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Originally posted by kalin agrivar


I know not all these places are 100% elf population but like I said, where are all these elves coming from? It doesn’t look like a Return but an Invasion

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That city isn't specifically for elves, it's for people of all races who are willing to keep Oacenth's vow. It's also a magical place that you have to be invited to--you can't just move in there, and only a few select people even KNOW it exists.

I consider that city to be the true New Myth Drannor, actually, in spirit if not in location.

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The Northern Kingdom is like Evermeet, a elven stronghold that protects against non-elves wiether it be friend or foe. A secret resort for Elven safety.

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Originally posted by GothicDan
That wasn't what the kingdom was supposed to represent. The Elves don't NEED another Evermeet; there's plenty of room in the one they have now.

The Northern Kingdom, as you put it, was supposed to be the new hope for the Elves of Faerun resettling the mainland.

Slowly.

Not in a burst of fireballs and lightning bolts and other such hack-and-slash.

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Originally posted by kalin agrivar


Now there is Myth Drannor, Myth Glaurach, Rhymanthiin, the “new homeland” where the Tree of Souls is planted in the arctic

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Originally posted by Foxhelm

Cormanthyr has developed over time into a place that can be home to all races that accept the nature of goodness and respect for magic and the environment...

Remember, the Crownblade can only be claimed by one who is willing to aid in the former Coronal's dream of racial harmony. Since it has been claimed, this dream must be alive again.

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Originally posted by GothicDan

That wasn't what the kingdom was supposed to represent. The Elves don't NEED another Evermeet; there's plenty of room in the one they have now.

The Northern Kingdom, as you put it, was supposed to be the new hope for the Elves of Faerun resettling the mainland.

Slowly.

Not in a burst of fireballs and lightning bolts and other such hack-and-slash.

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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

[quote]
Hold on a moment. Nowhere has it been said--as far as I know, that Myth Glaurach has been resettled. It's simply being watched over by the "forces of good" at the current time, to keep enemies like the fey'ri from coming back to it. It *might* be retaken in the future, but there are tons of factors involved with that (Where will the new settlers get food and water? Can trade flourish there? Are the surrounding lands too dangerous?), and being watched over does NOT equal "resettled".

Myth Glaurach is currently NOT a restored elven city, it's still a ruin.

And let's be honest: a good portion of your list consists of "might-be"s and speculation.

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Originally posted by GothicDan

Perhaps it's just 3E trying to portray Elves differently?

Which makes me sad, considering how much I liked them before. They felt very much like not-humans-with-funny-ears.

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Originally posted by kalin agrivar

And I don't have the novel with me but I'm sure it was slated to be resettled until the Crusade swung to Myth Drannor

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Originally posted by GothicDan

A lot of people have been sick of Elves for a long time, actually. :)

I'm just not one of them.

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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
I'm honestly not sure where you are getting this idea--I don't recall reading any such thing in the novels.

Also, my little list of questions was rhetorical--also, there are many more factors that go into resettling of a former ruin (including getting enough people to just up and *settle* there), and I don't think it's going to be as simple and quick as you are making it out to be.

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I don't think it's going to be as simple and quick as you are making it out to be.

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Originally posted by kalin agrivar

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I don't think it's going to be as simple and quick as you are making it out to be.

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The retaking of Myth Drannor was!

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Originally posted by Mkhaiwati

I can't believe that the elves will just walk away from an old mythal in a land once ruled by them.

correction: an old mythal that was strengthened and purified of the elements that Sarya and Malkizid inserted into it, and was paid for in elvish blood.

In the epilogue of Forsaken House, Seiveril talks of continuing his crusade, and when asked what will happen to empty Myth Glaurach, he says "it won't be empty" and continues that the folk of the High Forest and the Silver MArches will watch over the place when they leave.

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Originally posted by Wandering_mage

I agree. I was on my seat the whole way through the series. Rich knew what he was doing.

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Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

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Originally posted by Wandering_mage

I agree. I was on my seat the whole way through the series. Rich knew what he was doing.

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What, do you normally read standing up?

