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Kuje
Great Reader

USA
7915 Posts

Posted - 06 Jun 2006 :  17:57:29  Show Profile Send Kuje a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Zanan

Originally posted by Kuje

quote:
Originally posted by Zanan

quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
Plus the Staircase is mentioned in the Player's Guide in Shaundakal's entry and Selunes.



If only one has not to scan every book for every detail, especially if the details are quite important ... for some. The planescapers will surely be happy now.
Nod? Grin. Well I know my planar lore since I run FR and planar games. :)


Well, I run no planar games and thus checked the more important and relevant FR sources (3E/RE). But now that I know where to look and whom to ask

On another note. I am going to have a scout/druid of Fenmarel soon and came accross that druidic vow part again. Now, be default, druids may only ever wield weapons according to their druidic list, unless they belong to Mielikki's faith. Has there been any updates / changes to this ever after the FRCS, for one would assume that elven druids would still be used to able to work with bows (if not longswords). The Fenmarel entry in Demihuman Deities gives a list for specialty priests (he only had SP back then) which includes the short bow. Now, one wonders whether the druids of the Realms will get some more attention with regard to this and other issues, much like the clerics get PrC, substitution levels and initiate feats. Furthermore, the druidic deity list in the FRCS seems not to be all inclusive (e.g., Fenmarel has druids according to F&P), so a web-enhancment might be a fine option here. Anything in the making?



Well,

The Player's Guide does advance some of the planar info from the FRCS, like adding the three other astrals to Toril. :)

As for the druid issue, I'd say elven druids could wield bows but I'd not allow them to wield crossbows. I can't recall any lore showing changes to druid weapons except for whatever was changed in the 3.5e PHB..... But sine he allowed his clergy to have short bows in 2e, I see no reason to disallow them.

For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird

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Chosen of Bane
Senior Scribe

USA
552 Posts

Posted - 06 Jun 2006 :  18:34:18  Show Profile  Visit Chosen of Bane's Homepage Send Chosen of Bane a Private Message  Reply with Quote
In D&D 3.5 Druids can use any weapon they want to without violating their druidic oaths. Metallic armor is the only weapon/armor that is forbidden for Druids. A single class Druid is only proficient in the weapons listed in the PHB (club, dagger, dart, quarterstaff, scimitar, sickle, shortspear, sling, and spear) but if they gain weapon proficiency from another source than they can use them without worrying about upsetting their deity.

So, an elven druid could indeed use a longbow (or longsword for that matter) without upsetting their deity. A crossbow is also fine, but you need be gain the proficiency through multiclassing or the simple weapon proficiency feat.
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Kuje
Great Reader

USA
7915 Posts

Posted - 06 Jun 2006 :  18:41:25  Show Profile Send Kuje a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Chosen of Bane

A crossbow is also fine, but you need be gain the proficiency through multiclassing or the simple weapon proficiency feat.



It might be fine for the rules but to me it breaks the lore, which is why I said, I'd not allow them to use crossbows. :)

For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird

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Kajehase
Great Reader

Sweden
2104 Posts

Posted - 06 Jun 2006 :  20:32:25  Show Profile Send Kajehase a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Chosen of Bane

In D&D 3.5 Druids can use any weapon they want to without violating their druidic oaths. Metallic armor is the only weapon/armor that is forbidden for Druids. A single class Druid is only proficient in the weapons listed in the PHB (club, dagger, dart, quarterstaff, scimitar, sickle, shortspear, sling, and spear) but if they gain weapon proficiency from another source than they can use them without worrying about upsetting their deity.

So, an elven druid could indeed use a longbow (or longsword for that matter) without upsetting their deity. A crossbow is also fine, but you need be gain the proficiency through multiclassing or the simple weapon proficiency feat.



Well, they'd still have to refrain from using metal heads for the arrows/bolts.

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Zanan
Senior Scribe

Germany
942 Posts

Posted - 06 Jun 2006 :  22:28:42  Show Profile  Visit Zanan's Homepage Send Zanan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Well, my initial error was to believe in the German version of the 3RE PHB, which apparently copy & pasted that section from the 3E one. The original 3RE PHB as well as the SRDs have no restrictions on weapons and the FAQ has actually clarified the info:

Question
In 3.5, it appears that druids lose their abilities only when using metal armor or shields, but not when wielding nondruid weapons (as was previously true). Is this the case?

FAQ
For instance, could a barbarian/druid wield a greataxe without losing his abilities?
Beginning with version 3.5 of the D&D rules, druids have no restriction regarding which weapons they can wield. A druid could wield a greatsword, halberd, or repeating crossbow
without any ill effect (other than the normal penalty for nonproficiency). This is a specific change from previous versions of the game.

