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Ghost
Acolyte
Netherlands
38 Posts |
 Posted - 30 Sep 2002 : 13:20:33
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In reply to the other question asked (what is your favourite deity):
I'ld go for Mieliki or Shaundakul. I love to go out and about 
Tiax, order isn't the opposite of evil, but chaos. And no, two opposites can't exist without eachother (how could you tell it is light, if there is no dark to compare it with). |
The way of a superior man are three-fold;
virtuous, he is free from anxieties;
wise, he is free from perplexities;
bold, he is free from fear. ~ Confucius
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Mask
Learned Scribe
104 Posts |
Posted - 30 Sep 2002 : 14:10:27
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Bane is just the coolest. At the moment I also like Mask. And why shouldn't I take a known realms name? What's wrong with that?
And second of all, Tyr, Illmater and Helm suck too. I hate goody-two-shoes like they are. And what gives Tyr, or whatever god for that matter, the right to take them into their realms. Ok, Helm I could see, but the others have no right. At least, that's how I see it. |
Nothing is impossible! |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 30 Sep 2002 : 14:17:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Mask
Bane is just the coolest. At the moment I also like Mask. And why shouldn't I take a known realms name? What's wrong with that?
And second of all, Tyr, Illmater and Helm suck too. I hate goody-two-shoes like they are. And what gives Tyr, or whatever god for that matter, the right to take them into their realms. Ok, Helm I could see, but the others have no right. At least, that's how I see it.
To each his own. And you're entitled to your opinion on the other gods, but maybe you could try to back up your statements with some arguments. It is very easy to say I think this... or I feel that... maybe you can explain why you have that feeling or why you think that.
As to Tyr and Ilmater... maybe they have no rights to claim the worshippers, but remember that Torm is a subject of Tyr. And together Tyr, Torm and Ilmater form the Triad. These three gods are on very good (no pun intended) terms with eachother. If for some reason Torm would not have been able to regain his status as a deity, it is most likely that the souls of his worshippers would have defaulted to one of those two gods. Unless AO would have given Torm's portfolio to some other deity, maybe Red Knight. |
Edited by - Mumadar Ibn Huzal on 30 Sep 2002 14:23:12 |
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Ghost
Acolyte
Netherlands
38 Posts |
Posted - 30 Sep 2002 : 14:18:41
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Well, with Torm being subservient to Tyr, he WOULD be the logical choice..
And about Fearunian names, do you play drow rangers or greybearded wizards? Maybe more people should get a personality, instead of relying on stereotype.. |
The way of a superior man are three-fold;
virtuous, he is free from anxieties;
wise, he is free from perplexities;
bold, he is free from fear. ~ Confucius
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Edited by - Ghost on 30 Sep 2002 14:31:46 |
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Mask
Learned Scribe
104 Posts |
Posted - 30 Sep 2002 : 14:42:21
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I don't play Mask. I just use his name on this forum.
By the way, I think Torm could be an okay-guy, if he would just get his own personality and stop being Tyr's lapdog.
Ok Mumadar, you've made your point, but I don't have to give my reasons for liking, or disliking, if I don't want to. And I just don't want to. About the dead worshippers, I must say you have persuaded me. I think they would go to Tyr's realm, but I don't think they deserve to be in Ilmaters realm. It's not like they're martyrs. |
Nothing is impossible! |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 30 Sep 2002 : 14:50:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Mask
Ok Mumadar, you've made your point, but I don't have to give my reasons for liking, or disliking, if I don't want to. And I just don't want to. About the dead worshippers, I must say you have persuaded me. I think they would go to Tyr's realm, but I don't think they deserve to be in Ilmaters realm. It's not like they're martyrs.
 I'm not saying you have to give your reasons. It's just nice to have a good discussion on a topic. And empty statements tend to ruin a good discussion. But I've enjoyed sparring with you.
