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Shadovar
Senior Scribe
785 Posts |
 Posted - 02 Aug 2005 : 13:32:52
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A warmest greetings to all the scribes here, alright to be straight, I had been wondering about something and that is where do the faithless souls of the non-humans such as -orcs, elves and dwarves or halflings and dragons- go to after their lifespan on the mortal plane expires. It is known that faithless human souls tend to be put up in the wall of the faithless and those faithful will go to their respective deities realms, but what about those faithless non-human souls? Where do they go to after death especially when they do not not pay homage nor worship any deity associated with their race?
My thanks go to all who reply. Thanks.
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We have fostered trust, recruited loyalty, and gathered the faithful. We have trained thousands. Our legions can cover the land, fill the sky and travel through the darkness. We can hunt any and all that would deny our heritage. Now is our time, now is the time of the Dark Reign(Rain) of the Empire of Shadows.
- High Prince Telemont Tanthul, Lord Shadow
In a speech given to the citizens of Shade Enclave
At the celebration of the Shinantra Battle victory when he revealed that he was THE Lord Shadow of legend. |
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webmanus
Learned Scribe
Sweden
338 Posts |
Posted - 02 Aug 2005 : 14:00:51
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Hi Shadow,
Sorry for asking, but have you done a search for "faithless"? I got three pages of topics mentioning "faithless", and I did not check out the topics. It must be a tedious task going through all those posts ...
Best regards,
Manuel |
Link to my homepage: http://user.tninet.se/~bsu242v/ |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 02 Aug 2005 : 16:10:26
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We had this debate about a month or so ago. All of them go to Kel if they are faithless or false. Most know my feelings on that idiotic piece of text. :)
http://www.candlekeep.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=4402&SearchTerms=faithless |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
Edited by - Kuje on 02 Aug 2005 16:22:24 |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 02 Aug 2005 : 16:21:13
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
We had this debate about a month or so ago. All of them go to Kel if they are faithless or false. Most know my feelings on that idiotic piece of text. :)
I agree with your feelings on that. Though it is much better than where the "faithless" went according to 2E Planescape - So I won't argue too hard that it is a better place than there.
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 02 Aug 2005 : 16:24:00
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quote:
Originally posted by CrennenFaerieBane
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
We had this debate about a month or so ago. All of them go to Kel if they are faithless or false. Most know my feelings on that idiotic piece of text. :)
I agree with your feelings on that. Though it is much better than where the "faithless" went according to 2E Planescape - So I won't argue too hard that it is a better place than there.
C-Fb
Refresh my memory. Where did they go in Planescape....? They usually went to the planes of thier alignment, if I recall right. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 02 Aug 2005 : 16:26:24
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
quote:
Originally posted by CrennenFaerieBane
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
We had this debate about a month or so ago. All of them go to Kel if they are faithless or false. Most know my feelings on that idiotic piece of text. :)
I agree with your feelings on that. Though it is much better than where the "faithless" went according to 2E Planescape - So I won't argue too hard that it is a better place than there.
C-Fb
Refresh my memory. Where did they go in Planescape....? They usually went to the planes of thier alignment, if I recall right.
Well, when planescape went came out with the "Guide to Hell" or whatever that supplement was called, it explained that Asmodeus, who up until we all knew as an Archdevil, was really a Alien Essence who was collecting the souls of all non-believers and was going to use them to undo the Universe.... kind of dumb if you asked me. Even if a good person didn't worship a deity, the deities of good should do more to protect them than just let the Archdevil Alien suck them up. I was fine with most of Planescape but that was just dumb.
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 02 Aug 2005 : 16:34:34
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quote:
Originally posted by CrennenFaerieBane
Well, when planescape went came out with the "Guide to Hell" or whatever that supplement was called, it explained that Asmodeus, who up until we all knew as an Archdevil, was really a Alien Essence who was collecting the souls of all non-believers and was going to use them to undo the Universe.... kind of dumb if you asked me. Even if a good person didn't worship a deity, the deities of good should do more to protect them than just let the Archdevil Alien suck them up. I was fine with most of Planescape but that was just dumb.
C-Fb
Ah, see that sourcebook wasn't for Planescape though. At least it doesn't have the Planescape Lady symbol, etc. It was a generic sourcebook that came out after Planescape ended. :)
But even so, that is also a stupid idea and I'd toss it because that wasn't how it was in Planescape. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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RAKKIR
Seeker
61 Posts |
Posted - 02 Aug 2005 : 18:07:29
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Hello,
I always liked the idea that Asmodeus was secretly caching souls...sort of the ultimate puhisment for those who didn't believe in any diety. But I had to reconcile it somehow with the idea that souls "fade" when they are put into the wall of the faithless. Oviously, the FR cosmology would have to trump the old 2E "Guide to Hell" cosmology. I always secretly wondered however what REALLY happens to the souls in the wall.
Do they really just "fade" and "disperse" like that?
Can a soul really just fade like that into nothingness?
When they "Fade" is that just when they go to Asmodeus?
Or are the two things just so contradictory nobody can make sense of them and they cannot be reconciled?
Of course, some of the other stuff in the Guide to Hell I didn't care for. The idea that the Coutal god created the multiverse. I like the idea that Asmodeus is ancient beyond ancient....and from near the begining of time and can speak the "language primeval" and all that. But....Jazrim (or however it is spelled) being the co-creator? I thought that was sorta weak. Wasn't that portrayed those as a LEGEND however? Like the pages that talked about it were done as a "qoute" from some ancient tome? |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 02 Aug 2005 : 18:46:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
quote:
Originally posted by CrennenFaerieBane
Well, when planescape went came out with the "Guide to Hell" or whatever that supplement was called, it explained that Asmodeus, who up until we all knew as an Archdevil, was really a Alien Essence who was collecting the souls of all non-believers and was going to use them to undo the Universe.... kind of dumb if you asked me. Even if a good person didn't worship a deity, the deities of good should do more to protect them than just let the Archdevil Alien suck them up. I was fine with most of Planescape but that was just dumb.
C-Fb
Ah, see that sourcebook wasn't for Planescape though. At least it doesn't have the Planescape Lady symbol, etc. It was a generic sourcebook that came out after Planescape ended. :)
But even so, that is also a stupid idea and I'd toss it because that wasn't how it was in Planescape.
Yeah, I remembered that it was a Black Supplement rather than a Planescape one... my bad! But at least you knew what I was talking about! :) I like the Big K idea better anyway!
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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Gray Richardson
Master of Realmslore
USA
1291 Posts |
Posted - 02 Aug 2005 : 18:57:56
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It's not that they fade so much as their essence is absorbed by and merges with the Fugue Plane. There is a mold in the mortar of the wall that facilitates this process.
I like to think there is some sort of principle of conservation of "souler" energy at work. The essence of your soul is never lost, exactly, it just merges with something greater. The energy in your soul nourishes the plane of its afterlife or merges with its patron god and nourishes him, etc.
Perhaps this souler essence is even absorbed somehow back into the well of souls and is reincarnated as a newborn creature on the material plane.
This is all just speculation, but I can't help seeing it as something of a metaphysical ecosystem. The Circle of Afterlife, if you will.  |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 02 Aug 2005 : 22:59:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Gray Richardson
The Circle of Afterlife, if you will.
That's horrible. I am amused!  |
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The non-human faithless souls of the realms.
