| Author |
 Topic  |
|
Dracandos the Spellsage
Senior Scribe
466 Posts |
 Posted - 12 Jan 2004 : 21:44:54
|
somethin about achieveing elven Godhood, the elven circle of the divine? idk some1 explain what they know of it, cuz as u can c, idk much. thanks
|
Death strips away the masks men don to hide their true nature - The Slayer's Guide to Undead
The Lord of Murder shall perish, but in his doom he shall spawn a score of mortal progeny. Chaos shall be sown from their passage - So Sayeth the Wise Alaundo
Whenever magic one doth weave, 'tis never ever wise to deceive - Elminster
Strength and power come from knowing and controlling what others do not, but never reveal all that you know - Vecna
I have been known to cast a blue mage spell now and again - Dracandos the Spellsage |
|
|
Cherrn
Learned Scribe
Denmark
323 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jan 2004 : 22:03:39
|
The Seldarine is the name elves use for their own group of elven gods not counting drow. As simple as that, The Seldarine = Elven Pantheon.
The dwarves also have a name for theirs, I believe it's called the Morndinsamman or something similar. |
A wise man from Calimport once told me: "If a merchant puts sand in the flask of oil he's trying to sell you, then he isn't trying to sell you sand..." |
 |
|
|
Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2004 : 02:49:57
|
Hmm, the seldarine are also headed by Corellon Larethian, who my deity Vhaeraun harbors a special hatred for..... |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
|
|
|
Naroon Shimmerflow
Learned Scribe
Norway
104 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2004 : 06:41:05
|
Some of the Drow Phanteon was in the early ages also part of the seldarin, until Aurunshee (Lolth) turned against Corellon and the rest of the seldarin. This happende right after the battle between Groomsh and Corellon where Groomsh lost his eye to Corellons eleven blade. Aurunshee was uncovered as a traitor and so was also Aurunshees and corellons two children, Elistraee and Velshearun (i think, can remember)and banished to the abyss with their mother.
Elistraee was the best archer in the old seldarin, when Aurunshee attacked Corellon she tried to shoot an arrow at her, i think one of Aurunshees allies cast an spell on the arrow and the arrow hit Corellon, this is why Bow is a forbidden weapon for the Elistrae worshipers.
I think this is how the history goes, I guess The Sages of Candlekeep will correct me if something is wrong. |
Good dice rolls, beats good tactics anytime[/size=1] |
Edited by - Naroon Shimmerflow on 13 Jan 2004 06:43:01 |
|
|
|
Cherrn
Learned Scribe
Denmark
323 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2004 : 15:25:52
|
| Eilistraee was deemed innocent by Corellon and the rest of the Seldarine but she followed Lolth and Vhaeraun anyway, to serve as a sort of beacon of light to all the good drow who now where to live in darkness. |
A wise man from Calimport once told me: "If a merchant puts sand in the flask of oil he's trying to sell you, then he isn't trying to sell you sand..." |
|
|
|
Naroon Shimmerflow
Learned Scribe
Norway
104 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2004 : 16:45:14
|
correct my friend.
how about an ale? or maybe some godd icewine from Tentowns?
"where did i put it...hmmm... oohh her it is"
*Naroon pull a crystal flask in the shape of a ice chard from his backpack, the flask is coverd in white frost.*
"looks cold but warms the soul" |
Good dice rolls, beats good tactics anytime[/size=1] |
|
|
|
Cherrn
Learned Scribe
Denmark
323 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2004 : 17:24:33
|
| Ooh sounds and looks interesting, yes please. May the caliph shine on you a thousand times! |
A wise man from Calimport once told me: "If a merchant puts sand in the flask of oil he's trying to sell you, then he isn't trying to sell you sand..." |
|
|
|
Naroon Shimmerflow
Learned Scribe
Norway
104 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2004 : 18:10:12
|
*Naroon fills up two glasses of icewine and raises the glass and says;*
" For the realms and candlekeep"
|
Good dice rolls, beats good tactics anytime[/size=1] |
|
|
|
Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2004 : 20:18:34
|
Quote by Naroon:
Some of the Drow Phanteon was in the early ages also part of the seldarin, until Aurunshee (Lolth) turned against Corellon and the rest of the seldarin. This happende right after the battle between Groomsh and Corellon where Groomsh lost his eye to Corellons eleven blade. Aurunshee was uncovered as a traitor and so was also Aurunshees and corellons two children, Elistraee and Velshearun (i think, can remember)and banished to the abyss with their mother.
Elistraee was the best archer in the old seldarin, when Aurunshee attacked Corellon she tried to shoot an arrow at her, i think one of Aurunshees allies cast an spell on the arrow and the arrow hit Corellon, this is why Bow is a forbidden weapon for the Elistrae worshipers.
I think this is how the history goes, I guess The Sages of Candlekeep will correct me if something is wrong.
