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Snowblood
Senior Scribe
Australia
388 Posts |
 Posted - 11 May 2010 : 14:13:37
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Wizbro just sacked Any Collins.....whats the thinking with that one do you think??????
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Aryvandaar, Ilythiir, Arnothoi, Orva, Sarphil, Anauria/Asram/Hlondath, Uvaeren, Braceldaur, Ilodhar, Lisenaar, Imaskar, Miyeritar, Orishaar, Shantel Othrieir, Keltormir, Eaerlann, Ammarindar, Siluvanede, Sharrven, Illefarn, Ardeep, Rystal Wood, Evereska are all available here for download:http://phasai.deviantart.com/gallery/
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Zireael
Master of Realmslore
Poland
1190 Posts |
Posted - 11 May 2010 : 14:17:43
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| They sacked Andy Collins??? Fail to see any reason behind it... |
SiNafay Vrinn, the daughter of Lloth, from Ched Nasad!
http://zireael07.wordpress.com/ |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3243 Posts |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 11 May 2010 : 15:33:32
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| And who is Andy Collins? Its always bad when someone looses their job, but is there anything special about him specifically? |
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Ergdusch
Master of Realmslore
Germany
1720 Posts |
Posted - 11 May 2010 : 15:42:23
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Andy Collins was involved in so many WotC products over the last 10 years or so. IIRC he even wrote parts of the 4th Editon PHB.
Do you have any official reference to his dismissal? Maybe there we'll read somewthing about the causes...
I'm puzzled as well. |
"Das Gras weht im Wind, wenn der Wind weht." |
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Alisttair
Great Reader
Canada
3054 Posts |
Posted - 11 May 2010 : 15:56:38
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Yeah I see his name on some of the 4E books. Maybe he called in sick one too many times  |
Karsite Arcanar (Most Holy Servant of Karsus)
Anauria - Survivor State of Netheril as penned by me:
http://www.dmsguild.com/m/product/172023 |
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Quale
Master of Realmslore
1757 Posts |
Posted - 11 May 2010 : 16:03:50
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He wrote the mechanics for 4e, as far as I rememeber from Kobold Quarterly.
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Matt James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
918 Posts |
Posted - 11 May 2010 : 16:35:19
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I don't think he was let go guys. In fact, I believe he left on his own and might have found a new/different opportunity. I wish I could give you more than that, but I have nothing official- only from some talks.
Edit: As far as I can tell, this all stemmed from Chris Sims and Russell Morrissey putting it up on twitter and ENworld. |
Edited by - Matt James on 11 May 2010 16:36:56 |
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Darkmeer
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 11 May 2010 : 16:42:06
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I'm sad. Andy Collins wrote a number of books I enjoyed in the 3.x era. I'm sad to see a talented designer go, regardless of the situation.
/d |
"These people are my family, not just friends, and if you want to get to them you gotta go through ME." |
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Jakk
Great Reader
Canada
2165 Posts |
Posted - 11 May 2010 : 18:08:23
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| I hope Matt's right; if Andy has simply found a better opportunity and left voluntarily, that's great for him and WotC's loss. |
Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.
If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic. |
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Alisttair
Great Reader
Canada
3054 Posts |
Posted - 11 May 2010 : 18:57:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Jakk
I hope Matt's right; if Andy has simply found a better opportunity and left voluntarily, that's great for him and WotC's loss.
Agreed. I'd hate for it to be otherwise. |
Karsite Arcanar (Most Holy Servant of Karsus)
Anauria - Survivor State of Netheril as penned by me:
http://www.dmsguild.com/m/product/172023 |
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Hawkins
Great Reader
USA
2131 Posts |
Posted - 11 May 2010 : 19:40:56
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quote:
Originally posted by Matt James
I don't think he was let go guys. In fact, I believe he left on his own and might have found a new/different opportunity. I wish I could give you more than that, but I have nothing official- only from some talks.
Edit: As far as I can tell, this all stemmed from Chris Sims and Russell Morrissey putting it up on twitter and ENworld.
Or maybe, like Monte Cook, he left before they sacked him. How many of the original 4e designers does that leave still on staff at WotC now? |
Errant d20 Designer - My Blog (last updated January 06, 2016)
One, two! One, two! And through and through
The vorpal blade went snicker-snack!
