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ywhtptgtfo
Seeker
89 Posts |
 Posted - 28 Jan 2004 : 19:30:37
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| Everyone forgot about Dendar the NightSerpent. |
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EcThelion
Learned Scribe
Norway
323 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jan 2004 : 23:13:17
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Who?  |
Ec'Thelion, formerly known as Forgotten One, now known as Ec'Thelion the Overpowered.
Currently not all that active. I'm preoccupied with Warcraft III for the moment. Bite me :P |
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Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jan 2004 : 00:58:44
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| Shar does not "want this" as you put it. Shar wants the destruction and annihalation of everything, including her own worshipers! She wants Cyric gone, not glorified. |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
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ywhtptgtfo
Seeker
89 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jan 2004 : 02:59:36
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| Dendar is one of the elder evils who is destined to destroy the world. |
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Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jan 2004 : 03:03:35
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Dendar the Night Serpent: Dendar the Night Serpent came into existence shortly after the first being slept and had a nightmare. She has an uncountable horde of horrible dreams and foul visions in her gullet that she has been devouring since the dawn of time. She relishes the taste of particularly choice nightmares and savors the dreams of kings and deities alike. More horrifying, if she did not feed her insatiable appetite, every being, mortal or deity, would remember every nightmare he or she has ever dreamed in excruciating detail. Supposedly, she will be the harbinger of the end of the world and even the gods themselves.
The Night Serpent’s slit-pupiled eyes are the sickly yellow-black of rotten eggs. Her forked tongue flickers incessantly over her smooth lips. Her monstrous fangs are always coated with the viscous essence of lost dreams. She speaks with a sibilant, malignant voice that drips with ancient horrors. Midnight-black scales over her colossal hide and serve as the physical embodiment of the most terrifying nightmares she has swallowed.
Although she can slither across the Barrens of Doom and Despair or any of the lower planes at will, the Night Serpent is almost always found in her lair. Dendar lives in a vast cave near the oozing river that surrounds much of the Fugue Plane. The hiss of the Night Serpent’s breathing echoes through the plane as she sleeps, contentedly gorged on the world’s unremembered nightmares. Anyone who approaches her cave finds her awake and awaiting them with anticipatory delight as she savors and relives their worst unremembered nightmares. Her cavernous maw is large enough to swallow a giant, and her tongue can knock an armored man to the ground with a single flick. Beneath her tongue is a foul mire of greasy spittle and half-devoured bones -- the corporeal manifestations of her dream diet’s remnants.
To the ancient Rus, Dendar was known as Nidhogg, the serpent who gnaws at the roots of the world tree that connects all things. In Calimport, she is known (incorrectly) as the Mother of the Night Parade. In the Jungles of Chult, Dendar is known as the Eater of the World. Legends tell of how Ubtao, Creator of Chult, will battle the Night Serpent when she emerges through a gigantic iron door located beneath one of the Peaks of Flame and attempts to eat the sun. If Ubtao fails in his duty, the stories say Dendar will readily devour the sun and the doom of the world will finally arrive.
There you go. A complete history of the Night Serpent. You're welcome, by the way. |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
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Cyric
Senior Scribe
Norway
388 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jan 2004 : 15:16:42
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| I find that hard to belive all things but i must say i read it befor how could any one want all things dead ? And like i said Cyric could take her. |
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DDH_101
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1272 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jan 2004 : 17:02:22
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| You can also find out more about Dendar in Prince of Lies. BTW, I was reading Prince of Lies and I read about how there was once an ancient evil that was as powerful as Ao and how the gods had to band together to defeat it. Is it true? |
"Trust in the shadows, for the bright way makes you an easy target." -Mask |
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ywhtptgtfo
Seeker
89 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jan 2004 : 18:00:26
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Shar wants everything to be non-existent, not just dead.
Her clergy is much stronger than Cyric's and she has her own source of magic. I don't see how Cyric can beat her. |
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EcThelion
Learned Scribe
Norway
323 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jan 2004 : 18:27:10
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She doesn't sound that tough.
The fact that she can kill Armored Knights with her tounge does not impress me. My mage can do that, too.  If she is so potentally powerful, why doesn't somebody kill her? Shouldn't be that tough for one of the Greater Dietys.
quote:
Shar wants everything to be non-existent, not just dead.
