (who are not D&D players) that loved those games.
Also I'd say stay away from D&D Online as that is completely set in Eberron (and even the Eberron elements are not done very well).
For my own recommendations, outside of the original gold box adventures as mentioned by many posters above, I would strongly recommend NWN and NWN2.
There were actually some pretty good (free) mods for NWN 1, including one that was almost an exact recreation of the original gold box Pool of Radiance adventure.
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Just My Thoughts
Chyron :)
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Jimbobx
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
109 Posts |
Posted - 29 May 2007 : 09:20:34
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NWN for me too, simply because of the versatility of the toolset and the huge amount of excellent fan-created modules. Haven't really taken to NWN 2, I think it needs a few more years to build up some custom content before it is worth switching to. Pools of radiance on my trusty Amiga 500 comes a close 2nd.
I'd agree that the Dark Alliance games were pretty disappointing...didn't stop me playing them to death though.  |
Rilyetan's Retreat
Jimbob's Waterdeep Journal
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Ranin
Seeker
88 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2007 : 05:00:36
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I'm far more into the first Baldur's Gate because I prefer the version in abilities. Sure, NWN and its modules have versatile graphics, but I totally dislike the dialogs in those games. The Baldur's Gate series dialogues are far more comical and sophisticated in my book.
Also I'm an oldie when it comes to RPG computer games and I have nostalgia when I look at the manuals for BG I and BG II. They were made in the good old days when I was in college and thanks to them, I flunked half of my classes.
Also, I'm not into online and multiplayer gaming and I get ticked off seeing that all of the manuals nowadays are installed as a pdf Acrobat Reader file. Whats worse are those games like Wyvern Crown of Cormyr and new NWN modules where you have to be connected to the internet to play and each time you load a saved game, it has to authenticate online.
 How I miss the days of Icewind Dale and Baldur's Gate series where you bought the game at a store and a nice thick, new-smelling manual came with the games. |
Listen to the silence of the wilds, in there lies the wisdom of ages. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2007 : 05:41:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Ranin
I'm far more into the first Baldur's Gate because I prefer the version in abilities. Sure, NWN and its modules have versatile graphics, but I totally dislike the dialogs in those games. The Baldur's Gate series dialogues are far more comical and sophisticated in my book.
Well, to be fair, modules are all made by different people, so dialogue quality is dependant entirely on the author--it has nothing to do with format. I've played a lot of NWN1 modules (will play a lot of NWN2 modules in the near future), and I can say I've played NWN modules with excellent writing. Also, you only have to be connected to the internet to play the premium modules by Bioware (the ones you have to pay for--it's protection against piracy)--not so with "regular" modules downloaded for free off the NWVault. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 10 Jun 2007 05:43:48 |
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Ranin
Seeker
88 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jun 2007 : 18:47:51
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| I still say BGII and its expansion are the best. I prefer its camera view. |
Listen to the silence of the wilds, in there lies the wisdom of ages. |
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J D Dunsany
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
180 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2007 : 09:49:30
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quote:
Originally posted by Ranin
I still say BGII and its expansion are the best. I prefer its camera view.
Yes, I like the isometric view and the beautifully rendered backgrounds. As I think I've already mentioned elsewhere, I particularly love the original 'Icewind Dale' (my first ever CRPG ) - there's a real sense of atmosphere generated by the graphics and the backgrounds and, although it doesn't have the inter-party dynamics or quite the epic storyline of 'Baldur's Gate' it's rich in Realmslore and, I don't know... there was a genuine sense of place in the game - whether it was the huddled snow-bound village of Easthaven at the start or the ruined grandeur of the Severed Hand, there was just, I don't know, something about them that continues to linger in the memory even now.
Good times...
