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lowtech
Learned Scribe
USA
315 Posts |
 Posted - 11 Oct 2002 : 23:31:42
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quote:
Originally posted by Mumadar Ibn Huzal
quote:
Originally posted by lowtech
That suites me, I've been pretty pissed about Kelemvor's change. Not because of his treatment of the False, but because of his continued mistreatment of the Faithless. If someone is going to torture souls into oblivion for not worshiping a bunch of glorified elementals, they might as well be evil, and at least Mykrul had a personality.
In your (Real World) eyes, the Faerunian deities might appear as 'a bunch of glorified elementals'. However for the average inhabitant of Toril, they are a very real part of life. It is therefore very rare not to worship a deity, and would be seen as an affront by all deities. The 'faithless' are therefore kept in Kelemvor's realm, surrounded by a wall which is made up of the 'false'.
The whole concept of the faithless and the false and their 'treatment', comes more or less with the job. No matter who holds that job. Currently that is Kelemvor. He has been chided by the collective of gods for being to lenient and easy, not acting correctly within his portfolio. He is currently changing to a more neutral deity of death and the dead. If he hadn't done that, it is most likely that parts of his portfolio would have been stripped from him by Ao and given to other deities like Velsharoon.
You got the Faithless and False mixed up (I know that sounds anal-retentive, but its a pretty significant difference in this context). If the Faithless simply ceased to exist without a divine sponser I could excuse it, but they are tortured (as part of the wall) untill their essense is extinguished. |
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lowtech
Learned Scribe
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 12 Oct 2002 : 00:02:43
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it is up to you if you want to incorporate the changes or not, in whatever setting, Realms, Greyhawk, Planescape or other.
I like to work with the materials provided, its easier to carry over into other campaigns and easier to keep track of. |
Edited by - Alaundo on 12 Oct 2002 11:49:53 |
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The Great Drizzt
Learned Scribe
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 12 Oct 2002 : 08:21:09
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Whats the closest campaign setting to FR? is it Greyhawk?
The Great Drizzt |
"Don't poke Drizzt, 'tis highly unsociable!" Drizzt Do'Urden -BG1 |
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king-tiax
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
327 Posts |
Posted - 12 Oct 2002 : 11:39:44
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| I haven't played Grayhawk in ages, I should try it again some time. |
My name is Tiax, I would ask yours but I don't care to become aquainted with the dead.
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Drummer Boy
Senior Scribe
USA
395 Posts |
Posted - 13 Oct 2002 : 03:52:18
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quote:
Originally posted by lowtech
quote:
Originally posted by BoneHead
or perhaps Myrkul could be reborn when he puts it on, and wrest control of Kelemvors realm from him.
That suites me, I've been pretty pissed about Kelemvor's change. Not because of his treatment of the False, but because of his continued mistreatment of the Faithless. If someone is going to torture souls into oblivion for not worshiping a bunch of glorified elementals, they might as well be evil, and at least Mykrul had a personality.
Actually, there is a reason for the death god to torture the false and the faithless. Before Kelemvor changed to torturing the false and faithless more harshly, the mortals that were faithless or false were either reckless and not afraid to die or afraid to go outside for fear of getting struck down by a stray lightning bolt. This caused many gods to lose worshipers and therefore threatened the balance. |
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The Great Drizzt
Learned Scribe
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2002 : 07:34:48
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....Ok, but that still didnt answer my question, Which campaign setting is closest to Forgotton Realms?
The Great Drizzt |
"Don't poke Drizzt, 'tis highly unsociable!" Drizzt Do'Urden -BG1 |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2002 : 08:15:47
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| Which is a question that has nothing to do with the topic "the gods". You might want to re-post that in an approriate thread. |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2002 : 08:23:42
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quote:
Originally posted by lowtech
[brYou got the Faithless and False mixed up (I know that sounds anal-retentive, but its a pretty significant difference in this context). If the Faithless simply ceased to exist without a divine sponser I could excuse it, but they are tortured (as part of the wall) untill their essense is extinguished.
You might very well be right, I didn't have my books with me to verify. Most of what I post comes from memory.
Copied from Elven Afterlife thread.
quote:
Originally posted by lowtech
Nope, that would be the Faithless. The False essentially have to make of their afterlife as they will (read the Crucible, an excellant book), since its the same regardless of the the god they "turned stag on" (is that actually a slang term in the UK?). I have no problem with this developement, it actually appeals to me. The fate of the Faithless (atheistic or agnostic) still pisses me off, though. I prefer the Planescape version, in which belief in a higher ideal (not necessarily a god) guides your character, but he or she dosn't have to be damned for not adopting a patron god.
