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Ardashir
Senior Scribe
USA
544 Posts |
 Posted - 10 Aug 2006 : 16:21:20
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
I hear you Sleyvas, but the good thing is I chose Rilaunyr's deity to be Sune (only because Richard Lee Byers noted a member of the Council wearing that deity's symbol) so maybe he/she had some sort of divine gender intervention? Sune is kinky like that! 
-- George Krashos
_Very_ OT, but does that sort of thing still happen in official D&D material? Some friends of mine were discussing the old Gygax material, spec. Tomb of Horrors, and soemtimes it seems like back then you could get your gender reversed just by stepping into the wrong room...
Sometimes I remember just why folks think of RPGers as being weird. ;) |
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Trace_Coburn
Learned Scribe
New Zealand
137 Posts |
Posted - 11 Aug 2006 : 11:28:22
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Managed to get a hold of this yesterday, Krashos, along with a DMG and Dungeon #137 for completeness' sake.  (And can I just add: finally! After all, the distributor only waited three frakkin' months between shipments! Monopolised markets suck.  )
I read this avidly, loved prettty much all of it, and am eagerly attempting to integrate much of it into some backstories of my own.  Other than points already raised in this scroll, the thing that really caught my eye was that 'series of unfortunate events' which has seen Sambryl first assume the Queen-Regency and then retain it for quite a span of years.
Call me paranoid... but I'm reminded of an old military axiom: once is happenstance, twice is coincidence - three times is deliberate (hostile) activity.  |
D&D collection: Player's Handbook, Dungeon Master's Guide, Monster Manual I, Complete Arcane, Arms & Equipment Guide.
FR sourcebook collection: Dragons of Faerûn, Faiths & Pantheons, FRCS, Lords of Darkness, Monsters of Faerûn, Player's Guide to Faerûn, Power of Faerûn, Races of Faerûn, Silver Marches.
I just got back into this, okay? Give me time (or better yet money) - I'll catch up soon enough. |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6666 Posts |
Posted - 12 Aug 2006 : 03:05:00
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I tend to agree with you. But just WHAT has caused all the 'bad luck' in Impiltur over the last couple of decades is something Eric and I have purposely left wide open. It could be Soneillon, it could be nobles, it could be the Shadowmasters of Telflamm, it could be Thay, it could be ... well, just about anyone you want.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Derulbaskul
Senior Scribe
Singapore
408 Posts |
Posted - 12 Aug 2006 : 17:00:29
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Well, I wasn't prepared to wait the necessary three months for my subscription copy to arrive so I went and bought this issue of Dragon at my FLGS... and very pleased that I did!
Congratulations, George, it was a terrific article and the first time in a while that I felt like I got value from an issue of Dragon magazine. I really hope that you're able to get more articles published. |
Cheers
D
NB: Please remember: A cannon is a big gun. Canon is what we discuss here. |
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Mkhaiwati
Learned Scribe
USA
252 Posts |
Posted - 12 Aug 2006 : 17:28:02
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I thought the same thing as Trace_Coburn. I didn't see Soneillon or Shadowmasters, I saw Sambryl setting herself up to be the semi-permanent ruler of Impiltur.
Mkhaiwati |
"Behold the work of the old... let your heritage not be lost but bequeath it as a memory, treasure and blessing... Gather the lost and the hidden and preserve it for thy children."
"not nale. not-nale. thog help nail not-nale, not nale. and thog knot not-nale while nale nail not-nale. nale, not not-nale, now nail not-nale by leaving not-nale, not nale, in jail." OotS #367 |
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Sanishiver
Senior Scribe
USA
476 Posts |
Posted - 12 Aug 2006 : 18:47:02
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You know, it just popped into my head that Impiltur has been the scene of some truly hideous, bloody battles between men and fiends. I’m talking the kind of conflicts that make the events surrounding a typical all-slaughtering orc horde look tame by comparison.
Even better, thanks to the lore George has given us as well as that from other sources, Impiltur can ***still*** be the sight of such bloody battles!
I like this.
Why? Well, when I think of The Realms as a whole I do not get a visceral sense of danger. Like differing flavors of emotion, The Realms doesn’t at the start leave me with a sense of dread and terror when I think about it --more a staid feeling of ‘typical’ fantasy danger instead.