(And, when I first played it, I didn't even know some bloke called Salvatore had written a trilogy of the same name...  ) |
"How content that young woman looks, don't you think? How content, and yet how flammable." - Lemony Snicket, The Unauthorized Autobiography |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2007 : 23:57:28
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| The first Icewind Dale game was a masterpiece in terms of atmosphere and the "sense of place", even though it was light on actual role-playing. The sequel? I wasn't as impressed with that, though I liked it enough to play through it twice. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 15 Jun 2007 23:57:54 |
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Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2007 : 05:45:38
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I'll agree with most posters here: BG1 was the singlemost greatest leap FR has ever made computer games-wise.
Not FR, but a close second in my heart, was Torment, the Planescape game, which used an engine similar to BG1 (or vice-versa; I'm not sure which came first now...) |
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Ladejarl
Seeker
Norway
55 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2007 : 22:58:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Purple Dragon Knight
I'll agree with most posters here: BG1 was the singlemost greatest leap FR has ever made computer games-wise.
Not FR, but a close second in my heart, was Torment, the Planescape game, which used an engine similar to BG1 (or vice-versa; I'm not sure which came first now...)
Torment used a heavily modified version of the BG1 engine.
An for the sake of posting on topic thus avoiding necessarium duty: BG1 |
"There should be much less violence, and more nudity and kinkiness in the world." |
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Ulicus
Acolyte
United Kingdom
18 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jul 2007 : 16:05:29
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Baldurs Gate and Tales of the Sword Coast + mods.
Whilst there was a vast improvement in terms of NPC character development in SoA and it remains a fun game in its own right it is, in my opinion, a pretty dire Forgotten Realms game, playing fast and loose with Realmslore and paying no attention to, oh, I dont know Amns actual geography.*
It was also the start of BioWares silliness in regards to levelling and experience which culminated in the dire Throne of Bhaal...
Baldurs Gate, in contrast, is surprisingly accurate when it comes to Realmslore certainly enough to actually feel like Faerun and is perfectly balanced in regards to the main plot and the numerous side quests. Unlike BG II, it allows your good aligned characters the freedom to explore and spend money on magical items without making you feel guilty (shouldnt I be focusing on rescuing Imoen, etc)
The story, whilst basic, is also the better for it. SoA's overarching story was lame, confused and poorly executed.
So yes, if you want a good game, by all means get Shadows of Amn. If you want a great Realms games, however, stick to BG and IWD alone.
* That said, since learning that Baldur's Gate's population is 42,000, I have a hard time believing that it is as small as it appears in the game. It does, however, have all the correct features... which is more than I can say for Athkatla.
** Though, that said, Beregost is said in the FRCS to be made up of only forty buildings... yet has a population of 2915. Weird. |
"Bane" = "Xvim" = Cyric, Prince of Lies |
Edited by - Ulicus on 09 Jul 2007 16:14:07 |
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J D Dunsany
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
180 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jul 2007 : 13:29:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
The first Icewind Dale game was a masterpiece in terms of atmosphere and the "sense of place", even though it was light on actual role-playing. The sequel? I wasn't as impressed with that, though I liked it enough to play through it twice.
Hmmm... for some reason, I got much less involved in the plot of IWDII than the original. The game plays much more like a tactical squad-based strategy game in some respects than an rpg. Mind you, the implementation of 3E rules in IWDII is just peachy. All sorts of possibilities for adventuring parties present themselves...
And yes 'atmosphere' is exactly the thing I'm talking about in 'Icewind Dale'. It actually inspired my first ever bit of FR fanfic - all that howling wind, bleak snow-covered landscape and lowing mournful music gets the creative juices flowing...
And, naturally, an honourable mention must go to 'Planescape:Torment' - perhaps the best written rpg I've ever played. But, because it doesn't really address the original poster's question, perhaps I should leave it at that.
