| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
 Posted - 22 Sep 2004 : 22:25:04
|
Hi citizens,
I'm playing a male sun elf Rog3/Ftr4/Wiz1/Bladesinger4 in a local campaign here in Victoria (currently going through CotSQ, having passed my DMing duties over to a willing player - yes!!  )
As per PGtoF, I chose an Elf region with the Sun Elf recommended subrace. I took Silverymoon for the exquisite Mind Over Body regional feat, which now kicks ass in 3.5 (I have 18 Int so this gave me +4 hit point and +1 insight bonus to AC -- more hp later if I ever take a metamagic feat)
I was in a hurry during character creation, so I based my decision on feat selection. Now that I've played my first game with this character, it's time to adjust the feats/skills and build a character background.
However, trying to look for elf-related info for Silverymoon in FRCS and Silver Marches, I came up with a big nothing. Sure I was skimming for the word "elf" or "elven" in there, but still...
Does anybody have background info on elves living in Silverymoon? (the demographics found in Silver Marches indicate that all elf breeds exist within the city, but PGtoF has Moon and Sun Elf as recommended subrace, suggesting that the other subraces are not as numerous and established).
|
|
|
Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 24 Sep 2004 : 05:21:55
|
Gold and moon elves would of course dominate the elven population. Wild and green elves would hardly like it, drow aren't normally allowed in, and sea elves simply can't do it.
There are some elven noble houses in the city, but that's about all I can think of at the moment. I'll try to find some other stuff, but I'm sure someone else will come in with more than I could scrap up sooner than I can get it . . . . |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
 |
|
|
Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
Posted - 24 Sep 2004 : 09:38:45
|
quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
There are some elven noble houses in the city, but that's about all I can think of at the moment.
I have all 3E/3.5 books and many of the 2nd edition ones... if you remember where you read this I would very much appreciate this. I am desperately trying to flesh out my Silverean sun elf (Rog3/Ftr4/Wiz1/Bladesinger4)
Thank you! |
|
|
|
Wood Elf Ranger
Senior Scribe
USA
627 Posts |
Posted - 24 Sep 2004 : 16:45:55
|
Have you checked in the Silver Marches? I can't remember anything specific but I think it said pretty much what bookwyrm stated about there being a few noble houses of elves.
Personally I would imagine the elven families to be of the higher class since they have such long lives they have more time to accumulate wealth and status. There could be a few lone mages, or even ones taking apprentices, with their own towers and such. Also I would think there would be quite a few in the Spellguard. These are just my ideas though nothing official. Hope it helps  |
~Lee N.
"Breaktime yes?!.. Yes?.. Maybe?.. Noo, baaack to work.." -Grovel the Goblin from NWN: HotU |
|
|
|
Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 24 Sep 2004 : 17:58:24
|
Maybe in the four part article called My Slice of Silverymoon that was written by Ed as a web article, that is on the WOTC web site?
Or maybe in the info Ed gave us about Silverymoon that is here on Candlekeep in his novel thread. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
|
|
|
Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
Posted - 25 Sep 2004 : 00:52:50
|
Thanks Kuje and Wood Elf!
I will look these up tonight! 
PDK |
|
|
|
Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 25 Sep 2004 : 06:00:38
|
quote:
Originally posted by Purple Dragon Knight
Thanks Kuje and Wood Elf!
I will look these up tonight!
