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Kentinal
Great Reader
4692 Posts |
 Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 02:35:56
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quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
What I don't fully understand is the strong negative feeling of some toward the new edition in principle, as if it somehow affects their ability to use the 3E materials they have.
Long going campaigns are still trying to adjust 2nd to 3rd in a way that makes sense to players that only know 3.X. We do not know what changes 3 to 4 will have, hopefully minor. However there is some indication that skill ranks disappear to be replaced by another scheme which could make charater conversion unrecognisable. Excelled at disarming traps because even having three class levels, the charater level is much higher and skills points were high. That is game mechanique concern. RP concern involes the above in prepurchase 4th modules. The 3rd Edition Charater will be facing a different foe in skills, feats and posible other changes we do not know about.
Compatibility is an issue, blending 1st thru 3rd becomes a House tule that a new player would have to adjust to. That brand new 4th PHB will be of little use. For new gamers and new DMs prior Edtions mean nothing at all so those that only know or only played 3rd are unlikely to understan the concerns of players in omgoing campaigns trying to adjust to some rather strange changes to their campaign would, because a new class sounds good, but has to be balanced, old charaters might need to lose things to remain in balance.
If onepicks and chooses from all versions and the players are happy with it, there is no discord. In part the problem comes when a new player enters. FR map changed a new player would not expect the old map. Oh this ca be fixed by the DM making a copy of the old map. It though would not stop there, explaination of which rules from each version applies. Each DM could find themselves in a position of writing a mini PHB for the House game. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 02:46:14
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| Well, at least the picture of the halfling proves one thing . . . they aren't going for the hip "dungeonpunk" look anymore. |
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Chosen of Moradin
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1120 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 02:59:12
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really.
And it looks like Roberc, of the Bladesinger novel, don't you think?  |
Dwarf, DM, husband, and proud of this! :P
twitter: @yuripeixoto
Facebook: yuri.peixoto |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 03:01:52
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
And I don't recall what it was, but when asked about something specific that was changed, the answer was along the lines of "I just felt like changing it."
Xara Tantlor, from the Silver Marches region (went from NG to NE with no in-setting explanation)?
I want to say my impression of the current design direction for the FR setting definitely chimes with what Wooly is saying. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 17 Aug 2007 03:02:07 |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 03:03:03
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quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
Well, at least the picture of the halfling proves one thing . . . they aren't going for the hip "dungeonpunk" look anymore.
Well, that's a good thing. I hope the anime-style characters are no longer in fashion, either... |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Sanishiver
Senior Scribe
USA
476 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 03:11:37
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quote:
Originally posted by warlockco
Fixed
That post was made of stupid.
God I hope Reynolds is in on the next FRCS, if only to make the people willing to insult game designers expose themselves for the jerks they are.
I'll get some enjoyment out of it, then.
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09/20/2008: Tiger Army at the Catalyst in Santa Cruz. You wouldn’t believe how many females rode it out in the pit. Santa Cruz women are all of them beautiful. Now I know to add tough to that description.
6/27/2008: WALL-E is about the best damn movie Pixar has ever made. It had my heart racing and had me rooting for the good guy.
9/9/2006: Dave Mathews Band was off the hook at the Shoreline Amphitheater.
Never, ever read the game books too literally, or make such assumptions that what is omitted cannot be. Bad DM form, that.
And no matter how compelling a picture string theory paints, if it does not accurately describe our universe, it will be no more relevant than an elaborate game of Dungeons and Dragons. --paragraph 1, chapter 9, The Elegant Universe by Brian Greene |
Edited by - Sanishiver on 17 Aug 2007 03:14:19 |
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Arkhaedun
Senior Scribe
869 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 03:24:06
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Okay, that's it. No more shots at each other, no more personal attacks, no more names. I've had enough and everyone here has been here long enough to know how to have a civil discourse. Let's straigten up and try to have a discussion instead of scoring points with name calling and personal attacks.
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4692 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 03:26:22
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Well the site is kinda working, it appears they are bringing back weapon types. It will matter what weapon you use in combat.
It also appears I am expected to login, but they still might be fixing bugs. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 03:42:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
Well the site is kinda working,
It is? :-/
quote:
it appears they are bringing back weapon types. It will matter what weapon you use in combat.
Where'd you read that? |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 03:46:02
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quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
"Paladins" should be like Clerics and be open to all alignments
Blasphemy! How dare you?!? 
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 03:47:21
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| There was a "classes" blog entry on the site (when it was working) that mentioned that fighters learn different maneuvers (similar to the ones in Tome of Battle) and that different maneuvers will be available depending on what kind of weapon a fighter specializes in. |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 03:53:58
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quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
There was a "classes" blog entry on the site (when it was working) that mentioned that fighters learn different maneuvers (similar to the ones in Tome of Battle) and that different maneuvers will be available depending on what kind of weapon a fighter specializes in.