Regards,
JDD |
"How content that young woman looks, don't you think? How content, and yet how flammable." - Lemony Snicket, The Unauthorized Autobiography |
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Aaron Highcolor
Acolyte
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - 04 Aug 2007 : 17:44:54
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| I loved the old SSI Goldbox games. Actually, I still have them on the desktop PC. |
Run when you have to, fight when you must, rest when you can. |
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Daniel of the North
Acolyte
Norway
30 Posts |
Posted - 15 Aug 2007 : 00:07:31
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| Baldurs Gate I&II is some of my all time favorite games. |
THE ART OF ESCAPING REALITY |
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Alisttair
Great Reader
Canada
3054 Posts |
Posted - 07 Sep 2007 : 03:10:23
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Many replies already but I will put in my two cents.
Baldur's Gate (all three) are a must because of the story is really good IMO and better from start to finish.
NWN is built for online play but the single player modes and FR mods are FUN. NWN2 should be awesome but I don't have the system req. yet to install it :*(
And Demon Stone is very linear but written by Salvatore so MUST BUY |
Karsite Arcanar (Most Holy Servant of Karsus)
Anauria - Survivor State of Netheril as penned by me:
http://www.dmsguild.com/m/product/172023 |
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Dragonstar
Acolyte
USA
7 Posts |
Posted - 11 Sep 2007 : 02:00:04
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I have to agree, I loved Baldur's Gate. But for best of all time, it has to be Eye of the Beholder. I remember seeing the box on the shelf in the clearance section at babbages, with the skeletons busting through the door. I begged my mom for it, and she finally relented. My dad had to play with the settings to get sound (on our old IBM PS/1), but I wasted an entire summer on that game! That was my first experience with the Realms, and it's kept me hooked ever since (I still replay it now and again). You can find it in a box set somwhere with all 3 on CD plus a bunch of other older D&D games (Curse of the Azure Bonds and whatnot).
Of course my girlfriend is behind me screaming "Diablo! Diablo!" But that's a whole other tale. ;) |
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Aewrik
Seeker
80 Posts |
Posted - 14 Sep 2007 : 15:23:42
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quote:
Originally posted by J D Dunsany
Yes, I like the isometric view and the beautifully rendered backgrounds. As I think I've already mentioned elsewhere, I particularly love the original 'Icewind Dale' (my first ever CRPG ) - there's a real sense of atmosphere generated by the graphics and the backgrounds and, although it doesn't have the inter-party dynamics or quite the epic storyline of 'Baldur's Gate' it's rich in Realmslore and, I don't know... there was a genuine sense of place in the game - whether it was the huddled snow-bound village of Easthaven at the start or the ruined grandeur of the Severed Hand, there was just, I don't know, something about them that continues to linger in the memory even now.
Good times...
(And, when I first played it, I didn't even know some bloke called Salvatore had written a trilogy of the same name... )
The same for me... Icewind Dale is more of an adventure, but it is extremely well told. It's three years since I last played the game, and I can still recall the first few sentences of the introduction.
Baldur's Gate I is almost in the same league, but it misses something Icewind Dale had, I don't know what.
I personally think Baldur's Gate II (and especially the expansion) is rather thin. Of course, the story is immense, but I think they missed out a rather important part (for me): the atmosphere of being in the realms. The lore and the lack of mystique. Not that I didn't enjoy playing it, I really did.
BGII could've taken place in almost any setting, in my view. It focuses so much on character interaction and giving the player things to do, that the world around is brought out of focus. Just compare the introduction movies between BGII and IWD.
IWD tells the story of Dorn's Deep and the Severed Hand. Jerrod, Everard and Balhifet. Kuldahar and Easthaven. It is a true masterpiece, in that it switches the present to past and back seamlessly, and manages to tell several separate stories while still holding on the the main plot.
BGII tells the story of Jon Irenicus (Suldanesselar) and the main character. It brings attention to things that are present, the "everyday" world of Faerūn. But there is nothing magical in the way things are "put to canvas." The only truly mystical things in BGII are the Planar Sphere and the Cult of the Eyeless. Of course, there are more things to do in BGII than in both BGI and IWD together, but it lacks the depth those game have.
I don't know, it's just... try playing through Icewind Dale without hurry. Read every dialogue, and see the depth and history behind what is said. Perhaps you will see my point.
