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Paj
Seeker
United Kingdom
56 Posts |
 Posted - 28 Apr 2006 : 09:37:12
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Back in 2e, whith the shared cosmology asect of AD&D, the Guardian of Dead Gods was Anubis from the Egyptian Pantheon. He shed his divinity to become something 'other than a deity' though it doesnt state what. (Myself, I think he's somewhere between Greater Deity and Overgod).
Now that FR has never been connected to the other settings, which God do you think would make a suitable replacement for Anubis?
I was thinking maybe one of the presumed dead deities from Faerun's past.
Any other opinions?
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Arivia
Great Reader
Canada
2965 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2006 : 10:06:49
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| Anubis might still work due to the existance of the Mulhorandi pantheon, though. |
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Paj
Seeker
United Kingdom
56 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2006 : 10:10:43
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Hmm, true. Though I always assumed that the Mulhorandi Pantheon was similar to and based off the Egyptian Pantheon, rather than being the actual Egyptian Pantheon itself, just under a Realms name.
Is there any mention of Anubis, or a god similar in description to Anubis for the Mulhorandi Pantheon? |
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Kaladorm
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1176 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2006 : 10:33:09
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-Best possible (if tenuous) links I can find from faiths and pantheons
Osiris: Judge of the Dead (also nature, harvest)
Thoth: Scribe of the Gods, Keeper of Knowledge
Nepthys: part of description is 'Protector of the Dead', chiefly concerned with wealth though
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2006 : 11:03:22
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| I think I would still vote for Anubis, just because various pantheons in the Old Empires have several members that were once worshipped, when they first showed up in Toril. I could still be that Anubis has an aspect that exists in Toril's astral plane to guard them. Then again, I still like the idea that the planes really did used to be connected . . . |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2006 : 13:28:38
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Anubis, as the "Guardian of the Dead Gods", presents a unique case in terms of relations to the FR cosmology in 3e. As it is... I wouldn't think he'd have much purchase in the Realms nor with the Mulhorandi pantheon because we know Anubis "ascended" (by giving up his divinity) to his unique divine position before the Mulhorandi pantheon had properly established themselves in Faerun.
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Faramicos
Senior Scribe
Denmark
468 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2006 : 14:23:48
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| The reference to divine realms and gods from our "real" world is found in other aspects of the game and i cant see why the case with Anubis is a problem. We got references to both Hades as the realm of the dead and to Olympus (home of the greek gods) as the home of the Titans. The ties to real world mythology are many and understandable as the real world is the only logical and practical source of inspiration when creating a world of fiction. |
"When dragons make war, worlds can only tremble in the shadow of angry wings" |
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TomCosta
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2006 : 17:40:09
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| If the Mulhorandi pantheon came from elsewhere, and we know they still did, there's no reason some variation of Anubis didn't get dragged along as well. For example, Ptah never made it to the mainland of Toril, but was worshipped by Faerunian Spelljammers, and was instrumental in helping the Mulhorandi pantheon make their move. Anubis could have a very similar story. |
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Drakul
Senior Scribe
USA
367 Posts |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2006 : 17:50:51
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I'd keep a different Anubis, so then you keep with the theme of FR's new planes since each deity is seperate and different then thier counterparts. :)
So, there could be a Realms Anubis that is still the guardian.... |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2006 : 18:05:42
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That's kind of what I was thinking with my above post. Still divorced from the actual conception of Anubis as in the core D&D cosmology... an Realmsian interpretation for the Great Tree could be just as applicable... and could have developed (or rather come to be) after the Mulhorandi pantheon gained influence in Realmspace.
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11829 Posts |
Posted - 28 Apr 2006 : 21:41:06
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Hmmm, or mayhaps Anubis did this WHEN the mulhorandi deities were coming for some reason. Or perhaps he did this as a result of the Orcgate wars, when their deities actually began dying? Maybe the orcish deities were trying to steal the "bodies" of the fallen gods in order to empower their own presence in Toril?
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 29 Apr 2006 : 01:05:01
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Well, we know Anubis is an especially unique form of entity... no longer a god, but also, not mortal. Given this special nature, I would assume, at the very least, his relationship with the Astral Plane and the cosmology itself isn't what other gods and mortals have when they touch the Silvery Void.
