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darqravenDD
Acolyte
7 Posts |
 Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 02:51:45
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Greetings and well met.
I have asked this question on a couple of other places and I now wish to ask here. Do you that the Drow Females would allow a Drow male that showed exceptional merit, to learn the Clerical ways of Lolth or even Laveth (her daughter). And would Lolth grant that male the favor and powers vested for of Priest or High Priest status?
I am very interested in seeing what answers I get to this.
Thank you for your time.
darqravenDD
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Edited by - Alaundo on 05 Feb 2005 10:24:12
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4689 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 03:41:58
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| No I do not believe so under current rules, though these might be subject to change. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 05:07:24
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| With the opinion Lolth's female clergy seems to hold about men, I don't see any males lasting long in the church, if they were even admitted. |
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darqravenDD
Acolyte
7 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 05:34:45
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You know it is a shame. It seems that in 2 of the 3 places I have asked, I have gotten the same answer. To me the idea seemed interesting, new, somewhere that NO ONE had even thought of going. Yes, that male would not have the same level of respect that the Females did in the school. But at least it was not another Drizzt wanna be, knock off. It was a fresh new idea.
Dont get me wrong, I am not lashing out at the both of you that answered me or any others. Just disappointed. Thank you both for taking the time to answer, and provide your insight. I will keep looking here to see if any others answer. Who knows, maybe the third place I asked will have a different insight. Or I could be just barking up the wrong tree compleately. I do that sometimes.
til later
darqravenDD |
Edited by - Alaundo on 05 Feb 2005 10:24:31 |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 13:36:30
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quote:
Originally posted by darqravenDD
You know it is a shame. It seems that in 2 of the 3 places I have asked, I have gotten the same answer. To me the idea seemed interesting, new, somewhere that NO ONE had even thought of going. Yes, that male would not have the same level of respect that the Females did in the school. But at least it was not another Drizzt wanna be, knock off. It was a fresh new idea.
Wait a couple of months and who knows...perhaps the conclusion to the War of the Spider Queen series will bring about some radical changes to such drow structures. |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4689 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 14:08:36
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It should be note that 1st Edition did have male Clerics, though non were known to be higher then level 4 IIRC. So it certainly is posible if using an older rule set.
Also as indicated things are subject to change.
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 16:50:25
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| On the other hand, there are other drow deities that would readily accept a male cleric... Vhaeraun would, and Ghaunadar would. I think Selvetarm would, but I'd have to double-check that one. |
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 16:57:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
On the other hand, there are other drow deities that would readily accept a male cleric... Vhaeraun would, and Ghaunadar would. I think Selvetarm would, but I'd have to double-check that one.
According to Faiths and Avatars, he does. In fact the majority of his clergy are made up of drow males. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 17:16:27
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quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
On the other hand, there are other drow deities that would readily accept a male cleric... Vhaeraun would, and Ghaunadar would. I think Selvetarm would, but I'd have to double-check that one.
According to Faiths and Avatars, he does. In fact the majority of his clergy are made up of drow males.
Ah, thank you, my friend. You kept me from having to walk over to my bookshelf. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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DDH_101
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1272 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 18:41:56
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| Hmmm... but what about the drow high priest of Lolth that appeared in the Drizzt novels, Rai'gy? He was like a high priest from Ched Nasad and was granted special favour because he used the arcane and divine powers that he possessed to recover numerous amounts of Lolthites artifacts. |
"Trust in the shadows, for the bright way makes you an easy target." -Mask |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 20:29:00
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quote:
Originally posted by DDH_101
Hmmm... but what about the drow high priest of Lolth that appeared in the Drizzt novels, Rai'gy? He was like a high priest from Ched Nasad and was granted special favour because he used the arcane and divine powers that he possessed to recover numerous amounts of Lolthites artifacts.
I've never heard of him. Please do tell more as to my knowledge, males in the clergy of Lolth are only "tolerated in the lower ranks of the priesthood" (F&A, page 31). |
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darqravenDD
Acolyte
7 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 20:43:40
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quote:
Originally posted by DDH_101
Hmmm... but what about the drow high priest of Lolth that appeared in the Drizzt novels, Rai'gy? He was like a high priest from Ched Nasad and was granted special favour because he used the arcane and divine powers that he possessed to recover numerous amounts of Lolthites artifacts.
Yes, Pelase do.. I to would be interested in reading more about this. I have not finished all the book on Drizzt, I have. So could you give an idea of what book and about where?? Thanks.... looks like my SL idea is not dead after all!!!  |
I haven't lost my mind, it's backed up on disk somewhere....... |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4689 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 20:54:36
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http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=books/fr/drow2
Not sure of date, however provides this quote.