I guess that's the problem--the site's acting funny.
Thanks for the info. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
Edited by - Rinonalyrna Fathomlin on 17 Aug 2007 03:54:18 |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4692 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 03:54:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
Well the site is kinda working,
It is? :-/
I got in for a few minutes, with my non image browser. It is out againquote:
quote:
it appears they are bringing back weapon types. It will matter what weapon you use in combat.
Where'd you read that?
On the site, alas when I used image enabled browser it stalled and site went off line again. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 03:55:39
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| Thanks anyway. Hopefully the site will be more accessable when the initial craze dies down. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4692 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 03:59:59
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quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
There was a "classes" blog entry on the site (when it was working) that mentioned that fighters learn different maneuvers (similar to the ones in Tome of Battle) and that different maneuvers will be available depending on what kind of weapon a fighter specializes in.
Well that sounds simple and quicker, break out the golf bag again?
Perhaps called shots are back?
It does not sound too attractive what little I seen, but of course I can not see much right now. It might not be that bad, feats allowed an attack bonus if using a specific weapon (trained in) so the change might not be much at all.
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"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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SirUrza
Master of Realmslore
USA
1283 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 04:05:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Faraer
quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
The FRCS was the only big seller in the Realms line. Why do you think they barely converted the Realms to 3E? They weren't making any money on it.
You think Wizards would release four big Realms sourcebooks each year for seven straight years while not making any money?
Big? Sorry, but what Wizard of the Coast put out as far as the Realms is concerned is barely anything. Other companies, smaller companies at that have put out more material in more time. It's about getting the talent there to make the books. Make the books cheapter to make, ditch the glossy, ditch the unnecessary color. The Malhavoc books are perfect examples of high quality books with low production costs.
Wizards could be putting out 6-8 books Realms supplements a year, instead they only put out 4 because they can't risk anything else because they have to see a return on the book.
Wizard runs on a tight budget, it's been this way since Hasbro took them over. Before that they took a lot of risks. Look at their track record since, it's 1:1 every year for D&D. One product line gets replaced with another because Hasbro doesn't give them to money to take chance, they have a bottom line and they must make money on every product or else the bean counters come firing.
The proof is there. Wizards stopped producing campaigns and adventures because they weren't selling. Why can they do it now (you ask)? Well, they have Miniature profits to float on, something they didn't originally have.
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"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy. |
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SirUrza
Master of Realmslore
USA
1283 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 04:09:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Purple Dragon Knight
quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
"Paladins" should be like Clerics and be open to all alignments
Blasphemy! How dare you?!?
It's make being a blackguard a whole lot easier. Take the cleric's ability to inflict or cure spontaneously. Choice. Take the ranger's ranged vs dual wield. Choice.
Give the paladin a good or evil chain. IF the paladin falls (turns evil or turns good) then they have to "redeem" themselves or quest to convert to the new way.
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"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy. |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4692 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 04:17:21
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Why should being a blackguard be made easier?
Though the BD&D had Paladin and Advenger both subjected to same basic rules (though the Advenger had to pay an evil Cleric for blessings to be evil, I suspect that was TSR desire to make it hard for PCs to become Evil charaters). |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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SirUrza
Master of Realmslore
USA
1283 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 04:57:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
Why should being a blackguard be made easier?
Why should it be hard? An evil paladin is an evil paladin, it shouldn't be a prestige class. If you're playing an evil character.. or playing in an evil campaign.. you should start off as an evil paladin. If you want "Blackguard" to mean something in name, make it into the evil Divine Champion (and make DC something good paladins would want to become.) :P
This isn't TSR and it's code of lawful goodness.
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"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy. |
Edited by - SirUrza on 17 Aug 2007 05:00:17 |
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hammer of Moradin
Senior Scribe
USA
758 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 05:18:50
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I would be upset about this if I was not already expecting it. I am excited about it because it seems to me from the press releases and information I have read so far that D&D will go digital age!
I think I speak for a good percent of us here at Candlekeep in saying that the majority of my gaming or gaming related experiences come from contact with the fine folks on this site. Now we can pair off against Alaundo or Sage in a tabletop game without the clunky play-by-post waiting that ruined several on-line groups I participated in over the past few years. New updated rules, bring 'em on, but they also better have quite a bit of extras come from on-line Dragon and Dungeon, and the WOTC website, as they have in printed form. Heck, give me a few basic core books and put everything else in digital format as long as it is accessible and user friendly.
9 months and counting, but I want to be first in line for the Candlekeep role-playing group we can get together. I want to see Alaundo and a few authors joining in. Talk about your selling points for the site!
See you in May 2008 for an 4dventure.
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"Hurling himself upon his enemies, he terrified them with slaughter!"
