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Copper Elven Vampire
Master of Realmslore
1078 Posts |
 Posted - 17 Dec 2016 : 21:01:53
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As the DM of our Campaign, a PC really, really, really wants the Divine Agent PrC for his Cleric. But... he is asking if I can take away 5 class abilities and replace them with full spell progression in his existing divine spellcasting class. I took a look at the PrC and I will admit that this class has a bunch of powerful class abilities. The PC is asking if I could take away 5 class abilities and replace them with 5 additional spell levels (giving full spell progression in all 10 levels).
There are quite a few powerful class abilities, so my questions are, what 5 class abilities would you take away, and would you even allow the switch? I can figure out which 5 to take away, (the most powerful 5 class abilities), but I really want to know if you would even allow the switch.
Thank you,
CEV
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Copper Elven Vampire
Master of Realmslore
1078 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2016 : 00:28:29
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I'm thinking that the 5 class abilities I'll take away will be in order of class level of the PrC.
I'll take away Contact and Altered Appearance.
I'll take away Commune and Plane Shift (Deities home plane).
I'll take away Audience (which is really powerful) and Alignment shift.
And lastly I'd take away Gate.
Please let me know if you think exchanging these 7 class abilities for 5 extra levels of existing Divine spellcasting class is something you would allow.
Thank you,
CEV |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4457 Posts |
Posted - 18 Dec 2016 : 18:02:30
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Gate definitely, as you'd get that a whole level early instead as a 9th level spell at Cleric 17.
Commune and Plane Shift too because that's a nice easy get-away thing they'll always seem to have.
I don't particularly mind Audience because it's 2/year. I dunno but that would be something that can continue to fuel campaigns.
Contact and Altered Appearance are sort of meh features. I'd allow them to keep it.
Personally gate, commune, and planeshift are what I'd take away for full casting and maybe Alignment Shift if alignment is something that's really played up in your campaigns. |
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Copper Elven Vampire
Master of Realmslore
1078 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2016 : 16:54:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
Gate definitely, as you'd get that a whole level early instead as a 9th level spell at Cleric 17.
Commune and Plane Shift too because that's a nice easy get-away thing they'll always seem to have.
I don't particularly mind Audience because it's 2/year. I dunno but that would be something that can continue to fuel campaigns.
Contact and Altered Appearance are sort of meh features. I'd allow them to keep it.
Personally gate, commune, and planeshift are what I'd take away for full casting and maybe Alignment Shift if alignment is something that's really played up in your campaigns.
That sounds pretty much what I had in mind. It still keeps the flavor of the PrC while giving full casting. Thanks Diffan. |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1564 Posts |
Posted - 25 Dec 2016 : 04:33:49
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| I'd just repurpose the class as a cleric archetype. |
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Copper Elven Vampire
Master of Realmslore
1078 Posts |
Posted - 25 Dec 2016 : 21:06:29
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quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
I'd just repurpose the class as a cleric archetype.
And what would you do or allow to this class in your campaign. How would you change the PrC to make it a Cleric Archetype? |
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Copper Elven Vampire
Master of Realmslore
1078 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2016 : 01:16:05
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Would it be easier to to make the Divine Agent a 5 level PrC?
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Copper Elven Vampire
Master of Realmslore
1078 Posts |
Posted - 31 Dec 2016 : 03:59:02
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Here is the 10 lvl PrC that I made into a 5 lvl and took out most of the very powerful class abilities. Would any of you allow this PrC in your game, and do you think it still keeps the cool flavor of the class? All comments are welcome.
Spells per day: A Divine Agent's training focuses on divine magic. Thus, when a character gains a new level, she gains new spells per day as if she also gained a level in whatever Divine spellcasting class she belonged to before she added the prestige class. She does not however gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained.
Granted Domain: At 1'st level a divine agent gains access to one domain chosen from among those her deity offers, and with it the granted power of that domain. Divine agents who were once clerics essentially gain a third domain this way and can prepare their domain spells at each level from the new domain’s list if they wish.
Godly gift: : At 1'st, 3'rd, and 5'th levels, the deity bestows on the divine agent a gift. Each deity’s gift varies, but it is usually the ability to use a spell from one of the divine agent’s domains as a spell-like ability. The deity offers a spell of the divine agent’s level or lower. In other words, a 3rd-level divine agent would gain one of her 1st-level, 2nd-level, or 3rd-level domain spells as a spell-like ability. The divine agent may use this ability once per day. The spell-like ability functions as a spell cast by a cleric of a level equal to the divine agent’s character level.
