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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31797 Posts |
 Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 01:38:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
I think the Thunder Blessing is the best hope we have for reconciling the dwarf lore issue. Sure, there are stories of dwarven magic from before, legends, etc., but no one saw them, and the dwarves that ran around hitting things with axes seemed particularly resistant to using or suffering from arcane magic.
When the Thunder Blessing came, it increased the dwarf birth-rate to be more like that of humans. It is my supposition that an unintended consequence (and unnoticed for decades) of making dwarves "more like other mortal races" was that it opened up arcane magic to the dwarves born in that generation. We wouldn't have noticed dwarves working magic until the 3e era, because that's when the dwarves born of the Thunder Blessing would have come of age and discovered their talents.
Just because no one made this connection before doesn't mean we can't make it now. 
Cheers
The unintended/unnoticed consequence is an interesting take, and could be partially supported by the lore anyway.
As I see it, only the mortal dwarves may have interpreted it as unintended and/or unnoticed, simply because they are not privy to the knowledge of the gods or the proposed plan for the Thunder Blessing.
In the 3e FRCS [pg. 10], we're told the dwarves are uncertain of the origins of the Thunder Blessing, with many different stories existing about how it all came to pass.
It could be that, with dwarven oral traditions being what they've always been, the actual and original intent/purpose of the Thunder Blessing was merely one voice among literally hundreds of points of dwarven view on the subject... and was eventually drowned out by the many different stories of origin.
This could help to explain how it went unnoticed for so long in the Realmslore. |
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31797 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 01:39:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Super Wizard
@Sage
I read a book called the HOLY BIBLE! IN the Book, on Gologotha, God (Jesus) DIES, while talking to himself (God the father) while also getting some grace from Himself (God the Holy Spirit). So maybe the gods on the Faerun just have mythologies that are less ""dense"" than the religions of the Real Life, huh?
That's certainly a possibility for an individual DM's campaign, of course.
But in terms of the canon take, what I've already said is pretty much the case.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 07:23:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Jakk
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
To Erik
This is probably an idiotic one but:
What happened too the gnomish noses and the hins weight problem somewhere around 1370 ?
Problems absolutely caused more by rule-changes than lore products, but it would be fun to see your take on it.
Nothing happened to gnomish noses in my Realms, and honestly I haven't had a problem with the halflings' physique since seeing Peter Jackson's LotR movies. This one's a non-issue for me, but I'm also curious as to how they could be explained.
They shrunk the noses for the 3ed. And dont even get me started on Peter Jackson... |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36833 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 09:59:37
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
quote:
Originally posted by Jakk
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
To Erik
This is probably an idiotic one but:
What happened too the gnomish noses and the hins weight problem somewhere around 1370?
Problems absolutely caused more by rule-changes than lore products, but it would be fun to see your take on it.
Nothing happened to gnomish noses in my Realms, and honestly I haven't had a problem with the halflings' physique since seeing Peter Jackson's LotR movies. This one's a non-issue for me, but I'm also curious as to how they could be explained.
They shrunk the noses for the 3ed. And dont even get me started on Peter Jackson...
How did Peter Jackson get changed between editions?   |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Kilvan
Senior Scribe
Canada
894 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 13:50:14
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Got two for you Erik; How the hell did the succubus become a Baatezu? I'd guess that for creatures made of evil and chaos, it's not something you change easily, especially when your new "friends" hate everything you represent, unlawfulness (aka CHAOS!).
I know this change was made only because devils are now "pretty" and demons are "ugly", but for me this is a major retcon, as I use devils and demons a alot in my campaign, and the erinyes is very much different from the succubus. Besides, Asmodeus would never allow it.
Speaking of the devil (hehe), how did Asmodeus become a greater devil with the essence of Azuth, a lesser deity. Why was he allowed some new portfolios and not just Azuth's?
Hmmm, for your information, Kilvan is an half-elf, renegade spellfilcher, and total badass. You might need this information sometime  |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4454 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 14:25:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Kilvan
Got two for you Erik; How the hell did the succubus become a Baatezu? I'd guess that for creatures made of evil and chaos, it's not something you change easily, especially when your new "friends" hate everything you represent, unlawfulness (aka CHAOS!).