I actually already knew this, but it does not hurt to post it for those who dont..... Also, if Vhaeraun had been in charge, instead of lolth, all you faerie elves would be praying to him right now...... |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
|
|
|
Ezindir the dark
Senior Scribe
Norway
603 Posts |
|
|
Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2004 : 21:06:37
|
| Yes, she is, and shes worshipped by all types of elves, not just avariel..... |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
|
|
|
Ezindir the dark
Senior Scribe
Norway
603 Posts |
|
|
Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jan 2004 : 21:43:51
|
Shadowlord sends his icy glare towards Ezindir
Why, whatever do you mean??? |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
|
|
|
Dracandos the Spellsage
Senior Scribe
466 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jan 2004 : 02:28:52
|
| ah thank u scribes, i knew it was the elven pantheon but i wished 2 know more (as always) my thanks |
Death strips away the masks men don to hide their true nature - The Slayer's Guide to Undead
The Lord of Murder shall perish, but in his doom he shall spawn a score of mortal progeny. Chaos shall be sown from their passage - So Sayeth the Wise Alaundo
Whenever magic one doth weave, 'tis never ever wise to deceive - Elminster
Strength and power come from knowing and controlling what others do not, but never reveal all that you know - Vecna
I have been known to cast a blue mage spell now and again - Dracandos the Spellsage |
|
|
|
Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jan 2004 : 02:32:58
|
| No thanks necessary, my good man, just doing our duty...... |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
|
|
|
Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jan 2004 : 02:34:02
|
| Hmmm, actually, i have a link that goes into great detail about the seldarine.....contact me if interested..... |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
|
|
|
The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
|
|
Dracandos the Spellsage
Senior Scribe
466 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jan 2004 : 19:37:33
|
quote:
Originally posted by Shadowlord
Hmmm, actually, i have a link that goes into great detail about the seldarine.....contact me if interested.....
sure post it, thanks! |
Death strips away the masks men don to hide their true nature - The Slayer's Guide to Undead
The Lord of Murder shall perish, but in his doom he shall spawn a score of mortal progeny. Chaos shall be sown from their passage - So Sayeth the Wise Alaundo
Whenever magic one doth weave, 'tis never ever wise to deceive - Elminster
Strength and power come from knowing and controlling what others do not, but never reveal all that you know - Vecna
I have been known to cast a blue mage spell now and again - Dracandos the Spellsage |
|
|
|
Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jan 2004 : 15:40:23
|
No problem. This details the Seldarine quite thuroughly(sp?). Mind you, it is not entirely accurate, but you know what happens......
http://www.fantaseum.com/stories/showstory.asp?rec_id=9 |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
Edited by - Shadowlord on 18 Jan 2004 15:43:54 |
|
|
|
Dracandos the Spellsage
Senior Scribe
466 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2004 : 19:34:41
|
| Thanks 4 the link Shadowlord, some good stuff |
Death strips away the masks men don to hide their true nature - The Slayer's Guide to Undead
The Lord of Murder shall perish, but in his doom he shall spawn a score of mortal progeny. Chaos shall be sown from their passage - So Sayeth the Wise Alaundo
Whenever magic one doth weave, 'tis never ever wise to deceive - Elminster
Strength and power come from knowing and controlling what others do not, but never reveal all that you know - Vecna
I have been known to cast a blue mage spell now and again - Dracandos the Spellsage |
|
|
|
Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jan 2004 : 19:45:48
|
| You're welcome. I have more should you ever need it...... |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
|
|
|
lowtech
Learned Scribe
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jan 2004 : 18:08:39
|
| Does anyone know why Elistraee only accepts females as priests? One would think that this would discourage male drow from her service, pushing them into the greedy arms of Vhaerun... |
|
|
|
Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jan 2004 : 20:31:29
|
| It works for me..... The more Vhaeraunite, the more power for the Masked Lord. |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
|
|
|
Dracandos the Spellsage
Senior Scribe
466 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2004 : 00:52:36
|
| hmm isnt that a drow answer. lol |
Death strips away the masks men don to hide their true nature - The Slayer's Guide to Undead
The Lord of Murder shall perish, but in his doom he shall spawn a score of mortal progeny. Chaos shall be sown from their passage - So Sayeth the Wise Alaundo
Whenever magic one doth weave, 'tis never ever wise to deceive - Elminster
Strength and power come from knowing and controlling what others do not, but never reveal all that you know - Vecna
I have been known to cast a blue mage spell now and again - Dracandos the Spellsage |
|
|
|
Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2004 : 00:59:37
|
| Eh, you surfacers are too assuming. There is no "typical" drow answer, and I quote, "Where drow are concerned, its not safe to assume anything." by Liriel Baenre. |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
|
|
|
darkflame millithor
Seeker
USA
52 Posts |
Posted - 14 May 2006 : 23:37:10
|
| Tell them again,shadow lord!And for the record The Dancing Strumpet and the Sly Savage weren't exiled to the abyss with lolth .They were exiled to the prime .That's why Lolth had to stea..Claim their followers..And seize the hearts of the drow. The savage and Strumpet warred for thousands of years with each other before LOlth manifested .The eye is an Idiot who destroyed his own base of power (he used to have the power to head the DarkSeldarine, |
purge all weakness in the cleanzing flame of
rightousness.tear down the false idols of love,compassion,and self-sacrifice.down with the tyranny of the seldarine |
|
|
|
Elven Avenger
Acolyte
Brazil
27 Posts |
Posted - 17 May 2006 : 14:57:43
|
quote:
Originally posted by Shadowlord
Quote by Naroon:
Elistraee was the best archer in the old seldarin, when Aurunshee attacked Corellon she tried to shoot an arrow at her, i think one of Aurunshees allies cast an spell on the arrow and the arrow hit Corellon, this is why Bow is a forbidden weapon for the Elistrae worshipers.
