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Lucius
Seeker
98 Posts |
 Posted - 13 Jun 2005 : 11:53:11
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I'm currently reading Volo's Guide to the Sword Coast. Last night I noticed that the hamlet of Ulgoth's Beard is, by canon, meant to be on the coast, with the city of BG 20 miles away from the coast.
I'm aware that the games are not considered canon, but I was just wondering why you think they were moved? It seems odd to have Ulgoth's Beard to the east rather than west of the Gate, and for such a large mistake such as missplacing a city, to be overlooked. I can't see how either geographical disscrepencies add anything to the game.
I know what you mean when it's said that NWN moves away from the Realms, but I can't help to be dissapointed that my all time favourite game is also wrong in places.I always thought the Baldur's Gate games a=had that distinct Realms feel. :(
P.S. Does anyone know where I can find an official map of the Sword Coast?
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2005 : 12:11:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Lucius
I'm currently reading Volo's Guide to the Sword Coast. Last night I noticed that the hamlet of Ulgoth's Beard is, by canon, meant to be on the coast, with the city of BG 20 miles away from the coast.
I'm aware that the games are not considered canon, but I was just wondering why you think they were moved? It seems odd to have Ulgoth's Beard to the east rather than west of the Gate, and for such a large mistake such as missplacing a city, to be overlooked. I can't see how either geographical disscrepencies add anything to the game.
I know what you mean when it's said that NWN moves away from the Realms, but I can't help to be dissapointed that my all time favourite game is also wrong in places.I always thought the Baldur's Gate games a=had that distinct Realms feel. :(
P.S. Does anyone know where I can find an official map of the Sword Coast?
I wouldnt say the BG series isnt Canon to loudly if I where you
*Casts Protection against Kuje 10' Radius on Lucius*
I thought Ulgoth's Beard beard was on the Coast in BG (I vaguely recall that there are ships docked in the port area
Ed Greenwood has had a bit more to say on Ulgoth's Beard in his thread, he may have covered what your after there |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Enialus Meliamne
Acolyte
Portugal
43 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2005 : 12:43:04
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| Cannot be positive on this mind you, but I think the Ulgoth's Beard location in Baldur's Gate was placed there from the expansion Tales of the Sword Coast? I believe the first part of the game, had placed areas all along the coast, thusly causing them to have to move Ulgoth's Beard elsewhere? IIRC, it also had an arrow or something pointing towards it, suggesting that it may have been set that way in order to facilitate game play only (without them having to rewrite the map code) and thusly in theory, Maybe Ulgoth's Beard was in the proper location :-). You just have to get there in a roundabout game play manner. |
Unashamed RAS fan.
Unashamed fan of THE Drow Elf Ranger.
Reader of any author in FR who entertains or weaves a good yarn.
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Edited by - Enialus Meliamne on 13 Jun 2005 12:44:19 |
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Lucius
Seeker
98 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2005 : 16:04:19
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Bg is canon? I thought the games were not, like NWN?
I've just read that Nashkel is a city, officially, and not the sleepy town it appears to be in the game. Does anyone know of any other differences between the BG games and accepted lore? |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4689 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2005 : 16:41:43
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"Jim Butler gives the official (or canon) answer ;)
Everything that bears the Forgotten Realms logo is considered canon. Where two sources contradict one another, a decision needs to be made as to which one should be followed. For game products, that would mean you'd follow a game product over a novel. Later products have precedence over older products."
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"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2005 : 20:44:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Lucius
I've just read that Nashkel is a city, officially, and not the sleepy town it appears to be in the game. Does anyone know of any other differences between the BG games and accepted lore?
Mind you size alone doesn't necessarily mean the distinction between a hamlet and a city. In medieval Real World, towns could 'purchase' the rights to be a city, no matter what the size of the place might be, or how many inhabitants. While I haven't come across 'city rights' in the Realms, it doesn't mean the system does not exist in one form or other. |
Edited by - Mumadar Ibn Huzal on 13 Jun 2005 20:47:22 |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4689 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2005 : 21:04:26
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I seem to recall that in the UK cities were communities that had a major church.
IAE population in RW does not effect status of a community just the political organization these days. A city can have 5,000 a town 20,000 in population. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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SirUrza
Master of Realmslore
USA
1283 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jun 2005 : 01:25:20
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I look at the games like this...
Bioware, SSI, etc. are the Dungeon Masters and I'm playing in their campaign. The events of the games are as canon as when I'm DMing the game. :)
Until you see something from a game in print as a gaming product, don't consider any of it canon.
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"Evil prevails when good men fail to act."
The original and unapologetic Arilyn, Aribeth, Seoni Fanboy. |
Edited by - SirUrza on 14 Jun 2005 01:25:59 |
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Lucius
Seeker
98 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jun 2005 : 15:41:14
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I've just noticed another odd difference in lore in BG. What's with the kobolds? They seem to be more related to dogs than the lizard like ones I had seen in NWN and previous D&D material. Could someone shine some light on this for me?
P.S. Are there any other differences in lore, appart from the ones discussed above? |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4689 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jun 2005 : 16:30:47
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quote:
Originally posted by Lucius
I've just noticed another odd difference in lore in BG. What's with the kobolds? They seem to be more related to dogs than the lizard like ones I had seen in NWN and previous D&D material. Could someone shine some light on this for me?
Well I was shocked to discover kobolds were dargon kin, I first noticed this in a 3.x product. In the past versions I always had impression of dog-like.
From 2nd "Barely clearing 3 feet in height, kobolds have scaly hides that range from dark, rusty brown to a rusty black. They smell of damp dogs and stagnant water. Their eyes glow like a bright red spark and they have two small horns ranging from tan to white. Because of the kobolds' fondness for wearing raggedy garb of red and orange, their non-prehensile rat-like tails, and their language (which sounds like small dogs yapping), "
From 1st "The hide of kobolds runs from very dark rusty brown to a rusty black. They have no hair. Their eyes are reddish and thier small horns are tan to white."
From BD&D (RC) "These small, evil doglike humanoids"
So take your pick of past lore as posible answer of where dog-like came from.
Of course 3.x offers this "Kobolds are short, reptilian humanoids" |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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khorne
Master of Realmslore
Finland
1073 Posts |
Posted - 28 Jun 2005 : 13:14:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
quote:
Originally posted by Lucius
I've just noticed another odd difference in lore in BG. What's with the kobolds? They seem to be more related to dogs than the lizard like ones I had seen in NWN and previous D&D material. Could someone shine some light on this for me?
Well I was shocked to discover kobolds were dargon kin, I first noticed this in a 3.x product. In the past versions I always had impression of dog-like.
From 2nd "Barely clearing 3 feet in height, kobolds have scaly hides that range from dark, rusty brown to a rusty black. They smell of damp dogs and stagnant water. Their eyes glow like a bright red spark and they have two small horns ranging from tan to white. Because of the kobolds' fondness for wearing raggedy garb of red and orange, their non-prehensile rat-like tails, and their language (which sounds like small dogs yapping), "
From 1st "The hide of kobolds runs from very dark rusty brown to a rusty black. They have no hair. Their eyes are reddish and thier small horns are tan to white."
From BD&D (RC) "These small, evil doglike humanoids"
So take your pick of past lore as posible answer of where dog-like came from.
Of course 3.x offers this "Kobolds are short, reptilian humanoids"
I recently read a Dragon article about kobolds, and its contents certainly raised my respect for them. Beware the blood of Tiamat and the wrath of Kulturmak indeed. |
If I were a ranger, I would pick NDA for my favorite enemy |
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Ulgoth's Beard in BG
