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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
 Posted - 18 May 2005 : 07:33:22
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quote:
Originally posted by Ulrik Wolfsbane
Tell us something of it, Kuje...
Catch me online about it since Big Al is itching to whip me again because I have 3 or 4 scrolls I need to finish for Candlekeep. Those darn dead people are real pains in the nether regions. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
Edited by - Kuje on 18 May 2005 07:34:08 |
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Alaundo
Head Moderator
United Kingdom
5695 Posts |
Posted - 18 May 2005 : 08:48:08
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quote:
Originally posted by kuje31
quote:
Originally posted by Ulrik Wolfsbane
Tell us something of it, Kuje...
Catch me online about it since Big Al is itching to whip me again because I have 3 or 4 scrolls I need to finish for Candlekeep. Those darn dead people are real pains in the nether regions. :)
Well met
A wise move indeed, kuje   |
Alaundo
Candlekeep Forums Head Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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An Introduction to Candlekeep - by Ed Greenwood
The Candlekeep Compendium - Tomes of Realmslore penned by Scribes of Candlekeep
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Murray Leeder
Forgotten Realms Author
Canada
228 Posts |
Posted - 18 May 2005 : 16:54:14
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Oh, you've created more than just "some" interest from this Realms devotee...  .
As I stated earlier, I've been eagerly anticipating a "good" barbarian novel for a very long time, an I'm not just talking only about the Realms here. I've read a few non-Realms/non-WotC barbarian novels over the past year, and I've grown weary of the brutish and imbecilic stereotype that some authors seem to equate with a "barbarian" type.
Well I hope you'll find that my barbarians aren't too brutish, etc. If anything, I've been a little concerned that I've written them as too articlulate, etc. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 19 May 2005 : 02:09:36
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That's good to hear. It suggests that the nature of what it means to be an Uthgardt has been looked at from a different perspective, and I know I'm going to enjoy learning more about them given what you've said here already  .
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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TymoraChosen
Seeker
67 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2005 : 12:44:33
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| Erm ,excuse me. I heard that the Uthgardt are actually descendants of some Netherese, am I right and also are they similar or different to the barbarians found in the Spine of The World? |
May tymora's blessings be heaped on all |
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Ulrik Wolfsbane
Acolyte
New Zealand
27 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2005 : 13:18:58
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| Unless someone beats me too it, I'll answer your question in depth in the morning... There are a few good sources that I'll point you to... Goodnight I'm sleepy. |
Crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women! |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2005 : 14:24:40
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quote:
Originally posted by TymoraChosen
Erm ,excuse me. I heard that the Uthgardt are actually descendants of some Netherese, am I right and also are they similar or different to the barbarians found in the Spine of The World?
The Uthgardt are actually a people of mixed heritage. We know that Northmen fugitives, Netherese refugess, and the odd savage tribe, have all contributed to the barbarian peoples we now know as the Uthgardt.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 20 May 2005 : 14:29:56
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Relevant source material includes The Savage Frontier, The North boxed set, Silver Marches, and Races of Faerun... in particular, the section on the Illuskan humans.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 20 May 2005 14:32:17 |
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khorne
Master of Realmslore
Finland
1073 Posts |
Posted - 11 Sep 2005 : 20:19:14
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| Does anyone have a complete list of all the tribes? |
If I were a ranger, I would pick NDA for my favorite enemy |
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Kajehase
Great Reader
Sweden
2104 Posts |
Posted - 11 Sep 2005 : 22:01:42
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As far as I know, the list of totems for Uthgardt clerics of Uthgar in Faiths & Pantheons, mentions all of the tribes.
Black Lion; Black Raven, Blue Bear (destroyed, the remnants are now calling themselves the Tree Ghost tribe), Elk, Grey Wolf, Great Worm, Griffon, Red Tiger, Sky Pony, and Thunderbeast.
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There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett |
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Ulrik Wolfsbane
Acolyte
New Zealand
27 Posts |
Posted - 12 Sep 2005 : 02:40:45
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Curses, in my usual clumsy fashion I had crafted a fairly long response to your question but then lost it all. Yes all the current tribes are currect but haven't always existed in their current forms. The Tree Ghost are an offshoot of the Blue Bear, who left the tribe after the Blue Bear spirit was 'corrupted' by Malar. This is fairly inexplicable in game terms, as Uthgar is the source of all divine power for the Uthgardt even if it is filtered through his totem animals (status unknown, maybe equivalent of a greater celestial?) so how an aspect of him could be corrupted I'm not sure... Unless his AVATARS are sort of slighly free willed, each in the form of one of his beat totems... That sounds a bit better, if a little off the wall... Opinions?