Aaaaaand- why do people worship this lunatic? 
And is the religion known as "Suicidals United"?  |
Ec'Thelion, formerly known as Forgotten One, now known as Ec'Thelion the Overpowered.
Currently not all that active. I'm preoccupied with Warcraft III for the moment. Bite me :P |
Edited by - EcThelion on 29 Jan 2004 23:47:33 |
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Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jan 2004 : 20:11:33
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| No, they own a shop in Waterdeep called Idiots Unlimited..... |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
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Cherrn
Learned Scribe
Denmark
323 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jan 2004 : 20:44:01
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quote:
Originally posted by ywhtptgtfo
Shar wants everything to be non-existent, not just dead.
Her clergy is much stronger than Cyric's and she has her own source of magic. I don't see how Cyric can beat her.
Shar's clergy is not stronger than Cyric's. Cyric's clergy number 12000ish and Shar's number 3500ish. Judging by stats Cyric's is a whole lot stronger than Shar's. Also given the strife in Cyric's church one would imagine that the ones sitting on top would be extremely powerful since the fought the way there themselves. Whereas in Shars church one could get there through deals and politics.
Given the above stated numbers I can understand why Shar wants to ally with Cyric. |
A wise man from Calimport once told me: "If a merchant puts sand in the flask of oil he's trying to sell you, then he isn't trying to sell you sand..." |
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Cyric
Senior Scribe
Norway
388 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jan 2004 : 22:03:55
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Cherrn i have a god feling about you have you have sen the glorys of Cyric to. And yes we all se why Shar would ally with him being so powerful. And that thing all the gods banded toghter to take was the caos hound or somthing like that, he eats faithful souls there is some one the gods shuld band toghter to slay.
And people in Cyric curch is powerful that why they are so danguros so, Worst threat to Faerun? = Cyric
and whats the diffrens betwen non-existent and dead ? |
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Edain Shadowstar
Senior Scribe
USA
455 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jan 2004 : 22:43:09
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| Shar and Cyric allying? Have you been dipping into the Black Lotus again folks? Shar is the last person to really ally with anyone, lets be fair, and Cyric is not much better. They both are the backstabbing types, and while it qworks for them as deities, it does not work well in alliances. And let's clarify, Shar does not want everything dead and non-existant, she wants all the world covered in darkness in shadow, it's different. |
Edain Shadowstar
Archwizard of Rel Astra and Waterdeep
"Mmm…pie…"
- Gaius Solarian, Captain General |
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Cherrn
Learned Scribe
Denmark
323 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jan 2004 : 22:52:21
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Actually it did say in one of the sourcebooks that Shar was considering allying with Cyric. Now I just have to find which one. *goes off to rummage through his gajillion scrolls*
hmmm "Drow! How to cook and prepare them" by Mepdilflass the Mindflayer, nope not that one *searches some more*.
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A wise man from Calimport once told me: "If a merchant puts sand in the flask of oil he's trying to sell you, then he isn't trying to sell you sand..." |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jan 2004 : 01:37:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Cyric
Cherrn i have a god feling about you have you have sen the glorys of Cyric to. And yes we all se why Shar would ally with him being so powerful. And that thing all the gods banded toghter to take was the caos hound or somthing like that, he eats faithful souls there is some one the gods shuld band toghter to slay.
And people in Cyric curch is powerful that why they are so danguros so, Worst threat to Faerun? = Cyric
and whats the diffrens betwen non-existent and dead ?
There is considerable difference between non-existence and being dead. In most campaigns, being dead equates to being alive at some point on a chronological timeline, being alive and then dead upon the Temporal Prime. Non-existence can mean any number of things, from never being born, to existing more as an essence or concept. Essentially it means that something (that could have been alive under different circumstances) never actually received the spark of life granted to it, to bring it into Temporal Prime existence.
Underneath it all, time is the controlling factor...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jan 2004 : 01:47:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Cherrn
Actually it did say in one of the sourcebooks that Shar was considering allying with Cyric. Now I just have to find which one. *goes off to rummage through his gajillion scrolls*
hmmm "Drow! How to cook and prepare them" by Mepdilflass the Mindflayer, nope not that one *searches some more*.
