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Sarelle
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
508 Posts |
 Posted - 12 Jun 2004 : 11:58:24
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I was reading "Birth control in the Realms" and a discussion of humans being one of the five creator races of Toril. And I remembered a question I'd had a while back -
What was the third creator race?
1. 'the' Creator Race (reptilian ones to be written up in SK  )
2. Dragons
3. -
4. Giants
5. Humans
Anyone know? Is the rest of my list correct?
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Chair of the The Rightful Return of Monster Deities to FR Society (RRMDFRS)
My character, drawn by Liodain: Sarelle / Sarelle (smaller) |
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Capn Charlie
Senior Scribe
USA
418 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2004 : 13:41:11
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| THe aquatic race that became amphibious, came to conflict with "The" Creator Race, and then fell to barbarism, becoming Locathath in the sea, and Dopplegangers on land. |
Shadows of War: Tales of a Mercenary
My first stab at realms fiction, here at candlekeep. Stop on by and tell me what you think. |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2067 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2004 : 10:34:36
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There are two lists in the various sources, that differ slightly.
List 1:
a) Reptilian race.
b) Fey.
c) Amphibious race.
d) Avian race.
e) Humans
List 2
a) Reptilian race.
b) Fey.
c) Amphibious race.
d) Dragons.
e) Humans.
List 1 is probably more correct.
Trivia question: What is the name of the amphibious race and the avian race. Both are given in existing Realmslore. :-)
--Eric |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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Sarelle
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
508 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2004 : 11:44:38
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I thought that Fey came from Faerie?
Surely dragons are a creator race? And what about the giants. Both are featured in the earliest refernces I can find.
But thanks for the info Mr. Boyd and Charlie.
I had forgotten about the amphibious and avian races.
EDIT: Mr. Boyd: Well - I know it isn't what you asked but he reptilian creator race are called the 'sarrukh', and I only know that through references to Serpent Kingdoms. |
Chair of the The Rightful Return of Monster Deities to FR Society (RRMDFRS)
My character, drawn by Liodain: Sarelle / Sarelle (smaller) |
Edited by - Sarelle on 13 Jun 2004 11:47:37 |
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Sarta
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2004 : 16:44:20
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Trivia question: What is the name of the amphibious race and the avian race. Both are given in existing Realmslore. :-)
Well, I give. Just spent about 3 hours tearing apart my bookshelf. Tag, next FR geek, you're up.
Sarta |
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Capn Charlie
Senior Scribe
USA
418 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2004 : 16:53:11
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Perhaps it is a trick question, and you are making it too complex.
While I really have no idea for sure, my best guess would be Aaracockra, and oh, say, selkies. |
Shadows of War: Tales of a Mercenary
My first stab at realms fiction, here at candlekeep. Stop on by and tell me what you think. |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2004 : 18:25:18
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
There are two lists in the various sources, that differ slightly.
List 1:
a) Reptilian race.
b) Fey.
c) Amphibious race.
d) Avian race.
e) Humans
List 2
a) Reptilian race.
b) Fey.
c) Amphibious race.
d) Dragons.
e) Humans.
List 1 is probably more correct.
Trivia question: What is the name of the amphibious race and the avian race. Both are given in existing Realmslore. :-)
--Eric
Actually list 2 is more correct according to 3e lore that is on page 261 of the FRCS. :)
Saurian race that became nagas, lizardmen, troglodytes, and similiar creatures
Dragons
Aquatic race that became locathah on sea and dopplegangers on land.
Sylvan race
Humans |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Arivia
Great Reader
Canada
2965 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2004 : 18:44:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Sarta
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Trivia question: What is the name of the amphibious race and the avian race. Both are given in existing Realmslore. :-)
Well, I give. Just spent about 3 hours tearing apart my bookshelf. Tag, next FR geek, you're up.
Sarta
That goes into my list of memorable posts.
Those names do exist, though-I remember reading the amphibian one awhile back, but not where. |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2067 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2004 : 00:00:12
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To find the aforementioned races (and no, sarrukh doesn't count), you have to be a long-time FR fan and look into the darkened recesses of your bookshelf.
That's all the hint I'll give ...
--Eric
PS Or you can wait a month, unless that bit got cut. |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2004 : 01:57:17
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
To find the aforementioned races (and no, sarrukh doesn't count), you have to be a long-time FR fan and look into the darkened recesses of your bookshelf.
That's all the hint I'll give ...
--Eric
PS Or you can wait a month, unless that bit got cut.
I don't like the sounds of "unless that bit got cut."
If you're giving hints, does that mean a prize is involved too???  |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36784 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2004 : 03:16:01
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
To find the aforementioned races (and no, sarrukh doesn't count), you have to be a long-time FR fan and look into the darkened recesses of your bookshelf.
That's all the hint I'll give ...
--Eric
PS Or you can wait a month, unless that bit got cut.
I am a long time FR fan.... But there's still a lot of material to look thru. A little more specific, please? |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6653 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2004 : 04:29:47
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Stop teasing Eric!
