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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
 Posted - 19 Oct 2009 : 09:46:30
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quote:
Originally posted by BEAST
Perhaps "Daermon N'a'shezbaernon" is actually a phrase from an older form of the Drowic language--say, Ye Auld Drowe--with "House Do'Urden" being a phrase from a modern form of the language, akin to Auld English versus contemporary American English. There's lot of variation there, too. 
Another explanation could be that the name of the House changed to reflect that of the ruling family. The original House name was Daermon N'a'shezbaernon, but people began calling after the ruling family instead. |
Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2009 : 14:47:19
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quote:
Originally posted by Kiaransalyn
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
It could be that I've got my drow-sources mixed up. I'll admit, it's not a section of the Realmslore I visit often, so I could be kinda out of touch on this.
I skimmed the boxed set last night, but didn't find anything. Then again it's set after the fall of House Do'Urden.
Aye. As it happens, I scanned the boxed briefly also, and couldn't find the reference I was thinking of. And looking over BEAST's comprehensive note-taking, now, makes me think that I mistook the reference in The Drow of the Underdark as a possible proof.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Afromania
Acolyte
32 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2009 : 16:33:08
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Oh 1 more question, it's odd that i couldn't find it in google - what's the chronological order of reading Elminster's books?
Can't be only 5 books of him right ? |
"He's going after Obould. All by himself," Bruenor growled.
"I would not want to be Obould, then," the halfling said with a grin |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2009 : 17:10:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Afromania
Oh 1 more question, it's odd that i couldn't find it in google - what's the chronological order of reading Elminster's books?
Can't be only 5 books of him right ?
There have only been five books published as part of the "Elminster Series," [Elminster: The Making of a Mage, Elminster in Myth Drannor, The Temptation of Elminster[1], Elminster in Hell, and Elminster's Daughter] but the Old Mage has also enjoyed cameos and made lengthy appearances in other novels as well, like Spellfire and the "Knights of Myth Drannor" trilogy, for example.
There is a sixth book coming for the "Elminster Series," that Ed's been working on. We first heard about it at this year's Gen Con. It's tentatively titled Elminster Must Die. More details will undoubtedly follow, as the release date for this next book, approaches.
As for the chronological reading order of the books, it serves to read them according to their publication order, as I noted above.
-- [1] The first three novels in the "Elminster Series" have been collected together in an omnibus-styled tome, titled The Annotated Elminster. This hardcover features not only the first three tales of the series, but unique Ed-lore crafted for the books, and other annotations from the Ol' Bearded One himself. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 20 Oct 2009 17:19:04 |
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Afromania
Acolyte
32 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2009 : 18:40:05
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Thanks, again and again.
And how come the realms have so many human wizards that live hundreds or thousands of years?
I haven't followed much but went through realms-wiki :)
The seven sisters are somewhat godly, some other famous "human" wizard might be an elf, but generally they seem to survive for plenty for years!
Sorry for all the silly question - simply a curious reader :D |
"He's going after Obould. All by himself," Bruenor growled.
"I would not want to be Obould, then," the halfling said with a grin |
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swifty
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
517 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2009 : 23:12:56
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Afromania
Oh 1 more question, it's odd that i couldn't find it in google - what's the chronological order of reading Elminster's books?
Can't be only 5 books of him right ?
There have only been five books published as part of the "Elminster Series," [Elminster: The Making of a Mage, Elminster in Myth Drannor, The Temptation of Elminster[1], Elminster in Hell, and Elminster's Daughter] but the Old Mage has also enjoyed cameos and made lengthy appearances in other novels as well, like Spellfire and the "Knights of Myth Drannor" trilogy, for example.
There is a sixth book coming for the "Elminster Series," that Ed's been working on. We first heard about it at this year's Gen Con. It's tentatively titled Elminster Must Die. More details will undoubtedly follow, as the release date for this next book, approaches.
As for the chronological reading order of the books, it serves to read them according to their publication order, as I noted above.
-- [1] The first three novels in the "Elminster Series" have been collected together in an omnibus-styled tome, titled The Annotated Elminster. This hardcover features not only the first three tales of the series, but unique Ed-lore crafted for the books, and other annotations from the Ol' Bearded One himself.
elminster must die.that sounds like a horrible book title.no ed no. |
go back to sleep america.everything is under control.heres american gladiators.watch this.shuttup. BILL HICKS. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 21 Oct 2009 : 00:41:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Afromania
Thanks, again and again.
And how come the realms have so many human wizards that live hundreds or thousands of years?
I haven't followed much but went through realms-wiki :)
The seven sisters are somewhat godly, some other famous "human" wizard might be an elf, but generally they seem to survive for plenty for years!
