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It is true that for some decades in the Realms (the time covered by the Realms boxed sets of both the 1st and 2nd Edition) there were apparently no male clerics of Lolth and no male clerics of Eilistraee, and no non-drow clergy of either goddess.

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There wasn’t a single date or clear moment when the acceptance of males and non-drow began; it seems to have been slowly and almost secretively occurring over a decade or so. However, as of 1373 DR, “everyone” among the clergy of Eilistraee now seems to be aware of it.

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TSR 9326 FOR2 Drow of the Underdark, p. 23

"All clergy of Eilistraee are females of any intelligent race.

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TSR 9326 FOR2 Drow of the Underdark, p. 24

"At least once a year, priestesses of Eilistraee undertake a "Run." Those who are not drow blacken their bodies with natural dyes and oils. All priestesses, drow or not, boil certain leaves and berries to make their hair silvery..."

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TSR 9585 Demihuman Deities, p. 14

"All clergy of Eilistraee must be female, but they may be of any intelligent race."

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TSR 9585 Demihuman Deities, p. 17

"Sword dancers can be of any intelligent race, but they must be female."

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TSR 9326 FOR2 Drow of the Underdark, p. 38

"Customs, Rules, & Taboos: [ . . . ] There are male priests of Lolth, but the Spider Queen very rarely allows them to rise above 7th level of experience."

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MC3 Forgotten Realms Appendix, Entry Chitines

"Chitines are cast-off experiments of the drow. They have increased in numbers over the centuries, and even now plot to overthrow the drow who are Lolth's favorites. They are devoted to their spider queen and will do anything in her name. The priestesses of the chitines are rumored to be of a different and more powerful race, more akin to Lolth herself."

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Originally posted by grymhild

On Nov 5, 2006 THO posted

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It is true that for some decades in the Realms (the time covered by the Realms boxed sets of both the 1st and 2nd Edition) there were apparently no male clerics of Lolth and no male clerics of Eilistraee, and no non-drow clergy of either goddess.

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and

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There wasn’t a single date or clear moment when the acceptance of males and non-drow began; it seems to have been slowly and almost secretively occurring over a decade or so. However, as of 1373 DR, “everyone” among the clergy of Eilistraee now seems to be aware of it.

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However, this seems to contradict 2e AD&D sources such as Drow of the Underdark and Demihuman Deities.

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TSR 9326 FOR2 Drow of the Underdark, p. 23

"All clergy of Eilistraee are females of any intelligent race.

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...

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Originally posted by TBeholder

quote:

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Originally posted by grymhild

On Nov 5, 2006 THO posted

quote:

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It is true that for some decades in the Realms (the time covered by the Realms boxed sets of both the 1st and 2nd Edition) there were apparently no male clerics of Lolth and no male clerics of Eilistraee, and no non-drow clergy of either goddess.

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and

quote:

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There wasn’t a single date or clear moment when the acceptance of males and non-drow began; it seems to have been slowly and almost secretively occurring over a decade or so. However, as of 1373 DR, “everyone” among the clergy of Eilistraee now seems to be aware of it.

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However, this seems to contradict 2e AD&D sources such as Drow of the Underdark and Demihuman Deities.

quote:

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TSR 9326 FOR2 Drow of the Underdark, p. 23

"All clergy of Eilistraee are females of any intelligent race.

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...

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And the Dambraii half-drow venerate Lolth (it's secondary to the state religion of Loviatar, but she is an ancestral deity of their relatives/neighbours/allies in T'lindhet, after all).
But what exactly "seems to contradict" what?
Both deities evidently had male or non-drow priests, but so rare and/or remote and/or otherwise not noticeable that "there were apparently no" such.
And?.. You understand what "generalisation" is, right? Use common sense...
How many surface elves (of any sort) want to hang out with the drow (of any sort), much less look up at them? Where's that Dambrath and how many outsiders (other than from T'lindhet) visit it? How many surface-dwellers ever heard of the chitines at all, much less in juicy details? How exactly would an average hunter tell a drow from a wood elf with skin painted dark and hair silver, if he barely gets to see a glimpse of hair and sword as she runs by?..

I'm obviously not Ed, but it puzzles me that this needs a clarification at all, much less "from the horse's mouth".

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Originally posted by Xnella Moonblade-Thann
TBholder, not everyone can read between the lines on Realms Lore, and sometimes people miss details the first few times they read the lore. Don't be so harsh and demeaning with your words, please. It may make some scribes nervous to post their questions to the creator of the Realms if the other scribes act like the questions asked are too stupid to be asked.

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Originally posted by TBeholder
...
And the Dambraii half-drow venerate Lolth (it's secondary to the state religion of Loviatar, but she is an ancestral deity of their relatives/neighbours/allies in T'lindhet, after all).
But what exactly "seems to contradict" what?
Both deities evidently had male or non-drow priests, but so rare and/or remote and/or otherwise not noticeable that "there were apparently no" such.
And?.. You understand what "generalisation" is, right? Use common sense...
How many surface elves (of any sort) want to hang out with the drow (of any sort), much less look up at them? Where's that Dambrath and how many outsiders (other than from T'lindhet) visit it? How many surface-dwellers ever heard of the chitines at all, much less in juicy details? How exactly would an average hunter tell a drow from a wood elf with skin painted dark and hair silver, if he barely gets to see a glimpse of hair and sword as she runs by?..