However with Impiltur I have a ready-made portion of the Realms where gruesome, body rending battles can take place here and now, with fiends and worse ready to erupt from known vile locations at any time.
I find myself imagining the battles from the movie Excalibur, save the armored knights are being bodily ripped apart by fiends whose claws cut armor as simply as they cut flesh, and the knights themselves are holly warriors and devout worshippers who readily sacrifice themselves for the greater good of the land they love.
This is cool.
What’s more, should my players visit Impiltur (whether by my design or their own) I can contrast its dark history and the ‘ready’ nature of everyone to battle the worst the outer planes has to offer with the noble, almost divine (to me) state of the place and its people.
That’s something else I like also: more overt divine (well, to be honest, non-Mystra) influence in the leadership of a kingdom within the Realms, with all its attendant intrigues and foul-ups due to fallible human nature.
That and I think my players would be interested to learn more in-game about the place where Cormyr’s royal bloodline migrated from. (Maybe I could hint that Cormyr’s strong desire to ‘reign in’ its priesthoods stems at least in part from a longstanding bias against ‘how things were done’ in Impiltur?)
Lately I’ve come to realize that it’s good for my campaign if I go out of my way to stress the differences between regions of The Realms (or more precisely, to stress the differing {and therefore unique} mood and feeling of such places).
With George’s article plus the works of others, I’ve got more than enough to info to make Impiltur stand out in my player’s minds (and deliver a fantastically gory battle right to their feet, should they dare to find trouble in the place).
Wow, I didn’t intend for this to run so long. I’ll take that as a good sign of Impiltur’s potential.
So thanks again to George for a job well done!
J. Grenemyer |
09/20/2008: Tiger Army at the Catalyst in Santa Cruz. You wouldn’t believe how many females rode it out in the pit. Santa Cruz women are all of them beautiful. Now I know to add tough to that description.
6/27/2008: WALL-E is about the best damn movie Pixar has ever made. It had my heart racing and had me rooting for the good guy.
9/9/2006: Dave Mathews Band was off the hook at the Shoreline Amphitheater.
Never, ever read the game books too literally, or make such assumptions that what is omitted cannot be. Bad DM form, that.
And no matter how compelling a picture string theory paints, if it does not accurately describe our universe, it will be no more relevant than an elaborate game of Dungeons and Dragons. --paragraph 1, chapter 9, The Elegant Universe by Brian Greene |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 13 Aug 2006 : 01:57:37
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I have to agree--I finally picked up this issue of Dragon, and I have to say I like the way the article is written. I only skimmed it so far, but I can tell George worked hard putting it together.
Sambryl's picture is pretty fugly though. Yes, I guess I'm shallow, but...yick. Where's her hair? Also, I still don't think a person who isn't even 16 should have 8 class levels (I'm speaking of Imbrar, and his picture portrays someone who is older than 16, as well). |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Kajehase
Great Reader
Sweden
2104 Posts |
Posted - 13 Aug 2006 : 14:28:06
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| Well, it wouldn't be the first time a Realms-character is portrayed looking a bit older than they're supposed to be. See my avatar (supposed to be one of the Gemcloaks from City of Splendours), or the cover of The Ruby Guardian, for instance. |
There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 13 Aug 2006 : 21:25:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Kajehase
Well, it wouldn't be the first time a Realms-character is portrayed looking a bit older than they're supposed to be. See my avatar (supposed to be one of the Gemcloaks from City of Splendours), or the cover of The Ruby Guardian, for instance.
It doesn't matter if it's the first time or not--it's still pretty silly. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Kajehase
Great Reader
Sweden
2104 Posts |
Posted - 14 Aug 2006 : 12:01:25
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I'm not arguing the matter. But if I don't think about the cover of The Ruby Guardian being supposed to depict a sixteen-year-old I rather like it. *leers*
But um...there was another topic here at the start, right?
Since I haven't gotten my hands on the issue yet, can anyone tell me if there's anything on the hobgoblins of the area? |
There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 15 Aug 2006 : 03:00:53
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quote:
Originally posted by Kajehase
I'm not arguing the matter. But if I don't think about the cover of The Ruby Guardian being supposed to depict a sixteen-year-old I rather like it. *leers*
But um...there was another topic here at the start, right?
Since I haven't gotten my hands on the issue yet, can anyone tell me if there's anything on the hobgoblins of the area?