I know this change was made only because devils are now "pretty" and demons are "ugly", but for me this is a major retcon, as I use devils and demons a alot in my campaign, and the erinyes is very much different from the succubus. Besides, Asmodeus would never allow it.
Succubi are classified as devils (in 4E) and appear under the "devil" entry. Reason: A great many succubi were stranded in the Abyss at various points of the Blood War - these were corrupted and became ferroliths and incubi.
-Wikipedia.
quote:
Originally posted by Kilvan
Speaking of the devil (hehe), how did Asmodeus become a greater devil with the essence of Azuth, a lesser deity. Why was he allowed some new portfolios and not just Azuth's?
Because he's syphoning off Tyr's essence which he has trapped in the lower hells. When Tyr charged into the Abyss, guns a'blazing he eventually made it to Asmodeus, but he was weak and couldn't stand up to the Greater devil in his condition. So Asmodeus locked him in a powerful "hell" of sorrow, forlorn, and dispare. There Tyr sits in silence, going over the events of him killing Helm and consistantly blaming himself for the whole affair. And as he sits, Asmodeous slowly draws from him power to grow in strength and power. |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 14:43:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
quote:
Originally posted by Kilvan
Got two for you Erik; How the hell did the succubus become a Baatezu? I'd guess that for creatures made of evil and chaos, it's not something you change easily, especially when your new "friends" hate everything you represent, unlawfulness (aka CHAOS!).
I know this change was made only because devils are now "pretty" and demons are "ugly", but for me this is a major retcon, as I use devils and demons a alot in my campaign, and the erinyes is very much different from the succubus. Besides, Asmodeus would never allow it.
Succubi are classified as devils (in 4E) and appear under the "devil" entry. Reason: A great many succubi were stranded in the Abyss at various points of the Blood War - these were corrupted and became ferroliths and incubi.
-Wikipedia.
quote:
Originally posted by Kilvan
Speaking of the devil (hehe), how did Asmodeus become a greater devil with the essence of Azuth, a lesser deity. Why was he allowed some new portfolios and not just Azuth's?
Because he's syphoning off Tyr's essence which he has trapped in the lower hells. When Tyr charged into the Abyss, guns a'blazing he eventually made it to Asmodeus, but he was weak and couldn't stand up to the Greater devil in his condition. So Asmodeus locked him in a powerful "hell" of sorrow, forlorn, and dispare. There Tyr sits in silence, going over the events of him killing Helm and consistantly blaming himself for the whole affair. And as he sits, Asmodeous slowly draws from him power to grow in strength and power.
Didn't Tyr give all of his godly power to Torm before he went off slaying devils? |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4454 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 14:55:06
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| I think he might have gave him some (I'm away from my Grand History of the Realms book ATM) to become the leader of The Triad, but not all. I think that's the only tome that has an accounting of the incident taking place and so there isn't enough info to go on. And of course, it's just what happened in My realms game and a suggestion to the question. |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 15:01:28
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FWIW-
In 1385 DR just after the Spellplague, Tyr abdicated his godhood and granted Torm all his deific power, because he lost faith in himself and his ability to lead and judge. Tyr counsels all of his followers to offer their allegiance to Torm.[6]Tyr's portfolio of justice was subsequently absorbed by Bahamut who later became a subservient deity of Torm.
Source FR Wiki
But I quite like your homebrew idea. |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4454 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 15:10:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Arcanus
FWIW-
In 1385 DR just after the Spellplague, Tyr abdicated his godhood and granted Torm all his deific power, because he lost faith in himself and his ability to lead and judge. Tyr counsels all of his followers to offer their allegiance to Torm.[6]Tyr's portfolio of justice was subsequently absorbed by Bahamut who later became a subservient deity of Torm.
Source FR Wiki
But I quite like your homebrew idea.
While I often question the validity of the FR Wiki (it's been known to have a lot of continunity problems), it's hard to refute that. But one has to ask, what does "abdicated his godhood and granted Torm all his deific power" implicate. Does this turn Tyr into a Mortal? If so, then how does he get to the Nine Hells? I doubt any one of this subjects will just Planar Shift him there willy-nilly. Further more, if he's not truely a "deity" and not technically a "mortal" what abilities would he have and how far could get get into the Hells? And what if Asmodeous stopped him on the 1st level, grabbed him up and somehow fused what was left of Tyr and Azuth into something greater?