C'mon you guys, no sleeping at your desks!
Answers are: aearee (avians) and batrachi (amphibious). The reference can be found in REF5 Lords of Darkness (1E), p.81. A good read of this section might give you a sneaky peek at upcoming "Serpent Kingdoms" lore.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
Edited by - George Krashos on 15 Jun 2004 04:32:04 |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2004 : 05:48:22
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
Stop teasing Eric!
Who is teasing? I'm serious. I am strongly motivated by prizes especially ones with a ribbon on it.
quote:
C'mon you guys, no sleeping at your desks!
You're just jealous because we can sleep and new fathers will never see sleep again until......hmmm....let's not go there.
quote:
Answers are: aearee (avians) and batrachi (amphibious). The reference can be found in REF5 Lords of Darkness (1E), p.81. A good read of this section might give you a sneaky peek at upcoming "Serpent Kingdoms" lore.
This section has made me very curious to see what lore will be within SK as all us hip scribes are calling it now.
You should have held out your answer until he provided a prize.
Of course Eric's mini-challenge made me curious about whether or not to start another scroll. |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6653 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2004 : 10:53:42
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Well, I'm sure that there wouldn't have been a prize for me anyway Sirius.
You see, I spent a solid 2 weeks sending every single FR reference I could dig up on yuan-ti, snakes, serpents and lizards to Eric before he started doing his 'bit'. To quote the most read book in the world: and it was good.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Sarta
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2004 : 12:13:30
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Well, I don't feel too badly. Lords of Darkness for 1st edition is one of the few books I don't own. Hard to believe they haven't been mentioned since then.
Sarta |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jun 2004 : 14:24:31
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
Well, I'm sure that there wouldn't have been a prize for me anyway Sirius.
Not even a cupcake?
quote:
You see, I spent a solid 2 weeks sending every single FR reference I could dig up on yuan-ti, snakes, serpents and lizards to Eric before he started doing his 'bit'.
Well, thank you for performing such an arduous task and for providing the answer to EB's question in this thread.
quote:
To quote the most read book in the world: and it was good.
What Harry Potter book was that quote in??  |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6653 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 04:35:47
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quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
What Harry Potter book was that quote in??
LOL! Hmmm, could have been "Harry Potter and the Download of Doom" - I'm thinking he's got to start becoming a computer nerd soon.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Durak
Seeker
68 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 15:53:23
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I just got the pdf for that FRE5 Lord of Darkness book. Was reading up on the Greater Mummy.
quote:
Surrounded by dusty carvings of beasts
no man has seen, Hsssthak of ancient
Isstosseffiil broods upon his ebony
throne, in an airless hall deep beneath the
mighty desert. Across the eons he has
rested here, but he has found no peace.
He dreams dark visions of an age when
his people ruled, practicing mighty sorcery,
creating exotic new life forms, and
forever battling both the winged folk of
the Aearee and wretched wet-skinned
batrachi.Of the Isstossef, only Hsssthak now
remains, his dry, withered features barely
hinting at the lost glory of his reptilian
race. Someone taking a quick glance at
him would identify him as human, yet his
taut snake-like skin, dry, bony tail, and
distorted features categorize him otherwise.
The time of the creator races was waning,
the dinosaurs dying out and being
replaced by other creatures more able to
withstand the new, colder climate. Seers
among the reptilian creator race felt that
a time might come when the lizard folk
would need help to reclaim their rightful
place in the world. Hsssthak, once a noted
sorcerer among his reptilian people, willingly
allowed himself to be mummified in
order to protect part of the heritage of his
race the ability to magically modify other
creatures. Hsssthak patiently awaits
the day when the descendants of his
ancient race will come seeking the golden
spell scrolls that he guards.
As you can see the replilian race is differently named here, maybe its a clan name in stead of a race name. The story mentions the lizardmens(current race) hatred of the Bullywugs.
Also it hints, i am not sure if all the creators had made them, that these reptiles were the creators of Nether Scrolls. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36784 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 17:10:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Durak
I just got the pdf for that FRE5 Lord of Darkness book. Was reading up on the Greater Mummy.
quote:
Surrounded by dusty carvings of beasts
no man has seen, Hsssthak of ancient
Isstosseffiil broods upon his ebony
throne, in an airless hall deep beneath the
mighty desert. Across the eons he has
rested here, but he has found no peace.
He dreams dark visions of an age when
his people ruled, practicing mighty sorcery,
creating exotic new life forms, and
forever battling both the winged folk of
the Aearee and wretched wet-skinned
batrachi.Of the Isstossef, only Hsssthak now
remains, his dry, withered features barely
hinting at the lost glory of his reptilian
race. Someone taking a quick glance at
him would identify him as human, yet his
taut snake-like skin, dry, bony tail, and
distorted features categorize him otherwise.
