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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
 Posted - 30 Jan 2004 : 06:54:34
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Glad you liked it Edain. It made my week, when I first heard the news. I don't even think I'll bother with WotC's Planar Handbook now.
Anyway back to Eberron...yes, I had the feeling also that there was very little in the way of creative juices flowing, when this project was first put together. The lack of originality with most of the portions of the setting I have seen so far, have been the largest factor in my decision not to bother purchasing any Eberron products.
As I said previously, WotC had the opportunity here to be really be creative with the winning choice they made with regards to which setting was actually selected, but I think overall, profit and money-making was the final arbiter in those negotiations... . Looking back over some of the other finalists ideas, I couldn't help but think of why Eberron was actually selected, especially if you remove the 'what's-familiar-will-make-gamers-buy-it' aspect.
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Edain Shadowstar
Senior Scribe
USA
455 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jan 2004 : 19:48:55
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Personally, I am a firm believer that creativity will most often be the best choice. Look at Planescape that was definately not a 'normal' settings, but it was fantastic. Of course, then there is the Forgotten Realms, which is also great, but obviously a more classic world. Personally, I am glad to hear some of the other entries are being picked up by Third Party Publishers, since some of them were very good. Maybe we will see some good third party books soon; it would be a nice change since I shy away from them after buying (yes, these ones did not fall off a truck) some terrible third party books.
Oh, and what is this about a Planar Handbook?
Planar handbook? It probably will not even mention the City of Doors and they will still call it a handbook. |
Edain Shadowstar
Archwizard of Rel Astra and Waterdeep
"Mmm…pie…"
- Gaius Solarian, Captain General |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2004 : 01:14:35
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The Planar Handbook does sound - at least to an extent - like an interesting tome for the average planes fan, but die hard PS fans like you and I will most likely find little of value in it.
Here's a quote taken from the EN World News site -
quote:
Planar Handbook: A Players Guide to the Planes
Bruce R. Cordell, Gwendolyn F.M. Kestrel
A complete guide to integrating planar travel into any D&D campaign.
This new guidebook is specifically designed to make travel to other planes of existance an easy part of any D&D campaign. The rules are written in a modular fashion, allowing players and Dungeon Masters alike the ability to choose only the material suited to their current campaign. Considered a complementary product to Manual of the Planes, this title contains a wealth of new material, including new rules subsets, player races, feats, spells, magic items, equipment, and vehicles.
Since Bruce R. Cordell is contributing to the work, I guess we can assume that it won't be all that bad...
As well as this, Andy Collins has said that -
quote:
the Planar Handbook will not be an updated Manual of the Planes, it will be will be a complementary product.
So what do you think...?
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Edain Shadowstar
Senior Scribe
USA
455 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2004 : 01:44:38
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| I think its a poor attempt to recreate something good (the Planeswalker's Handbook} without resurrecting Planescape. They will probably continue using there less than stellar base cosmology, which does not offer nearly as much without the flavor the Planescape adds to it. I mean any good DM can make the Planes interesting, but the tone of the base cosmology leaves something lacking. |
Edain Shadowstar
Archwizard of Rel Astra and Waterdeep
"Mmm…pie…"
- Gaius Solarian, Captain General |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 01 Feb 2004 : 02:32:05
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Thanks for those links Sirius, although they've done little to generate any real interest for me in the setting. Something I read in the second link actually disappointed me a great deal. Here's a small sampling -
quote:
Action points are taken from Star Wars and the d20 system. They designed feats around action points to imbue the game with a cinematic adventure feeling which really make character lives interesting and special. Action points are supposed to provide for flair in adventuring. PC's are expected to describe their actions to the dm in depth when in the process of this in order to convince him that this is really ACTION that is going on. What is going on should be movie quality special effect action scenery.
Monsters do not have action points however NPC's and very special monsters can take feats for action points in order to spice up encounters.
I'm really not sure whether the ACTION point system should have been worked into the Eberron setting. To me, it's part of what made the Star Wars RPG unique. What do the rest of you think...?
I mean, I know it helps the Eberron setting convey the 'cinematic adventure feeling' (which WotC seems to be pushing quite a lot of late), but to see something taken directly from another setting again demonstrates the lack of originality and creativity that this 'setting search' was meant to be about...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 01 Feb 2004 : 15:02:18
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Thanks for those links Sirius, although they've done little to generate any real interest for me in the setting.....
but to see something taken directly from another setting again demonstrates the lack of originality and creativity that this 'setting search' was meant to be about...
Agreed, the information hasn't done anything to generate interest for me to take a look unlike FFG's teasers about Dawnforge. The only thing I find enjoyable is reading the hilarious comments made by people at Gaming Report and ENWorld regarding this setting.
Additionally, it's amazing the support this setting is getting from WOTC on future releases and additional material without having sold book one yet. A MMORPG??!! Interesting... |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 01 Feb 2004 : 15:11:48
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Strangely though, I've not heard anything new on the Eberron novel front...Especially about the trilogy that was supposed to have been in the development stages already...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Edain Shadowstar
Senior Scribe
USA
455 Posts |
Posted - 01 Feb 2004 : 23:14:40
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| The way Wizards is pushing Eberron worries me a little; it seems like they are putting all their energy behind it, and I as it is I do not see Eberron garnering much popular support, regardless of how long till release. I mean eberron is going ot suffer terrible competition from the other in-house settings, the Forgotten Realms, let alone other third party settings, which either tap into established fan bases (Ravenloft and Dragonlance) or are new, and likely more creative, than Eberron. I just see Wizards setting themselves up for a huge failure, one that is going to hurt the D&D community. More so, I can see Wizards taking energy out of the Realms products and putting it towards Eberron, which would harm us, the Realmsian faithful. Of course, this also means, any chance of Planescape revival is less likely, not like it was veyr likely before {I am very good at making things about Planescape). |
Edain Shadowstar
Archwizard of Rel Astra and Waterdeep
"Mmm…pie…"
- Gaius Solarian, Captain General |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 03 Feb 2004 : 13:32:14
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Monte Cook said a while back (on his forums) that if there is ever to be a Planescape revival it will be something that he will definitely be working on. So, you never know...