And I'm glad you like what I wrote up about Asmodeus's ascent and Tyr's imprisonment |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 15:21:00
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I agree with you about wiki not being the most accurate of sources but the same info was in a novel (forget which one), so it is canon. Mortal or not, Tyr died fighting an invasion of the UPPER realms.
Of course that's only the official version... |
Edited by - Arcanus on 23 Jan 2012 15:23:38 |
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Bakra
Senior Scribe
628 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 16:14:19
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quote:
Originally posted by Kilvan
Got two for you Erik; How the hell did the succubus become a Baatezu? I'd guess that for creatures made of evil and chaos, it's not something you change easily, especially when your new "friends" hate everything you represent, unlawfulness (aka CHAOS!).
I know this change was made only because devils are now "pretty" and demons are "ugly", but for me this is a major retcon, as I use devils and demons a alot in my campaign, and the erinyes is very much different from the succubus. Besides, Asmodeus would never allow it.
The novel by Erin Evans, Brimstone Angels, explains the succubus an erinyes issue in the Forgotten Realms. As for the official reason it was because they wanted the erinyes to match their original mythology. This too was covered on Erin’s website : http://slushlush.com/2011/10/sexy-devil-women/ |
I hope Candlekeep continues to be the friendly forum of fellow Realms-lovers that it has always been, as we all go through this together. If you don’t want to move to the “new” Realms, that doesn’t mean there’s anything wrong with either you or the “old” Realms. Goodness knows Candlekeep, and the hearts of its scribes, are both big enough to accommodate both. If we want them to be.
(Strikes dramatic pose, raises sword to gleam in the sunset, and hopes breeches won’t fall down.)
Enough for now. The Realms lives! I have spoken! Ale and light wines half price, served by a smiling Storm Silverhand fetchingly clad in thigh-high boots and naught else! Ahem . .
So saith Ed. <snip>
love to all,
THO
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Kilvan
Senior Scribe
Canada
894 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 16:27:19
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Darn it! I didn't know it was covered in official lore (the succubus thing). I still think erinyes and succubi are quite different in design, origins, and personality. People just stop at "fiendish female corrupting men with sex", but there is more to them both, and the end of their similarities IMO.
As for Asmodeus sucking the life-force of Tyr, it this canon? It is interesting, but as Arcanus pointed out, I thought Tyr gave all his powers away before going Leroy Jenkins in the Abyss. It still doesn't explain how he created new portfolios.
I think I'm still in this contest (great idea Erik BTW)! |
Edited by - Kilvan on 23 Jan 2012 16:28:06 |
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Bakra
Senior Scribe
628 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 16:45:54
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quote:
Originally posted by Kilvan
As for Asmodeus sucking the life-force of Tyr, it this canon? It is interesting, but as Arcanus pointed out, I thought Tyr gave all his powers away before going Leroy Jenkins in the Abyss. It still doesn't explain how he created new portfolios.
It isn’t canon. Tyr bequeathed his divine powers to Torm. This resulted in Tyr being a high powered being located in the upper planes. In other words, he took his avatar form (think Time of Troubles) with all of his high powered gear. He then helped stop an evil invasion into the Upper Planes.
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I hope Candlekeep continues to be the friendly forum of fellow Realms-lovers that it has always been, as we all go through this together. If you don’t want to move to the “new” Realms, that doesn’t mean there’s anything wrong with either you or the “old” Realms. Goodness knows Candlekeep, and the hearts of its scribes, are both big enough to accommodate both. If we want them to be.
(Strikes dramatic pose, raises sword to gleam in the sunset, and hopes breeches won’t fall down.)
Enough for now. The Realms lives! I have spoken! Ale and light wines half price, served by a smiling Storm Silverhand fetchingly clad in thigh-high boots and naught else! Ahem . .
So saith Ed. <snip>
love to all,
THO
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Edited by - Bakra on 23 Jan 2012 16:47:35 |
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Apex
Learned Scribe
USA
229 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 19:59:04
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I have to stumper.
Erik, we know that the Realms are connected to Earth from Ed's chats with Elminster. We also know (based on previous records of these conversations) that Earth time was very similar to Realms time (in terms of the passage/link and what not). Please explain how the Realms could have a 100 year time jump without us noticing (and no, "the Earth was in stasis" is not an acceptable answer)? |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36833 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 21:31:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Apex
I have to stumper.