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Originally posted by krocha
As for the battle with the fiendish army being unrealistic, I can't see how that statement can be made. This is an heroic epic. Maybe 9 out of 10 times if this type of battle happened again the fiends would win but this one time the heroes all rolled 20's... Is it probable? No. But possible, yes, and as long as it's possible then I have no problem with it. Drannor.

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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Well yeah...if the only silly/unrealistic/inconsistent thing about the trilogy was the heroes "rolling all 20s", I probably would have liked trilogy a lot more. As it stands, I saw a lot more problems with it than that.

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I just finished Final Gate today, at a snooze-a-thon family gathering... and I find myself backing Rinonalyrna Fathomlin's position and comments pretty much all the way down the line.
Maybe it's because I don't have and thus haven't read Forsaken House; maybe it was reading a bunch of spoilers back when I thought I hadn't a prayer of actually finding and reading the novels; maybe it's because I took a two-month break six pages into chapter five; maybe it's because the dialogue mostly comes across as... well, flat, clichéd, or both; but of Araevin's team, Maresa's the only one who strikes me as having any personality at all (and that's counting Araevin himself). I had a hard time telling the others apart, and a harder one really caring about their fates. Indeed, with the exception of the Lorosfyr sequences and the Crusade's battles with Sarya's forces outside of Myth Drannor itself - the final investment of the city was oddly disappointing, and Seiveril mainly died of a case of the dumbs - I found myself curiously unmoved by the book as a whole.

That said, the Underdark sequences were some of the most evocative depictions of that realm that I've ever seen - that chasm was downright spooky, and nothing really happened there until they got into the depths.

Semi-random observations:
Now, it may have been a blink-and-you'll-miss-it moment, but did anyone read the description of The Pale Sybil while she was propositioning Araevin (p.159 - in Ch.09, with my apologies) and wonder if she might be a Sharran? If so, would anyone care to speculate as to whether she might return from her planar dislocation and cause trouble in the upcoming module trilogy about the trauma to the Weave? ISTR that Shar's slated to get involved in that....

The mention of apple trees in Lorosfyr is quite heartening, given my own use thereof in a recent Candlekeep Compedium contribution detailing an Underdark civilisation. It's a nice touch in its own right, of course, but finding a hint of canon support for a semi-random touch of my own is pretty cool.

Finally, the Zhents are shown winning one! Granted, my only previous experience with them was through Spellfire and Crown of Fire, but (owing to various editorial limitations) those books created an unfortunate impression, in that it was pretty hard to take the Zhentarim seriously when they spent most of their word-count getting squashed by the Hero of the Day. Now, though, they've not only capitalised on the misfortunes of and defeated one of their bitterest rivals, they've broken Hillsfar and (per Bane's doctrine) are unlikely to relax their grip in the foreseeable future, making pretty much the entire Moonsea 'a Zhentish lake'.
(Calling all Harpers: you've got biiig problems north of Shadowdale....)

All in all, as a plot-driven novel, Final Gate is pretty good. But for getting a true sense of the characters, understanding their motivations and feelings, and living their pain and turmoil as they go through all of these upheavals in Faerūn's history and social/political landscape...
... well, it's a good plot-driven novel.
Sorry to say it, Richard, but I have to call 'em like I see 'em. Maybe the editors took out a little too much when they were trimming the manuscript down for printing?

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Originally posted by Trace_Coburn
Now, it may have been a blink-and-you'll-miss-it moment, but did anyone read the description of The Pale Sybil while she was propositioning Araevin (p.159 - in Ch.09, with my apologies) and wonder if she might be a Sharran? If so, would anyone care to speculate as to whether she might return from her planar dislocation and cause trouble in the upcoming module trilogy about the trauma to the Weave? ISTR that Shar's slated to get involved in that....

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Originally posted by Trace_Coburn
All in all, as a plot-driven novel, Final Gate is pretty good. But for getting a true sense of the characters, understanding their motivations and feelings, and living their pain and turmoil as they go through all of these upheavals in Faerūn's history and social/political landscape...
... well, it's a good plot-driven novel.
Sorry to say it, Richard, but I have to call 'em like I see 'em. Maybe the editors took out a little too much when they were trimming the manuscript down for printing? [/font=Trebuchet MS]

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