As a hypothetical, this special relationship with the Astral Plane may been similar in respect to Sigil's position in the planes... having a dual-role in both the Great Wheel and Great Tree -- in other words, like the fact that the City of Doors in the Great Tree is the same Sigil in the Great Wheel, perhaps it is the same for Anubis as well. Anubis may have the ability to represent himself in any cosmology -- or divorce aspects of himself for every cosmology he has access to.
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Edited by - The Sage on 29 Apr 2006 01:06:44 |
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Jamallo Kreen
Master of Realmslore
USA
1537 Posts |
Posted - 29 Apr 2006 : 18:57:46
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quote:
Originally posted by TomCosta
If the Mulhorandi pantheon came from elsewhere, and we know they still did, there's no reason some variation of Anubis didn't get dragged along as well. For example, Ptah never made it to the mainland of Toril, but was worshipped by Faerunian Spelljammers, and was instrumental in helping the Mulhorandi pantheon make their move. Anubis could have a very similar story.
Tom expresses my opinion exactly. If one wants to get Lovecraftian, however, one may posit a being which transcended divinity and became "one with time and space" a la Nyarlathotep and/or Tawil at-Umr. On the other hand, He might well have become some variety of Overpower -- not a creator of gods, however, but one who (as the thread title suggests) tends them in whatever passes for an afterlife among them and thus has divine worshippers. In RW Egypt there was a democratizing of rituals for the dead, and an afterlife which was originally conceived of as the prerogative of the divine Son of Horus (the Pharaoh) came to be regarded as a possibility for anyone who could afford a suitable funeral. It may be that in the game the trend was reversed, and game-Anubis became not the tender of all dead, but ONLY the guardian of dead gods, deriving his power from ... the Powers.
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TomCosta
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
971 Posts |
Posted - 01 May 2006 : 21:45:50
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| To expand on my earlier comments, perhaps Anubis morphed upon the death of some of the Mulhorandi gods during the Orcgate Wars. Far away from their real godly selves, these manifestations of divinity needed something to protect their dead husks. Anubis agrees to do this at the behest of the new Horus-Re, leaving his temporary home on the Realms and taking memory of his stay there to the Astral. |
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Gray Richardson
Master of Realmslore
USA
1291 Posts |
Posted - 02 May 2006 : 03:12:54
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That sounds very plausible--a very simple and elegant explanation.
When Gruumsh slew Re in -1071 DR in the Orcgate wars, it is often referred to as "the first known deicide." While it certainly wasn't the first--we know Malar slew Herne circa -30,00 DR, Lanaxis slew Othea sometime back then as well, and there were probably countless other, less publicized god slayings throughout Faerūn's history--it was certainly the first for the Mulan pantheons.
Following on the heels of Re, many other Mulan deities were also killed in the Orcgate Wars, including Inanna, Girru, Ki, Marduk, Nanna-Sin, Nergal, and Utu. I am sure that a Guardian of Dead Gods would have become necessary at that time. Especially if the god corpses in the Astral could be tapped for their residual energy. The Mulan deities may have needed such a guardian to prevent the Orc gods or Set or Tiamat from using that residual mana against them. Anubis would be the logical choice for such a guardian.
Perhaps Anubis interloped as an ordinary god with the rest of the Mulan pantheons and ascended to guardian circa the Orcgate Wars. Or alternatively, maybe he was already the Guardian of the Dead Gods over on the Great Wheel, and after the Orcgate Wars, the Mulan pantheons entreated him to send over an avatar/aspect to perform the same function in Faerūn's Astral.
And just speculating wildly here... I could imagine a plot where some god or epic level bad guy tried to use the mana in the god corpses in the Astral to ascend to deity or overdeity status. I can conceive of this causing a breach in the Crystal Sphere or the cosmology itself. Such an event might require the intervention of Ao or Ptah or Anubis to repair the rent. Maybe this could provide the kernel of an in-game explanation for why the cosmologies separated in the first place. |
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The Guardian of Dead Gods
