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EltonRobb
Learned Scribe
USA
148 Posts |
 Posted - 14 Mar 2025 : 23:28:25
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I know that this is a controversial topic, but I'd like to really know. Have any of you used a sacred band like Thebes' Sacred Band in your campaigns?
I discussed this briefly on the Canonfire! forums for Greyhawk, and I got some good intellectual responses on how I felt about Hextor having a sacred band in the Great Kingdom. Yes I like Greyhawk, but I like the Realms too.
Ahem, so it may be uncomfortable to talk about a band of men who love each other intimately and go and fight wars. But I thought you can discuss everything about the Realms here on this board. So no question is off limits as far as I know.
So, what is the Sacred Band of Thebes? It is a band of homosexual men that acted like Thebes' special troops. In the game Zeus by Sierra Online this Band was recognized as the Spartiates. Crack troops that worshipped Ares that went to fight wars for Thebes (and Sparta).
I wanted to implement something like it for my Drow campaign. Although I think drow women would find the Sacred Band of Lolth(?) to be hot. Although I'm not sure if Drow homosexuality was ever explored in gaming products for FR or the novels. However, Wizards is presently coddling gamers in an effort to be uncontroversial and popular. I have gay friends who game, though. And I let them play characters who identify with their sexuality.
So is this a topic we can discuss with some maturity?
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Delnyn
Master of Realmslore
USA
1027 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2025 : 10:50:54
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| For your drow campaign, I would recommend male sacred bands be dedicated to Selvetarm. Having suffered the sadistic attentions of Lolthite priestesses could make a drow male shun female companionship. Selvetarm already serves as a drow war god. Homophobia is not welcome at Candlekeep, as the ArchCEV incident showed. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11969 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2025 : 13:39:57
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| Actually, given his focus on male empowerment, if you wanted to focus on a male group of drow (of whatever sexuality... homo, hetero, bi... doesn't really matter) I'd recommend them being followers of Vhaeraun. Most view him as simply a god of thieves, but he could easily have rangers, fighters, warlock(hexblades), rogues of all flavors, elven bladesingers, etc... serving him. While I don't personally get the need to focus on their sexuality from a game perspective, to each their own. On drow exploring homosexuality, there was one instance of light exploration of female homosexuality in the like 5 (6?) books that involved Lolth going silent. It was more of a hint than anything else. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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EltonRobb
Learned Scribe
USA
148 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2025 : 14:31:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
For your drow campaign, I would recommend male sacred bands be dedicated to Selvetarm. Having suffered the sadistic attentions of Lolthite priestesses could make a drow male shun female companionship. Selvetarm already serves as a drow war god. Homophobia is not welcome at Candlekeep, as the ArchCEV incident showed.
Gotcha. I thought this group would be like the Eberron Discord group, I'm happy that's not the case. The Eberron Discord is just . . . not mature enough.
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Actually, given his focus on male empowerment, if you wanted to focus on a male group of drow (of whatever sexuality... homo, hetero, bi... doesn't really matter) I'd recommend them being followers of Vhaeraun. Most view him as simply a god of thieves, but he could easily have rangers, fighters, warlock(hexblades), rogues of all flavors, elven bladesingers, etc... serving him. While I don't personally get the need to focus on their sexuality from a game perspective, to each their own. On drow exploring homosexuality, there was one instance of light exploration of female homosexuality in the like 5 (6?) books that involved Lolth going silent. It was more of a hint than anything else.
Selvetarm or Vaeraun, gotcha. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36863 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2025 : 15:28:59
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quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Actually, given his focus on male empowerment, if you wanted to focus on a male group of drow (of whatever sexuality... homo, hetero, bi... doesn't really matter) I'd recommend them being followers of Vhaeraun. Most view him as simply a god of thieves, but he could easily have rangers, fighters, warlock(hexblades), rogues of all flavors, elven bladesingers, etc... serving him. While I don't personally get the need to focus on their sexuality from a game perspective, to each their own. On drow exploring homosexuality, there was one instance of light exploration of female homosexuality in the like 5 (6?) books that involved Lolth going silent. It was more of a hint than anything else.