Sweet Water and Light Laughter |
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Mask
Learned Scribe
104 Posts |
Posted - 30 Sep 2002 : 15:26:20
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| Likewise |
Nothing is impossible! |
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The Great Drizzt
Learned Scribe
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2002 : 08:48:45
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Hey mask, is the God mask in 3rd edition, and what happened to Lloth?
The Great Drizzt |
"Don't poke Drizzt, 'tis highly unsociable!" Drizzt Do'Urden -BG1 |
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Mask
Learned Scribe
104 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2002 : 09:08:30
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| Of course Mask is still a god. Nearly every god is still a god(dess) in 3rd ed. Lloth/Lolth is also still a goddess. |
Nothing is impossible! |
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The Great Drizzt
Learned Scribe
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2002 : 09:23:11
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Ok, thanks, but I couldnt find her in any book, I was just wondering, cause i'm too lazy to do anymore research for her in 3rd ED.
The Great Drizzt |
"Don't poke Drizzt, 'tis highly unsociable!" Drizzt Do'Urden -BG1 |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2002 : 09:34:26
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FRCS has some basic detail on Lloth/Lolth and Faiths and Pantheons also has information on her IIRC. That last book is basically the 3e version of the 2e FR-Gods books (F&A, P&P and DD)
FRCS: Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting
F&A: Faith & Avatars
P&P: Powers & Pantheons
DD: Demihuman Deities |
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The Great Drizzt
Learned Scribe
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2002 : 09:36:19
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Cool! Thanks.
The Great Drizzt |
"Don't poke Drizzt, 'tis highly unsociable!" Drizzt Do'Urden -BG1 |
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king-tiax
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
327 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2002 : 19:24:27
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| I must say I am a great fan of Lolth, MAny sects of Dwarves do still worship thier Allied god. |
My name is Tiax, I would ask yours but I don't care to become aquainted with the dead.
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2002 : 08:27:53
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| Ehm... Tiax, where do you get this wisdom from? Unless you're referring to the Duergar and Derro dwarf-subraces, there would be very few, if any, dwarves that would worship or ally with Lloth/Lolth. And even the Duergar and Derro are carefull allies at best with the drow, lest they end up as slaves and toys for the wicked dark elves. |
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king-tiax
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
327 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2002 : 17:02:20
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| I was refering to the Urdunnir, and if you check the monsters of Faerun compendium you will find that they live in the underdark with Drows, cheak before you accuse Mumadar. |
My name is Tiax, I would ask yours but I don't care to become aquainted with the dead.
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2002 : 18:13:20
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I was not accusing, it was a comment made in jest. As a fan of dwarves, I couldn't believe anyone linking the dwarves to Lloth/Lolth.
Yet I can further comment on your statement. Though it is true that the Urdunnir live deep underground (there's a community deep under the Almraiven peninsula near Calimshan), they are not on good terms with the Drow, and certainly not with Lolth/Lloth.
The Urdunnir are almost universally worshipping Dumathoin, their dwarvish patron deity. The Urdunnir are an almost unknown dwarven subrace and more or less reclusive. One is more likely to encounter a deep-gnome (svirfnebblin sp?)
Again, I would be curious as to where you think the relation between dwarves and Lloth/Lolth comes from. The fact that both races live underground is not that link.
For further information on dwarves in general and Urdunnir in specific, I would like to refer to Drizzt's Guide to the Underdark and Demihuman Deities. Both excellent 2e products. |
Edited by - Mumadar Ibn Huzal on 02 Oct 2002 18:18:36 |
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king-tiax
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
327 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2002 : 20:06:13
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From the days of old Dwarves have been friendly with Drow, they are as good, if not better than adverage Elves as they pratcice Nectomancy and they are more suited to a relationship with Dwarves then the Common Elf, living underground and all. so in many ocassions it is the Drow not Elves that the Dwarves turn to. Many Dwarves (not to mention other races) revear Elves and the Drow are not only old friends but also have the same habital alowance. Ofthen Dwarves go to Drow, serving up to them, these formed into clans, the Urdunner.
Happy now! |
My name is Tiax, I would ask yours but I don't care to become aquainted with the dead.