Of course I don't know how he intends to do that, but it's nice to hear it nonetheless...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 06 Feb 2004 : 12:12:20
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Despite the less-than encouraging attitudes displayed in this scroll concerning WotC's new setting, I feel I should make it known, that a new Eberron column has been updated to the website. It details a new PrC called Extreme Explorer, also describing it's Action Point system as well...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 06 Feb 2004 : 17:37:43
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| Without the feats mentioned, I can't really tell how good this thing is. It looks interesting, at least. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 07 Feb 2004 : 09:05:53
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Actually, I've just starting working on my own interpretation of this class, specifically for Realms-use. It's nowhere near ready for presentation yet, but if you have any thoughts on feats, feel free to post them...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 10 Feb 2004 : 14:45:04
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
This interview still failed to produce all real interest on my part with the new setting...What did everyone else think...?
I think this product is getting hyped more than certain antics at a halftime show. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 11 Feb 2004 : 13:15:29
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Agreed...
Although, I've heard some rumors about a posting of the tome's 'Table of Contents', for advanced viewing. I wonder whether this will enchance the settings image in anyway...?
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 11 Feb 2004 : 15:05:58
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Agreed...
Although, I've heard some rumors about a posting of the tome's 'Table of Contents', for advanced viewing. I wonder whether this will enchance the settings image in anyway...?
It appears, from reading comments on ENWorld, that individuals are becoming polarized a bit on Eberron. Those who like it, can hear that it will have a page with the number 1 in it and they will decry that it's a sign from the heavens that they have been blessed. Those who don't like it, can hear that the book will contain a $20 bill stuck between two pages, and they'd still find something to gripe about. "The bill might have germs on it and I'd get an infection. Thanks a lot WOTC!"
I doubt the TOC will change such opinions. |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 11 Feb 2004 : 16:48:16
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About the only thing going for it is that Ed Greenwood liked it, insofar as it was "getting back" to the basics of exploration.
Personally, I'll hold my opinion of things until I actually read the campaign setting, should that ever happen. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2004 : 02:11:28
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I'll probably end up doing the same...Unfortunately though, no body around here that I know intends to buy the Eberron tome, so I can't borrow it later to see whether it will actually be worth the purchase...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2004 : 05:29:12
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
I'll probably end up doing the same...Unfortunately though, no body around here that I know intends to buy the Eberron tome, so I can't borrow it later to see whether it will actually be worth the purchase...
ENWorld and some other D20 sites offer some very detailed reviews at times. I know that's not like being able to thumb through the book itself. But, those combined with the massive web enchancements, sneak peeks, art galleries, that I'm sure WOTC will roll out, might give you a clear idea whether or not to purchase the item. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2004 : 06:31:40
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I suppose, still I always like to at least have the oppoportunity to look through (and sometimes read) certain areas of a newly published tome. I can't even browse through the book at my local gaming store, the owner hates it when customers stand in the aisles and just read through the gaming materials on sale at the time...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2004 : 15:53:32
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
I suppose, still I always like to at least have the oppoportunity to look through (and sometimes read) certain areas of a newly published tome. I can't even browse through the book at my local gaming store, the owner hates it when customers stand in the aisles and just read through the gaming materials on sale at the time...
Time to find a new store. But, alas, you're probably like me and that's the one store you have in your immediate area. I actually have no gaming store in my immediate vicinity. I have some claiming to be gaming stores, but it's just a thinly veiled disguise. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 14 Feb 2004 : 07:42:26
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It is indeed the only gaming store that is fairly close to me...it's also part of the reason why I have been purchasing all my gaming materials online for the last year or so...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 14 Feb 2004 : 16:40:55
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
It is indeed the only gaming store that is fairly close to me...it's also part of the reason why I have been purchasing all my gaming materials online for the last year or so...
Exactly, I've seen that topic "Buying Online versus Supporting the Friendly Local Gaming Store (FLGS)" heat up many threads on such sites as ENWorld. However, I don't see how anyone has the right to criticize someone for where they choose to spend their money on gaming products especially when many people live near a FLGS that lacks the F portion. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2004 : 17:28:32
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| When it comes out, Amazon might have that "Look Inside" feature on it. It doesn't always, but I noticed it on several of the D&D products they have. They won't, of course, have game stats and such -- they want you to buy it for that. But maybe they'll at least have enough fluff to give an idea about worth . . . . |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2004 : 04:01:22
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That's a good point Bookwyrm, and thank you for reminding me. I haven't used Amazon that much of late (over the last year), so I had forgotten that they sometimes offer this 'service'...
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2004 : 05:37:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
When it comes out, Amazon might have that "Look Inside" feature on it. It doesn't always, but I noticed it on several of the D&D products they have. They won't, of course, have game stats and such -- they want you to buy it for that. But maybe they'll at least have enough fluff to give an idea about worth . . . .
Just remember that Amazon is, in my experiences, about two weeks at least behind getting a new WOTC release compared to a local gaming store or other online distributors. |
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Get Ready for Eberron
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