He left it dead, and with its head
He went galumphing back. --Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking-Glass
"Mmm, not the darkness," Myrin murmured. "Don't cast it there." --Erik Scott de Bie, Shadowbane
* My character sheets (PFRPG, 3.5, and AE versions; not viewable in Internet Explorer)
* Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document (PFRPG OGL Rules)
* The Hypertext d20 SRD (3.5 OGL Rules)
* 3.5 D&D Archives
My game design work:
* Heroes of the Jade Oath (PFRPG, conversion; Rite Publishing)
* Compendium Arcanum Volume 1: Cantrips & Orisons (PFRPG, designer; d20pfsrd.com Publishing)
* Compendium Arcanum Volume 2: 1st-Level Spells (PFRPG, designer; d20pfsrd.com Publishing)
* Martial Arts Guidebook (forthcoming) (PFRPG, designer; Rite Publishing)
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Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3287 Posts |
Posted - 11 May 2010 : 20:00:50
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I 'heard' last night at En World.
About 5 poeple lost their job's... |
"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 12 May 2010 : 00:39:34
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quote:
Originally posted by HawkinstheDM
How many of the original 4e designers does that leave still on staff at WotC now?
I'm curious about this one, myself. I know that the economy isn't going so hot right now, but seeing so many people let go -- especially when this edition is still fairly "young" is simply not the most promising indicator of how business is going for WotC. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 12 May 2010 : 01:03:06
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There's a few things about these layoffs that I've been curious about... what actually happens to their positions in most cases, once the former staff have been let go? Are they folded up or just folded into other existing positions at Wizards? Does Wizards promote in-house or do they employ individuals from outside to fill some of these now "vacated" positions?
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Joran Nobleheart
Senior Scribe
USA
495 Posts |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 12 May 2010 : 01:20:59
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| I've long speculated about that. And it would make perfect sense... as it would be a shame to permanently lose the kind of talent that Wizards has been letting go recently. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Joran Nobleheart
Senior Scribe
USA
495 Posts |
Posted - 12 May 2010 : 01:28:13
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Agreed. These men and women carry great talent, and spun for us fascinating tales and sourcebooks to broaden our imagination and entertain us. I hope that they're picked up and carry on with that great tradition.  |
Paladinic Ethos
Saint Joran Nobleheart |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3243 Posts |
Posted - 12 May 2010 : 01:28:24
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quote:
Originally posted by Joran Nobleheart
Is it possible that some of them will go to work for Paizo and join the Pathfinder group? Have any done that yet?
Considering that's how Paizo actually got started...
But I don't think they're hiring full-time right now. They still freelance a lot. |
I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.
Ashe's Character Sheet
Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs |
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Snowblood
Senior Scribe
Australia
388 Posts |
Posted - 12 May 2010 : 07:53:56
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| well according to his partner/wife/love of his life....Andy was layed off by Wizbro....sigh.......another great talent cut free... |
Aryvandaar, Ilythiir, Arnothoi, Orva, Sarphil, Anauria/Asram/Hlondath, Uvaeren, Braceldaur, Ilodhar, Lisenaar, Imaskar, Miyeritar, Orishaar, Shantel Othrieir, Keltormir, Eaerlann, Ammarindar, Siluvanede, Sharrven, Illefarn, Ardeep, Rystal Wood, Evereska are all available here for download:http://phasai.deviantart.com/gallery/
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Hawkins
Great Reader
USA
2131 Posts |
Posted - 12 May 2010 : 16:46:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Ergdusch
Do you have any official reference to his dismissal? Maybe there we'll read somewthing about the causes...
quote:
Originally posted by Snowblood
well according to his partner/wife/love of his life....Andy was layed off by Wizbro....sigh.......another great talent cut free...
Do you have a link to her blog or something where she states that? |
Errant d20 Designer - My Blog (last updated January 06, 2016)
One, two! One, two! And through and through
The vorpal blade went snicker-snack!
He left it dead, and with its head
He went galumphing back. --Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking-Glass
"Mmm, not the darkness," Myrin murmured. "Don't cast it there." --Erik Scott de Bie, Shadowbane
* My character sheets (PFRPG, 3.5, and AE versions; not viewable in Internet Explorer)
* Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document (PFRPG OGL Rules)
* The Hypertext d20 SRD (3.5 OGL Rules)
* 3.5 D&D Archives
My game design work:
* Heroes of the Jade Oath (PFRPG, conversion; Rite Publishing)
* Compendium Arcanum Volume 1: Cantrips & Orisons (PFRPG, designer; d20pfsrd.com Publishing)
* Compendium Arcanum Volume 2: 1st-Level Spells (PFRPG, designer; d20pfsrd.com Publishing)
* Martial Arts Guidebook (forthcoming) (PFRPG, designer; Rite Publishing)
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Mr_Miscellany
Senior Scribe
545 Posts |
Posted - 12 May 2010 : 17:21:52
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Andy Collins caught a lot of hate for changes he wrote into the 3.5 PHB, such as new—and overly cumbersome—weapon size rules, as well as changes to spells that seemed on their face to make things simpler for player interpretation at the gaming table, but in fact only made things more difficult.