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Mask
Learned Scribe
104 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2002 : 21:55:18
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| First of all, Tiax, the question was not how the standards are between drow and dwarves, but between dwarves and Lloth. Second of all, I find it hard to believe drow and dwarves are allies, let alone friends. Either you are inventing this as we speak, or I (and I think some with me) am lacking knowledge about this. If this is the case I am curious about where you find this information. And monsters of Faerun might state the Urdunnir live in the underdark with the drow, but so do a lot of other creatures. |
Nothing is impossible! |
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kahonen
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
358 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2002 : 22:07:23
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I've certainly never heard (or seen) any evidence to suggest that "drow and dwarves are allies".
Look at Bruenor Battlehammer's reaction to Drizzt when they first meet. Look at the reaction of Cattie Brie when she first meets Drizzt - a reaction she subsequently explains as being due to being brought up with Dwarves. I also can't see why Drow practicing Necromancy would encourage Dwarves to become allies and as for Drow living underground - I'd suggest that an average dwarf would see this as a threat, not as a reason to be friendly.
I don't have a problem believing that Duergar could ally with Drow but not other Dwarves.
As Mask says, where is your source for this revelation? |
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The Great Drizzt
Learned Scribe
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 03 Oct 2002 : 06:42:27
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Me and Tiax are allies, I'm a drow and he's a dwarf!
The Great Drizzt |
"Don't poke Drizzt, 'tis highly unsociable!" Drizzt Do'Urden -BG1 |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 03 Oct 2002 : 08:31:10
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quote:
Originally posted by king-tiax
From the days of old Dwarves have been friendly with Drow, they are as good, if not better than adverage Elves as they pratcice Nectomancy and they are more suited to a relationship with Dwarves then the Common Elf, living underground and all. so in many ocassions it is the Drow not Elves that the Dwarves turn to. Many Dwarves (not to mention other races) revear Elves and the Drow are not only old friends but also have the same habital alowance. Ofthen Dwarves go to Drow, serving up to them, these formed into clans, the Urdunner.
Happy now!
I'm quite happy to try and enlighten you.
I believe you own a copy of Dwarves Deep, so I invite you to read this book. Or otherwise check Drizzt's Guide to the Underdark if you have access to a copy. If you want an example of the 'great friendship' you claim exists between drow and dwarves read about the history of 'The Great Rift'. You'll see that drow and dwarves are on even worse terms then George Bush jr and Saddam Hussein.
A further, and even better known, example is the current history of Mithril Hall, the dwarven Kingdom of Bruenor Battlehammer (the most well known dwarf on Faerun?). The drow of Menzoberranzan did not visit his stronghold with an entire drow army to drink a pint of beer in friendship...
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 04 Oct 2002 : 18:47:30
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The following quote is from another thread: http://www.candlekeep.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=52
quote:
Originally posted by Rudolf_Weathermay
There are also whisperings that not only Bane survived the time of troubles, but also Bhaal and Myrtul. I don't know of this is truth. Can someone tell me more about it?
The Baldur's Gate computer game has a theme around Bhaal, though the game is mostly considered fringe territory when it comes to Realms canon.
Some of Myrkul's essence remains in the Crown of Horns. There are rumors that the so-called dead deity has even some awarness within this crown. After it disappeared from Blackstaff Tower, the crown seems to have ended up in the Mere of Dead Men. In the midst of this swamp there seems to be a gathering of more and more undead. As if someone... or something is building an undead army.
Anyway, the official stance (at least at this moment) seems to be not to resurrect more dead gods. |
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The Great Drizzt
Learned Scribe
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 08 Oct 2002 : 07:51:29
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.....I love dark elves, but I don't like Lloth/Lolth that much, shes a woman favorer! I much rather like Vhaerun(I think thats how its spelled)He like the male gender and is not so opposed to the surface world, and encourages breeding with other races, which is kinda cool I guess too.
