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Originally posted by Beirnadri Magranth

I dont really think they had a choice in later abandoning the ruins of Myth Glaurach. They needed all their strength for the fight for the ruins of Myth Drannor.
Anyway, I liked the way malkizid was destroyed but I don't really believe that he's gone for good. I agree with Richard writing with characters of immense age or power is very difficult so I don't blame him that many readers won't recognize that he has been planning contingencies etc for longer than most human kingdoms have existed. The way he fought is more or less what I expected from him... he thought Araevin et al. would fight him whereas they just were toying with him till they got in position.

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Originally posted by RichardBaker

One thing I discovered in working on this series is that elves (rather like aliens in SF) are very, very difficult to write well. Either you make them just like humans with pointy ears, or you try to make them something essentially different and risk losing some of the depth or "texture" readers expect from human characters. I felt that the humans-with-pointy-ears approach was a cop-out, so I took a run at the second option. Araevin, Seiveril, Ilsevele, they're all innately good people... noble, generous, courageous, almost inhumanly so. That's the fantasy of the Last Mythal's elven characters--not that they're just as realistic or believable as real people, but instead they're *better* than just about anybody you would ever meet in real life. And so at times they may ring a little false.

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Originally posted by RichardBaker

As far as the characters *I* liked, well, I felt that Fflar was the most interesting character, really. Coming to terms with his resurrection, the idea that his wife came to love someone else after his death, his attraction to Ilsevele--there was some good stuff there. I was especially proud of the scene where he found his wife's grave. Maresa, on the other hand, was easy. She was just a smartass, but I guess she "stuck" where other characters didn't. Go figure. Smartass = good characterization, hero mourning a wife who showed up in Arvandor married to someone else = cardboard cutout. Clearly I don't know as much about this business as I thought I did (which wasn't all that much anyway!)

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Originally posted by Lord Rad

I read a similiar explanation of how to portray non-human races recently in a Warhammer 40,000 book. The author stated that they will always write from the viewpoint of the Imperium (humans) as that is what we, the reader (and the author, of course), can relate too. Writing from the alien's point of view would just give them a human feel and logical methods and actions with just a different visual appearance.

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Originally posted by RichardBaker

No worries, Trace. I set out to write a strongly plot-driven story. Sometimes plot serves the characters, sometimes characters serve the plot. In Last Mythal, I hoped to create a "technothriller" in the Realms--a Tom Clancy-style action-based story. I tried hard to craft interesting and empathic characters within that overall plot-driven framework, with apparently mixed results.

One thing I discovered in working on this series is that elves (rather like aliens in SF) are very, very difficult to write well. Either you make them just like humans with pointy ears, or you try to make them something essentially different and risk losing some of the depth or "texture" readers expect from human characters. I felt that the humans-with-pointy-ears approach was a cop-out, so I took a run at the second option. Araevin, Seiveril, Ilsevele, they're all innately good people... noble, generous, courageous, almost inhumanly so. That's the fantasy of the Last Mythal's elven characters--not that they're just as realistic or believable as real people, but instead they're *better* than just about anybody you would ever meet in real life. And so at times they may ring a little false.

As far as the characters *I* liked, well, I felt that Fflar was the most interesting character, really. Coming to terms with his resurrection, the idea that his wife came to love someone else after his death, his attraction to Ilsevele--there was some good stuff there. I was especially proud of the scene where he found his wife's grave. Maresa, on the other hand, was easy. She was just a smartass, but I guess she "stuck" where other characters didn't. Go figure. Smartass = good characterization, hero mourning a wife who showed up in Arvandor married to someone else = cardboard cutout. Clearly I don't know as much about this business as I thought I did (which wasn't all that much anyway!)

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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

If elves are so very alien, how come they can breed with humans (and other creatures) and produce non-sterile offspring? And that's only one similarity (they wear clothes, have relationships, have culture, worship gods, and so forth). They aren't xenomorphs.

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Originally posted by Lord Rad
I didn't say that they were. I was refering to the comment by the author of a Warhammer 40,000 book featuring an alien race (Tyranids), which I felt was similiar to what Richard said earlier.

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Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin

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Originally posted by Lord Rad
I didn't say that they were. I was refering to the comment by the author of a Warhammer 40,000 book featuring an alien race (Tyranids), which I felt was similiar to what Richard said earlier.

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I mentioned that because while I agree that elves shouldn't be depicted as "humans with pointy-ears", I also disagree with the opposite argument that seems to have cropped up here: that elves are so alien to humans that we could never understand them, and their characters just can't ring true to us if they are written properly (if I misunderstood anything here, I do apologize).

I've thought about this for a while, and overall I think elves as they are depicted in D&D share more similarities with humans then differences (they can mate with humans, for goodness sake) so I'm just having trouble "buying" the "elves are alien" argument.

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Originally posted by Octa

Rich- In all honesty I really loved the book, and I thought the characterization was actually pretty good, trust me I have grown pretty picky in my old age and the only FR authors I can stomach now are You, Ed, Paul Kemp and Steven Schend.

Some people like the characters in their novels to have expository soliliquies (sp?) where they bare their souls in order for the readers to understand their 'characters' and some don't, you don't write in that way and it means it takes alot more to get your point across. I.e. its much easier to say 'Araevin was afraid' or have him internal monologue about how he hasn't been this afraid since the Balrog ate his sister, than it is to show how he is afraid descriptively, by action, body posture etc....

Part of it just might be age, I suspect the younger people like and expect those soliloques in their fantasy more than us old times.

The one thing I will say is that you should have kept the old fat lovable first priest of Lathander in the Mix, Donnor was just too much of a dudley do right.

I think that overall the Ilseve, Seveiril, and Fflar parts of the story line worked better than the Araevin story line. The Araevin story line had too many characters, the yuirwood ranger, the star elf bard, the lathanderite and the thief, I would have increased the tension by killing them all off one by one until only Araevin was left, although I guess they needed at least three warm bodies to use the Gate Keepers crystal.

The scenes that cast doubt on Fflar's motives were particulary good, and overall Ilseve, Fflar and Seveiril really came alive, at least for me, so thanks for a great book, :)

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