The main criticism was that Collins was “thrown into” the mix and as a result didn’t possess the required background knowledge that the original 3E designers (who themselves either left WotC or were let go by WotC prior to the announcement of Eberron) had in droves, before he started making his changes to the 3E system.
So in a way we’re seeing the same pattern: the people with the background and knowledge to properly guide the current game system into the future are let go, creating a brain drain at the offices of their employer.
I thought he was a little too mechanics-minded myself, but to his credit Collins demonstrated with his subsequent game design work that he’d closed the presumed knowledge gap and generated some pretty good stuff.
Wishing him all the best.
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Edited by - Mr_Miscellany on 12 May 2010 17:23:06 |
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Razz
Senior Scribe
USA
749 Posts |
Posted - 12 May 2010 : 22:38:44
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| I see it as a sign 4E isn't doing so hot plus the bad economy. I've heard many didn't even want to do the next edition of D&D the way 4E did but had no choice but to "drink the Kool Aid". If these designers are seen writing for Paizo, we'll know the truth for sure. |
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Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3287 Posts |
Posted - 12 May 2010 : 22:41:29
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What truth, that they go where the work is for them.
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"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
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Gambit
Learned Scribe
110 Posts |
Posted - 12 May 2010 : 23:55:57
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| It is my hope that Hasbro sells the D&D licence outright, either to an existing company or a newly formulated one that reacquires many of the great minds of yore that have gone wayward, either way someone worthy of carrying the D&D name. |
Edited by - Gambit on 12 May 2010 23:57:59 |
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Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3287 Posts |
Posted - 13 May 2010 : 03:04:14
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| Hasbro is a Company that would sit on an IP rather than sell it. Hasbro could sit on the D&D Brand for 10 years, and then liscense it out to Blizzard. Then we would have D&D WoW Edition. Only its online... |
"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
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Jakk
Great Reader
Canada
2165 Posts |
Posted - 13 May 2010 : 04:33:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
Hasbro is a Company that would sit on an IP rather than sell it. Hasbro could sit on the D&D Brand for 10 years, and then liscense it out to Blizzard. Then we would have D&D WoW Edition. Only its online...
 Are you trying to give us nightmares, Brimmy?  |
Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.
If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 13 May 2010 : 05:57:37
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quote:
Originally posted by Jakk
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
Hasbro is a Company that would sit on an IP rather than sell it. Hasbro could sit on the D&D Brand for 10 years, and then liscense it out to Blizzard. Then we would have D&D WoW Edition. Only its online...
Are you trying to give us nightmares, Brimmy?
It is, honestly, a fear of mine: that one day Hasbro will decide to shut WotC down, and will simply sit on all the IPs rather than let someone else run with it. It's not a business decision that I understand or can explain, but I've seen it happen before. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 13 May 2010 : 06:23:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Jakk
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
Hasbro is a Company that would sit on an IP rather than sell it. Hasbro could sit on the D&D Brand for 10 years, and then liscense it out to Blizzard. Then we would have D&D WoW Edition. Only its online...
Are you trying to give us nightmares, Brimmy?
It is, honestly, a fear of mine: that one day Hasbro will decide to shut WotC down, and will simply sit on all the IPs rather than let someone else run with it. It's not a business decision that I understand or can explain, but I've seen it happen before.
Indeed. Shutting down Wizards would be an extensively complicated move... given its somewhat comfortable niche in the "general gaming" market. I don't believe it's a decision Hasbro would make lightly.
I think the more likely scenario, at least in this case, is that Wizards might simply decide to set aside the entire D&D IP and all its associated brands for a time -- and then restructure the D&D division by focusing all that money and development into other divisions of Hasbro.
There's no doubt that it's still a money-maker for them, so I doubt they'd let it go completely. Renewing the licensing and copyrights for the D&D brand would be the next step, to ensure the further security of their IPs, and prevent any outside company from seizing it for its own interest and development. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Sian
Senior Scribe
Denmark
596 Posts |
Posted - 13 May 2010 : 08:56:20
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| wouldn't mind a bit if Paizo (maybe if need be in a Joint Venture with people such as Green Ronin) somehow managed to drum up enough money to satisfy the brass to buy the IP's ... those i at least trust will try to listen to the majority of players and not only the loud minority |
what happened to the queen? she's much more hysterical than usual
She's a women, it happens once a month |
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Alisttair
Great Reader
Canada
3054 Posts |
Posted - 13 May 2010 : 12:50:51
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| I certainly don't want any IP lingering in the astral sea for a decade. |
Karsite Arcanar (Most Holy Servant of Karsus)
Anauria - Survivor State of Netheril as penned by me:
http://www.dmsguild.com/m/product/172023 |
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WOTC layoffs,,,,,