However Planescape and the Forgotten Realms are two completely different settings. The whole concept of False and Faithless is part of the whole that makes the Forgotten Realms. The concept is something that could be considered an equivalent of Hell in Faerun. Not literally (I know Hell is one of the lower planes), but more in the sense of cultural upbringing. e.g. "If you don't worship a god my son, you'll end up in Kelemvor's wall." Or something along those lines. |
Edited by - Mumadar Ibn Huzal on 14 Oct 2002 08:25:53 |
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The Great Drizzt
Learned Scribe
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 15 Oct 2002 : 08:20:43
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FINE, hows this?
Are the Gods in Greyhawk the same as the ones in Forgotten Realms?
or is there another campaign setting thats closer to FR?
The Great Drizzt |
"Don't poke Drizzt, 'tis highly unsociable!" Drizzt Do'Urden -BG1 |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 15 Oct 2002 : 10:20:18
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| There is an overlap in deities between the Greyhawk Pantheon and the Faerunian Pantheon. This overlap is as good as exclusively on the demi-human deities and monster deities. Lloth for instance is known on both Oerth and Toril. |
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king-tiax
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
327 Posts |
Posted - 16 Oct 2002 : 17:33:08
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| What gods were made to walk the earth in the Time of Troubles? |
My name is Tiax, I would ask yours but I don't care to become aquainted with the dead.
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 16 Oct 2002 : 18:08:14
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quote:
Originally posted by king-tiax
What gods were made to walk the earth in the Time of Troubles?
One might want to check out the following link (Realms FAQ on the Candlekeep site)
http://www.candlekeep.com/fr_faq.htm#_Toc16090488
The FAQ holds answers to a lot of questions about the Realms, especially the more obscure ones. It's worth browsing through. |
Edited by - Mumadar Ibn Huzal on 16 Oct 2002 18:11:06 |
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king-tiax
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
327 Posts |
Posted - 16 Oct 2002 : 19:47:52
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| Thanks, I'll be soure to. |
My name is Tiax, I would ask yours but I don't care to become aquainted with the dead.
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Jeffrey Williams
Acolyte
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - 17 Oct 2002 : 02:06:56
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quote:
Originally posted by king-tiax
What gods were made to walk the earth in the Time of Troubles?
All of them where made to walk the Earth during the ToT, save Helm. It was his task to guard the Celestial Stairway.
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Geoffrey Mordraith, Sage, Cleric of Helm, Bearer of the Morning Star
devilboy@anv.net
www.bigbluepigeon.blogspot.com
www.thefourthportal.blogspot.com |
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The Great Drizzt
Learned Scribe
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 17 Oct 2002 : 03:33:33
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Yeah, from what I understand, they all were supposed to be walking Faerun.
The Great Drizzt |
"Don't poke Drizzt, 'tis highly unsociable!" Drizzt Do'Urden -BG1 |
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Drummer Boy
Senior Scribe
USA
395 Posts |
Posted - 17 Oct 2002 : 05:06:12
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| Actually, I think it was only the human gods, besides Helm, who had to walk Faerun during the Time of Troubles. |
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The Great Drizzt
Learned Scribe
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 17 Oct 2002 : 06:07:08
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Do Half-Elves have their own god(s), or do they either worship a Human god or an Elf god, I'm sure its probably the latter, but I was just curious, I've never thought of it before.
The Great Drizzt |
"Don't poke Drizzt, 'tis highly unsociable!" Drizzt Do'Urden -BG1 |
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Jeffrey Williams
Acolyte
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - 17 Oct 2002 : 09:41:14
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quote:
Originally posted by drummerboy465
Actually, I think it was only the human gods, besides Helm, who had to walk Faerun during the Time of Troubles.
Incorrect, if you read through Powers and Pantheons and Demi-Human Deities (both second edition), all deities worshipped in Faerun got Ao's boot mark on their posterior as they were expelled from the outer planes. In fact, Lolth was reported to dwell in Menzobarranzan during the Seige of Darkness. Clangeddin and Labelas Enoreth fought on the island of Rhauthym(?). Tiamat and Gilgeam fought until their mutual destruction was assured in Unther.