I'm obviously not Ed, but it puzzles me that this needs a clarification at all, much less "from the horse's mouth".

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DM (redacted #1) to another player wrote:
...
When it comes to worship of Eilistraee it is not enabled for humans. We can allow you to pick her as a deity on the these conditions,

You pick the no-deity option and RP worshipping Eilistraee instead
Your character ceases to be a paladin and favoured soul
Your character does not take the cleric class (in fact he won't be able to given the lack of a mechanical deity)

Eilistraee does not support paladins and we generally do not like to see favoured souls switch deities for RP and mechanical reasons. Also in this timeline Eilistraee does not have human clergy.

If a mechanical fix becomes available we can then later change your character's deity to Eilistraee.

How does this sound to you?

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grymhild to the DM Staff wrote:
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Hi,

I've heard that there might be some confusion by some on the staff as to Eilistraee's clergy.

Unless our server specifically deviates from canon FR lore, Eilistraee accepts females of _any_ intelligent race as a priestess.

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TSR 9326 FOR2 Drow of the Underdark, p. 23 wrote:
"All clergy of Eilistraee are females of any intelligent race."

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TSR 9585 Demihuman Deities, p. 13 (p. 11 in an OCR pdf) wrote:
"Eilistraee also has worshipers of human, elven, and in particular, half-elven stock (particularly around Silverymoon), and she looks kindly upon the Harpers."

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TSR 9585 Demihuman Deities, p. 14 (p. 13 ocr pdf) wrote:
"All clergy of Eilistraee must be female, but they may be of any intelligent race."

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quote:

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TSR 9585 Demihuman Deities, p. 17 (p 16. ocr pdf) wrote:
"Sword dancers can be of any intelligent race, but they must be female."

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... my question is... what is the lore source for Eilistraee only accepting elven blooded clergy (ie. Drow, half-drow, elves, half-elves)?

~Grymhild

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Head DM (redacted #2)
...
The source for this is Ed Greenwood.

His replies on Candlekeep give a history of the development of Eilistraee's clergy. Check the post from "The Hooded One" dated 5th November 2006 in this thread: http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=5812&whichpage=67

Its also quoted here: http://www.candlekeep.com/library/articles/sse/sse_101112-06.htm

As you will see, in our timeline strictly speaking the only clergy allowed are female drow as our server is pre 1st Edition, and the faith is secluded and isolationist. Changes start in about 1363 DR

Mechanically on this server though the deity is open to male and female elves and half elves and so we have allowed that.

But an expansion to humans and other races is throwing the lore baby out with the bathwater so we have not allowed it.

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Originally posted by CorellonsDevout

Eilistraee would of course accept male followers, but as far as I know, it is rare for a male to be in the clergy. I know there was a point when they were forbidden to join in the nightly dancing. I love Eilistraee, but that restriction has always bothered me, because she is supposed to be about equality and liberating drow.

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Originally posted by CorellonsDevout

Oh, okay then. I was just going by what I had read in the novels, so if the sourcebooks (and Ed), say otherwise, great.

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Originally posted by CorellonsDevout
I have Demihuman Deities, but I don't remember whether or not it mentioned that males could join in the dance/rituals.

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Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

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Originally posted by The Hooded One

Oooh, great question!
dravenloft, I can clearly recall a sudden fad among adventurers in the Moonsea North, Dales, Sembia, Cormyr, and Lake of Dragons area, in 1357 DR, for using bucklers (the small, round, hand-sized shields). Great in unexpected duels or close-quarters taverm brawls, but of less utility against orcs or barbarians whaling away at you with huge axes or two-handed swords.
That fad was followed by a fashion that lasted for four years (and in some cases clung for another decade or so) for wearing a huge plate-armored "battle arm" (sleeve, fastened at shoulder and wrist, and covering one arm in a properly-jointed but massively armored [[and adorned]] assembly of overlapping and sliding armor plates that covered one arm from shoulder to wrist. Worn even with festive clothing, not just "when armored and ready for war."
As the creator of all of this, Ed can, of course, elaborate.
love,
THO

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I quite liked this tidbit from the other day, and mentioned in an email to Ed that I was making a dwarf NPC with a battle arm. He added:

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Ah, yes, battle arms. Remember that they are great places to wear hidden keys, lockpicks, pionards and "knitting needle daggers," and for a dwarf to latch a detachable drinking-cup to . . . :}

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I'm sure there will be still more to follow, but -- as we all know -- Edlore must be shared!

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Orl: A gemstone believed unique to the North, where it is found only in "blue caves" such as those at Whaeloon.

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Originally posted by George Krashos

You mean Wheloon in Cormyr. Now a "prison city" ... *sigh*

-- George Krashos

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Mordenkainen and Vangerdahast both competed magically for the hand of a young extra-planar beauty (both lost, by the way).

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