That brings me to something that's been nagging me for a while... if Uthgar is neutral, what sort of outsiders serve him? There don't seem to ne any powerful neutral outsiders that seem appropriate... Not Invincibles, certainly not Slaadi... Suggestions anyone? And along those lines, are there generic 'petitioner' stats anywhere? PGF gives planar traits for Faerunian petitioners but not the stats themselves).
Back to the Uthgardt, the appearance of a NEW totem (Tree Ghost) is fairly interesting. I understand that on his deathbed Uther Gardolfsson ordered his followers to take the spirits of the creatures he had defeated as their guides... Why did no tribe take Tree Ghost at that time? Or are there more spirits waiting to be revealed or reveal themselves as guardians of the Uthgardt? And how exactly do the spirits 'die'? Do they wither through lack of worship like normal deities? I think somewhere earlier on this thread we discussed the possibility of one of the lost tribes being resurrected... An adventure to recover Morgur's spear from the grimlocks of the Red Pony and re-establish that tribe would be cool, someone should give it a go... I'm keen for collaboration if anyone is interested...
Finally, the best sources for information on the Uthgardt are The Savage Frontier (1st ed), The North boxed set (2nd ed) and the Mintiper's Chapbook series on the FR website (find it in the archives). The 3rd ed FR products contain very little about the Uthgardt and Faiths and Pantheons is particularly disappointing. The Silver Marches has a little.
Hope that helps. |
Crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women! |
Edited by - Ulrik Wolfsbane on 12 Sep 2005 02:43:03 |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 12 Sep 2005 : 02:43:40
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Both the 2e The Savage Frontier tome and The North boxed set also list most of the Uthgardt barbarian tribes.
As I recall, Silver Marches also has some specifics on the various tribes.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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lowtech
Learned Scribe
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 12 Sep 2005 : 04:53:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Ulrik Wolfsbane
Good point, sagacious one. I'm a fairly frequent player of Uthgardt in our FR campaigns, and often struggle against the perception of other players that barbarians must be unceasingly violent, unthinkingly brutal and willfully ignorant. And you're right, this is a pretty strong theme in fantasy literature too. Interestingly, Conan, who is pretty much the archetypal barbarian, is none of these things... if anything, he is the ultimate human, with the strength, cunning and honesty of the beast and the curiosity and the insight of a human. I wonder where it all went wrong? Any ideas?
Much of it likely stems from a backlash against the "noble savage" myth that so many people adhere to. In an attempt to denigrate the former, writers with different opinions often seem to rely on simplistic stereotypes and assumptions. Personally, I'm extremely critical of the "noble savage" idea and archetype, but that dosn't mean "barbarian" cultures are uncomplicated or worthless. That said, most of my thoughts concerning the Uthgardt revolve around the gradual absorption of the barbarian tribes into the Silver Marches and to what degree Uthgardt culture changes the dominant one. |
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khorne
Master of Realmslore
Finland
1073 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2005 : 18:44:21
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quote:
Originally posted by lowtech
quote:
Originally posted by Ulrik Wolfsbane
Good point, sagacious one. I'm a fairly frequent player of Uthgardt in our FR campaigns, and often struggle against the perception of other players that barbarians must be unceasingly violent, unthinkingly brutal and willfully ignorant. And you're right, this is a pretty strong theme in fantasy literature too. Interestingly, Conan, who is pretty much the archetypal barbarian, is none of these things... if anything, he is the ultimate human, with the strength, cunning and honesty of the beast and the curiosity and the insight of a human. I wonder where it all went wrong? Any ideas?
Much of it likely stems from a backlash against the "noble savage" myth that so many people adhere to. In an attempt to denigrate the former, writers with different opinions often seem to rely on simplistic stereotypes and assumptions. Personally, I'm extremely critical of the "noble savage" idea and archetype, but that dosn't mean "barbarian" cultures are uncomplicated or worthless. That said, most of my thoughts concerning the Uthgardt revolve around the gradual absorption of the barbarian tribes into the Silver Marches and to what degree Uthgardt culture changes the dominant one.
The Uthgart are not going to change their lifestyle. That would mean that they would become civilized=soft. Uthgar would never allow that to happen. |
If I were a ranger, I would pick NDA for my favorite enemy |
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Brom Greenstar
Acolyte
Argentina
25 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2005 : 19:02:53
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so far Uthgar has not been able to stop the process, so he is losing worshipers to Auril and Tyr
by the way who is the leader of the thunder beast tribe? gundar brontoskin or someone new? |
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Murray Leeder
Forgotten Realms Author
Canada
228 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2005 : 20:30:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Brom Greenstar
so far Uthgar has not been able to stop the process, so he is losing worshipers to Auril and Tyr
by the way who is the leader of the thunder beast tribe? gundar brontoskin or someone new?