Sorry for all the silly question - simply a curious reader :D
It's because of potions of longevity, mostly, or curious arcane experimentation that leads to life-extending abilities, like lichdom for example. In the case of the Chosen and the Seven Sisters, it's mostly thanks to the influence of Mystra and her power as part of their divinely granted special abilities. Ed has explained all this somewhat in his replies here at Candlekeep over the years, and in various sources, like The Seven Sisters. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Afromania
Acolyte
32 Posts |
Posted - 21 Oct 2009 : 20:52:03
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Lovely!
Well I'm almost done with "The Pirate King" in Drizzt's series.
Sadly i can't find "The Ghost King" in my country yet, hopefully i would soon cause i hate leaving things in the middle.
Then to Elminster i go! |
"He's going after Obould. All by himself," Bruenor growled.
"I would not want to be Obould, then," the halfling said with a grin |
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Afromania
Acolyte
32 Posts |
Posted - 21 Oct 2009 : 21:09:04
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By the way, Drizzt keeps mentioning some Goblin slave he befriended...
I read every single book of his up to Transitions and still didn't see that part, unless i forgot something or unless it was in some side-story or short story i haven't read.
Anyone knows?
Should have named this thread "questions!" |
"He's going after Obould. All by himself," Bruenor growled.
"I would not want to be Obould, then," the halfling said with a grin |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3247 Posts |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2009 : 02:54:48
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
'Twas "Dark Mirror," in the Realms of Valor anthology.
Yes. And It was one of the better Salvatore short stories, and was very sad and very moving.
Spoilers below regarding what I think his best shorts are. Highlight to read.
My favorite Salvatore short story is still "The third level" from Realms of infamy(Which also had an excellent Elaith Craulnober backstory from Elaine Cunningham) with a young Artemis making his first kills and how he began to climb the ranks of the killers in Basadoni, but the story of Drizzt with Nojheim the goblin from Realms of Valor always gets me emotionally. "I found Nojheim hanging from Rico's crosspole". I always tear up at that scene once Drizzt realizes Nojheim was murdered by Rico.
The third best short story from Salvatore for me was the more recent one in which Drizzt gets absolution from Ellifain's ghost in Realms of Elves. When her ghost cups his face in her hands and whispers "I know now" it was just immensely satisfying that finally Drizzt gets that load off his conscience. Tosun's part in that story was also very good. |
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Afromania
Acolyte
32 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2009 : 12:30:57
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Damn, i don't think i can find those stories.
Hope i can though - I'll check my library ^_^
Thanks :D |
"He's going after Obould. All by himself," Bruenor growled.
"I would not want to be Obould, then," the halfling said with a grin |
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Afromania
Acolyte
32 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2009 : 13:26:45
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Oh and back to my original question - so if Drizzt is level 17-18 by official sources of the realms, it means somewhat lower than Entreri (18 last time i checked) or is it like in D&D where a 17 drow is equal to 34 anything else?
I didn't play D&D for a long time so i might have had this wrong but I recall every "drow level" is equal to two normal ones for some reason...Anyone can elaborate? |
"He's going after Obould. All by himself," Bruenor growled.
"I would not want to be Obould, then," the halfling said with a grin |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3247 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2009 : 17:13:10
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| In 3.0/3.5, Drow had a +2 Level Adjustment, meaning that even though Drizzt is L16, he is the equivalent of a L18 character. Which meant that he was on "equal footing" with Artemis. |
I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.
Ashe's Character Sheet
Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs |
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Zeffaniah
Acolyte
30 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2009 : 22:12:51
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I was searching for some newer stats for both Artemis and Drizzt, but as Ashe wrote, their latest stats seems to be from 3.0 in the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting.
Artemis is a lvl 4 rogue, 1 lvl ranger, 12 lvl fighter and 1 lvl assassin while Drizzt is lvl 10 fighter, 1 lvl barbarian and 5 lvl ranger (Mielikki).
I actually would've thought, that Artemis had more than 4 levels of rogue and perhaps more than 1 lvl assassin. His actions in the beginning of Icewind Dale Trilogy are described as if he's so much more experienced as a rogue than a lvl 4 rogue.
No matter what I must admit that those 2 are some of the coolest personalities in FR together with Elminster, The Simbul and Halastar, but then again, Ed is very good at making his favourite characters interesting :)
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We should take care not to make the intellect our god; it has, of course, powerful muscles, but no personality. |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3247 Posts |
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Afromania
Acolyte
32 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2009 : 23:15:53
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| It's so lame that even though Drizzt is uber cool and actually beats strong opponents he's only level 17 (or 19 with adjustment), but on the other hand he's a young elf, and if he manages to survive through a few centuries I'm sure he'll become epic! |
"He's going after Obould. All by himself," Bruenor growled.