PDK
If you have a hard time finding the articles on the WOTC site, they are linked in my FR FAQ on the FR WOTC boards. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
|
|
|
Thieran
Learned Scribe
Germany
293 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 16:48:17
|
| On a related issue, do you think it is reasonable that some branch of the Nharimlur family (as in Ederan, Elénaril, Amaara and Lynnasha) still exists in Silverymoon in 1372, and do you know whether they were sun or moon elves? There seems to be no information on that anywhere, though I have deduced that they probably were sun elves from the fact that after he had miscast a find familiar spell in 705, High Mage "Ederan Nharimlur now has light gold fur covering his skin and the green eyes of a cat" (hence his nickname "Catseyes"). What do you think? I'd be grateful for your opinions. |
|
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36803 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 18:44:28
|
quote:
Originally posted by Thieran
On a related issue, do you think it is reasonable that some branch of the Nharimlur family (as in Ederan, Elénaril, Amaara and Lynnasha) still exists in Silverymoon in 1372, and do you know whether they were sun or moon elves? There seems to be no information on that anywhere, though I have deduced that they probably were sun elves from the fact that after he had miscast a find familiar spell in 705, High Mage "Ederan Nharimlur now has light gold fur covering his skin and the green eyes of a cat" (hence his nickname "Catseyes"). What do you think? I'd be grateful for your opinions.
I'm inclined to think the gold fur didn't have anything to do with his skin color -- it says it mixed his form with that of a summoned cat.
But... In the abscence of official lore, anything you make up works. If nothing says it's wrong, then it can't be wrong.
I'm more inclined to think him a moon elf, since moon elves are more known for getting along with non-elves than gold elves are. Of course, not all elves fall into that particular stereotype.
Either way, it's not unreasonable to assume that at least one elf now walking the streets of Silverymoon is a descendant of his. This descendant doesn't necessarily have to be a native, either. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
|
|
|
Thieran
Learned Scribe
Germany
293 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 19:12:47
|
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I'm inclined to think the gold fur didn't have anything to do with his skin color -- it says it mixed his form with that of a summoned cat.
Well, that's what I first thought as well, but ultimately, it's only the fur of which we can be sure that it has something to do with the cat. The golden colour can but doesn't have to come from the cat, right? My thinking is: sun elf + cat = sun elf with sun-elf-coloured fur. Of course it could be "moon elf + cat = moon elf with cat-coloured fur" as well, but I am inclined to think that when the writer of the sourcebook put down the colour of the fur, it is slightly more plausible that he had the elf's, not the cat's colour in mind.
But otherwise, I fully agree with your thoughts. Thanks! |
Edited by - Thieran on 18 Apr 2011 19:58:19 |
|
|
|
Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
|
|
Thieran
Learned Scribe
Germany
293 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 20:06:00
|
quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
Possible, but it might just as easily have been the golden-hued fur of a marmalade tabby or a light Abbysinian color.
Yes, I had indicated as much in my post - apologies if that was unclear -, but I wondered whether there is a hint in the Realmslore fragment which I quoted above that could help us to decide whether one alternative is a bit more plausible than the other. I wondered whether from a sourcebook writer's point of view, you would be inclined to think of the elf's colour, rather than the cat's, when putting down that information. I know it's never going to be unambiguous, but maybe slightly in favour of the one rather than the other alternative? That's my question. |
|
|
|
Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 20:18:23
|
| Probably the cat's. The elf's hair could have originally been black, red, blonde or brown, if he was a gold elf, or black, blue, gray, or red if a Moon elf. None of those really say "gold" fur to me. (Except the blonde, but since it doesn't specify his race, it's a one in six chance of being the original hair color. The cat seems more likely- orange or marmalade tabby is very common.) |
The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.
"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491
"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs
Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469
My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188
Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u |
|
|
|
Thieran
Learned Scribe
Germany
293 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 20:26:15
|
Thanks!
Interesting that you equate fur colour with hair colour, I had skin colour (gold elf - gold fur) in mind - thanks, I hadn't thought about it that way! I guess it comes down to which equivalence the sourcebook author had in mind; if it was fur colour = hair colour, which might actually be more likely, then I would agree with you.
Otherwise, I would like to point out that we don't know whether orange or marmalade tabby is very common with Faerűnian cats ;) |
|
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36803 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 20:30:11
|
| Keep in mind the skin color of many furred animals doesn't have much to do with the color of their fur. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
|
|
|
Thieran
Learned Scribe
Germany
293 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 20:37:13
|
Another good point!
