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Mournblade
Master of Realmslore
USA
1287 Posts |
 Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 05:27:26
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Just wondering if anyone likes Dorn. I like his friends but not him. Something about him I don't like.
What does everyone else think?
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A wizard is Never late Frodo Baggins. Nor is he Early. A wizard arrives precisely when he means to... |
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Faramicos
Senior Scribe
Denmark
468 Posts |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 11:44:25
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| That depends on who Dorn is? Please explain... |
"When dragons make war, worlds can only tremble in the shadow of angry wings" |
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Shadovar
Senior Scribe
785 Posts |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 12:14:03
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| Is Dorn the half-golem character in the Year of the Rogue Dragons Trilogy? The half-golem who goes by the name of Dorn Graybrook? |
We have fostered trust, recruited loyalty, and gathered the faithful. We have trained thousands. Our legions can cover the land, fill the sky and travel through the darkness. We can hunt any and all that would deny our heritage. Now is our time, now is the time of the Dark Reign(Rain) of the Empire of Shadows.
- High Prince Telemont Tanthul, Lord Shadow
In a speech given to the citizens of Shade Enclave
At the celebration of the Shinantra Battle victory when he revealed that he was THE Lord Shadow of legend. |
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Xysma
Master of Realmslore
USA
1089 Posts |
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Xysma
Master of Realmslore
USA
1089 Posts |
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Mournblade
Master of Realmslore
USA
1287 Posts |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 23:11:45
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Yes Dorn the half golem.
I like the Rogue Dragons so far. I don't hate dorn.. he is just well uninspiring.
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A wizard is Never late Frodo Baggins. Nor is he Early. A wizard arrives precisely when he means to... |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 03 Aug 2005 : 23:20:01
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| He's okay. I have nothing against him, but most of those characters have failed to grab me. I think part of the problem is that there's too many exotic characters in the group -- it ruins the believability, for me. |
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Shadovar
Senior Scribe
785 Posts |
Posted - 04 Aug 2005 : 02:22:44
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| I do not harbor any dislike against Dorn, anyway, I do like his character, a strong willed and determined guy or short of a freak that lets nothing stops him from achieving his goals. And I do admire his zealousness against dragons too, seldom do I see any characters with such zeal. |
We have fostered trust, recruited loyalty, and gathered the faithful. We have trained thousands. Our legions can cover the land, fill the sky and travel through the darkness. We can hunt any and all that would deny our heritage. Now is our time, now is the time of the Dark Reign(Rain) of the Empire of Shadows.
- High Prince Telemont Tanthul, Lord Shadow
In a speech given to the citizens of Shade Enclave
At the celebration of the Shinantra Battle victory when he revealed that he was THE Lord Shadow of legend. |
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Xysma
Master of Realmslore
USA
1089 Posts |
Posted - 04 Aug 2005 : 04:38:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
He's okay. I have nothing against him, but most of those characters have failed to grab me. I think part of the problem is that there's too many exotic characters in the group -- it ruins the believability, for me.
That's a good point. I enjoy exotic characters, Vheod from The Glass Prison, Dragonbait and Alias, Yago from Faces of Deception, Talbot Uskevren, and Kohtakah from Maiden of Pain are some of my favorite characters. I suppose though that if all of these had been thrown together in the same novels, they would have lost some of their effectiveness. |
War to slay, not to fight long and glorious.
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Crust
Learned Scribe
USA
273 Posts |
Posted - 04 Aug 2005 : 04:44:35
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I think Dorn is interesting. His history is strong, even a bit traditional. I like that. The maimed young boy who becomes a monster of sorts, only to find redemption in (insert here). In Dorn's case, it's a woman (a dragon, no less). His past as a pit fighting gladiator is very strong. Dorn is great.
As a DM, Dorn's build is quite interesting. A dragonslayer half-iron golem. Very interesting. The bastard sword. The off-hand golem slam attack. The ranger abilities. The Draconomicon feats. Very solid. Really, what else but a half-iron golem has any buisness hunting dragons?
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"That's right, hurl back views that force ye to think by name-calling - 'tis the grand old tradition, let it not down! Anything to keep from having to think, or - Mystra forfend - change thy own views!"
Narnra glowered at her father. "Just how am I to learn how to think? By being taught by you?"
"Some folk in the Realms would give their lives for the chance to learn at my feet," Elminster said mildly. "Several already have."
~from Elminster's Daughter, Ed Greenwood |
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Melfius
Senior Scribe
USA
516 Posts |
Posted - 15 Aug 2005 : 21:56:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
He's okay. I have nothing against him, but most of those characters have failed to grab me. I think part of the problem is that there's too many exotic characters in the group -- it ruins the believability, for me.
I have to agree with you here, Wooly. Too many 'special' characters. Don't we miss the old days of a group of 'normal' folks out doing their thing?
Otherwise, I like the books, especially the return of...nope! Not gonna spoil it!  |
Melfius, Pixie-Priest of Puck - Head Chef, The Faerie Kitchen, Candlekeep Inn
"What's in his pockets, besides me?"