In my short story "The Fallen Lands," the leader of the Thunderbeasts was established as Sungar Wolfkiller. You'll learn some background about what happened to Gundar and how Sungar came to succeed him in Son of Thunder. |
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Brom Greenstar
Acolyte
Argentina
25 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2005 : 21:12:39
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IMC uthgardt folk are in an all out war against malarites, lead by a champion of the Red Tiger tribe (a pc), but Gundar was one of his main suporters
The fallen land appears in Realms of Shadows right?
I'll have to delay my purchase waiting for your book then :) |
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Murray Leeder
Forgotten Realms Author
Canada
228 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2005 : 21:32:27
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| Yes, in Realms of Shadow. Son of Thunder follows its events, but I tried to design the novel to be accessible without having read "The Fallen Lands." |
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Brom Greenstar
Acolyte
Argentina
25 Posts |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 13:43:20
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| I'll try to get it anyway. Right now it would be fantastic if Alaundo or any of the high scribes gives you your rightful place on the chamber of sages |
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Murray Leeder
Forgotten Realms Author
Canada
228 Posts |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 13:51:41
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| I do have a scroll in the Chamber of Sages already, it's just kind of down the list now. I'm sure once the novel comes out I'll get some more posts. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 15:09:09
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And it's one FR novel that I'm definitely waiting to read. After the discussions we've had previously in this scroll, I've been anticipating the "barbarian focus" of this book... especially because of Murray's previous comments about his efforts to give the typical "barbarian stereotype" a more appropriate and accurate form.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Murray Leeder
Forgotten Realms Author
Canada
228 Posts |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 15:46:17
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| Well, I hope not to disappoint. My book is not free of the bronzed barbarian superwarrior mythology, but I aimed to examine its underlying foundation, while depicting a tribe and a few individuals torn between adhering to ancient customs and adapting to a changing world. |
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Brom Greenstar
Acolyte
Argentina
25 Posts |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 20:10:34
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aside from my obvious interest for the book, since it may have details to add to my campaign, it'll be fun to compare your descriptions with mine
will you explore the myths of the uthgardt? (like beorunna's return)or will you focus on the present day problems of the tribe? |
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Murray Leeder
Forgotten Realms Author
Canada
228 Posts |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 20:23:52
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quote:
Originally posted by Brom Greenstar
aside from my obvious interest for the book, since it may have details to add to my campaign, it'll be fun to compare your descriptions with mine
will you explore the myths of the uthgardt? (like beorunna's return)or will you focus on the present day problems of the tribe?
That's a definite "a little from column A, a little from column B." |
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Ulrik Wolfsbane
Acolyte
New Zealand
27 Posts |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 22:44:57
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| Good good great! The Uthgardt are probably the the only human culture with a developed mythology (as opposed to religion/cosmology), however brief it might be. Blending ancient heroes like Uther, the Bey and Morgred with superstition and legend gives the Uthgardt a sense of history and depth the other ethnicities really lack (are the Chondathans are just 'fantasy humans' or have i missed something? My players claim they are like late medieval Italians. I'm not sure if i can see it). I'm looking forward to the novel Murray, what was the release date again? |
Crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women! |
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Ulrik Wolfsbane
Acolyte
New Zealand
27 Posts |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 22:46:37
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| Murray, have you talked to Paul Jaquays at all about his orignal vision of the Uthgradt? Just curious... |
Crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of their women! |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 17 Sep 2005 : 03:30:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Murray Leeder
Well, I hope not to disappoint. My book is not free of the bronzed barbarian superwarrior mythology, but I aimed to examine its underlying foundation, while depicting a tribe and a few individuals torn between adhering to ancient customs and adapting to a changing world.
The examination is the part I'll find most interesting. At least you're willing to give your barbarian characters a more solid grounding, and explore the dynamic that makes the Uthgardt what they are.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Murray Leeder
Forgotten Realms Author
Canada
228 Posts |
Posted - 17 Sep 2005 : 06:55:53
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Son of Thunder comes out in January.
I did exchange some emails with Paul Jaquays, though most of his vision I gleaned from the Savage Frontier accessory.
Glad to be generating interest. |
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Mr. Wilson
Seeker
USA
73 Posts |
Posted - 06 Oct 2005 : 15:16:53
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| Indeed. I'm not one to pick up Fantasy books hot off the presses, but this book I'm simply going to have to get the first time I see it. |
"I've got a plan..."- Dan
"Nothing good has ever come after those four words." - Jesse |
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The Uthgardt