Menacing aura: : At 2'nd level, a divine agent gains the ability to generate an intangible, invisible aura of menace that weakens hostile creatures within a 20-foot radius. Anyone about to attack the divine agent must attempt a Will save (DC = the divine agent’s character level). Those who fail the saving throw suffer a –2 morale penalty on attacks, checks, and saves for one full day or until they successfully damage the divine agent generating the aura. A creature that made its initial save or damaged the divine agent is immune to that divine agent’s aura for one day.
Mystic union: At 4'th level, a divine agent becomes a magical creature. She is treated as an outsider of the deity’s home plane rather than as a humanoid. For instance, charm person does not affect her. Additionally, the divine agent gains damage reduction 20/+1. This damage reduction does not stack with other forms of damage reduction.
Plane shift to Deities Plane: : A divine agent of 5th level may plane shift to her deity’s home plane once per day, and from that plane to the divine agent’s native plane. This spell-like ability functions as the spell cast by a cleric of a level equal to the divine agent’s character level.
The Divine Agent TABLE 1:1
Base
Attack
Level Bonus Fort Ref Will Special Spellcasting
1st +0 +0 +2 +2 Granted Domain, +1 spellcasting level
Godly gift
2nd +1 +0 +3 +3 Menacing aura +1 spellcasting level
3rd +2 +1 +3 +3 Godly gift +1 spellcasting level
4th +3 +2 +4 +4 Mystic Union +1 spellcasting level
5th +3 +1 +4 +4 Godly gift,
Plane shift +1 spellcasting level
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Edited by - Copper Elven Vampire on 31 Dec 2016 04:49:35 |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1564 Posts |
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Copper Elven Vampire
Master of Realmslore
1078 Posts |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1564 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jan 2017 : 04:08:48
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I'm sorry, I thought that this was a pathfinder thread for some reason.
Anyway, looking at the Divine Agent again, the abilities are all over the place. I'd entirely suggest backporting the pathfinder Exalted and Evangelist prestige classes to your 3.5e campaign, but if not, here are some suggested changes.
Remove the divine spellcasting requirement. The Divine Agent is specifically a trusted agent of a deity, not a souped-up cleric. There's no reason why, say, Corellon, a god of combat and the arcane arts, would promote a cleric over a wizard.
Move Altered Appearance to 7th level, replace with Aspect of Divinity. Remove plane shift to any plane, just allow the plane shift to deity's plane to allow plane shifting to any plane if it would further the interests of the deity in question.
Delete Mystic Union and Gate, replace Gate with either Perform Miracle or Spiritual Form.
You can find the abilities I've listed here:
http://archivesofnethys.com/PrestigeClassesDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Evangelist
http://archivesofnethys.com/PrestigeClassesDisplay.aspx?ItemName=Exalted |
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Copper Elven Vampire
Master of Realmslore
1078 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jan 2017 : 05:43:24
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I will look into that. Thank you LoB. Did you dig my 5 level version of Divine Agent?
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Copper Elven Vampire
Master of Realmslore
1078 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jan 2017 : 05:45:18
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But Mystic Union is such a yummy class ability. And not unbalanced.
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1564 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jan 2017 : 11:04:31
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The mystic union feature is awkward. It's supposed to be a capstone, but you get it at 9th level, and the DR is functionally meaningless at that point.
Either delete it, or adapt the pathfinder monk's capstone ability; instead of 20/+1, it's 10/opposite alignment and maybe some other bonus thrown in. If you turn it into a capstone ability, you have to make it appealing, maybe refluff Spiritual Form somehow, and you gain the outsider subtype for x minutes along with a physical attribute and a mental bonus that fits your god?
Also, I'd suggest giving the agent the Evangelist's Aligned Class feature.
Also, with regard to the 5 level Divine Agent, I mostly deal with pathfinder, and 5 level prestige classes tend to be quite strong and focused. I mean, it's good, but kind of underpowered compared to pathfinder. |
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Copper Elven Vampire
Master of Realmslore
1078 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jan 2017 : 14:38:48
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quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
The mystic union feature is awkward. It's supposed to be a capstone, but you get it at 9th level, and the DR is functionally meaningless at that point.
Either delete it, or adapt the pathfinder monk's capstone ability; instead of 20/+1, it's 10/opposite alignment and maybe some other bonus thrown in. If you turn it into a capstone ability, you have to make it appealing, maybe refluff Spiritual Form somehow, and you gain the outsider subtype for x minutes along with a physical attribute and a mental bonus that fits your god?
Also, I'd suggest giving the agent the Evangelist's Aligned Class feature.
Also, with regard to the 5 level Divine Agent, I mostly deal with pathfinder, and 5 level prestige classes tend to be quite strong and focused. I mean, it's good, but kind of underpowered compared to pathfinder.
Well how would you make this class a more powerful 5 level PrC? I'm very curious and may use it.
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A question to DM's about Divine Agent PrC