"Rai'gy Bondalek: Rai'gy is a former high priest of Lolth from the city of Ched Nasad. A member of a more moderate sect of the Spider Queen that allows male clerics, he was ousted in a coup instigated by Jarlaxle, and he later joined Bregan D'Aerthe. Rai'gy has studied wizardry and knows how to craft magic items, including duplicating existing items."
It appears is no longer a cleric, not sure what Clerical level was required to become a high Prist. I suspect it varies.
Might dig a little more on this.
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Edited by - Kentinal on 05 Feb 2005 21:05:35 |
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DDH_101
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1272 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 23:14:31
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***SPOILERS!!!***
Well, Rai'gy first appeared in The Silent Blade as one of Jarlaxle's chief lieutenants in Bregan D'Arthe. It was said that even Gromph Baenre would have a difficult time fighting this wizard/cleric. There were several times where Rai'gy uses his clerical abilities, such as healing the serious wounds of Regis and Drizzt.
He died in The Servant of the Shard by the breath of a red dragon when he tried to overthrow Jarlaxle's rule of Bregan D'Arthe and also steal the Crystal Shard for himself. |
"Trust in the shadows, for the bright way makes you an easy target." -Mask |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 23:27:40
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quote:
Originally posted by darqravenDD
Yes, Pelase do.. I to would be interested in reading more about this. I have not finished all the book on Drizzt, I have. So could you give an idea of what book and about where?? Thanks.... looks like my SL idea is not dead after all!!!
You're going to drive the moderators batty changing your font each time you post.
Regardless of what is learned about the Salvatore character, I don't think your idea should be affected. It's your world, make whatever changes that you see fit. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2005 : 23:53:23
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Remember that Rai'gy (however it's spelled) was a 2nd edition character, as well. I think Lolth allowed male clerics in 2E, even if they were uncommon.
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"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 06 Feb 2005 : 00:20:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Remember that Rai'gy (however it's spelled) was a 2nd edition character, as well. I think Lolth allowed male clerics in 2E, even if they were uncommon.
Yes, Faiths and Avatars which I quoted in a previous message is a 2e product. |
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darqravenDD
Acolyte
7 Posts |
Posted - 09 Feb 2005 : 20:04:27
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Thank you all for the input on the subject. It had given me the information and directions I needed to move forward with the storyline. I wish you all well.
darqravenDD |
I haven't lost my mind, it's backed up on disk somewhere....... |
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warlockco
Master of Realmslore
USA
1695 Posts |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 14 Feb 2005 : 13:50:09
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quote:
Originally posted by darqravenDD
Do you think that the Drow Females would allow a Drow male that showed exceptional merit, to learn the Clerical ways of Lolth.
No, in my opinion, female Lolthite clerics would not allow a male to be taught the various sacred rites of Lloth. Lolthite doctrine says that the female is the superior gender since that is also Lolth's gender. Even when males were allowed into the clergy, their main role (albeit unwittingly) was to demonstrate the lack of male aptitude for divine magic. Allowing a male to become a cleric would be tantamount to declaring the matriarchal theocracy that is drow society void, or imperfect. No female cleric could sanction a male becoming a cleric as that action could be used, by rivals, as evidence that she thought Lolth's divine plan was flawed.
I think the only way any male that demonstrated sufficient wisdom could experience Lloth's divine magic would be to become a ranger. Since rangers can cast a small amount of divine spells.
As a side note, I think that any male that demonstrated a high degree of wisdom would be a popular patron since a female would hope that any daughters produced from a coupling with such a male would inherit great wisdom.
Of course, as has already been mentioned, there are other drow deities that accept male priests, namely Vhaeraun and Selvetarm. The ooze deity, Ghaunadaur also accepts males. But none of these deities are acceptable in a Lolthite dominated society.
The two other drow deities, the goddesses, Kiaransalee (all praise to her) and Eilistraee may allow male clerics since their entries in Faiths and Pantheons don't have a gender restriction noted. However, both of these deities did have a gender restriction in the 2nd Edition Demi-human Deities, (whereas, just to add further confusion, Lolth didn't.)
quote:
Originally posted by darqravenDD
And would Lolth grant that male the favor and powers vested for of Priest or High Priest status?
Lloth is chaotic and she may do so if she found the idea amusing or it suited her purpose. She has given the staunchly Lolthite cities a strict code to follow but she is, of course, above her own code. In her battles against the other drow deities she may consider tempting males to become clerics in some of the Vhaeraunite communities found on the surface.
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Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 06 Mar 2005 : 02:36:20
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| Don't forget that there is a difference between how Lolth is worshipped in Menzoberranzan and in other drow cities. In Menzoberranzan no other god can be mentioned or worshipped besides Lolth. In other cities, the preistesses allow Selvetarm's worship, and in some cities Lolth isn't the main deity ( I forget the name now, but there is a city of Ghaunadaur worshippers out there in the Underdark). |
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Clerical Magic and Drow Males
