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Genis
Learned Scribe
USA
226 Posts |
 Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 05:53:46
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No offense at all to those who dont enjoy Salvatore but im fairly new at the realms and alot of the books you discuss i have yet to read....and i have also noticed olot of slavatore criticism...so please....if your a salvatore fan lets chat about soething ive read....being most of the realms books ive read so far have been purely salvatore....anything of the drizzt books or other salvatore novels would be appreciated...Mead for everyone!
Mod Edit: Shifted to the correct shelf.
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Unofficial Random Hiatus Taker. |
Edited by - The Sage on 08 Aug 2006 05:58:07
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Winterfox
Senior Scribe
895 Posts |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3566 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 12:55:53
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quote:
Originally posted by Genis
No offense at all to those who dont enjoy Salvatore but im fairly new at the realms and alot of the books you discuss i have yet to read....and i have also noticed olot of slavatore criticism...so please....if your a salvatore fan lets chat about soething ive read....being most of the realms books ive read so far have been purely salvatore....anything of the drizzt books or other salvatore novels would be appreciated...Mead for everyone!
Mod Edit: Shifted to the correct shelf.
Im sure many would discuss with you, you might want to start with which Books you have read and/or want to discuss.
P.S. You might want to avoid topics with "Spoilers" in the thread in the future!
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A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Edited by - The Red Walker on 08 Aug 2006 12:56:34 |
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wwwwwww
Learned Scribe
116 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 13:44:34
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There's nothing wrong at all about discussing Salvatore's work on this forum. He's written some fantastic stuff, and I personally believe he's had far more impact regarding the popularity of realms (novels) then even Mr. Greenwood himself. His popularity has extended well past the FR spectrum and into the general "fantasy" audience.
Sometimes I wonder if his popularity is the reason that some FR fans spurn him. If you go to amazon.com, his books usually get raved about (and typically have 100+ reviews). No other FR author can say that.
Anyway, as I said, feel free to discuss him here. This is an FR novels forum and the perfect place to do so. |
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scererar
Master of Realmslore
USA
1618 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 15:09:43
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I would be more than happy to discuss Salvatore's work in the realms. I can see them quickly getting carried away here though. Can you provide more specifics on what you are interested in discussing?
Additionally, there are a lot of differing opinions here on this subject. If you just want to post with others who are mostly pro-Salvatore , I would advise following the link that Winterfox provided above  |
Edited by - scererar on 08 Aug 2006 15:14:03 |
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Aes Tryl
Learned Scribe
181 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 15:39:43
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| Hmm Salvatore was the author that got me on the FR bandwagon and though yes, perhaps Drizzt's character development may have been a bit two dimensional(honestly, Path of Darkness did nothing for him, it just made him well more boring), but Hunter's Blades was a cool trilogy which i felt fleshed out Drizzt more and made him well darker and more vulnerable(Drizzt with no friends is an angry Drizzt to say the least), but honestly i'm enjoying the sellsword series the most except for the whole ambigious Entreri shade business. Personally, i feel he has a nice writing style, but yes he could work on character development but on the whole i'm still a Drizzt fan. |
Edited by - Aes Tryl on 08 Aug 2006 15:40:21 |
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Genis
Learned Scribe
USA
226 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 15:59:39
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| Salvatores what got me into FR also, i read his hunters blade trilogy a while back...and then discovered theres 10 other drizzt books before that so now i just got done reading those and am about to go looking for some other FR novels by authers like Greenwood or other authers...and suprisenly enough drizzt hasnt bored me yet...alot of other people say he bored them but for some reason im not there yet...do you think salvatore plans on writing any more dirzzt books or is the huntere blade trilogy his last "i thought at the end of that book he left quit and opening for more" |
Unofficial Random Hiatus Taker. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36794 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 16:20:34
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I don't think it matters if Salvatore wants to write more Drizzt books or not... If he wants Wizards to keep paying him, he'll keep writing them. They once, in fact, tried to have someone else write a Drizzt book -- that plan was only cancelled when RAS came back to do another book himself.
I personally think he's tired of Drizzt, and would prefer to write about someone else. But WotC won't let go of their biggest cash cow, and so RAS is a victim of his own success.