You do know I'm going to have to destroy that book, don't you? |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
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Cherrn
Learned Scribe
Denmark
323 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jan 2004 : 07:05:59
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| Huhh errr what book? *discreetly pushes something under a bookshelf* |
A wise man from Calimport once told me: "If a merchant puts sand in the flask of oil he's trying to sell you, then he isn't trying to sell you sand..." |
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Edain Shadowstar
Senior Scribe
USA
455 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jan 2004 : 20:03:24
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Some days I hate going into the Third Edition shelves and taking down the Third Edition sourcebooks; so pretty, yet so inferior to their Second Edition predecessors, at least to me. Well, it seems the correct way to phrase Shar's primary goal is:
quote:
Originally from Faiths & Pantheons:
Her heart longs for a return to the calm of nonexistance, and she schemes from the shadows to tear down establishments, destroy order, and undermine all creation.
So it seems ywhtptgtfo was, in fact, correct. My apologies, so as you see even I can be wrong. Honestly, I think selune needs to be a Greater Deity, otherwise Shar's power is not properly checked. In general Shar and Selune have been fighting for all of Toril's history, and for the most part none of the other deities involve themselves in it, save Mystryl/Mystra. Just my feelings. |
Edain Shadowstar
Archwizard of Rel Astra and Waterdeep
"Mmm…pie…"
- Gaius Solarian, Captain General |
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Cyric
Senior Scribe
Norway
388 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jan 2004 : 21:15:09
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| yes but it is a fact that Shar wants to ally with Cyric, the world coverd in darkness is one thing but to end all life that is madnes, no one could suport that not even Talos |
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ywhtptgtfo
Seeker
89 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jan 2004 : 23:41:42
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Shar's clergy is not stronger than Cyric's. Cyric's clergy number 12000ish and Shar's number 3500ish
The known members of Shar's clergy perhaps? There are a lot of hidden pockets of Shar's followers. One of them would be the City of Shade which has the population of around 25000 (I suppose at least 3000 of them would be Shar's puppies).
Another thing, not every follower of a god belongs in a clergy. Alustriel is a follower of Mystra, but is not a cleric of her church.
the world coverd in darkness is one thing but to end all life that is madnes, no one could suport that not even Talos
Destruction is one of Talo's main portfolio. If non-existent is achieved, there must've been a lot of destruction done beforehand.
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2004 : 01:35:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Edain Shadowstar
Some days I hate going into the Third Edition shelves and taking down the Third Edition sourcebooks; so pretty, yet so inferior to their Second Edition predecessors, at least to me. Well, it seems the correct way to phrase Shar's primary goal is:
quote:
Originally from Faiths & Pantheons:
Her heart longs for a return to the calm of nonexistance, and she schemes from the shadows to tear down establishments, destroy order, and undermine all creation.
So it seems ywhtptgtfo was, in fact, correct. My apologies, so as you see even I can be wrong. Honestly, I think selune needs to be a Greater Deity, otherwise Shar's power is not properly checked. In general Shar and Selune have been fighting for all of Toril's history, and for the most part none of the other deities involve themselves in it, save Mystryl/Mystra. Just my feelings.
Actually I agree with you Edain. It is much more of an appropriate pairing, however I think outside circumstances (and the reshaping of the setting from 2e to 3e) have forced the current situation between Shar and Selune into it's now obvious position.
Oh well...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Edain Shadowstar
Senior Scribe
USA
455 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2004 : 01:54:26
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| For such a classic, and important piece of Realmsian history, the conflict between Shar and Selune has been oddly downplayed of late, in favor of the Mystra/Shar confrontation. In of itself it does not make very much sense, as Selune and Shar are a logical pairing, one being light and the other darkness; one being creation the other being destruction; it is a very classic mythological pairing, the forces of choas and order, creation and destruction. Too bad Wizards wants to create more complexities int he magic system rather than stick with what is good. |
Edain Shadowstar
Archwizard of Rel Astra and Waterdeep
"Mmm…pie…"
- Gaius Solarian, Captain General |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2004 : 02:31:35
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Just out of curiousity Edain, do you emphasize the Shar and Selune pairing, or the do you focus more upon the conflict between Shar and Mystra in your campaigns...?