I would help you, but...I haven't looked that deeply at the article yet. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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RodOdom
Senior Scribe
USA
509 Posts |
Posted - 09 Sep 2006 : 15:27:43
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| Question for Master Krashos : is it known from where the mad dragon of Bluefang Water comes from? It seems strange that a blue dragon would live outside its natural desert habitat. |
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Ardashir
Senior Scribe
USA
544 Posts |
Posted - 09 Sep 2006 : 15:51:02
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quote:
Originally posted by RodOdom
Question for Master Krashos : is it known from where the mad dragon of Bluefang Water comes from? It seems strange that a blue dragon would live outside its natural desert habitat.
Well, it is mad. |
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EvilKnight
Learned Scribe
USA
162 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2006 : 18:55:11
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Hello George,
Questions:
1. On page 63, under the last heading it has "Year of the Dawndance (1097 DR)". Is that suppose to be 'Year of the Gleaming Crown (1097 DR)' or "Year of the Dawndance (1095 DR)"?
2. On page 58, is it Thelnarm or Thelnam (as on the map page 62)?
3. On pages 59 and 67 you have it as Great Imphras River. The map on 62 has it as Great Impharas River. Which one? I'm leaning away from the map now.
4. (map diff again) On pages 58 & 59 -> "Tower Ithfell". Map has "Tower Ithfel".
5. (ditto) On page 59 ->"Towers of Lamentation". Map has "Tower of Lamentation".
Just some things that I have run across while trying to clean up the Danali Index entries.
EvilKnight |
Danali Index |
Edited by - EvilKnight on 15 Sep 2006 21:59:30 |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6666 Posts |
Posted - 16 Sep 2006 : 02:56:53
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quote:
Originally posted by EvilKnight
Hello George,
Questions:
1. On page 63, under the last heading it has "Year of the Dawndance (1097 DR)". Is that suppose to be 'Year of the Gleaming Crown (1097 DR)' or "Year of the Dawndance (1095 DR)"?
2. On page 58, is it Thelnarm or Thelnam (as on the map page 62)?
3. On pages 59 and 67 you have it as Great Imphras River. The map on 62 has it as Great Impharas River. Which one? I'm leaning away from the map now.
4. (map diff again) On pages 58 & 59 -> "Tower Ithfell". Map has "Tower Ithfel".
5. (ditto) On page 59 ->"Towers of Lamentation". Map has "Tower of Lamentation".
Just some things that I have run across while trying to clean up the Danali Index entries.
EvilKnight
The text takes precedence over the map. Cartographers in the Realms are notorious for their mistakes.
Now, as to the 1097 DR date, yes that whole paragraph is a blunder. Not just for that date, but the one preceding it also. Consider this chagrined official errata:
Impiltur was founded in the Year of Splendor which happens to be -74 DR, not -72 DR.
Modern-day Impiltur was founded in the Year of the Gleaming Crown (1097 DR) as you noted, not the Year of the Dawndance. The Year of the Dawndance is when Imphras defeated the hobgoblins.
I'll go slink off into a corner with my tail between my legs now.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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EvilKnight
Learned Scribe
USA
162 Posts |
Posted - 16 Sep 2006 : 12:07:42
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George, I did not mean to come on like a priestess of Loviatar there (I am into the SM thing but the consensual kind). I would not have even noticed except I got index entries that were slightly off. I'll make sure notes get in to lead Scribes to the right information.
Of course.. if there's anything else you would like to confess...fingers wicked looking flogger at belt.
EvilKnight |
Danali Index |
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Trace_Coburn
Learned Scribe
New Zealand
137 Posts |
Posted - 11 Nov 2006 : 11:09:18
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Greetings, George Krashos. As you seem to be the designated sage for all matters Impilturan , I just have a 'quick' flavour-style question that goes to the background of a character.
Historically, most of Impiltur is (or was) over-run with fiends and their works, but those fiends are usually described as demons, implying that tanar'ri were/are behind most of the region's fiendish woes. How common would you say are incidences of baatezu showing up to make sundry mayhem and/or launch schemes to thwart the works of their hated rivals? Would it be a non-issue, a vanishingly rare occurence, or something that happens every now and then?