Is that sure? I thought Eilistraee never used a bow again since that day she shoot Corellon but I did not know that she would make the use of weapon forbidden even for her followers. Is that right, I mean in the rule thing? (Just questioning because I've already seen eilistraee worshipers even cleric ones using longbows as ranged weapon..) |
|
|
|
Wandering_mage
Senior Scribe
688 Posts |
Posted - 17 May 2006 : 15:11:23
|
I would be very interested to hear the answer to this question.  |
Illum
The Wandering Mage |
|
|
|
Kentinal
Great Reader
4689 Posts |
Posted - 17 May 2006 : 15:20:11
|
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20020503a does not speak to the issue, however 2nd offers:
quote:
After Eilistraee nearly slew her father with an arrow during a great battle between the Seldarine and a host of evil deities bent on conquering Arvandor, the Dark Maiden forswore the use of ranged weapons (although she permits them to her followers).
|
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
|
|
|
Kentinal
Great Reader
4689 Posts |
Posted - 17 May 2006 : 16:03:48
|
quote:
Originally posted by lowtech
Does anyone know why Elistraee only accepts females as priests? One would think that this would discourage male drow from her service, pushing them into the greedy arms of Vhaerun...
I missed this before.
There is no clear answer to this and some followers of Eilistraee believe the male restriction is an error.
Posible in game reasons to justify the rule are.
1) At one point in time it was said the Clerics of the "fair elves" all were femate, no males allowed (however that was a long time ago as others deities now have male Clerics, so not a very good reason but Eilistraee might be a traditionalist).
2) One assepect of Eilistraee is the role of mother to the Drow, thus females only can be mothers to the Drow and lead and nuture followers. No male really makes a good mother.
3) Because Eilistraee is female she relates well with only females when granting Clerics spells.
4) Males do not have the grace and beaty enough to qualify to be a Cleric (This one clearly debatable as some males clearly cound be considered beautiful, though most might be descriped handsome if fair to look on).
5) Most followers are still Drow and for thousands of years have lived in a culture of mostly female Clerics (er, in 2nd and earilier Lolth did have some male Clerics, however never allowed them to gain high level, 3rd edition killed off all Lolth male Clerics [or turned them into females], and leaders it would thus be hard for followers to adapt to the idea of a male Cleric.
Posible out of game reasons:
1) The idea of dancing naked males was an image somebody at TSR or ED did not want to promote.
2) Drow, in 3rd at least, favored class for Drow females is Cleric.
3) Tradition first enty said female only (this does not hold well, because Lolth lost her male Clerics).
I do know most followers/fans of Eilistraee believe the female only restriction should not exist and many house rule that there can be rarely male Clerics of the Dark Maiden. Also from time to time a question come up if 3rd now allowys males because of a novel that indicates a Priest of Eilistraee was killed. The actual line read something like "he was killed" hardly deffinitive for the nay sayers. The Cleric wa not named just killed. Thus the he might have slipped past the editors. Or the author intended to wrire she intead of he or did not know the female rule.
There is no reason to debate the issue, both sides of the debate are rather sure of the points of aguments and niether side likely will change their mind on the issue by anything fans write here.
The question has been put to Ed and a few others already with out recieving a clear Yes or No answer. Ed's replies often do refer to female Clerics when discussing Eilistraee which some nay sayers take to mean all must be famales.
Nay sayers is that balanced enough to reflect the status of the Eilistraee Cleric debate or did I miss something? |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
|
|
|
The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 17 May 2006 : 17:04:16
|
Ed doesn't need to put "male" terms in the lore for Eilistraee because he created her and thus he knows what her clerics are. He's said they are female. Priestesses, with silver gowns.
I don't really think we need more proof. Eilistraee has female clerics and that's pretty much it. Ed's said it and his words, as the creator of the deity in question, should be enough. You really can't look to the entry in 3e Faiths & Pantheons as a proper reference because there's significantly more justification that the clerics of Eilistraee are female moreso than male in the lore.
And we have 3e/3.5e sourcebook that carries a definitive explanation for why male clerics are allowed.
|
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 17 May 2006 17:08:58 |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
The Seldarine?