I'm going to agree with this. I personally don't see any reason sexuality has to be a part of it, but if it's something you want to run with, I'd expect it to be something connected to gods more known for hedonism/sensuality/lust.
Some other points:
quote:
Originally posted by EltonRobb
Although I think drow women would find the Sacred Band of Lolth(?) to be hot.
I think it would be like the real world. Some drow women would find it hot, some wouldn't care, some would be disgusted by it. And since we're talking about drow, some drow women may demand one or more members of this band for their own beds.
I've known plenty of women who would be delighted by this idea, but I've also known many that have never paid any attention whatsoever to the topic of male homosexuality.
quote:
Originally posted by EltonRobb
However, Wizards is presently coddling gamers in an effort to be uncontroversial and popular. I have gay friends who game, though. And I let them play characters who identify with their sexuality.
There was a hell of a lot of blowback several years ago when Wizards dared to say that characters could have any sexuality and that it didn't have to match the player's sexuality. I think it's cowardly that they've backed away from such "bold" statements, but I understand how businesses operate... And WotC isn't a company I currently hold in high regard; I don't have favorable expectations for them on any particular topic aside from adventure design.
Good on you for letting your players be comfortable at your table.
quote:
Originally posted by EltonRobb
So is this a topic we can discuss with some maturity?
putting on the moderator hat for a moment
This topic WILL be discussed with some maturity. I will remove homophobic posts and I will temporarily ban people if I have to.
Just be respectful. If you don't like the concept, either say so without being a homophobe, or just don't say anything. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11969 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2025 : 17:48:41
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On a female drow version, Zinzerena might make a better group than Lolth. They are rebellious outcast assassins, illusionists, arcane casters, etc... and she has a focus on females over males. While I don't see a problem with Lolth having similar, I kind of see Lolth with her focus on houses and families .... I see them less likely to be a homosexual group. Zinzerena however... at least to me, it seems a good fit for a group of outcast warriors, rogues, hunters, etc... who MIGHT supplement with magic and serve on the outskirts of society.
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Zinzerena |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Edited by - sleyvas on 15 Mar 2025 17:54:52 |
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EltonRobb
Learned Scribe
USA
148 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2025 : 19:02:50
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quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
On a female drow version, Zinzerena might make a better group than Lolth. They are rebellious outcast assassins, illusionists, arcane casters, etc... and she has a focus on females over males. While I don't see a problem with Lolth having similar, I kind of see Lolth with her focus on houses and families .... I see them less likely to be a homosexual group. Zinzerena however... at least to me, it seems a good fit for a group of outcast warriors, rogues, hunters, etc... who MIGHT supplement with magic and serve on the outskirts of society.
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Zinzerena
Just read that.
So, sort of like Leira. Could the two be related? |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11969 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2025 : 20:09:30
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quote:
Originally posted by EltonRobb
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
On a female drow version, Zinzerena might make a better group than Lolth. They are rebellious outcast assassins, illusionists, arcane casters, etc... and she has a focus on females over males. While I don't see a problem with Lolth having similar, I kind of see Lolth with her focus on houses and families .... I see them less likely to be a homosexual group. Zinzerena however... at least to me, it seems a good fit for a group of outcast warriors, rogues, hunters, etc... who MIGHT supplement with magic and serve on the outskirts of society.
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Zinzerena
Just read that.
So, sort of like Leira. Could the two be related?
I wouldn't personally. Just because she's illusions and lies and female shouldn't mean same person. As much as I like Leira, linking these two is not something I'd push for. Also, for any goddess of illusions, lies is a pretty easy linkage. Assassins though, not necessarily part of all that. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Thebes Sacred Band in Forgotten Realms