Erik, we know that the Realms are connected to Earth from Ed's chats with Elminster. We also know (based on previous records of these conversations) that Earth time was very similar to Realms time (in terms of the passage/link and what not). Please explain how the Realms could have a 100 year time jump without us noticing (and no, "the Earth was in stasis" is not an acceptable answer)?
It's apparently possible to visit separate points in time. Elminster visits Ed from time to time, but according to Realmspace, El also has a portal to 1894 Wyoming. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Bakra
Senior Scribe
628 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 21:36:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Apex
I have to stumper.
Erik, we know that the Realms are connected to Earth from Ed's chats with Elminster. We also know (based on previous records of these conversations) that Earth time was very similar to Realms time (in terms of the passage/link and what not). Please explain how the Realms could have a 100 year time jump without us noticing (and no, "the Earth was in stasis" is not an acceptable answer)?
It's apparently possible to visit separate points in time. Elminster visits Ed from time to time, but according to Realmspace, El also has a portal to 1894 Wyoming.
Wooly is correct.
After all of this typing I wasn't about to let my reply go to waste:
The planar connections to Earth from the Realms by portals, gates, or spells could be sheared and we wouldn’t notice. And if in the late 1400’s it is reestablished we still wouldn’t notice. It is possible El has found find a gate or cast a spell in 1480+ and travel back to our ‘present’ to have a chat with our Ed. Which could explain some of the information found within the Ghost Knight of Galardoun article. (Dungeon #196) |
I hope Candlekeep continues to be the friendly forum of fellow Realms-lovers that it has always been, as we all go through this together. If you don’t want to move to the “new” Realms, that doesn’t mean there’s anything wrong with either you or the “old” Realms. Goodness knows Candlekeep, and the hearts of its scribes, are both big enough to accommodate both. If we want them to be.
(Strikes dramatic pose, raises sword to gleam in the sunset, and hopes breeches won’t fall down.)
Enough for now. The Realms lives! I have spoken! Ale and light wines half price, served by a smiling Storm Silverhand fetchingly clad in thigh-high boots and naught else! Ahem . .
So saith Ed. <snip>
love to all,
THO
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Apex
Learned Scribe
USA
229 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 22:19:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Bakra
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Apex
I have to stumper.
Erik, we know that the Realms are connected to Earth from Ed's chats with Elminster. We also know (based on previous records of these conversations) that Earth time was very similar to Realms time (in terms of the passage/link and what not). Please explain how the Realms could have a 100 year time jump without us noticing (and no, "the Earth was in stasis" is not an acceptable answer)?
It's apparently possible to visit separate points in time. Elminster visits Ed from time to time, but according to Realmspace, El also has a portal to 1894 Wyoming.
Wooly is correct.
After all of this typing I wasn't about to let my reply go to waste:
The planar connections to Earth from the Realms by portals, gates, or spells could be sheared and we wouldn’t notice. And if in the late 1400’s it is reestablished we still wouldn’t notice. It is possible El has found find a gate or cast a spell in 1480+ and travel back to our ‘present’ to have a chat with our Ed. Which could explain some of the information found within the Ghost Knight of Galardoun article. (Dungeon #196)
The point was, however, that in the past Elminster has been portrayed as talking about the present Realms (that of the 1300's). So if that is the present, and we have about 2 decades of this clearly linking the Realms timeline with our own, what explains a 100 year time jump in the Realms? I have no problem with Elminster being able to travel into our past, what I do have a problem with is that all of a sudden the Realms timeline seems to have delinked from ours and skipped 100 years. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36833 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 23:00:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Apex
quote:
Originally posted by Bakra
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Apex
I have to stumper.
Erik, we know that the Realms are connected to Earth from Ed's chats with Elminster. We also know (based on previous records of these conversations) that Earth time was very similar to Realms time (in terms of the passage/link and what not). Please explain how the Realms could have a 100 year time jump without us noticing (and no, "the Earth was in stasis" is not an acceptable answer)?
It's apparently possible to visit separate points in time. Elminster visits Ed from time to time, but according to Realmspace, El also has a portal to 1894 Wyoming.