I will agree, though, that his books have greatly helped the Realms. I'm just bored with them, myself. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
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Kalin Agrivar
Senior Scribe
Canada
956 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 16:51:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I don't think it matters if Salvatore wants to write more Drizzt books or not... If he wants Wizards to keep paying him, he'll keep writing them. They once, in fact, tried to have someone else write a Drizzt book -- that plan was only cancelled when RAS came back to do another book himself.
I personally think he's tired of Drizzt, and would prefer to write about someone else. But WotC won't let go of their biggest cash cow, and so RAS is a victim of his own success.
I will agree, though, that his books have greatly helped the Realms. I'm just bored with them, myself.
I toyally agree with that...considering that Drizzt has had the least character development out of all the heros in the storyline (except for maybe Regis) |
Kalin Xorell El'Agrivar
- High Mage of the Arcane Assembly
- Lore Keeper of the Vault of Ancestors
- 3rd Son of the Lord of the Stand |
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wwwwwww
Learned Scribe
116 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 17:10:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I personally think he's tired of Drizzt, and would prefer to write about someone else. But WotC won't let go of their biggest cash cow, and so RAS is a victim of his own success.
It's an interesting thought . . . although, you have is no way to prove such an assertion. Maybe he still loves writing about Drizzt.
Regardless, he's popular enough that he could leave WotC and strike-out on his own (which, of course, he already has). He might not make quite as much money with non-Drizzt books, but he'd more than make ends meet and get to exercise other creative directions. Unless he signed a contract awhile back that stated he HAD to write "blank number of Drizzt books,” there's nobody to force him to do so. I tend to believe that simply likes writing about Drizzt.
If his contract is just for novels (not specifically Drizzt), then we could have this scenario:
WotC: Mr. Salvatore, we don't want anything but another Drizzt volume.
Salvatore: Sorry, I'm tired of Drizzt. I have this idea for about a female Vorpal Blade wielding Master Lich Otyugh named Susie.
WotC: We won't publish that.
Salvatore: Well, that's breach of contract. I'll take my money anyway. |
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Aes Tryl
Learned Scribe
181 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 17:14:19
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| Yep its always the "I'm so tormented and nobody likes me" kinda self-doubting mentality, i feel that Salvatore should move on from there, which he is fortunately progressively doing. Regis, character-wise is pretty grounded but we know too little of his history before the series to truly connect eh |
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Snotlord
Senior Scribe
Norway
476 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 20:32:48
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| I enjoyed the Hunter series quite a bit, goofy dwarves and all. But then again, I haven't ready any Salvatore since the Icewind Dale series as a kid, and it was kinda fresh to me. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36794 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 21:04:04
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quote:
Originally posted by wwwwwww
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I personally think he's tired of Drizzt, and would prefer to write about someone else. But WotC won't let go of their biggest cash cow, and so RAS is a victim of his own success.
It's an interesting thought . . . although, you have is no way to prove such an assertion. Maybe he still loves writing about Drizzt.
True, I can't prove it... But the way he's jumped over to Entreri and Jarlaxle, and the way he's brought in characters from his Cleric Quintet, makes me think he'd like to branch out beyond Drizzt, but isn't getting the chance. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Kalin Agrivar
Senior Scribe
Canada
956 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 21:11:46
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
True, I can't prove it... But the way he's jumped over to Entreri and Jarlaxle, and the way he's brought in characters from his Cleric Quintet, makes me think he'd like to branch out beyond Drizzt, but isn't getting the chance.
I know it's negative but I'd think it's equally a marketing decision to make readers buy the older reprinted Cleric Quintet series as much as wanting to branch out |
Kalin Xorell El'Agrivar
- High Mage of the Arcane Assembly
- Lore Keeper of the Vault of Ancestors
- 3rd Son of the Lord of the Stand |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36794 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 21:26:58
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quote:
Originally posted by kalin agrivar
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
True, I can't prove it... But the way he's jumped over to Entreri and Jarlaxle, and the way he's brought in characters from his Cleric Quintet, makes me think he'd like to branch out beyond Drizzt, but isn't getting the chance.
I know it's negative but I'd think it's equally a marketing decision to make readers buy the older reprinted Cleric Quintet series as much as wanting to branch out
But those books haven't been reprinted, and they're not pushing the connection. Besides, Cadderly was the main character, not the dwarves. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Kalin Agrivar
Senior Scribe
Canada
956 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 21:33:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
But those books haven't been reprinted, and they're not pushing the connection. Besides, Cadderly was the main character, not the dwarves.
are you sure? the Cleric Quintet with all new covers? and the thick Hardcover? the ones I see on the shelves are not the same that I own...