"I would not want to be Obould, then," the halfling said with a grin |
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Zeffaniah
Acolyte
30 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2009 : 00:40:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Afromania
It's so lame that even though Drizzt is uber cool and actually beats strong opponents he's only level 17 (or 19 with adjustment), but on the other hand he's a young elf, and if he manages to survive through a few centuries I'm sure he'll become epic!
Aye, but alot of other forgotten realms characters have gotten to epichood long before Drizzt got to lvl 17/19 - although most of those are spellcasters or have reached divine rank. |
We should take care not to make the intellect our god; it has, of course, powerful muscles, but no personality. |
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Afromania
Acolyte
32 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2009 : 01:53:11
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Well, is that to say that they don't like melee there? :P
I find it weird that he didn't reach epic level.
I'll ask it like this - (without giving names or specifics please, since i haven't read the books yet) - what did Elminster vanquish?
Drizzt has a matron mother (super strong priest?), a dragon or two, demons of all sort, armies of all sorts. Even some grand wizards and magical devices.
Just wondering if it's Salvatore that makes it sound grand or is it really grand compared to other achievements in the realms. |
"He's going after Obould. All by himself," Bruenor growled.
"I would not want to be Obould, then," the halfling said with a grin |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36875 Posts |
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2009 : 02:36:24
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quote:
Originally posted by Afromania
It's so lame that even though Drizzt is uber cool and actually beats strong opponents he's only level 17 (or 19 with adjustment), but on the other hand he's a young elf, and if he manages to survive through a few centuries I'm sure he'll become epic!
Why is a 17th or 19th level "Lame"?
Once a character reaches level 14 or 15 they are considered exceptionally dangerous. The differences between levels 10-14 are exponential. The differences between a level 16-20, not so much so. And the differences between a level 20-25 are minimal in comparison.
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Zeffaniah
Acolyte
30 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2009 : 08:56:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
Why is a 17th or 19th level "Lame"?
I don't think, that Afromania means a level 19 is lame, but compared to the achievements he's done versus the achievements other NPC's in Forgotten Realms have done, he should've been at epic level and not a lvl 19 NPC.
He has defied Lolth and survived her wrath, plus escaped from the most dangerous city in The Underdark world of the drows, Menzoberanzan, he's killed atleast one high lvl dragon, loads of powerful demons, battled armies almost by single hand and this is just a small portion of what he has done (please correct me if I'm wrong about anything).
So, in all fairness Afromania and I just thinks, that he should be more than lvl 17.
I have a lvl 15 very powerful cleric and I would not have survived more than 8 rounds in some of the fights he's been a part of, if you try and compare NPC's with PC's aswell.
Elminster is one of the very few, that you can't compare with anyone and their achievements - Elminster is Elminster, although I would've liked alot more books about him. As someone wrote on another forum in here I think, there's only 5 book about him, he's a part of other books, such as The 7 Sisters etc. but not entirely about Elminster, like there is about Drizzt.
But then again, I guess it depends on what author writes about him - some authors are alot more active than others when it comes to publishing books.
Well, I might've gotten it all wrong, haven't slept that much this night due to my daughter waking up early, so my greatest apologies if I have written something wrong, too tired to delete this post hehe :)
Be good and have a pleasant day
Cheers |
We should take care not to make the intellect our god; it has, of course, powerful muscles, but no personality. |
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Afromania
Acolyte
32 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2009 : 13:37:43
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Well, yea, Zeffaniah got my feelings right there ^_^
But as i said I'll learn more soon after i read Elminster's books! |
"He's going after Obould. All by himself," Bruenor growled.
"I would not want to be Obould, then," the halfling said with a grin |
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2009 : 16:19:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Zeffaniah
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
Why is a 17th or 19th level "Lame"?
I don't think, that Afromania means a level 19 is lame, but compared to the achievements he's done versus the achievements other NPC's in Forgotten Realms have done, he should've been at epic level and not a lvl 19 NPC.
He has defied Lolth and survived her wrath, plus escaped from the most dangerous city in The Underdark world of the drows, Menzoberanzan, he's killed atleast one high lvl dragon, loads of powerful demons, battled armies almost by single hand and this is just a small portion of what he has done (please correct me if I'm wrong about anything).
So, in all fairness Afromania and I just thinks, that he should be more than lvl 17.
I have a lvl 15 very powerful cleric and I would not have survived more than 8 rounds in some of the fights he's been a part of, if you try and compare NPC's with PC's aswell.