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EytanBernstein
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
704 Posts

Posted - 07 Jun 2006 :  01:48:54  Show Profile  Visit EytanBernstein's Homepage Send EytanBernstein a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Druids aren't proficient with those weapons in either edition, but if they got proficiency (via a level in barbarian or fighter for example), they would be allowed to wield those weapons. That only applies to the weapons, however, not the armor.

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Edited by - EytanBernstein on 07 Jun 2006 01:50:23
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Zanan
Senior Scribe

Germany
942 Posts

Posted - 07 Jun 2006 :  12:32:22  Show Profile  Visit Zanan's Homepage Send Zanan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by EytanBernstein

Druids aren't proficient with those weapons in either edition, but if they got proficiency (via a level in barbarian or fighter for example), they would be allowed to wield those weapons. That only applies to the weapons, however, not the armor.



True enough. My concern was with regard to elven druids, who gain proficiency with bows (and longswords) because of their race. Hence the initial question. Obviously, a certain degree of common sense should be applied by players nonetheless. Especially with regards to weapons quite uncommon and of not that much use in the wilderness or Underdark, e.g. greatswords, greataxes, halberds, or the like.

Cave quid dicis, quando et cui!

Gęš a wyrd swa hio scel!

In memory of Alura Durshavin.

Visit my "Homepage" to find A Guide to the Drow NPCs of Faerūn, Drow and non-Drow PrC and much more.
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EytanBernstein
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
704 Posts

Posted - 07 Jun 2006 :  22:06:52  Show Profile  Visit EytanBernstein's Homepage Send EytanBernstein a Private Message  Reply with Quote
If you look at the more Arthurian take on druids (at least that's have I've always seen it) as spellcasters who derive their power from the land, but also are wise and sought after in the world of men (basically what is done in Doug Niles' Moonshae series with the character Robyn), having a longsword or a bow wouldn't be so weird. A bow hardly seems out of character, consisdering it's a hunting weapon. And a longsword, well, I guess I could just write that one off because they're elves. Restrictions like that never made sense to me anyway - why can they wield metal sickles, but not scythes? Why slings, but not bows?

quote:
Originally posted by Zanan

quote:
Originally posted by EytanBernstein

Druids aren't proficient with those weapons in either edition, but if they got proficiency (via a level in barbarian or fighter for example), they would be allowed to wield those weapons. That only applies to the weapons, however, not the armor.



True enough. My concern was with regard to elven druids, who gain proficiency with bows (and longswords) because of their race. Hence the initial question. Obviously, a certain degree of common sense should be applied by players nonetheless. Especially with regards to weapons quite uncommon and of not that much use in the wilderness or Underdark, e.g. greatswords, greataxes, halberds, or the like.


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Kuje
Great Reader

USA
7915 Posts

Posted - 07 Jun 2006 :  22:28:52  Show Profile Send Kuje a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by EytanBernstein

If you look at the more Arthurian take on druids (at least that's have I've always seen it) as spellcasters who derive their power from the land, but also are wise and sought after in the world of men (basically what is done in Doug Niles' Moonshae series with the character Robyn), having a longsword or a bow wouldn't be so weird. A bow hardly seems out of character, consisdering it's a hunting weapon. And a longsword, well, I guess I could just write that one off because they're elves. Restrictions like that never made sense to me anyway - why can they wield metal sickles, but not scythes? Why slings, but not bows?


They could wield scythe's in 2e but for some reason WOTC removed that but kept the sickle in the 3/3.5e rules. Or maybe that was a variant rule from the Druids Handbook... And I agree with the bows but I don't agree, as I said above, with multiclass druids wielding many of the other metal weapons. However, since this was about Fenmarel and he allowed bows for his specality priests, which incidently were not druids. But I could see an elf druid with a longsword, I suppose..... I guess.....

For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird

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Edited by - Kuje on 07 Jun 2006 22:33:09
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Zanan
Senior Scribe

Germany
942 Posts

Posted - 07 Jun 2006 :  22:50:36  Show Profile  Visit Zanan's Homepage Send Zanan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
But I could see an elf druid with a longsword, I suppose..... I guess.....



Well, I would make that sword look like the thing the LotR-movie-Arwen wielded. Elven-elegantish scimitar-single-edgish sort of weapon. Obviously, it might even be carved from some hard wood as described in the DMG / Magic of Faerūn.