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium
Candlekeep proverb: If a thing is said often enough, fools aplenty will believe it to be true. |
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Skeptic
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1273 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 05:30:20
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quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
Why should being a blackguard be made easier?
Why should it be hard? An evil paladin is an evil paladin, it shouldn't be a prestige class. If you're playing an evil character.. or playing in an evil campaign.. you should start off as an evil paladin. If you want "Blackguard" to mean something in name, make it into the evil Divine Champion (and make DC something good paladins would want to become.) :P
This isn't TSR and it's code of lawful goodness.
D&D (not all RPGs) is made to play adventurous heroes, many things are build around that idea. Knowing that, I can understand that the core rules doesn't support Evil PCs. |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 06:47:40
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quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
Well, at least the picture of the halfling proves one thing . . . they aren't going for the hip "dungeonpunk" look anymore.
Well that would be the first good news on the illustration front in, what is it now, seven years? Now a few telephones to Steven Fabian, Larry Elmore and Valerie Valusek and we are rollin' |
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Skeptic
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1273 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 06:53:27
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quote:
Originally posted by hammer of Moradin
9 months and counting, but I want to be first in line for the Candlekeep role-playing group we can get together. I want to see Alaundo and a few authors joining in. Talk about your selling points for the site!
See you in May 2008 for an 4dventure.
Ok, now I have a good reason to learn how to speak English  |
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warlockco
Master of Realmslore
USA
1695 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 08:08:31
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quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
quote:
Originally posted by Purple Dragon Knight
quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
"Paladins" should be like Clerics and be open to all alignments
Blasphemy! How dare you?!?
It's make being a blackguard a whole lot easier. Take the cleric's ability to inflict or cure spontaneously. Choice. Take the ranger's ranged vs dual wield. Choice.
Give the paladin a good or evil chain. IF the paladin falls (turns evil or turns good) then they have to "redeem" themselves or quest to convert to the new way.
There are rules for Variant Paladins.
Dragon has released rules for a Paladin of each alignment, and Unearthed Arcana has 3 more there too. |
News of the Weird
D20 System Reference Document
D20 Modern System Reference Document
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Zanan
Senior Scribe
Germany
942 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 08:35:27
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| People, peace! We know next to nothing about the 4E, so no use getting at each others throats and all that over things we have no real clue about. Maybe all will be better and fan-oriented? Maybe the one-step rule goes out of the window and all classes have at least 4 skill points per level? Maybe ... well ... |
Cave quid dicis, quando et cui!
Gæð a wyrd swa hio scel!
In memory of Alura Durshavin.
Visit my "Homepage" to find A Guide to the Drow NPCs of Faerûn, Drow and non-Drow PrC and much more. |
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Alaundo
Head Moderator
United Kingdom
5696 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 08:46:21
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Well met
I'm unable to access the site this morning (firewall block rather than an issue with WotC servers, you'll be pleased to hear )... could anyone please confirm if the 3.5 D&D and FR material is still available or if this has been archived off. |
Alaundo
Candlekeep Forums Head Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
An Introduction to Candlekeep - by Ed Greenwood
The Candlekeep Compendium - Tomes of Realmslore penned by Scribes of Candlekeep
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Brenigin
Learned Scribe
New Zealand
117 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 09:01:02
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Alaundo, I've been trying all day to access the site, without joy. Just keep getting the polite "we're broken right now" message from Wizards.
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warlockco
Master of Realmslore
USA
1695 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 10:33:52
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quote:
Originally posted by Alaundo
Well met
I'm unable to access the site this morning (firewall block rather than an issue with WotC servers, you'll be pleased to hear )... could anyone please confirm if the 3.5 D&D and FR material is still available or if this has been archived off.
I still get the overloaded site page. |
News of the Weird
D20 System Reference Document
D20 Modern System Reference Document
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warlockco
Master of Realmslore
USA
1695 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 10:34:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Zanan
People, peace! We know next to nothing about the 4E, so no use getting at each others throats and all that over things we have no real clue about. Maybe all will be better and fan-oriented? Maybe the one-step rule goes out of the window and all classes have at least 4 skill points per level? Maybe ... well ...
If 4E is like the Saga System for Star Wars, Skill took a big nerf. |
News of the Weird
D20 System Reference Document
D20 Modern System Reference Document
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Drakul
Senior Scribe
USA
367 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2007 : 11:04:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Alaundo
Well met
I'm unable to access the site this morning (firewall block rather than an issue with WotC servers, you'll be pleased to hear )... could anyone please confirm if the 3.5 D&D and FR material is still available or if this has been archived off.
I still keep gettin the 'We are experiencing Technical Difficulties' thing. Whatever they are doin, they must be redoin everything. I wouldn't be surprised to find a completely new design and set-up. |
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDonLNKf6_KA9Qlal3Qu3zQ?view_as=subscriber |
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D&D 4e Discussion Scroll
