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Originally posted by Aldrick

There is no official lore on the matter. At least not that I know of, like everyone else said.

However, I imagine the clergy to be somewhat divided. The division would center around whether or not to treat them like followers of Eilistraee or just kill them all on site. Unlike Irennan I think Shevarash and his faithful have plenty of reasons to kill them on site. For example, we have to keep in mind that those transformed into Dark Elves were not just the followers of Eilistraee. There are certainly worshipers of Lolth among the Dark Elves, individuals who would very much seek to carry on with their old ways on the surface.

It is difficult to say how the divisions would shake out, but if Dark Elves are expecting mercy from the faithful of Shevarash--I do not think they will find it.

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Originally posted by Irennan

The others were the ''pure Miyeritari'', who should be extremely few. TBH, after like 20000 years of living with other drow, I can't see ''pure Miyeritari'' still being around. Many of them also likely died trying to get on the surface, or killed by other drow.

However, the more I think about it, the more it makes sense to assume that followers of Shevarash would be divided on the matter, but IMO more because of prejudice rather than ''legitimate'' reasons.

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Originally posted by Aldrick

Yeah, we would think that, but a lot of things about those novels did not make sense.

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Maybe someone remembers the source, unless I am misremembering. For some reason I am recalling something like 25%--which, yes, sounds outrageous, but whatever.

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Originally posted by Kentinal

Worship percentage clearly has to be considered in that many deities are worshiped, polytheism clearly allows for Lolth and Eilistraee to be given worship from the same person. It was not said that about 25 percent of Drow had Eilistraee as a patron deity, the deity most worshiped and tenets followed is the patron deity of a person/creature.
Ed has indicated that a smaller percent of Drow had Eilistraee as patron deity in one of his answers. Of course as in many things the actual percent or numbers clearly depend on time. The Twisted Tower was once an Eilistraee stronghold however last reference to that I recall reading Eilistraee was almost banished from the Temple within it.
The destruction of most Miyeritari reduced the followers of Lady Silverhair and I never saw any percentage offered of the number of dark Elves that survived the Dark Disaster (which occurred before the Descent) that were from Miyerita. Clearly some would survive deforestation that occurred in the three month storm that killed the forest.

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Originally posted by Mystic Lemur

George, every source I've read (which is by no means all) has said that all the dark elves (Ilythiir and Miyeritar) were turned into Drow. It was an unintended consequence of the high magic used to punish the bad ones (or maybe the mages just didn't care). I'm a little hazy on if Elistraee was turned by the spell, or chose her new form when she chose to become a drow deity.

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As Araushnee, Lolth was once a lesser power of the Seldarine and the consort of Corellon Larethian. She was the patron of artisans, the goddess of elven destiny, and-later, by Corellon's decree-the keeper of those elves who shared her darkly beautiful features.

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Eilistraee chose banishment from Arvandor (and the Seldarine) along with her mother and brother, foreseeing a time when she would be needed to balance their evil.

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Originally posted by Irennan

According to the event in ''Evermeet'', Eilistraee was already a drow before that (for example, she is described as having her current appearence when she appears to Sharlario and his son, or during the tale of Araushenee's betrayal). I guess that she chose her form.

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Originally posted by Fellfire

I was under the impression that wood/green/copper elves were the same thing.

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Originally posted by Aldrick

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Originally posted by Irennan

The others were the ''pure Miyeritari'', who should be extremely few. TBH, after like 20000 years of living with other drow, I can't see ''pure Miyeritari'' still being around. Many of them also likely died trying to get on the surface, or killed by other drow.

However, the more I think about it, the more it makes sense to assume that followers of Shevarash would be divided on the matter, but IMO more because of prejudice rather than ''legitimate'' reasons.

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Yeah, we would think that, but a lot of things about those novels did not make sense. I also recall that an estimate was given at some point in the past (by Ed, I think?). It was a sizable chunk.

Maybe someone remembers the source, unless I am misremembering. For some reason I am recalling something like 25%--which, yes, sounds outrageous, but whatever.

Either way, I agree with your last statement. No matter what, it is easy to envision at least some portion (and a sizable portion at that) of the cult wanting to skin them all alive; simply because they are bigots. It is not like they really liked the faithful of Eilistraee before, and of course she merged with her brother before her death.

I think it is a safe bet to say that at absolute best their relationship with Dark Elves is... chilly. At best.

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Originally posted by Aulduron

Except that the Miyeritari worshiped the Seldarine, according to Qarlynds Selukiira

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Originally posted by Brian R. James

I have a somewhat divergent take on the Descent of the Drow. I think it's much more interesting to frame this story of this as a religious struggle, rather than a racial conflict.

In ancient times only one sub-species of elf existed, the green elves. Like their faerie kin, the green elves lived in the Feywild. The pantheon of gods known as the Seldarine were unknown to the fey, who instead venerated the archfey of the Seelie Court.

In the aftermath of the Dawn War between the gods and the primordials, a growing number of green elves began to worship an ascendant archfey turned god, Corellon Larethian. Fueled by this powerful influx of faith, Corellon blessed his flock by changing them into sun elves. Later, another group of green elves would share a similar blessing, changing into moon elves at the behest of Sehanine Moonbow.

Back on Toril, the end of the Days of Thunder heralded the rise of dragon empires across the world. The leShay, last of the enigmatic creator races, opened gates between between the Feywild and Toril, summoning several tribes of green elves to the mortal world. With their primal powers, the green elves succeeded in limiting the dominion of the dragons and giants alike. By the time the eldarin (sun elves and moon elves) found their way to Faerûn the Age of Dragons was already in its twilight.

