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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
 Posted - 28 Sep 2006 : 00:44:57
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quote:
Originally posted by RichardBaker
I'm glad you enjoyed the read!
By way of dropping a hint about upcoming events... you can expect the Zhents and the Cormanthyran drow to come to an understanding about the new management in Myth Drannor. You can add to the story by building adventures themed around helping the elves to root out hidden drow fortresses and unmask Zhent spies.
quote:
Originally posted by Alisttair
Well I just finished reading the book. A very good read. Looks like that player in my campaign can forget about reclaiming Myth Drannon now (since we agreed to stay true to cannon)....he can help with what's going on now though :)
Great Rich, now you have piqued my curiosity AND set off the evil DM laugh I always get in my brain when I can spring something on my players . . . (eagarly awaiting clarification on the Zhent/Drow "agreement") |
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Mace Hammerhand
Great Reader
Germany
2296 Posts |
Posted - 28 Sep 2006 : 08:19:51
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quote:
Originally posted by RichardBaker
I'm glad you enjoyed the read!
By way of dropping a hint about upcoming events... you can expect the Zhents and the Cormanthyran drow to come to an understanding about the new management in Myth Drannor. You can add to the story by building adventures themed around helping the elves to root out hidden drow fortresses and unmask Zhent spies.
Although my campaign is about 8 years away from the events it's great to know that I will be able to annoy my players with drow and Zhents as a team in the future.
Will the unfolding events have any impact on the Moonstars' plans that did involve Myth Drannor, or was the reclaiming of Myth Drannor part of what Khelben had forseen? |
Mace's not so gentle gamer's journal My rants were harmless compared to this, beware! |
Edited by - Mace Hammerhand on 28 Sep 2006 08:28:50 |
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J D Dunsany
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
180 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jul 2007 : 01:37:53
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Late to the party again...
*grumble, grumble*
(At least I've brought something better than cheesy nibbles. Well, I hope I have anyway...)
Well, I finished the book a few days ago, but, knowing from one or two passing comments that Final Gate is a novel that has divided opinion somewhat, I thought I'd better have a proper think about it before I posted my usual meanderings. The very many interesting comments that precede these were very useful too in ordering my thoughts, for which I give due thanks - even if I happen to disagree with some of them.
So, here goes. Oh, there are spoilers in the next few paragraphs, btw - just in case anyone hasn't read the book yet.
Starting with the generalities, let me first say that I've really enjoyed the series and this novel in particular. I've read a fair few Realms novels now (although nowhere near as many as a lot of people on these boards) and I remain constantly exhilirated by the variety of possible stories the setting can generate. The 'Last Mythal' series marks itself out very early on as being in the 'epic' category and it's been a very entertaining and, at times, very thrilling ride.
A number of people have, both in this thread and others, commented on the appropriateness or otherwise of dealing with such momentous events as the Crusade/Return of the elves and the defeat of House Dlardrageth in novel form, arguing, if I'm reading them right, that dramatic changes to the established setting should not be taken so directly out of players' hands. If I'm honest, I have some sympathy with that position. But then, I have some sympathy with the authors' and designers' position too. The Realms are, after all, meant to be a living breathing changing world and this particular change is one I actually rather like. The idea of the elves seeing a need to Return and permanently settle in Myth Drannor works for me. The way the change is portrayed - debate and then Crusade in the first novel, followed by a sharp series of lessons in human politicking in the second and third - seems both sensible and intriguing. It also, it seems to me, opens up a fair few opportunities for campaign and scenario ideas, even as it closes others off.
Ultimately, of course, my opinion is largely determined by the fact that, when it comes to the Realms, I'm more of a reader than a player. And it's as a reader that I want to make most of my comments.
The first thing to point out, I suppose, is that Baker can write. His prose is clear, crisp and largely free of some of the clunkier fantasy cliches. His sense of space is very impressive; I particularly enjoyed the descriptions of the journeys to Lorosfyr and through the Barrens, both very threatening and disturbing albeit in quite different ways.
Where he falls down a little, as has already been mentioned elsewhere in this thread, is in his depiction of characters, particularly elves. Partly this is due to the practical constraints of handling a fairly large cast in a short(ish) space, but partly, I think, it's to do with the elves themselves. My previous experience with Faerunian elves in any great number was Ed's Elminster in Myth Drannor, a novel that takes the isolationist political outlook of elves as hinted at in LOTR and weds it rather deliciously with an almost wanton sensuality and interestingly contingent morality. The elves of old Myth Drannor were a scheming, vicious lot (something that Baker acknowledges in a highly effective prologue) and, although there is some contrast of political opinion in Evermeet in the first novel, the elves of the Crusade in this one are too noble to be as interesting as they should be. To be fair, this isn't true of characters like Fflar and Seiveril, but it is of the second string characters like Gaerradh, Jorildyn and Felael. It's even true of characters who seemed more three-dimensional in the second novel than they do in this one - between them, Jorin and Nesterin don't seem to have enough personality for one character, let alone two!