While we are at it ... I never quite understood why certain weapon could not be created from adamantine or mithril, e.g. a quarterstaff. I mean, the only difference would be that the adamantine QS would be somewhat heavier than the wooden one (metal and all), but the mithril one does not fall into this category. Matter of factly, their creation should be far easier than that of a sword et al, given the far less work of a weaponsmith. (Ahem, just in case, I speak of quarterstaff in general, not druidic weaponry any longer ... though, they could wield them too nowadays.)

Cave quid dicis, quando et cui!

Gęš a wyrd swa hio scel!

In memory of Alura Durshavin.

Visit my "Homepage" to find A Guide to the Drow NPCs of Faerūn, Drow and non-Drow PrC and much more.
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Kajehase
Great Reader

Sweden
2104 Posts

Posted - 08 Jul 2006 :  12:10:20  Show Profile Send Kajehase a Private Message  Reply with Quote
A minor issue that has been pecked away at my sanity like a shoal of cats ever since I took a closer look at the 3.5 Monster Manual entry for elves:

When creating a wood elf for Realms products, is it the Monster Manual (Str +2, Int -2) or the one from the FRCS (Str +2, Dex +2, Con -2, Int -2, Cha -2) that is used?

There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
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Kuje
Great Reader

USA
7915 Posts

Posted - 08 Jul 2006 :  14:47:52  Show Profile Send Kuje a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Kajehase

A minor issue that has been pecked away at my sanity like a shoal of cats ever since I took a closer look at the 3.5 Monster Manual entry for elves:

When creating a wood elf for Realms products, is it the Monster Manual (Str +2, Int -2) or the one from the FRCS (Str +2, Dex +2, Con -2, Int -2, Cha -2) that is used?



I'd use the FRCS or Races of Faerun or any other FR info over something from the core, but that's me.

For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird

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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
36784 Posts

Posted - 08 Jul 2006 :  16:30:48  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje

quote:
Originally posted by Kajehase

A minor issue that has been pecked away at my sanity like a shoal of cats ever since I took a closer look at the 3.5 Monster Manual entry for elves:

When creating a wood elf for Realms products, is it the Monster Manual (Str +2, Int -2) or the one from the FRCS (Str +2, Dex +2, Con -2, Int -2, Cha -2) that is used?



I'd use the FRCS or Races of Faerun or any other FR info over something from the core, but that's me.



Ditto. Setting-specific always trumps non-specific stuff for me.

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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31701 Posts

Posted - 08 Jul 2006 :  16:42:49  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'm going to have to agree with Wooly and Kuje on this one, Kaje.

Not only is it important to recognise the relevance of setting-specific material over non-specific, but I think the FRCS/RoF stats for wood elves reflect, overall, how wood elves should be, and not just because they're in the Realms.

The MM stats feel like they're missing something.

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Edited by - The Sage on 08 Jul 2006 16:44:04
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Kajehase
Great Reader

Sweden
2104 Posts

Posted - 08 Jul 2006 :  17:23:44  Show Profile Send Kajehase a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Oh I prefer the FRCS-version myself, as well (especially with three moderators saying so). But, shrug, it'd still be nice to know what the official line for the elves we see in 3.5 Realms-products is. I think there's a wood elf in Champions of Ruin for instance.

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Foxhelm
Senior Scribe

Canada
592 Posts

Posted - 08 Jul 2006 :  18:42:20  Show Profile Send Foxhelm a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I was wondering this question. Could a PC reach epic levels after six years of character time? From going from first level to over twenty. Would it be possible? How much adventuring would they have to do? Would it help if they were adventuring on the planes?

Just curious.

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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
36784 Posts

Posted - 08 Jul 2006 :  19:43:01  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Foxhelm

I was wondering this question. Could a PC reach epic levels after six years of character time? From going from first level to over twenty. Would it be possible? How much adventuring would they have to do? Would it help if they were adventuring on the planes?

Just curious.



It depends on what they're doing.... Six years of guarding caravans? Nope, not happening. Six years of constant adventure, saving this kingdom, slaying that lich, rescuing the other deity from a fate worse than opera... Yeah, that could to it.

As with so much else, it's quality, not quantity.