On the other hand (I'm just trying to think this through properly, never doubt that you are helping me a lot!), I wonder how present that would have been in the author's mind when describing a magical effect. But I am starting to think that - unfortunately - Ederan Nharimlur's skin colour cannot be deduced from that sentence... I might as well try to find out who wrote that bit and ask the author her-/himself. |
|
|
|
Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 18 Apr 2011 : 21:26:58
|
It's a good question and I'm not really sure of the answer. My thinking is that Amaara wouldn't have had the middle name of "goldentresses", which she does according to the Grand History, if she was a sun elf. I say this because usually sun elves tend to have more of the blonde hair while moon elves rarely had blonde hair, according to Cormanthyr.
That said.... I see no reason why a branch of the family couldn't have had sun elven children, or even had a branch of the family that was sun elves. So, that's my DM's call. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
|
|
|
The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31772 Posts |
Posted - 19 Apr 2011 : 01:11:30
|
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Thieran
On a related issue, do you think it is reasonable that some branch of the Nharimlur family (as in Ederan, Elénaril, Amaara and Lynnasha) still exists in Silverymoon in 1372, and do you know whether they were sun or moon elves? There seems to be no information on that anywhere, though I have deduced that they probably were sun elves from the fact that after he had miscast a find familiar spell in 705, High Mage "Ederan Nharimlur now has light gold fur covering his skin and the green eyes of a cat" (hence his nickname "Catseyes"). What do you think? I'd be grateful for your opinions.
I'm inclined to think the gold fur didn't have anything to do with his skin color -- it says it mixed his form with that of a summoned cat.
But... In the abscence of official lore, anything you make up works. If nothing says it's wrong, then it can't be wrong.
I'm more inclined to think him a moon elf, since moon elves are more known for getting along with non-elves than gold elves are. Of course, not all elves fall into that particular stereotype.
Either way, it's not unreasonable to assume that at least one elf now walking the streets of Silverymoon is a descendant of his. This descendant doesn't necessarily have to be a native, either.
I'd say Wooly has the right of it.
Whatever really works for the story of your campaign would be appropriate, given the absence of definitive lore on the subject.
The only thing I would stress, is not to focus on the "fur"/"skin colour" relation. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
|
|
|
The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31772 Posts |
Posted - 19 Apr 2011 : 01:12:28
|
quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
It's a good question and I'm not really sure of the answer. My thinking is that Amaara wouldn't have had the middle name of "goldentresses", which she does according to the Grand History, if she was a sun elf. I say this because usually sun elves tend to have more of the blonde hair while moon elves rarely had blonde hair, according to Cormanthyr.
That said.... I see no reason why a branch of the family couldn't have had sun elven children, or even had a branch of the family that was sun elves. So, that's my DM's call. :)
Agreed.
And the sun-elf option adds some intriguing role-playing opportunities for the family anyway, so I'd say go for it!  |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
|
|
|
Thieran
Learned Scribe
Germany
293 Posts |
Posted - 19 Apr 2011 : 17:25:20
|
Many thanks to all of you!
And here is Ed's interesting reply:
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
Hi again, all.
Ed is deep in writing the next Elminster novel right now, but gave me some "quickie" replies to pass on (he'll elaborate on them when he has time), so as not to keep scribes waiting.
Thieran, Ed says you're very welcome, and that Nharimlur was a moon elf. Neither he nor the cat had golden or near-golden hair or fur, the spell mishap did that. Most Silvaeren elves are moon elves, though there are at least twenty sun elf families resident in Silverymoon (most of them get along very well with non-elves and other sorts of elves, or they wouldn't reside in the Gem of the North, though certain individuals can be as haughty as sun elves are "all said to be" by many folk in the wider Realms).
[...]
I guess that doesn't exclude the possibility that one of the mentioned sun elf families is a branch of the Nharimlurs, or that there are sun elf children of that family, as some of you have suggested. |
Edited by - Thieran on 19 Apr 2011 17:30:37 |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
|
|
Elves in Silverymoon
