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Rekindin
Acolyte
USA
43 Posts |
 Posted - 19 Mar 2003 : 18:36:48
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List the strengths and weaknesses of Abyss and Fauren ,and tell me who would win.
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Please let me be your good part of your day |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2003 : 19:28:43
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You can't talk about the Lower Planes invading mortal worlds without the Higher Planes defending them. That's why evil hasn't triumphed -- good is still standing against it. If the Abyss could have attacked directly, then it would have already.
Personally, I like the bit in the beginning of The Crystal Shard -- where an Archangel banishes a Balor (the most famous Balor  ) "with a word." Obviously, the Higher Planes are watching over mere mortals. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
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zemd
Master of Realmslore
France
1103 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2003 : 19:39:54
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So why the higher planes don't just destroy abyss if they are so powerful?
IMO, faerun is the neutral, between abyss and heaven. It's also most of time the battle field, where evil and good meet and fight but won't ever fight FOR |
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Echon
Senior Scribe
Denmark
422 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2003 : 19:46:46
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I would like to point out two things:
Firsty, divine beings cannot enter the Prime Material Plane. This applies to Greater Gods through Quai-Powers, including such creatures as Tana'ri/Baatezy Lords and (Greater) Titans. Gods are only capable of sending their avatars. This is the only law of the planes that affect divine beings.
Secondly, the only things that keeps the devils and the demons (Tana'ri and Baatezu) from conquering all the other planes is the Blood War. The demonic races areb by far a lot more powerful than the celestial.
-Echon |
"If others had not been foolish, we should be so."
-William Blake |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2003 : 19:47:11
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| Well, the same goes the other way. Plus, good by definition is constrained by rules. (I.e., Thou Shalt Not Hurt the Innocent by Making Them Collateral Damage!) Evil doesn't have that problem. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2003 : 19:58:40
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The simple answer to the original question is: Faerun would lose. There are not enough Elminsters, Symbuls, Chosen, ect. around to battle the seemingly endless hordes of the Abyss.
Yet I agree with the other scribes that such a thing has been planned often enough, and is still being planned. The devils and demons like nothing better than to wage their Blood War on Torillian soil... or Oerthan, or Athasian etc. Weren't it for the powers of the good aligned planes and their minions, and of course the active opposing of such an event by many inhabitants of Toril, this Blood War would already be waged across the length and breadth of Faerun.
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zemd
Master of Realmslore
France
1103 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2003 : 22:22:21
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And i'd like them to win for once (not that they destroy everyting!). But i'd like for once that evil wins. It could change things a little bit, to see Zhentil Keep, the Harpers, Luskan, Waterdeep, ... united to face the hordes of devils!
I know i'm close to the 'FR War' post... sorry
Ps: Don't think that i became evil, at the end i'd prefer the 'good' to win. Toril ruled by devil wouldn't be very funny to play/read! |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2003 : 23:34:58
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Hmm, what about a truly Evil nation, ruled by a group of demons? Imagine -- an openly demon-infested nation, ruled by demons. It would be too tough for other nations to take on, at least for now, so all they could do would be to defend.
It might make for an interesting thing, like for adventuring parties and their missions. (Go rescue a master Harper, or take out a particular demon.) |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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Echon
Senior Scribe
Denmark
422 Posts |
Posted - 20 Mar 2003 : 12:27:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
Hmm, what about a truly Evil nation, ruled by a group of demons? Imagine -- an openly demon-infested nation, ruled by demons. It would be too tough for other nations to take on, at least for now, so all they could do would be to defend.
It might make for an interesting thing, like for adventuring parties and their missions. (Go rescue a master Harper, or take out a particular demon.)
As soon as just one demon/devil enters the Prime Material Plane, it can gate in others, who in turn are capable of gating yet more of their fiendish kin...and I am sure you can see where that will lead.
This actually happened once, during the Fall of Myth Drannor, but the demons were imprisoned in some mighty spell the name of which I cannot remember. If this had not been done...
-Echon |
"If others had not been foolish, we should be so."