Read a tale of my earlier days! - Happiness Comes in Small Packages |
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Mournblade
Master of Realmslore
USA
1287 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 02:32:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Melfius
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
He's okay. I have nothing against him, but most of those characters have failed to grab me. I think part of the problem is that there's too many exotic characters in the group -- it ruins the believability, for me.
I have to agree with you here, Wooly. Too many 'special' characters. Don't we miss the old days of a group of 'normal' folks out doing their thing?
Otherwise, I like the books, especially the return of...nope! Not gonna spoil it!
Ia mreading THE RITE now. You are so so lucky Melfius. I would have found a way to duct tape you to the floor for that.
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A wizard is Never late Frodo Baggins. Nor is he Early. A wizard arrives precisely when he means to... |
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Melfius
Senior Scribe
USA
516 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 02:51:50
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| Sometimes I'm SUCH a stinker! |
Melfius, Pixie-Priest of Puck - Head Chef, The Faerie Kitchen, Candlekeep Inn
"What's in his pockets, besides me?"
Read a tale of my earlier days! - Happiness Comes in Small Packages |
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Winterfox
Senior Scribe
895 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 08:17:58
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| I don't have a problem with Dorn so much as with his relationship with Kara. In the first book, the attraction seems... pasted on. There's no reason for it at all apart from the fact that Dorn's male and Kara's a pretty female (uhm, simple lust, anyone?). In the second book, it gets more interesting and believable, but the initial impression has been rather durable. |
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Mournblade
Master of Realmslore
USA
1287 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 10:31:18
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Romance can be pretty weak in these stories. Especially if they are written by a male author.
Elaine Cunningham does a good job with it. But rarely the male authors make Romances work.
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A wizard is Never late Frodo Baggins. Nor is he Early. A wizard arrives precisely when he means to... |
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Melfius
Senior Scribe
USA
516 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 10:59:23
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| I don't know if I would blame the authors entirely. From what we are led to believe, the powers-that-be prefer more action than romance in D&D novels. |
Melfius, Pixie-Priest of Puck - Head Chef, The Faerie Kitchen, Candlekeep Inn
"What's in his pockets, besides me?"
Read a tale of my earlier days! - Happiness Comes in Small Packages |
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Mournblade
Master of Realmslore
USA
1287 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 22:19:22
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quote:
Originally posted by Melfius
I don't know if I would blame the authors entirely. From what we are led to believe, the powers-that-be prefer more action than romance in D&D novels.
I would agree with you. I am also guilty of wanting more action than Romance. I can appreciate Romance when it adds to a story, I hate when Romamnce is the focus of the story.
But generally speaking... male authors are not NEARLY as proficient as female authors at writing romances. Anne McCaffery is a master at it, where writers like David Eddings are OK at it. But that is OK, I do not read stories like this for Romance. |
A wizard is Never late Frodo Baggins. Nor is he Early. A wizard arrives precisely when he means to... |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2005 : 23:06:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Melfius
I don't know if I would blame the authors entirely. From what we are led to believe, the powers-that-be prefer more action than romance in D&D novels.
Well, look at the target audience. I'm not bashing gamers; I'm pointing out that a large part of the fantasy-reading audience is male, and is more interested in action. |
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Melfius
Senior Scribe
USA
516 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2005 : 01:12:28
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| My point exactly! |
Melfius, Pixie-Priest of Puck - Head Chef, The Faerie Kitchen, Candlekeep Inn
"What's in his pockets, besides me?"
Read a tale of my earlier days! - Happiness Comes in Small Packages |
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Winterfox
Senior Scribe
895 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2005 : 12:22:40
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| Uhhm. I think someone's missing my point. I don't read fantasy for romance, but the relationship happens to be a large part of Dorn's character development. Dorn's a major character. Ergo, the romance can't help but be really noticable. It's not a question of how much screen time it gets; it's a question of how well it's written. (I belong to the school of thought that, if it's badly done, a novel as a whole would benefit from having no romance at all.) Besides, Richard Lee Byers didn't do too badly with The Shattered Mask (a book that's all about character development, in which a romantic relationship happens to be a huge factor). |
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Gromph Baenre
Acolyte
USA
9 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2005 : 02:48:33
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| I like him, but he tends fill a lot of the stereotypes. I prefer Taegan. |
Give a man a fire, he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, he'll be warm for the rest of his life-Terry Pratchett |
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Inquisitor
Acolyte
Germany
42 Posts |
Posted - 28 Aug 2005 : 21:29:52
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I don't like him. Too shallow character and the romance is realy badly written (at least in book 1).
And I generally dislike characters who can simply walk through fights as if they were nothing as he (and most of the protagonists) do in these books. |
Edited by - Inquisitor on 31 Aug 2005 18:04:29 |
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SirUrza
Master of Realmslore
USA
1283 Posts |
Posted - 29 Aug 2005 : 17:56:17
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I don't like him or his friends cause it's a blatant cast to get fanboys to buy the supplements that no one needs to make their own half golem or ice dwarf or whatever.