Meh. Drizzt's accomplishments are not all that much on a grand scale. If you ask RA Salvatore, he will personally answer you with some different answers. Many people have brought up that Drizzt and Wulfgar should never have been able to slay a white dragon by themselves, and Salvatore always answers "Look at a white dragons stats in 1st edition. They had 25 HP and exceptionally low intelligence, so they were easy meat"
By loads of powerful Demons, I think you mean 1 or 2 powerful Demons, and a score of weak demons. He beat Errtu by sheer luck in the first book(unless you subscribe to the notion that finding icingdeath in the dragons pile was not luck. The exact sword he needed to beat a demon), and beat Errtu the second time with the help of all his friends. hardly a single handed feat.
I compare Drizzt and the companions of the hall more to some of the weaker Knights of Myth Drannor, the weaker princes of Shade or Possibly Azoun and Vangerdahast than I do the Elminsters and Khelben's of the world.
In any case, his last few books may have pushed him closer to the level 20-22 range. But he is not quite in the epic level range yet.
quote:
Elminster is one of the very few, that you can't compare with anyone and their achievements - Elminster is Elminster, although I would've liked alot more books about him. As someone wrote on another forum in here I think, there's only 5 book about him, he's a part of other books, such as The 7 Sisters etc. but not entirely about Elminster, like there is about Drizzt.
But then again, I guess it depends on what author writes about him - some authors are alot more active than others when it comes to publishing books.
Well, I might've gotten it all wrong, haven't slept that much this night due to my daughter waking up early, so my greatest apologies if I have written something wrong, too tired to delete this post hehe :)
Be good and have a pleasant day
Cheers
Meh. There are a few who compare favorably to Elminster, although stories of them are fewer. The most high Telamont Tanthul, Ruler of Shade for one. Larloch the Lich King. Khelben Blackstaff, The Simbul, etc and several ancient dragons(Creeping doom)and other creatures. |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4460 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2009 : 17:46:56
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Apparently there was a DDi article on him this month that offically stats him at a cozy level 22 Ranger. So he's hit epic levels in the last century. Now, whether he's fully statted as a PC or as a Monster, I don't know because I don't subscribe to DDi.
Oh, and apparently Twinkle is a radiant weapon  . Don't get me wrong, I love 4e and I'm a big fan of RA's writing and the character Drizzt, but even with the edition change, I don't see how they (WotC) came up with Twinkle being a radiant weapon. Has it ever been overly dangerous to say...undead or shadow-like beings in previous books? |
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BEAST
Master of Realmslore
USA
1714 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2009 : 22:30:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
Oh, and apparently Twinkle is a radiant weapon . Don't get me wrong, I love 4e and I'm a big fan of RA's writing and the character Drizzt, but even with the edition change, I don't see how they (WotC) came up with Twinkle being a radiant weapon. Has it ever been overly dangerous to say...undead or shadow-like beings in previous books?
Well, 1) Drizzt hasn't faced that many shadow-type enemies with Twinkle before, and
2) Remember that nobody knew Icingdeath was particularly good against demons, either, until after he found that out by accident, as well. 
I will say that there didn't seem to be anything special about Twinkle's effect on the underground creatures that Drizzt faced en route to Baffenburg in The Orc King. It seemed to have the exact same effect as Icingdeath.
Then again, dead is dead.
EDIT:
<TGK Spoiler>It is my understanding that it is at some point in the latest novel that Twinkle becomes enhanced with these new properties which enable it to fight better against shadow-type enemies. That's why it sounds so unfamiliar to us.  </spoiler> |
"'You don't know my history,' he said dryly."
--Drizzt Do'Urden (The Pirate King, Part 1: Chapter 2)
<"Comprehensive Chronology of R.A. Salvatore Forgotten Realms Works"> |
Edited by - BEAST on 24 Oct 2009 21:29:24 |
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Afromania
Acolyte
32 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2009 : 22:59:11
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I gotta make up a lot of reading to know how to look at Drizzt with the correct perspective.
All i know is, he seems to be able to beat everything he faces!
And luck IS a factor in games and in life :)
Might be level 22 with a level 50 worth of luck *wink* |
"He's going after Obould. All by himself," Bruenor growled.
"I would not want to be Obould, then," the halfling said with a grin |
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Afromania
Acolyte
32 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2009 : 00:17:42
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Grr this is so annoying, can't find "The Ghost King" anywhere in my country.
To Amazon, or not to Amazon? That is the question. |
"He's going after Obould. All by himself," Bruenor growled.
"I would not want to be Obould, then," the halfling said with a grin |
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Joran Nobleheart
Senior Scribe
USA
495 Posts |
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A question :)