When and if devils poke their heads up, do typical Impilturans know (or care) enough about the difference between the two breeds of fiend to make the distinction - or has all their experience with the denizens of the Nine Hells conditioned them to think in terms of "fiend(ish) = demon(ic)"?  |
D&D collection: Player's Handbook, Dungeon Master's Guide, Monster Manual I, Complete Arcane, Arms & Equipment Guide.
FR sourcebook collection: Dragons of Faerûn, Faiths & Pantheons, FRCS, Lords of Darkness, Monsters of Faerûn, Player's Guide to Faerûn, Power of Faerûn, Races of Faerûn, Silver Marches.
I just got back into this, okay? Give me time (or better yet money) - I'll catch up soon enough. |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6666 Posts |
Posted - 11 Nov 2006 : 11:31:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Trace_Coburn
Greetings, George Krashos. As you seem to be the designated sage for all matters Impilturan , I just have a 'quick' flavour-style question that goes to the background of a character.
Historically, most of Impiltur is (or was) over-run with fiends and their works, but those fiends are usually described as demons, implying that tanar'ri were/are behind most of the region's fiendish woes. How common would you say are incidences of baatezu showing up to make sundry mayhem and/or launch schemes to thwart the works of their hated rivals? Would it be a non-issue, a vanishingly rare occurence, or something that happens every now and then?
When and if devils poke their heads up, do typical Impilturans know (or care) enough about the difference between the two breeds of fiend to make the distinction - or has all their experience with the denizens of the Nine Hells conditioned them to think in terms of "fiend(ish) = demon(ic)"?
That's a good question - and one I'm still pondering on in terms of concrete, definite answers. The scattered sources (mainly the novels) talk about baatezu influence in ancient Narfell - something the gaming sources haven't really run with. My view is that the predominate fiendish taint is demonic but that over the centuries, wizards have latched onto the Blood War rivalry between devils and demons and used whichever best suited a particular purpose. In other words, if your arch-rival happens to be fond of summoning Orcus and/or his charges, then they might decide to throw some baatezu at him in opposition. Either that or a rival demon prince and/or his followers.
I'm also toying with the idea that ancient Narfell had many power and dynastic changes in its 750 year-long existence, and that cabals devoted to particular fiends (and even types of fiends) waxed and waned over the years. I've nailed down why the ancient Narfelli turned to demon worship, but haven't expanded much into their ongoing history yet.
As for Impilturians making a distinction between fiends, that's usually uncommon. You see, the waving pitchforks and the mob shouting usually mean that anything fiendish doesn't get examined at their leisure. And I'm of the old school - a dead fiend starts to discorporate when slain on the Prime, collapsing quickly into a puddle of smoke and goo, so there isn't usually much of an opportunity for a post-slaying examination.
Keep in mind that open fiendish activity just doesn't happen in Impiltur. Just like it doesn't happen in most civilized places of the Realms. Fiendish is fiendish - whether your home plane has 666 layers or 9. Impilturians don't care to much to make a distinction - they just want it dead and its summoner hunted down and slain as quickly as possible.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Trace_Coburn
Learned Scribe
New Zealand
137 Posts |
Posted - 11 Nov 2006 : 11:57:24
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
As for Impilturians making a distinction between fiends, that's usually uncommon. You see, the waving pitchforks and the mob shouting usually mean that anything fiendish doesn't get examined at their leisure. And I'm of the old school - a dead fiend starts to discorporate when slain on the Prime, collapsing quickly into a puddle of smoke and goo, so there isn't usually much of an opportunity for a post-slaying examination.
Keep in mind that open fiendish activity just doesn't happen in Impiltur. Just like it doesn't happen in most civilized places of the Realms. Fiendish is fiendish - whether your home plane has 666 layers or 9. Impilturians don't care to much to make a distinction - they just want it dead and its summoner hunted down and slain as quickly as possible.
Open activity is contra-indicated, of course. That said, I was thinking of a slightly more subtle approach, such as Summoner X or Fiend Y breeding up a few broods of tieflings as potential spies and/or 'sleeper agents'.
Nonetheless, I'd imagine that exhibiting (or manifesting) unmistakeable signs of fiendish ancestry in Impiltur would still be a great way to get run out of town (or lynched, as you describe). Which lends itself to the whole "favoured class: rogue" thing and an artifically high proportion of tieflings becoming adventurers, come to think of it - they're accepted in precious few other places/sub-cultures.... [/me wanders away to ponder that quietly]
Cheers for the quick reply, George. |
D&D collection: Player's Handbook, Dungeon Master's Guide, Monster Manual I, Complete Arcane, Arms & Equipment Guide.
