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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
 Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 15:34:27
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| Well, why does the monster have to be mindless? I usually use the monsters the same as the npc's even if the motivations can at times be a little alien. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36797 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 17:33:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
Well, why does the monster have to be mindless? I usually use the monsters the same as the npc's even if the motivations can at times be a little alien.
'Tis a good point, and one I think more people need to realize. There's a habit on the parts of many folk to assume monsters just sit around, waiting for random adventurers to come by and slay them. The 3E monster descriptions that we've gotten to date, without the 2E ecology notes, add to that trend. |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 17:39:46
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
'Tis a good point, and one I think more people need to realize. There's a habit on the parts of many folk to assume monsters just sit around, waiting for random adventurers to come by and slay them. The 3E monster descriptions that we've gotten to date, without the 2E ecology notes, add to that trend.
That's one of the elements I always liked with Dragonlance, that the place of the "monsters" in the world was clearer. I would love a product like the SAGA systems the Bestiary which is one of the best products done by TSR/WotC. |
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Fletcher
Learned Scribe
USA
299 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 19:16:10
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I use a mix of both NPC's and Monsters. I love monsters for the combat, and NPC's generally as people working with/for or directing the monsters. (cult of the dragon and dracolich, Vampires and Necromancer Wizards. Orcish bandits and merchants looking to gain an advantage etc.)
And just often enough i make the villain and mastermind something like a Beholder or Succubus or Treant Druid to break things up and keep them entertained.
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Run faster! The Kobolds are catching up! |
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Mazrim_Taim
Learned Scribe
341 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 22:01:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
Well, why does the monster have to be mindless? I usually use the monsters the same as the npc's even if the motivations can at times be a little alien.
It doesn't at all. I meant I like to show them, not only how to play smartly, but how to play their own classes well. I play my monsters based on their intelligence scores and any other factors that determine behavior.
The last NPC group I tossed at my PC's were a group of Adventurers dedicated to Bane who were trying to use the PC's to recover a cursed piece of a former artifact. The group of NPC's was almost a mirror setup, with a few variations, to my group of PC's. |
And if the PCs DO win their ways through all the liches to Larloch, “he” will almost certainly be just another lich (loaded with explosive spells) set up as a decoy, with dozens of hidden liches waiting to pounce on any surviving PCs who ‘celebrate’ after they take Larloch down. As the REAL Larloch watches (magical scrying) from afar. Myself, as DM, I’d be wondering: “Such a glorious game, so many opportunities laid out before your PCs to devote your time to, and THIS fixation is the best you can come up with? Are you SURE you’re adventurers?” -Ed Greenwood
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Edited by - Mazrim_Taim on 23 Jun 2006 22:01:45 |
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Faramicos
Senior Scribe
Denmark
468 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 00:34:32
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| Let me give a clearer definition of "my" idea of a monster. In my mind, a monster is MINDLESS. If it gains intelligence, it stops being a monster and gains some attributes that makes it possible to roleplay, and thus makes it more a NPC than a monster. Just to be clear on the line bewtween monster and NPC... Dragon=NPC, Goblin=NPC, Zombie=Monster, Umber Hulk=Monster... Follow me? |
"When dragons make war, worlds can only tremble in the shadow of angry wings" |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 04:40:56
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quote:
Faramicos
Let me give a clearer definition of "my" idea of a monster. In my mind, a monster is MINDLESS. If it gains intelligence, it stops being a monster and gains some attributes that makes it possible to roleplay, and thus makes it more a NPC than a monster. Just to be clear on the line bewtween monster and NPC... Dragon=NPC, Goblin=NPC, Zombie=Monster, Umber Hulk=Monster... Follow me?
I get your point. Then do you then think of guards, brigands, etc. of "NPC races" as monsters or npc's. I mean, do you use monster as the common term for all straight ahead threats that the pc's don't interact with? Just curious. |
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Ergdusch
Master of Realmslore
Germany
1720 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 11:40:42
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Question:
Ever happened to any of you that a worked out in every detailed NPC got hacked apart without thinking in mere seconds by your players even though they were suppose to interact with him and get crucial information from?
Somewhat sad - but somewhat amusing as well, seeing them struggle through the rest of the adventure rather aimlessly... |
"Das Gras weht im Wind, wenn der Wind weht." |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36797 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 17:02:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Ergdusch
Question:
Ever happened to any of you that a worked out in every detailed NPC got hacked apart without thinking in mere seconds by your players even though they were suppose to interact with him and get crucial information from?
Somewhat sad - but somewhat amusing as well, seeing them struggle through the rest of the adventure rather aimlessly...
I've never DM'ed, but it's my understanding that PCs often do things like that. 
The easy solution, I would think, would be to simply reuse the details on another NPC, if the plot will allow for it. |
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Faramicos
Senior Scribe
Denmark
468 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jul 2006 : 14:17:08
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There are alot of failed opportunities when i DM due to the fact that the common player sees to many threats where there arent any. I have had plenty NPC's killed before they could play out their intended role. Lots of opportunities to improvise new ways of giving them bits of crucial information.
All straight ahead threats arent monsters... If you can reason with them, talk to them or in another way get some roleplaying out of the situation, i will put them in the NPC category. |
"When dragons make war, worlds can only tremble in the shadow of angry wings" |
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GRYPHON
Senior Scribe
USA
527 Posts |
Posted - 02 Dec 2007 : 19:14:38
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| A mixture of both... |
'Everyone dies...I only choose the time and place for a few.' --Eric Destler |
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Brynweir
Senior Scribe
USA
436 Posts |
Posted - 02 Dec 2007 : 19:35:15
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| As a player, I like a mixture. The more surprises there are, the more interesting it makes it for me. |
Anyone who likes to read something that's really dark and gritty and completely awesome ought to read The Night Angel Trilogy by Brent Weeks. You can check out a little taste at www.BrentWeeks.com I should probably warn you, though, that it is definitely not PG-13 :-D
He also started a new Trilogy with Black Prism, which may even surpass the Night Angel Trilogy in its awesomeness. 
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BARDOBARBAROS
Senior Scribe
Greece
581 Posts |
Posted - 25 Jan 2008 : 07:53:51
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| A mixture |
BARDOBARBAROS DOES NOT KILL.
HE DECAPITATES!!!
"The city changes, but the fools within it remain always the same" (Edwin Odesseiron- Baldur's gate 2) |
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Monsters or NPC´s?