The time of the creator races was waning,
the dinosaurs dying out and being
replaced by other creatures more able to
withstand the new, colder climate. Seers
among the reptilian creator race felt that
a time might come when the lizard folk
would need help to reclaim their rightful
place in the world. Hsssthak, once a noted
sorcerer among his reptilian people, willingly
allowed himself to be mummified in
order to protect part of the heritage of his
race the ability to magically modify other
creatures. Hsssthak patiently awaits
the day when the descendants of his
ancient race will come seeking the golden
spell scrolls that he guards.
As you can see the replilian race is differently named here, maybe its a clan name in stead of a race name. The story mentions the lizardmens(current race) hatred of the Bullywugs.
Also it hints, i am not sure if all the creators had made them, that these reptiles were the creators of Nether Scrolls.
Perhaps that was the name of an ancient city/nation/tribe? |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Sarelle
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
508 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 17:27:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Durak
I just got the pdf for that FRE5 Lord of Darkness book. Was reading up on the Greater Mummy.
[snip]
As you can see the replilian race is differently named here, maybe its a clan name in stead of a race name. The story mentions the lizardmens(current race) hatred of the Bullywugs.
Also it hints, i am not sure if all the creators had made them, that these reptiles were the creators of Nether Scrolls.
Perhaps that was the name of an ancient city/nation/tribe?
Interesting take WK - I agree. "of ancient Isstosseffiil" sound more like he belonged to a city than anything else. Isstossef might be like Waterdhavian.
Who wants to bet against my $/£100 that no mention of Isstossef-anything is mentioned in SK? No one? I'll reduce the odds to 1000000/999999! |
Chair of the The Rightful Return of Monster Deities to FR Society (RRMDFRS)
My character, drawn by Liodain: Sarelle / Sarelle (smaller) |
Edited by - Sarelle on 16 Jun 2004 17:29:21 |
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Nephilim
Acolyte
United Kingdom
33 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 18:08:55
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| I beleive that the Neverwinter Nights game revolves around this reptillian creator race and the "Words of Power" they created. |
ooops. |
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Nephilim
Acolyte
United Kingdom
33 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 18:16:01
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I have just re-read the entry in FRCS(3rd Ed).
It clearly states the 5 creator races as:
Saurians (Dinosaur/Lizardfolk)
Dragons
an Amphibious race (that has now devolved to the Locathahs and Dopplegangers)
The Fey [although what they actually created is open to argument]
and finally Humanity. |
ooops. |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2067 Posts |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 21:11:28
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Sarelle,
You're going to lose some money soon. ;-)
--Eric
Tease! July or the end of June needs to get here quickly as there are two products I want now. |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6653 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2004 : 04:10:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Sarelle
Who wants to bet against my $/£100 that no mention of Isstossef-anything is mentioned in SK? No one? I'll reduce the odds to 1000000/999999!
I'll bet anything you like - oh, and I'd prefer to agree to payment terms now.
Can't wait for Serpent Kingdoms.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Sarelle
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
508 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2004 : 13:34:03
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Sarelle,
You're going to lose some money soon. ;-)
--Eric
I reckoned without the craftiness of certain Sages. Yay! |
Chair of the The Rightful Return of Monster Deities to FR Society (RRMDFRS)
My character, drawn by Liodain: Sarelle / Sarelle (smaller) |
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chosenofvelsharoon
Acolyte
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2004 : 21:20:03
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according to forgotten realms campaign setting (3e) i forget what page, beginning of the chapter that's "the dawn of "something or another
it's saurials(reptilians that produced nagas, yuanti, and others)
dragons, giants, amphibious shape changers(produced dopplegangers and the fish people, i forgeth what they're called), and humans.
other races came here from other planes, or were created artificially by god's or other races.
"and naught shall be left but shattered thrones, with none to rule them but the dead. Dragons shall rule the world entire" |
~chosen of Velsharoon
"and naught shall be left, saved shattered throwns with none to rule them but the dead." |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2004 : 21:50:32
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quote:
Originally posted by chosenofvelsharoon
according to forgotten realms campaign setting (3e) i forget what page, beginning of the chapter that's "the dawn of "something or another
it's saurials(reptilians that produced nagas, yuanti, and others)
dragons, giants, amphibious shape changers(produced dopplegangers and the fish people, i forgeth what they're called), and humans.
That sounds like the Creator Races paragraph on page 261 in the FRCS' History chapter. |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2004 : 23:42:54
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quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
That sounds like the Creator Races paragraph on page 261 in the FRCS' History chapter.
Maybe I'm going senile now as well because I thought I posted that on page one. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2004 : 00:16:03
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quote:
Originally posted by kuje31
Maybe I'm going senile now as well because I thought I posted that on page one. :)
I thought it had been mentioned too. But, when I see the same thing come up again, I figure I either didn't see it like I thought or I have my threads mixed up. Regardless, I'm happy in my deluded state until someone comes along to rock the boat again. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36784 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2004 : 01:15:26
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quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
Regardless, I'm happy in my deluded state
I'm gonna remember you said that. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Creator Races