I may be spoiled on details and other "candy" when roleplaying PnP, and I expect the same from computer games having had years in development. The most important is the manuscript, after all. Other factors have impact on the quality (which Star Wars Episodes 1-3 clearly shows), but if you want a good story, you need good interactions and most importantly the backgrounds of the people and environments you interact with.
I mean, what would Tolkien's works have been, if he never explained or showed the history and reasoning behind the events that led to Frodo having the One Ring?
"Here you go, a ring for you, mr. Baggins. Please travel to Rivendell where the elf Elrond resides"
*travel there* "Now you must travel to Mordor in order to destroy this ring, so that the Dark Lord Sauron can be destroyed"
*on the way there, in Moria* "Oh look, a Balrog! Nice! I can use magic to make you disappear!" (not "You shall not pass! I am the servant of the secret fire, wielder of the flame of Anor. The dark fire shall never avail you, flame of Udūn!")
*Gandalf dies, journey continues*
About IWDII, NWN and NWN2, I think they focus too much on the game system and character development.
I think the plot of IWDII and NWN were okay, they were just portrayed poorly. NWN2 I didn't even get through the introduction before quitting. Atmosphere is measured very slightly on graphics. They should've learned that from the Infinity Engine games. |
Edited by - Aewrik on 14 Sep 2007 15:25:43 |
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Raxtin
Acolyte
USA
5 Posts |
Posted - 11 Nov 2007 : 07:08:13
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| Pool of Radiance and Curse of the Azure Bonds. What was up with Hillsfar? |
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Karzak
Learned Scribe
196 Posts |
Posted - 11 Nov 2007 : 17:29:58
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quote:
Originally posted by Aewrik
I mean, what would Tolkien's works have been, if he never explained or showed the history and reasoning behind the events that led to Frodo having the One Ring?
A lot less tiresome? Maybe if he'd spent some of those mightily lengthy pages on characterization... |
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Aravine
Senior Scribe
USA
608 Posts |
Posted - 12 Nov 2007 : 13:16:32
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| Balder's Gate 2 is my favorite game. Although I would thoroughly enjoy it if they mad a game simalar to elder scrolls game Oblivion.*looks at game designer* |
The brave don't live forever,the cautious don't live at all |
Edited by - Aravine on 12 Nov 2007 13:17:11 |
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Karzak
Learned Scribe
196 Posts |
Posted - 12 Nov 2007 : 17:18:56
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Haha, you know that most hardcore RPGers spit and urinate on the name of Oblivion?
Mass Effect, with its super dumbed-down dialogue options, seems to be heading in that direction, though. |
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Aravine
Senior Scribe
USA
608 Posts |
Posted - 12 Nov 2007 : 17:26:39
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| I mean the expansivness of the game. yes, I do see the problems with it, but then again, everything can be tweaked can't it? I was thinking more of a 3rd personthing where, like BG2, you could set whether you wanted it to be turned based or not. however, that is just my opinion, and I ask that you don't urinate on it. |
The brave don't live forever,the cautious don't live at all |
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Karzak
Learned Scribe
196 Posts |
Posted - 12 Nov 2007 : 18:49:19
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It's more the irony of the fact that hardcore RPGers tend to see BG2 as fairly all right, and here you want Bioware or whoever make something more like Oblivion. It'd piss them off to no end, but then again a subset of them think Bioware caters to mentally deficient fanboys.
As for the game's expansiveness - I've seen Oblivion/Morrowind compared to MMORPGs "except it's singleplayer." Maybe MMORPGs are more your type of thing.
quote:
I was thinking more of a 3rd personthing where, like BG2, you could set whether you wanted it to be turned based or not.