I understood they were out of print then the-powers-that-be decided to reprint all of RAS's D&D works again
Cadderly was brought back too...the Drizzt/Catte-Brie and Cadderly/Danica meeting was like watching the old Scooby-Doo meets Jose and the *****cats crossover specials
and the dwarves were more interesting than Cadderly anyways ;) |
Kalin Xorell El'Agrivar
- High Mage of the Arcane Assembly
- Lore Keeper of the Vault of Ancestors
- 3rd Son of the Lord of the Stand |
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wwwwwww
Learned Scribe
116 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 21:51:57
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At this point in his career, I just can't imagine ANYONE forcing RAS to write about certain characters. He simply carries too much weight and could probably write about harlot ogres and someone would publish it. I have a feeling that WotC would bend over backwards to keep RAS on board, as his name alone is a cash cow.
The whole Shores of Dusk episode (Drizzt's unpublished novel by Mark Anthony) was a move by the failing and desperate TSR to "stick it" to RAS over a disagreement. That was the time period where TSR had basically burned the bridges of everyone who had worked for them. Fortunately, RAS got his way and Shores of Dusk was never published. |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3566 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 22:37:28
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quote:
Originally posted by wwwwwww
At this point in his career, I just can't imagine ANYONE forcing RAS to write about certain characters. He simply carries too much weight and could probably write about harlot ogres and someone would publish it. I have a feeling that WotC would bend over backwards to keep RAS on board, as his name alone is a cash cow.
The whole Shores of Dusk episode (Drizzt's unpublished novel by Mark Anthony) was a move by the failing and desperate TSR to "stick it" to RAS over a disagreement. That was the time period where TSR had basically burned the bridges of everyone who had worked for them. Fortunately, RAS got his way and Shores of Dusk was never published.
Thanks to the gods for that!
It would have been like me getting an "Elminster" book published!
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A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Winterfox
Senior Scribe
895 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 22:39:18
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quote:
Originally posted by wwwwwww
That was the time period where TSR had basically burned the bridges of everyone who had worked for them. Fortunately, RAS got his way and Shores of Dusk was never published.
I dunno. I find Mark Anthony a rather good writer, and enjoyed his "The Fires of Narbondel" a lot more than anything RAS has written. It'd have been interesting to see what he might have done with RAS' characters. |
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Genis
Learned Scribe
USA
226 Posts |
Posted - 08 Aug 2006 : 23:25:51
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| any of you read the war of the spider queen series? ive been thinking of starting that....and the one with daughter of the drow...i heard good things about that from a few people....any recommendations? to those books i stated or any other books you think i should start...i just finished all the drizzt books and am looking for a something new? |
Unofficial Random Hiatus Taker. |
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Genis
Learned Scribe
USA
226 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 00:29:52
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| oooo come back!!! where is everyone |
Unofficial Random Hiatus Taker. |
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wwwwwww
Learned Scribe
116 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 00:39:19
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quote:
Originally posted by WinterfoxI dunno. I find Mark Anthony a rather good writer, and enjoyed his "The Fires of Narbondel" a lot more than anything RAS has written. It'd have been interesting to see what he might have done with RAS' characters.
Have you read anything else by Mark Anthony? Just curious . . .
I won’t say anything to disparage Mark Anthony. He’s made his own mark in the fantasy genre, and Shores of Dusk might have been a good read.
However, I’m certain there’s a slew (and I mean A SLEW) of Salvatore/Drizzt fans that like their Drizzt books penned by RAS and none else. It really wouldn’t have mattered how amazing Shores of Dusk was. Drizzt wasn’t Mr. Anthony’s creation and that book would have always been perceived as the other, non-cannon account of Drizzt, and quite possibly a black-mark in the world of FR. |
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Archwizard
Learned Scribe
USA
266 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 00:52:15
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| That doesn't stop scores of other characters from dozens of other shared worlds from being written about by authors other than those who created them. That includes many of Ed Greenwood's characters, some of which RA Salvatore has used. Many of those characters have been used well by good authors who did their research. |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 00:56:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Archwizard
That doesn't stop scores of other characters from dozens of other shared worlds from being written about by authors other than those who created them. That includes many of Ed Greenwood's characters, some of which RA Salvatore has used. Many of those characters have been used well by good authors who did their research.