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"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 29 Aug 2005 : 17:58:25
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quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
I don't like him or his friends cause it's a blatant cast to get fanboys to buy the supplements that no one needs to make their own half golem or ice dwarf or whatever.
I don't know that I'd go that far... I've never felt the urge to run out and buy a sourcebook because of a novel. And it's not like any of the sourcebooks contained blurbs like "Now you too can play exotic race X, just like character Y in novel Z!" |
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Asgetrion
Master of Realmslore
Finland
1564 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2005 : 14:03:49
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Actually, I like Dorn. I think it is a nice twist to apply a template to the main character in a novel. I have thought about using half-golems and NPCs/minions of a villain in my campaign, so I was positively surprised by Dorn in the series.
Don't get me wrong - I love fluff over crunch any time - but it is rare for an author to actually dare to use "rare" or "special" NPCs in FR novels. It is also rare that an author actually uses accessories and rulebooks in this way.
Maybe Dorn is a gruff, rigid and straight-forward in his nature, but it suits his background and appearance. I actually like it that he is not a "shining hero type", but a selfish and bitter swordsman adventurer. |
"What am I doing today? Ask me tomorrow - I can be sure of giving you the right answer then."
-- Askarran of Selgaunt, Master Sage, speaking to a curious merchant, Year of the Helm |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2005 : 17:56:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Asgetrion
Actually, I like Dorn. I think it is a nice twist to apply a template to the main character in a novel. I have thought about using half-golems and NPCs/minions of a villain in my campaign, so I was positively surprised by Dorn in the series.
Don't get me wrong - I love fluff over crunch any time - but it is rare for an author to actually dare to use "rare" or "special" NPCs in FR novels. It is also rare that an author actually uses accessories and rulebooks in this way.
I don't mind him being a half-golem -- that is kinda interesting. My problem is that he's a half-golem in a group of other exotic races.
Seriously, what are the odds of a half-golem, an arctic dwarf, a human, a halfling, a song dragon, and an avariel meeting?
That sounds almost like the beginning of a joke... "So a half-golem, an arctic dwarf, and an avariel all walk into a tavern. The barmaid says..."  |
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 31 Aug 2005 17:56:39 |
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Inquisitor
Acolyte
Germany
42 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2005 : 18:06:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Seriously, what are the odds of a half-golem, an arctic dwarf, a human, a halfling, a song dragon, and an avariel meeting?
Actually, most RPG partys look like this. |
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Winterfox
Senior Scribe
895 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2005 : 20:25:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Inquisitor
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Seriously, what are the odds of a half-golem, an arctic dwarf, a human, a halfling, a song dragon, and an avariel meeting?
Actually, most RPG partys look like this.
And how realistic is that? Party makeup in RPGs doesn't always make a good party makeup in a novel. It's one of my problems with this trilogy, too -- too many OMGWTFSPECIAL!11! characters. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2005 : 23:14:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Inquisitor
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Seriously, what are the odds of a half-golem, an arctic dwarf, a human, a halfling, a song dragon, and an avariel meeting?
Actually, most RPG partys look like this.
If I was DM'ing, I'd not allow so many exotic races in one group. One or two, sure. Three, maybe. But that's it. Only if the campaign specifically called for it would I allow that kind of mix.
quote:
Originally posted by Winterfox
It's one of my problems with this trilogy, too -- too many OMGWTFSPECIAL!11! characters.
Well-stated, in the manner that only you can pull off.  |
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Inquisitor
Acolyte
Germany
42 Posts |
Posted - 31 Aug 2005 : 23:29:13
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A artic dwarf isn't that special and song dragons have been featured in recent nocels before (Elminster Daughter).
And an Avariel isn't that much more special than a Drow also he isn't really a part of the party but stands rather alone. That leaves only Dorn himself as "OMGWTFSPECIAL!11!" |
Edited by - Inquisitor on 31 Aug 2005 23:30:37 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 01 Sep 2005 : 00:26:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Inquisitor
A artic dwarf isn't that special and song dragons have been featured in recent nocels before (Elminster Daughter).
And an Avariel isn't that much more special than a Drow also he isn't really a part of the party but stands rather alone. That leaves only Dorn himself as "OMGWTFSPECIAL!11!"
An arctic dwarf may not be all that special, but they are rare in most parts of the Realms. Hence, I consider that an exotic race.
Song dragons have indeed been in other sources... Still, any dragon that is a character is exotic.
I consider an avariel to be more special than an elf. They are far more rare, and, unlike drow, they are not strictly tied to the ground. A rare flying race is exotic. And he does work with the party, eventually, and he is a major character in the novels.
And, of course, the half-golem.
So, I rest on my earlier statement: too many exotic characters in one group. |
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Who likes Dorn?