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Cherrn
Learned Scribe
Denmark
323 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2004 : 03:24:53
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quote:
Originally posted by ywhtptgtfo
The known members of Shar's clergy perhaps? There are a lot of hidden pockets of Shar's followers. One of them would be the City of Shade which has the population of around 25000 (I suppose at least 3000 of them would be Shar's puppies).
Another thing, not every follower of a god belongs in a clergy. Alustriel is a follower of Mystra, but is not a cleric of her church.
Yes I am well aware of that. But as it is said in "Lords of Darkness" supplement.
Cyric's clergy: 12000
Shar's clergy: 3500
Number of worshipers of Cyric: 250000
Number of worshipers of Shar: As many as 100000
I would think that "Lords of Darkness" shows the actual number and not the number known to others seeing as how it has a whole lot of other incriminating details. So going by that, Cyric's church is way more powerful than Shar's. That's why Shar would want to ally with Cyric, to try and get him to be a puppet to her. Given the past history with Cyric (Prince of Lies and Crucible), I have a feeling that it will blow up in Shar's face of she tried to goad Cyric around. |
A wise man from Calimport once told me: "If a merchant puts sand in the flask of oil he's trying to sell you, then he isn't trying to sell you sand..." |
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Edain Shadowstar
Senior Scribe
USA
455 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2004 : 03:50:54
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| Well, currently in my core campaign Shar is still butting heads with Mystra, though it has not quite escalated to the ugly place yet. Apparently Shar did not take well to Shade getting grouded. Oh well. I have also been setting the stage of Selune to ascend to the rank of Greater Deity, so I can bring her more into the mix, that is pit her and Shar off against each other. Of course I am also pushing the little Bane and Cyric chess pieces together, but that is secondary. Also, I smell a Godswar int he furture (maybe) to thin out the herd, as it were. |
Edain Shadowstar
Archwizard of Rel Astra and Waterdeep
"Mmm…pie…"
- Gaius Solarian, Captain General |
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DDH_101
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1272 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2004 : 04:30:22
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| Cherrn is right. If you have read the Faiths and Pantheons manual, it talks about the average amount of followers a demigod, lesser deity, intermediate, and greater deity have. Greater deities have at least 1 million worshipers. It's impossible for Shar to have only 3000 followers since even a lesser deity like Torm has like 10 thousand. |
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Edain Shadowstar
Senior Scribe
USA
455 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2004 : 04:36:57
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| I believe the difference is that 3,000 (or whatever the number is) is the number of clergy of Shar. Technically the Church means the clergy, not really lay worshippers. I am sure Shar has mor ethan a million worshippers, but only a fraction of them are her priests and priestesses. |
Edain Shadowstar
Archwizard of Rel Astra and Waterdeep
"Mmm…pie…"
- Gaius Solarian, Captain General |
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DDH_101
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1272 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2004 : 04:51:10
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| Hmmm... I guess you are right. I think it was just misinterpretation of what he said. Lol. |
"Trust in the shadows, for the bright way makes you an easy target." -Mask |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2004 : 06:00:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Edain Shadowstar
Well, currently in my core campaign Shar is still butting heads with Mystra, though it has not quite escalated to the ugly place yet. Apparently Shar did not take well to Shade getting grouded. Oh well. I have also been setting the stage of Selune to ascend to the rank of Greater Deity, so I can bring her more into the mix, that is pit her and Shar off against each other. Of course I am also pushing the little Bane and Cyric chess pieces together, but that is secondary. Also, I smell a Godswar int he furture (maybe) to thin out the herd, as it were.
Hmm...that's interesting. I've been laying the groundwork in my own campaign for Selune to ascend to a higher status among the Faerunian pantheon. I'm hoping to eventually restore the Shar/Selune rivalry that seems to make more sense. But this overall upheaval is mainly due to small flashpoints/conflicts in the general deity hierarchy that already threatens a universal Gods-War between a number of human and demi-human pantheons.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Cyric
Senior Scribe
Norway
388 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2004 : 10:42:24
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yes and any one who says the Shar is more powerful then Cyric is wrong he has way more followers and more powerful i do belive based on what Cherrn and if you read The lords of darkness you do get a whole lot of info about Cyric church and Shars and you wil learn that Cyric is more powerful. and its not just the number its the devotion they show to there gods and maney people pay respect to god gods and fear evil ones and there are maney lay whorshipers.
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Worst threat to Faerun?