(Keep all snarky replies to that last line to a minimum, folks! )

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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader

USA
5402 Posts

Posted - 08 Jul 2006 :  19:47:07  Show Profile  Visit KnightErrantJR's Homepage Send KnightErrantJR a Private Message  Reply with Quote
In general, I like to think of adventurers taking years and years to reach high level, but at the same time, some people are just "prodigies" when it comes to how well they learn their craft (and so might become epic level in less than a decade), and some campaigns might feature "chosen ones" (not Chosen with a big C mind you), that were born to (insert campaign goal here) and as such only take a year or two to become amazingly powerful.
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EytanBernstein
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
704 Posts

Posted - 09 Jul 2006 :  05:46:54  Show Profile  Visit EytanBernstein's Homepage Send EytanBernstein a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Realistically, people go through bursts of success in their lives. Very few people, no matter how famous or successful, are constantly prolific. I could imagine an Elf adventuring even before his hundreth birth day and becoming quite high level, then taking chunks of time off to start a family, rule a realm, etc... Then, if the realm is destroyed (as most of the Elven realms have been), the character might become an adventurer or mover/shaker again. This is why nearly every high level elf character (not including Drizzt) seems to be adept in both magic and fighting. It's like they have mutltiple careers.

I think it might be different for humans. They probably go through a few concentrated years, then settle down. They might take it up again or they might not. Most human adventurers retire before they reach 30.

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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader

USA
5402 Posts

Posted - 09 Jul 2006 :  05:53:20  Show Profile  Visit KnightErrantJR's Homepage Send KnightErrantJR a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Good point Eytan, and it also reminds me of something. Someone that becomes, say, a 15th level fighter when adventuring, retires and becoms the marshal of some region or another. Even though he still engages in combat, fighting orc and hobgoblins isn't as challenging as fighting the beholders, dragons,and giants he fought as an adventurer, so he isn't really challenging himself to become better, even though he isn't exactly "retired" from fighting, which, of course, is represented in the 3.5 rules as the encounters that he faces not producing XP because the EL isn't high enough to do so.

I guess thats why I have never had a problem with elven characters stalling out at high level, because even if they live for 700 years, once they reach, say, 20th level, is the given elf still running out and fighting Great Wyrm dragons and Balors, or is he doing things that wouldn't likely challenge him as much as when he was involved in this or that major endevor.

But I like Eytan's comment about elves and martial/magical classes. I definately see elves changing careers later in their lives.


Edited by - KnightErrantJR on 09 Jul 2006 05:59:48
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader

USA
5402 Posts

Posted - 09 Jul 2006 :  06:01:28  Show Profile  Visit KnightErrantJR's Homepage Send KnightErrantJR a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Eytan (or anyone else), what is your opinion about having to perform something "special" to be able to start gaining epic levels? I like the idea myself that PCs might have to go on a special quest to prove their "epic worth." I think we have a good precedence with books like Farthest Reach, where Araevin had to "learn" epic abilities from a dangerous artifact.
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EytanBernstein
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
704 Posts

Posted - 09 Jul 2006 :  11:33:13  Show Profile  Visit EytanBernstein's Homepage Send EytanBernstein a Private Message  Reply with Quote
In terms of novels, I'd expect that anyone of the equivalent of epic level would have to have played a major part in one or more major world-changing event such as the Shade's Return, Phaerimm/Evereska battle, Rogue Dragons fight, War with Feyri, Time of Troubles, Tuigan invasion, Sahaugin invasion, etc...

I think it's unlikely that in any well-run FR game, anyone reaching 20th level hasn't been involved in something major. It certainly doesn't have to be any of the novel world-changing events, but odds are that the PCs have thwarted an evil god's plan, saved a city/region/race from extinction, founded a realm, destroyed a major threat, or slain a dragon so powerful that an entire region was being devastated. In many games, the PCs might even have been major players in an event like the ones listed above.

If I was running a game about to hit epic, I would make sure the PCs took part in an extremely challenging life-or-death battle before reaching 21st level. I don't think you should hit epic levels by killing a bunch of mid-level demons and disarming a bunch of deadly traps, no matter how tough, unless the threat is in some way meaningful and could cause real harm to someone other than your party. Major personal victories against an incredible nemesis or undoing a major mistake you caused, thereby achieving some sort of redemption, are also valid.

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Kaladorm
Master of Realmslore

United Kingdom
1176 Posts

Posted - 09 Jul 2006 :  18:20:34  Show Profile  Visit Kaladorm's Homepage Send Kaladorm a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I think as Eytan says they should have been involved in 'something' major by the time they reach epic levels, but I wouldn't agree with having to do something special to become epic. Levels are more of an abstraction in Realms terms, and I don't see a character suddenly 'switching' from being normal to epic when they gain that last level
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Kuje
Great Reader

USA
7915 Posts

Posted - 09 Jul 2006 :  18:53:13  Show Profile Send Kuje a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Kaladorm