Wooly is correct.
After all of this typing I wasn't about to let my reply go to waste:
The planar connections to Earth from the Realms by portals, gates, or spells could be sheared and we wouldn’t notice. And if in the late 1400’s it is reestablished we still wouldn’t notice. It is possible El has found find a gate or cast a spell in 1480+ and travel back to our ‘present’ to have a chat with our Ed. Which could explain some of the information found within the Ghost Knight of Galardoun article. (Dungeon #196)
The point was, however, that in the past Elminster has been portrayed as talking about the present Realms (that of the 1300's). So if that is the present, and we have about 2 decades of this clearly linking the Realms timeline with our own, what explains a 100 year time jump in the Realms? I have no problem with Elminster being able to travel into our past, what I do have a problem with is that all of a sudden the Realms timeline seems to have delinked from ours and skipped 100 years.
Nope. It's a future El that's telling us about it. Before, he was talking about an earlier era. Or maybe it's two different Elminsters, from different points in time.
Honestly, I'm not real keen on that explanation, but it's not an unplausible one. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 23 Jan 2012 23:01:14 |
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Jakk
Great Reader
Canada
2165 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 23:13:42
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quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
I think the Thunder Blessing is the best hope we have for reconciling the dwarf lore issue. Sure, there are stories of dwarven magic from before, legends, etc., but no one saw them, and the dwarves that ran around hitting things with axes seemed particularly resistant to using or suffering from arcane magic.
When the Thunder Blessing came, it increased the dwarf birth-rate to be more like that of humans. It is my supposition that an unintended consequence (and unnoticed for decades) of making dwarves "more like other mortal races" was that it opened up arcane magic to the dwarves born in that generation. We wouldn't have noticed dwarves working magic until the 3e era, because that's when the dwarves born of the Thunder Blessing would have come of age and discovered their talents.
Just because no one made this connection before doesn't mean we can't make it now.
Cheers
I like this... and I may use it, depending on whether or not I tie the era to the ruleset more rigorously in my Realms... I've played all editions, some longer than others (obviously)... and if D&D Next takes the path that it appears to be on, particularly with the reprinting of the 1e core books (even if only in a limited edition), this may very well be the best fit for the lore. Many thanks! |
Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.
If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic. |
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Bakra
Senior Scribe
628 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2012 : 23:58:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Apex
quote:
Originally posted by Bakra
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Apex
I have to stumper.
Erik, we know that the Realms are connected to Earth from Ed's chats with Elminster. We also know (based on previous records of these conversations) that Earth time was very similar to Realms time (in terms of the passage/link and what not). Please explain how the Realms could have a 100 year time jump without us noticing (and no, "the Earth was in stasis" is not an acceptable answer)?
It's apparently possible to visit separate points in time. Elminster visits Ed from time to time, but according to Realmspace, El also has a portal to 1894 Wyoming.
Wooly is correct.
After all of this typing I wasn't about to let my reply go to waste:
The planar connections to Earth from the Realms by portals, gates, or spells could be sheared and we wouldn’t notice. And if in the late 1400’s it is reestablished we still wouldn’t notice. It is possible El has found find a gate or cast a spell in 1480+ and travel back to our ‘present’ to have a chat with our Ed. Which could explain some of the information found within the Ghost Knight of Galardoun article. (Dungeon #196)
The point was, however, that in the past Elminster has been portrayed as talking about the present Realms (that of the 1300's). So if that is the present, and we have about 2 decades of this clearly linking the Realms timeline with our own, what explains a 100 year time jump in the Realms? I have no problem with Elminster being able to travel into our past, what I do have a problem with is that all of a sudden the Realms timeline seems to have delinked from ours and skipped 100 years.
Nope. It's a future El that's telling us about it. Before, he was talking about an earlier era. Or maybe it's two different Elminsters, from different points in time.
Honestly, I'm not real keen on that explanation, but it's not an unplausible one.
The official policy for FR time being linear to Earths changed over the decades. For example, 2nd edition started in 1368 then 8 years later the 3rd edition moved the FR time line up to 1372.