As I've already mentioned, though, I think this is more to do with the fact that this novel is all about elves acting a certain way - if most of your characters are elves and almost all of them are acting with the same reserve, commitment and focus, differentiating between them is going to be problematic. It's significant that, of Arevin's adventuring party, it's the two non-elf characters who stand out as memorable creations - Maresa, in fact, is someone I'd happily shell out another six quid to read about.
As to the villains, well Malkizid's great and I'm hoping it won't be too long before he's back. Baker does a great job of portraying his 'silky' evil and the description of the voice puts me in mind of Sutekh from Doctor Who's 'Pyramids of Mars'. Once again, Baker's felicity with description of place works well here to communicate the extent of Malkizid's evil - the descriptions of elegant elven architecture bound in devilish iron are memorable and very effective.
Sarya is perhaps lacking in some tactical astuteness, but, with all the extra help she's been getting (plus the personal humiliation she's had to undergo to get it), it does make a certain kind of sense for her to fly off the handle in the way that she does. Her demise is, perhaps, a little too convenient and is overshadowed by the destruction of the Waymeet, but, nevertheless, it's memorable and... well, there's that word again... 'epic'. (There's a nice piece of misdirection by the author, too, that, at one point, leads you to think she's going to survive, plotting and scheming her revenge.)
As far as the plot goes, well, yes, I thought it was a tad rushed, but, looking back on it now, it's actually quite surprising to see how much is crammed into these 340 pages. A curious kind of inversion took place in this novel, I thought. In the first novel of the trilogy, it was the politics and the epic battle scenes that really grabbed my attention, while Arevin's quest seemed a little too generic and formulaic. In this novel, though, it's the quest sections that really stand out - as they should, because that's where the main action is really taking place.
Araevin's own personal journey - including the loss of Ilsevele to Fflar - is handled with welcome maturity and dignity (not to mention at least some sort of realism - see, you can't get virtually unlimited power and the girl!), as is Fflar's coming to terms with his own personal return during the course of the trilogy. The Realms regulars are also handled well - particularly Scyllua Darkhope (loved the scene with the beholder) and Miklos Selkirk.
All in all, then, I enjoyed this immensely. I'm glad that every Realms tale isn't like this one, but I'm equally glad that, every so often, there's space to tell a story as bold and broad and, well, 'epic' as this one, too.
All the best!
JDD |
"How content that young woman looks, don't you think? How content, and yet how flammable." - Lemony Snicket, The Unauthorized Autobiography |
Edited by - J D Dunsany on 31 Jul 2007 13:07:01 |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jul 2007 : 02:57:10
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Thanks for sharing your thoughts, JDD. The novel certainly didn't leave the same impression on me as it did on you, but I find it interesting to read about what other people thought, even if I may not necessarily agree with them.
BTW, I did rather like Lorosfyr, myself. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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J D Dunsany
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
180 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jul 2007 : 13:10:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Thanks for sharing your thoughts, JDD. The novel certainly didn't leave the same impression on me as it did on you, but I find it interesting to read about what other people thought, even if I may not necessarily agree with them.
BTW, I did rather like Lorosfyr, myself.
Thanks for your kind comments, Rinonalyrna. As I think I've remarked elsewhere, life would be dreadfully dull if people agreed with each other all the time. I'm always grateful for Candlekeep as a place where such differences of opinion can be aired in a (reasonably) calm and eloquent manner.
One thing I forgot to mention, actually, was that my favourite 'bit' in the novel (or at least the bit that made me chuckle the most) was Fflar's desperate attempt to warn Ilsevele of the drow trap. The image of him crashing through the window and careering headlong into the meeting chamber will live long in the memory - a kind of drunken, elven Superman. 
Regards, as always...
JDD |
"How content that young woman looks, don't you think? How content, and yet how flammable." - Lemony Snicket, The Unauthorized Autobiography |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 01 Aug 2007 : 02:27:21
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quote:
Originally posted by J D Dunsany
Thanks for your kind comments, Rinonalyrna. As I think I've remarked elsewhere, life would be dreadfully dull if people agreed with each other all the time.
Now that's something I can...agree on. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Final Gate (spoilers)