FR sourcebook collection: Dragons of Faerûn, Faiths & Pantheons, FRCS, Lords of Darkness, Monsters of Faerûn, Player's Guide to Faerûn, Power of Faerûn, Races of Faerûn, Silver Marches.
I just got back into this, okay? Give me time (or better yet money) - I'll catch up soon enough. |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6666 Posts |
Posted - 21 Nov 2006 : 04:58:09
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Sorry for the delay in responding.
Noting your comments, I was thinking how cool it would be to have tiefling births in Impiltur somewhat more common than other places in the Realms. Responses to such births would be many and varied. The over-zealous would destroy such a creature immediately while the more 'human' approach would be to raise the child in secret to see how it turns out (evil/good; nature or nurture). There would be other factors as well, such as geography. Who's to say that there isn't an isolated thaedar in the remote reaches of the Uplands where tieflings are very common (and used as dull-witted slave laborers - being descended froma particularly stupid demonic strain) and kept hidden from the authorities. Or several noble families who have an unfortunate taint in their outwardly pure bloodline ("Shar take her, but Aunt Naelintra was a dark one! Her brood looks like they crawled out of the unholy pits of the Abyss!") and produce a tiefling every generation or so - which is not always slain, but sometimes hidden (because its nature might see it grow in power and be used as a 'weapon' for the family) or sent to other lands to be fostered or raised in secret and then sent away to become an adventurer.
I guess I should have titled my article: Impiltur: the Onion-like Kingdom. It's got lots of layers, for you Shrek fans.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
Edited by - George Krashos on 21 Nov 2006 04:58:28 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 21 Nov 2006 : 07:01:53
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| I actually thought something similar about Narfell... And one of the Hooks from volume 6 of the Candlekeep Compendium features a tiefling from that area. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Asgetrion
Master of Realmslore
Finland
1564 Posts |
Posted - 27 Nov 2006 : 00:12:24
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quote:
Originally posted by EvilKnight
George, I did not mean to come on like a priestess of Loviatar there (I am into the SM thing but the consensual kind). I would not have even noticed except I got index entries that were slightly off. I'll make sure notes get in to lead Scribes to the right information.
Of course.. if there's anything else you would like to confess...fingers wicked looking flogger at belt.
EvilKnight
Off-topic here, but do you happen to be a fellow librarian, EvilKnight? |
"What am I doing today? Ask me tomorrow - I can be sure of giving you the right answer then."
-- Askarran of Selgaunt, Master Sage, speaking to a curious merchant, Year of the Helm |
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EvilKnight
Learned Scribe
USA
162 Posts |
Posted - 28 Nov 2006 : 03:03:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Asgetrion
Off-topic here, but do you happen to be a fellow librarian, EvilKnight?
No, but honored to be mistaken for one (or accused).
I do a volunteer DND game for the teen program there and support the local 'Friends of the Library' (BPL). I am a bibliophile of sorts ("Hello, my name is Keith and I am a biblioholic..."). A little over 2000 books (not counting most of my game books).
In the end, I'm an electrical engineer (though not a PE, yet) doing computer based monitor and control systems in the aerospace business to support my habits.
I have taken an interest in preserving my FR/DND collection (need to start a scroll on that topic) and have considered giving it to a library as a special collection later in life. Kind of kick off something like the Merril Collection in Toronto. I have started trying to make an index called the Danali Index (see link in sig below). It is suppose to be somewhat of a concordance covering all the FR sources. It has been put on hold awhile while I try to concentrate on finishing an MS degree. Hopefully, in six months or so I'll be digging back into it. Alaundo is suppose to integrate what we already have into Candlekeep when he gets a chance.
EvilKnight |
Danali Index |
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Eremite
Learned Scribe
Singapore
182 Posts |
Posted - 07 Apr 2007 : 17:54:42
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos (snip) Noting your comments, I was thinking how cool it would be to have tiefling births in Impiltur somewhat more common than other places in the Realms. (snip)
... and a corollary to that would be an increased incidence of warlocks. |
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Impiltur in Dragon#346