Once again I agree with Woolys' explanation. And I would like to add El never fully told Ed everything on purpose. One reason being so the players can have surprises, another reason because if El can find Earth so can his enemies. Imagine Manshoon getting his hands on the OGB and seeing a secret entrance straight into the Dragons Throne room. |
I hope Candlekeep continues to be the friendly forum of fellow Realms-lovers that it has always been, as we all go through this together. If you don’t want to move to the “new” Realms, that doesn’t mean there’s anything wrong with either you or the “old” Realms. Goodness knows Candlekeep, and the hearts of its scribes, are both big enough to accommodate both. If we want them to be.
(Strikes dramatic pose, raises sword to gleam in the sunset, and hopes breeches won’t fall down.)
Enough for now. The Realms lives! I have spoken! Ale and light wines half price, served by a smiling Storm Silverhand fetchingly clad in thigh-high boots and naught else! Ahem . .
So saith Ed. <snip>
love to all,
THO
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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore
USA
1446 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2012 : 00:21:13
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| I've often imagined what it would be to be ported to the Realms and try explaining to Vanderghast or some other where you came from. I wonder what kind of weird looks you'd get from people due to our clothing. Or try explaining ICBM's to a wizard of war. haha. I'm not a huge fan of linking our world with Faerun, otherwise Manshoon would just go shopping at a sporting goods store and come back with some rifles and a caravan of ammo. Imagine how bad that would be. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31797 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2012 : 00:25:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Apex
I have to stumper.
Erik, we know that the Realms are connected to Earth from Ed's chats with Elminster. We also know (based on previous records of these conversations) that Earth time was very similar to Realms time (in terms of the passage/link and what not). Please explain how the Realms could have a 100 year time jump without us noticing (and no, "the Earth was in stasis" is not an acceptable answer)?
It's apparently possible to visit separate points in time. Elminster visits Ed from time to time, but according to Realmspace, El also has a portal to 1894 Wyoming.
And Ed has also said that the portals between the Earth and the Realms can lead to other different times and places, because that's largely why they are the "Forgotten" Realms. So many of those ancient portals have been lost or forgotten. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31797 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2012 : 00:26:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Apex
The point was, however, that in the past Elminster has been portrayed as talking about the present Realms (that of the 1300's). So if that is the present, and we have about 2 decades of this clearly linking the Realms timeline with our own, what explains a 100 year time jump in the Realms? I have no problem with Elminster being able to travel into our past, what I do have a problem with is that all of a sudden the Realms timeline seems to have delinked from ours and skipped 100 years.
I've always assumed this would likely be the result of Elminster having some mastery of the Temporal Prime via a cunningly deliberate spellcrafting. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2012 : 01:16:32
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quote:
The Sage
I've always assumed this would likely be the result of Elminster having some mastery of the Temporal Prime via a cunningly deliberate spellcrafting.
If Realmspace and Earth are indeed located in "Alternate Primes" (by whatever name) then links between the two worlds would involve planar transit. Time does not flow evenly across the planes, there are portals to pasts and to futures, the "present" moves forward at different rates, and there is often "slippage" which gains or loses time when moving across such boundaries. The Realms and Krynn have various sorts of temporal guardians, but our world apparently does not. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2012 : 01:29:41
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Succubi fiends being present on both poles of the Blood War does blatantly defy older lore. Although I'm preferential to the traditional Erinyes-vs-Succubi arrangement, I think the new methodology is the wiser choice. DMs like myself can easily employ Erinyes instead of Succubi (and truth be told, they aren't really all that different anyways, from a mortal point of view). These fiends always cause a great deal of fascination and confusion with newer players anyhow, so making them more generic is probably better overall.
Having said that, I'm a little resistant to these fallen-celestial fiends enjoying "special" status, it invites questions about what other exceptions might be (must be!) made. Although there's never enough fiends to go around I think that some rough semblance of ordered taxonomy should be instilled; most especially since about one third of all the fiends are structured within a definitively "lawful" hierarchy. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2012 : 01:37:41
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I find the idea of joining earth and the realms a step too far. Earth time and realms time out of sync? Elminster coming to earth?
Not in my realms! |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2012 : 01:41:42
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| That step was taken in the late 1960s. |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2012 : 01:47:27
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| I'm aware of the reason the realms are 'forgotten', it just blurs the line between fantasy and reality a little too much for me. |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2012 : 01:49:24
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| Just noticed I'm now a learned scribe, (rolls up sleeves) lol. |
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