And some by authors who haven't done their research. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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wwwwwww
Learned Scribe
116 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 01:01:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Archwizard
That doesn't stop scores of other characters from dozens of other shared worlds from being written about by authors other than those who created them. That includes many of Ed Greenwood's characters, some of which RA Salvatore has used. Many of those characters have been used well by good authors who did their research.
Greenwood doesn't sell novels (nor garner the glowing reviews) like Salvatore. |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 01:03:12
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Bob's sales give him lots of leverage, but he and Wizards both know that the Drizzt books (and maybe the Jarlaxle/Artemis books) sell better than his non-Realms work or the Cleric Quintet. The big sales trigger is Salvatore + drow, hence the War of the Spider Queen 'R.A. Salvatore presents' series.
TSR has at times treated authors' names with disdain, on the theory that people buy (and should be encouraged to buy) books based on trademarks instead, to the extent that some of the sourcebooks don't even give their authors on the cover. Worse, this has worked, with many RPGers associating their favourite stuff with publishers before writers. So do the ENnie Awards. Whereas the Wizards books department has been much better, especially lately, about presenting their books as having been written by people. |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 01:07:09
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quote:
Originally posted by wwwwwww
Greenwood doesn't sell novels (nor garner the glowing reviews) like Salvatore.
I'm failing to get your point. Ed's reviews in the fantasy press and web-press, in Publishers Weekly and occasionally other mainstream venues, are about even with Bob's generally, as I recall. |
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wwwwwww
Learned Scribe
116 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 01:10:42
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quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
Bob's sales give him lots of leverage, but he and Wizards both know that the Drizzt books (and maybe the Jarlaxle/Artemis books) sell better than his non-Realms work or the Cleric Quintet. The big sales trigger is Salvatore + drow, hence the War of the Spider Queen 'R.A. Salvatore presents' series.
Absolutely. But, as I stated earlier, if RAS is truly tired of writing Drizzt tomes, there’s nothing to stop him from branching out. It’s his choice, not WotC. |
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Reefy
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
892 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 01:26:51
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quote:
Originally posted by wwwwwww
quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
Bob's sales give him lots of leverage, but he and Wizards both know that the Drizzt books (and maybe the Jarlaxle/Artemis books) sell better than his non-Realms work or the Cleric Quintet. The big sales trigger is Salvatore + drow, hence the War of the Spider Queen 'R.A. Salvatore presents' series.
Absolutely. But, as I stated earlier, if RAS is truly tired of writing Drizzt tomes, there’s nothing to stop him from branching out. It’s his choice, not WotC.
Hard to say unless you know what he's contract says.
Personally I'd like to see him write something completely new; he can always come back to Drizzt later on. |
Life is either daring adventure or nothing. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 01:27:37
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I'm also not really sure that I "buy" that RAS no longer enjoys writing about Drizzt. From all the little interviews and snippets I've read, RAS loves his character and still likes writing about him.
It might be true that RAS wants to "branch out" more though. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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wwwwwww
Learned Scribe
116 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2006 : 01:36:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
I'm failing to get your point. Ed's reviews in the fantasy press and web-press, in Publishers Weekly and occasionally other mainstream venues, are about even with Bob's generally, as I recall.
Do you really want me to respond to this? REALLY? It’ll probably just get deleted by the mods.
I'll say this . . . which is fairly diplomatic . . .
Go to amazon.com and start reading reviews of Ed's work by the general public. Sure, he's had a few successes. Good for him. But check out:
Elminster in Hell
or The Temptation of Elminster
or any Band of Four novel
or The Shandril Saga
or Stormlight
or Silverfall
or . . .
Ed provides amazing lore for FR fans to chew on. Beyond that, it’s not a stretch to say that his appeal doesn’t go much beyond FR fans.
Now do the same thing with RAS. Notice a difference? Not to mention the sheer amount of reviews RAS receives utterly dwarfs Greenwood.
Look, I’m not trying to say that one is awesome, and one sucks. To each his own, right. I’m merely stating facts based on third party reviews. Take them for whatever they’re worth. RAS is WotC’s man in the FR novel department. Obviously Greenwood has him beat in every other area. |
Edited by - wwwwwww on 09 Aug 2006 01:36:39 |
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Salvatore fans please!
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