The Great Drizzt |
"Don't poke Drizzt, 'tis highly unsociable!" Drizzt Do'Urden -BG1 |
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king-tiax
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
327 Posts |
Posted - 08 Oct 2002 : 13:52:42
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| Year, one thing about Drow is they are rather sexist, the wimen do rule the men. |
My name is Tiax, I would ask yours but I don't care to become aquainted with the dead.
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BoneHead
Acolyte
USA
6 Posts |
Posted - 10 Oct 2002 : 04:24:02
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I miss Myrkul.
Cyric was ok as lord of the dead in my opinion as well.
Velsharoon would make a great successor to Myrkul/cyric.
Velsharoon should get the crown of horns and either become the reaper, letting Kelemvor remain judge of the damned with Velsharoon as his reluctant servant, or perhaps Myrkul could be reborn when he puts it on, and wrest control of Kelemvors realm from him.
It is nearing halloween, the time when i miss Myrkul most LoL! |
Edited by - BoneHead on 10 Oct 2002 04:24:55 |
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lowtech
Learned Scribe
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 10 Oct 2002 : 18:29:12
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| What's the deal with the orc gods? They've changed a great deal from the Monsters Mythology and Hollowed Ground books. Does this change also take place in the Planescape setting? |
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lowtech
Learned Scribe
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 10 Oct 2002 : 18:51:54
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quote:
Originally posted by BoneHead
or perhaps Myrkul could be reborn when he puts it on, and wrest control of Kelemvors realm from him.
That suites me, I've been pretty pissed about Kelemvor's change. Not because of his treatment of the False, but because of his continued mistreatment of the Faithless. If someone is going to torture souls into oblivion for not worshiping a bunch of glorified elementals, they might as well be evil, and at least Mykrul had a personality. |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 11 Oct 2002 : 15:30:47
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quote:
Originally posted by lowtech
What's the deal with the orc gods? They've changed a great deal from the Monsters Mythology and Hollowed Ground books. Does this change also take place in the Planescape setting?
As far as I know there hasn't been much change in the Orcish pantheon, except the change from 2e to 3e. If there are others, then it is up to you if you want to incorporate the changes or not, in whatever setting, Realms, Greyhawk, Planescape or other. |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 11 Oct 2002 : 15:38:02
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quote:
Originally posted by lowtech
That suites me, I've been pretty pissed about Kelemvor's change. Not because of his treatment of the False, but because of his continued mistreatment of the Faithless. If someone is going to torture souls into oblivion for not worshiping a bunch of glorified elementals, they might as well be evil, and at least Mykrul had a personality.
In your (Real World) eyes, the Faerunian deities might appear as 'a bunch of glorified elementals'. However for the average inhabitant of Toril, they are a very real part of life. It is therefore very rare not to worship a deity, and would be seen as an affront by all deities. The 'faithless' are therefore kept in Kelemvor's realm, surrounded by a wall which is made up of the 'false'.
The whole concept of the faithless and the false and their 'treatment', comes more or less with the job. No matter who holds that job. Currently that is Kelemvor. He has been chided by the collective of gods for being to lenient and easy, not acting correctly within his portfolio. He is currently changing to a more neutral deity of death and the dead. If he hadn't done that, it is most likely that parts of his portfolio would have been stripped from him by Ao and given to other deities like Velsharoon. |
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Ghost
Acolyte
Netherlands
38 Posts |
Posted - 11 Oct 2002 : 19:37:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Mumadar Ibn Huzal
As far as I know there hasn't been much change in the Orcish pantheon, except the change from 2e to 3e. If there are others, then it is up to you if you want to incorporate the changes or not, in whatever setting, Realms, Greyhawk, Planescape or other.
The change from Lawful Evil to Chaotic Evil should be pretty significant. And because the Orcish deities are less cooperative with this new alignment, one would suspect them to be more powerful individually.
As they now have more in common with Demons than with Devils, the homeplane of the Orcish deities in Planscape should also change, I think. |
The way of a superior man are three-fold;
virtuous, he is free from anxieties;
wise, he is free from perplexities;
bold, he is free from fear. ~ Confucius
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The gods.
Topic Locked