-William Blake |
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Aust Grimshadow
Acolyte
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - 20 Mar 2003 : 13:08:16
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| Im going to have to say the Abyss, if they were battling only Faerun. The lower planes would win by sheer numbers. The amount insanely powerful beings of the lower planes would have no trouble... considering not everyone is as skilled as Drizzt in defending Faerun. |
"Lies engulf the drow in fear and mistrust, refute friendship at the tip of a Lolth blessed sword. The hatred and ambition fostered by these amoral tenets are the doom of my people, a weakness they perceive as strength. The result is a paralyzing existence that the drow call the edge of readiness." -Drizzt Do'Urden |
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Rekindin
Acolyte
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 20 Mar 2003 : 16:45:37
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If Abyss ruled Faruen , then it would just make another great book.(like if abyss engulfed Faruen then they could make a book about Faruen taking back thier homeland and destroy Abyss forever)
(does anybody here have aol) |
Please let me be your good part of your day |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 20 Mar 2003 : 17:11:09
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No, that would be a series. And if they destroyed the Abyss, what would you have to fight against then? D&D would be finished.
And lots of people here have AIM, just look around. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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Rekindin
Acolyte
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 20 Mar 2003 : 17:21:25
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quote:
No, that would be a series. And if they destroyed the Abyss, what would you have to fight against then? D&D would be finished.
But what if somebody incredibity evil(Errtu)created a new Abyss, but it took every evil creature from FR(goblins, orcs ....etc) and prepared for an assault on all three contients on the earth.Now that would be interesting ,no..............
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Please let me be your good part of your day |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 20 Mar 2003 : 17:28:59
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Errtu isn't powerful enough to create an entire plane.  |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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Rekindin
Acolyte
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 20 Mar 2003 : 17:41:22
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| I did'nt say Errtu I said somebody very powerful like Errtu.Who would be powerful enough to create an entire plane ,Bookwyrm? |
Please let me be your good part of your day |
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Rekindin
Acolyte
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 20 Mar 2003 : 17:42:49
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| I did'nt say Errtu, I said somebody very powerful like ,Errtu.Who would be powerful enough to create an entire plane ,Bookwyrm? |
Please let me be your good part of your day |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 20 Mar 2003 : 17:43:35
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| Actually, I don't know of any beings who could do that. I had thought Ao could, but I'm told his power and control is limited to one crystal sphere in particular . . . . |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
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The_Mirt
Acolyte
USA
45 Posts |
Posted - 20 Mar 2003 : 20:28:34
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I have heard Rumors of AO's Master... I have no Idea if he really exists, but if he did, He may be able to create a entire plane... I think AO is only limited to FR. AO could probably change FR as much as he wanted but that probably limits his power.
~Mirt |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 21 Mar 2003 : 02:43:18
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Yes, I know. And the only place he/she/it is referred to (as far as I know) is at the end of the Avatar Trilogy.
Heh. I was just thinking about Ao's role in the Realms, and had an image of him in a suit and tie, sitting behind a desk, managing the other gods.
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Ao: "Cyric? Yes, this is Ao. Oh, I'm fine, just fine. Look, I wanted to talk about your portfolio. I was thinking you're a bit too diversified . . . uh huh. Uh huh. Yes, that's true. Yes, you did win the portfolios fair and square.
"Cyric, I just think it would be better for you and your company to concentrate a little more. No? . . . . Okay, I hate to pull rank, you know that . . . look, I'll let you in on a little secret. Bane's back in town, and he'd like some of this turf back. No, you don't get to start a war again, so don't even think about it.
"Don't talk that way to me! I write your paycheck, remember? Besides, Mystra owes me a favor. Yes, of course I'd let her do that again. She'd do it in a heartbeat.
"You will? Good, I'm glad we see eye to eye on this. I'll send someone over to draw up the transfer papers tomorrow. Yes. Okay. Talk to you later. Goodbye."
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Sorry, just my imagination running away again.  |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
Edited by - Bookwyrm on 22 Mar 2003 04:01:57 |
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Faeurn /vs/ Abyss