Blood, Sweat and Tears
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Geoffrey Mordraith, Sage, Cleric of Helm, Bearer of the Morning Star
devilboy@anv.net
www.bigbluepigeon.blogspot.com
www.thefourthportal.blogspot.com |
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Jeffrey Williams
Acolyte
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - 17 Oct 2002 : 09:44:34
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quote:
Originally posted by The Great Drizzt
Do Half-Elves have their own god(s), or do they either worship a Human god or an Elf god, I'm sure its probably the latter, but I was just curious, I've never thought of it before.
The Great Drizzt
They worship either. But in most cases, half-elven children are raised by their human parents. Elves in the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting can be very bigoted towards half-elves or their elven parent as well. Not all elven scoieties openly accept half-elves.
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Geoffrey Mordraith, Sage, Cleric of Helm, Bearer of the Morning Star
devilboy@anv.net
www.bigbluepigeon.blogspot.com
www.thefourthportal.blogspot.com |
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The Great Drizzt
Learned Scribe
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 18 Oct 2002 : 08:13:05
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Ok, thanks, but just one other question, are their any actual
"Half-Elf" gods? I havent heard of any, but I could be wrong.
The Great Drizzt |
"Don't poke Drizzt, 'tis highly unsociable!" Drizzt Do'Urden -BG1 |
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Jeffrey Williams
Acolyte
USA
45 Posts |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 18 Oct 2002 : 10:23:36
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| IIRC there used to be a goddess in the Yuirwood which has been considered a half-elven deity. However this goddess is no more, she is now an aspect of Sharess. If there are any half-elven deities left, they are among the old deities of the Yuirwood. |
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Drummer Boy
Senior Scribe
USA
395 Posts |
Posted - 18 Oct 2002 : 15:00:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Jeffrey Williams
quote:
Originally posted by drummerboy465
Actually, I think it was only the human gods, besides Helm, who had to walk Faerun during the Time of Troubles.
Incorrect, if you read through Powers and Pantheons and Demi-Human Deities (both second edition), all deities worshipped in Faerun got Ao's boot mark on their posterior as they were expelled from the outer planes. In fact, Lolth was reported to dwell in Menzobarranzan during the Seige of Darkness. Clangeddin and Labelas Enoreth fought on the island of Rhauthym(?). Tiamat and Gilgeam fought until their mutual destruction was assured in Unther.
Blood, Sweat and Tears
I stand corrected. |
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Jeffrey Williams
Acolyte
USA
45 Posts |
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Drummer Boy
Senior Scribe
USA
395 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2002 : 03:44:28
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Thanks, Jeffrey |
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Stoyka Wintercrow
Acolyte
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2002 : 17:29:40
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quote:
Originally posted by The Great Drizzt
Ok, thanks, but just one other question, are their any actual
"Half-Elf" gods? I havent heard of any, but I could be wrong.
The Great Drizzt
Greetings all,
There is a reference, in Demihuman Deities IIRC, that says a growing faction of half-elves are claiming Mielikki, using a different name to reflect her true heritage, as a half-elf goddess. They base their belief on Mielikki being the offspring of Silvanus and Hanali(?) I think.
Sorry for such vague references. I don't have my books right to hand and am currently in the middle of something so I can't take the time just now to track it down. I don't remember the exact specifics but I do remember reading this. In fact, I used the half-elf aspect of Mielikki for the patron god of my half-elf ranger in a game just a bit over a year ago. I'll try to find the exacts and get back later. |
"What's the doppleganger password!?!" |
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Drummer Boy
Senior Scribe
USA
395 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2002 : 20:23:51
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| So are Silvanus and Hanali a human god(dess) and an elf god(dess) or are they both half-elven deities? Either one of those would make Mielikki a half-elf. So what race was Mielikki thought to be before they thought she was a half-elf? |
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king-tiax
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
327 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2002 : 22:31:51
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| Is there an Orc god, (or goblin). |
My name is Tiax, I would ask yours but I don't care to become aquainted with the dead.
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n/a
deleted
20 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2002 : 23:07:08
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| i'd doubt it. there to stupid but some stupid creature have gods... |
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lowtech
Learned Scribe
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 21 Oct 2002 : 01:35:14
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quote:
Originally posted by king-tiax
Is there an Orc god, (or goblin).
There are several of both. I've always kind of liked the monstrous gods for some reason. |
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The gods.
Topic Locked