Or you could go play NWN/NWN2. I don't see the big giant deal with turn-based gameplay; I personally loathe it thoroughly - and anyway in BG2, you can't set it to "turn-based." You only have the option to make the game pause when enemies are spotted, and so on. |
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Hawkins
Great Reader
USA
2131 Posts |
Posted - 12 Nov 2007 : 19:35:20
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| My votes go for the BG series as a whole, and for NWN:HotU. But I did really like the NWN main campaign, and NWN2 as well. Not so much NWN:SoU. Have not played NWN2:MotB yet, but hoping to in the next 2-3 months. Has anyone played the FR specific NWN Premium Campaigns? They look good. |
Errant d20 Designer - My Blog (last updated January 06, 2016)
One, two! One, two! And through and through
The vorpal blade went snicker-snack!
He left it dead, and with its head
He went galumphing back. --Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking-Glass
"Mmm, not the darkness," Myrin murmured. "Don't cast it there." --Erik Scott de Bie, Shadowbane
* My character sheets (PFRPG, 3.5, and AE versions; not viewable in Internet Explorer)
* Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document (PFRPG OGL Rules)
* The Hypertext d20 SRD (3.5 OGL Rules)
* 3.5 D&D Archives
My game design work:
* Heroes of the Jade Oath (PFRPG, conversion; Rite Publishing)
* Compendium Arcanum Volume 1: Cantrips & Orisons (PFRPG, designer; d20pfsrd.com Publishing)
* Compendium Arcanum Volume 2: 1st-Level Spells (PFRPG, designer; d20pfsrd.com Publishing)
* Martial Arts Guidebook (forthcoming) (PFRPG, designer; Rite Publishing)
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Edited by - Hawkins on 12 Nov 2007 19:38:57 |
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Karzak
Learned Scribe
196 Posts |
Posted - 12 Nov 2007 : 19:59:12
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| I haven't tried the premium campaigns; don't support daylight robbery (and there're plenty of modules just as good - if not better - you can have for free). But isn't only one of them FR-specific (since Bioware themselves, I suspect, don't want to touch FR ever again)? Wyvern of... something. |
Edited by - Karzak on 12 Nov 2007 19:59:38 |
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Hawkins
Great Reader
USA
2131 Posts |
Posted - 12 Nov 2007 : 20:28:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Karzak
I haven't tried the premium campaigns; don't support daylight robbery (and there're plenty of modules just as good - if not better - you can have for free). But isn't only one of them FR-specific (since Bioware themselves, I suspect, don't want to touch FR ever again)? Wyvern of... something.
Pirates of the Sword Coast and Wyvern Crown of Cormyr. I have yet to find a module that has the same polish as on made for "professionally." If you know of some, would you PM them to me? |
Errant d20 Designer - My Blog (last updated January 06, 2016)
One, two! One, two! And through and through
The vorpal blade went snicker-snack!
He left it dead, and with its head
He went galumphing back. --Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking-Glass
"Mmm, not the darkness," Myrin murmured. "Don't cast it there." --Erik Scott de Bie, Shadowbane
* My character sheets (PFRPG, 3.5, and AE versions; not viewable in Internet Explorer)
* Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document (PFRPG OGL Rules)
* The Hypertext d20 SRD (3.5 OGL Rules)
* 3.5 D&D Archives
My game design work:
* Heroes of the Jade Oath (PFRPG, conversion; Rite Publishing)
* Compendium Arcanum Volume 1: Cantrips & Orisons (PFRPG, designer; d20pfsrd.com Publishing)
* Compendium Arcanum Volume 2: 1st-Level Spells (PFRPG, designer; d20pfsrd.com Publishing)
* Martial Arts Guidebook (forthcoming) (PFRPG, designer; Rite Publishing)
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Edited by - Hawkins on 12 Nov 2007 20:29:44 |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 12 Nov 2007 : 22:05:17
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Demon Stone, since it had a cute 1/2 Drow girl. >.>
Ok, seriously, Pools of Radiance, Curse of the Azure Bonds, then Secret of the Silver Blades... but damn to hell those Remorhazzes!!! They certainly rolled natural 20s often... stupid molten bellies. |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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What is the best FR game? (any system)