I think as Eytan says they should have been involved in 'something' major by the time they reach epic levels, but I wouldn't agree with having to do something special to become epic. Levels are more of an abstraction in Realms terms, and I don't see a character suddenly 'switching' from being normal to epic when they gain that last level



I agree and I was going to say the same thing but I didn't. :)

For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird

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EytanBernstein
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
704 Posts

Posted - 09 Jul 2006 :  22:06:06  Show Profile  Visit EytanBernstein's Homepage Send EytanBernstein a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje

quote:
Originally posted by Kaladorm

I think as Eytan says they should have been involved in 'something' major by the time they reach epic levels, but I wouldn't agree with having to do something special to become epic. Levels are more of an abstraction in Realms terms, and I don't see a character suddenly 'switching' from being normal to epic when they gain that last level



I agree and I was going to say the same thing but I didn't. :)



I definitely agree that you shouldn't hold characters back if they've earned the experience. I would just try to plan for something major to happen around the time they are going to reach 20th or so. You certainly could run a module all the way to epic. I tend to stay away from this. If I run a long dungeon (not that magazine) module, even if it's to 15th level, I think it's important for the characters to develop a greater amount of freedom after that. At that level, they can decide to do what they want because they can teleport frequently and without error.

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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31701 Posts

Posted - 10 Jul 2006 :  01:44:41  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'd have to agree with that, for the most part.

However, I think it takes more to allow PCs past 20th level rather than just the fact that it looks like the characters themselves are about to achieve something "big". The campaign itself may be epic, but it's something the PCs have to work into... building up to an Epic-Level point, which doesn't just "happen" at 20th level.

Then again, Epic PCs are rare in my games anyway, I don't actually like epic campaigns, nor the Epic Rules themselves... so I tend to keep the PCs focused toward developing greater abilities at lower-levels.

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Kuje
Great Reader

USA
7915 Posts

Posted - 10 Jul 2006 :  01:51:14  Show Profile Send Kuje a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage

Then again, Epic PCs are rare in my games anyway, I don't actually like epic campaigns, nor the Epic Rules themselves... so I tend to keep the PCs focused toward developing greater abilities at lower-levels.




So are they in mine and, since I'm still used to the info from 2e, all the same events that "epic" characters can do in the new rules can happen before they hit 21st level in 3/3.5e. They can have bastions/guilds/schools/etc since all of those events took place in the core material of 2e long before anyone got into thier teens for levels. So, I tend to keep my games below 20th level in every rule set that I've DM'd for.

For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird

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EytanBernstein
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
704 Posts

Posted - 10 Jul 2006 :  06:41:58  Show Profile  Visit EytanBernstein's Homepage Send EytanBernstein a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje

quote:
Originally posted by The Sage

Then again, Epic PCs are rare in my games anyway, I don't actually like epic campaigns, nor the Epic Rules themselves... so I tend to keep the PCs focused toward developing greater abilities at lower-levels.




So are they in mine and, since I'm still used to the info from 2e, all the same events that "epic" characters can do in the new rules can happen before they hit 21st level in 3/3.5e. They can have bastions/guilds/schools/etc since all of those events took place in the core material of 2e long before anyone got into thier teens for levels. So, I tend to keep my games below 20th level in every rule set that I've DM'd for.



All of this aside, I've never played in or run an epic level campaign. I'd really like to because I do like epic play, but campaigns rarely last long enough to get to epic levels. I like characters to earn their levels, so I wouldn't want to start a campaign at that high a level.

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GothicDan
Master of Realmslore

USA
1103 Posts

Posted - 10 Jul 2006 :  20:52:08  Show Profile  Visit GothicDan's Homepage Send GothicDan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ah, 2E. Where it took a decade of real life play to reach 20th level. :)

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"That attitude should be stomped on, whenever and wherever it's encountered, because it makes people holding such views bad citizens, not just bad roleplayers (considering D&D was structured as a 'forced cooperation' game, and although successive editions are pointing it more and more towards a me-first, min-max game, the drift away from 'we all need each other to succeed' will at some point make it 'no longer' D&D)." - ED GREENWOOD
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EytanBernstein
Forgotten Realms Designer

USA
704 Posts

Posted - 11 Jul 2006 :  00:53:18  Show Profile  Visit EytanBernstein's Homepage Send EytanBernstein a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by GothicDan

Ah, 2E. Where it took a decade of real life play to reach 20th level. :)



You've got that right. I had a thief that went to 10th level, then dual classes into a cleric after having a religious awakening. He eventually reached 16th level as a cleric. The whole dual class system was really bizarre. That campaign was a good 6 or 7 years long.

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