As the elven nations began to spread across the Faerûn, it became increasingly important to the faithful of the Seldarine to proselytize their beliefs and convert the heathen green elves to the true faith. In many cases they were quite successful, with many green elves adopting the faiths of Rillifane, Solonor, or others.

One tribe of green elves, however, the Ilythiiri, were staunch in their rejection of the Seldarine. “Where was saintly Corellon Larethian and his priests, when their kind were being slaughtered en masse by the dragon overlords of the south?” Desperate in their struggle, these southern elves turned to other, darker, powers to aid them in their fight against the dragons (Ghaunadaur among others).

Millennia later, the coronal of the eladrin nation of Aryvandaar sought to spread the faith of the Seldarine to their “primitive” neighbor Miyeritar. To the coronal’s thinking (goaded on by the fallen angel Malkizid) any elf which rejected the ‘true faith’ of the Seldarine was branded a ‘dark-elf’ traitor and must be forcibly brought into the faith. The green elves of Miyeritar resisted and Aryvandaar invaded, thus beginning the Crown Wars.

When Miyeritar was scoured by killing storms, the Ilythiiri were outraged. By this time the Ilythiiri (not all ‘dark elves’) were largely corrupted by their dark gods. Using vile magic, the ilythiiri marched and burned their way across the south. Reports of these atrocities just further reinforced the belief in the eladrin that Corellon’s teachings were the only ‘right and true’ path.

In time the eladrin (and Seldarin worshiping green elves) came together to cast the mighty ritual which would finally force the dark-elves to embrace the light of the Seldarine. But something went awry in the casting. Instead of bringing the heathens into the fold, the high magic bleached the hair and darkened the bodies of the non-believers to onyx (all non-believers mind you, the majority being green elves but a score or more eladrin as well).

Thus were the drow of Faerûn born. Their striking similarity in appearance to the children of Kiaransalee leading some to believe that the dark goddess may have had a hand in corrupting the high magic ritual leading to the Descent of the Drow.

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Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

While I normally really like your lore, Brian, the brainwashing aspect bugs me...

So here's how I'd spin it. I'd keep everything up until that part. What I would change would be the end goal of the ritual.

As I understand it, one of the things we learned in the Lady Penitent trilogy was that the drow carry the taint of Wendonai. I'd work with that.

The eladrin discovered the taint of Wendonai, and in their typically arrogant way, thought if they removed that from the equation, the dark elves would naturally return to the light. So they created and cast this big spell, with the intent of purging the taint of Wendonai, and any other fell influences.

However, some of the casters did not have such pure intentions. Perhaps they'd been subverted by the dark elves, or perhaps they themselves were similarly tainted, or maybe they were controlled or even replaced by dark elves. Either way, these guys twisted the spell, intending to subvert the magic and use it to make the dark elves more powerful than their lighter brethren. And the end result of this was the creation of the drow.

The good guys among the ritual casters were very surprised at what had happened. They'd had good, if misguided, intentions, and were horrified at what happened. And it may be a nifty element if the rogue casters turned on them, as well, making sure that the change could not be undone. The rogue casters were driven off, but at a high cost.

The survivors kept quiet about what actually happened, and in time, the whole thing got blamed on the Seldarine.

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Originally posted by Brian R. James


Millennia later, the coronal of the eladrin nation of Aryvandaar sought to spread the faith of the Seldarine to their “primitive” neighbor Miyeritar. To the coronal’s thinking (goaded on by the fallen angel Malkizid) any elf which rejected the ‘true faith’ of the Seldarine was branded a ‘dark-elf’ traitor and must be forcibly brought into the faith. The green elves of Miyeritar resisted and Aryvandaar invaded, thus beginning the Crown Wars.

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Originally posted by Mystic Lemur

George, every source I've read (which is by no means all) has said that all the dark elves (Ilythiir and Miyeritar) were turned into Drow. It was an unintended consequence of the high magic used to punish the bad ones (or maybe the mages just didn't care). I'm a little hazy on if Elistraee was turned by the spell, or chose her new form when she chose to become a drow deity.

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Originally posted by Irennan

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Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

While I normally really like your lore, Brian, the brainwashing aspect bugs me...

So here's how I'd spin it. I'd keep everything up until that part. What I would change would be the end goal of the ritual.

As I understand it, one of the things we learned in the Lady Penitent trilogy was that the drow carry the taint of Wendonai. I'd work with that.

The eladrin discovered the taint of Wendonai, and in their typically arrogant way, thought if they removed that from the equation, the dark elves would naturally return to the light. So they created and cast this big spell, with the intent of purging the taint of Wendonai, and any other fell influences.

However, some of the casters did not have such pure intentions. Perhaps they'd been subverted by the dark elves, or perhaps they themselves were similarly tainted, or maybe they were controlled or even replaced by dark elves. Either way, these guys twisted the spell, intending to subvert the magic and use it to make the dark elves more powerful than their lighter brethren. And the end result of this was the creation of the drow.

The good guys among the ritual casters were very surprised at what had happened. They'd had good, if misguided, intentions, and were horrified at what happened. And it may be a nifty element if the rogue casters turned on them, as well, making sure that the change could not be undone. The rogue casters were driven off, but at a high cost.

The survivors kept quiet about what actually happened, and in time, the whole thing got blamed on the Seldarine.

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But the ''taint'' of Wendonai doesn't do really much to the drow (except barring them from Arvandor), they act as they do mainly because of context (as it is shown by many instances of drow choosing differently, especially when taken out of said context). Unless you meant that this was what the rest of the elves believed.

Also, this would make the light elves look a bit too much like the good guys (save for the Vyshaan) and the dark elves the bad ones (if we exclude the Miyeritari, who were basically exterminated), IMO. Honestly I prefer a more morally blurred version of the Descent, where neither drow, nor elves are completely in the right and both have points going for them.

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