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Sourcemaster2
Senior Scribe
USA
361 Posts |
 Posted - 15 Jul 2004 : 03:28:50
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If a wizard has levels of bard or sorcerer, can he prepare the spells known in those classes without a spellbook? Obviosly, bardic spells that can't be cast by wizards wouldn't count, but I what about those that can?
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But what have all the passing years/Done, but breed new angers, fears?/Show me now an equal worth/To innocence I earned at birth. |
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brjr2001
Learned Scribe
106 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jul 2004 : 04:25:01
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| i dunno but then again i dun like mages sorry |
on second thought lets not go to candlekeep it is a silly place |
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Karesch
Learned Scribe
Canada
199 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jul 2004 : 06:55:50
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I believe the way it works is that, if you cast Arcane spells, you invariably have a spellbook. Even though bards and sorcerers do not need to prepare their spells beforehand, they still maintain a spellbook full of all the spells they know as a reference material. So if you dual-classed as a Wizard/sorcerer say, then you would maintain a single spellbook with all spells you know in it, and as such both classes would have access to the same spells, barring of course those spells that are class specific, in which case, they would still be in the book, however they would not be prepareable by any class other than that which they are specific to.
I could be mistaken in some way, but to the best of my knowledge, that is how it works.
K |
Knowledge is power... power corrupts... knowledge corrupts? hmm...
Death is only frightening to those who haven't died yet... |
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Sourcemaster2
Senior Scribe
USA
361 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jul 2004 : 07:35:16
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| Since sorcerers and bards only learn spells as they gain new levels, I don't believe that they could just use spells from their wizardly spellbook. That's how the sorcerer/wizard balance works, with sorcerers knowing far fewer spells but not needing a spellbook and having more spells per day. Spontaneous casters are intuitive, not methodical; they don't need study, exactly, just time/experience to learn new spells. On the other hand, I think (not sure) that a sorcerer/wizard could use the spells he knows as a sorcerer to effectively study as a wizard (a sorcerer knows magic missle, is also a wizard, and so can memorize magic missle as a wizard without a spellbook) Is that correct? |
But what have all the passing years/Done, but breed new angers, fears?/Show me now an equal worth/To innocence I earned at birth. |
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Karesch
Learned Scribe
Canada
199 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jul 2004 : 07:39:26
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Perhaps your right, I'm unsure. I'm not much for playing with sorcerer's or bards, so I can't honestly say I know a whole lot about the mechanics of the class, I was going mostly based on supposition, not really on a basis of alot of reading into the subject. You could very well be right however sourcemaster2.
K |
Knowledge is power... power corrupts... knowledge corrupts? hmm...
Death is only frightening to those who haven't died yet... |
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Thelonius
Senior Scribe
Spain
730 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jul 2004 : 09:26:02
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| The book is necessary to cast arcane spells. Remember that the concentration of casting a spell ends with the spell just casted completely erased from the memory of the caster, and is necessary to study it again to be able to cast it. So the book is completely necessary cause then when all the spells would be casted, it would be impossible to cast the spells twice. |
"If you are to truly understand, then you will need the contrast, not adherence to a single ideal." - Kreia
"I THINK I JUST HAD ANOTHER NEAR-RINCEWIND EXPERIENCE"- Discworld's Death frustrated after Rincewind scapes his grasp... again.
"I am death, come for thee" - Nimbul, from Baldur's Gate I just before being badly spanked
Sapientia sola libertas est |
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Darkheyr
Learned Scribe
264 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jul 2004 : 09:43:11
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Its quite simple actually.
Bards and Sorcerers do not have spell books. Neither do any other arcane casters unless its description specifically mentions one.
All the same, you have to keep the spell lists of the individual classes totally seperate from each other - unless of course you belong to two classes using a spell book; there you can obviously prepare spells as either class, assuming its on the class spell list. |
silm.pw - A Neverwinter Nights Persistent World |
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Sourcemaster2
Senior Scribe
USA
361 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jul 2004 : 09:56:46
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| Gion, sorcerers and bards always know their spells; their casting relies on a supply of magical strength, not memorizing spells over and over again. Only wizards (of the core classes) have a spellbook. |
But what have all the passing years/Done, but breed new angers, fears?/Show me now an equal worth/To innocence I earned at birth. |
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Sarta
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jul 2004 : 13:46:15
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True, even the arcane spell preparation feat does not require the sorcerer or bard to have a spellbook.
Darkheyr has the right answer in terms of multi-classed spell-casters. The spell lists are kept seperate and are both prepared in the manner they would for a single-classed character of the two respective classes. A player who prepares well for this would take advantages of the sorcerer class for spells which would be useful if cast repeatedly (like detect magic) and make use of his wizard levels for spells which benefit from meta-magics and which have very situational use (like magic mouth).
A sorcerer 3/wizard 4 would require the 8 hours of rest and then would prepare his sorcerer spells as a sorcerer (from memory) and his wizard spells as a wizard (from his wizard spellbook). However, in terms of his familiar, it would have the benefits of him being a 7th level spellcaster.
Sarta |
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Karesch
Learned Scribe
Canada
199 Posts |
Posted - 15 Jul 2004 : 17:18:32
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ok, even I was getting a bit confused there for a few moments. Thank you for laying it out plainly Sarta. I believe I now grasp the matter completely.
K |
Knowledge is power... power corrupts... knowledge corrupts? hmm...
Death is only frightening to those who haven't died yet... |
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Darkheyr
Learned Scribe
264 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2004 : 06:13:31
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| I also believe the caster levels stack for spells accessible by both classes... But I am really uncertain on that one, and I don't have access to my books right now. |
silm.pw - A Neverwinter Nights Persistent World |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2004 : 07:55:58
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Let me see if I can clear this up.
A wizard/sorcerer would have two sets of spells. Those in his spellbook (wizard) and those in his soul (sorcerer). These spells do not stack. For determining caster level, you use only the levels in the class it belongs to. A Wiz4/Sor1 with burning hands in both spell lists could prepare it (using a first-level wizard spell slot) for four dice of damage. Or, he could cast it spontaneously (as a sorcerer) for a single dice of damage.
The only point in the classes that stacks with its counterpart is -- as was mentioned -- the familiar. In the above example, the multiclassed mage would not have two familiars; he would have just one, but it would count as a familiar of a master with five levels. Or as I prefer, the familiar itself has five levels of "familiar." |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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Darkheyr
Learned Scribe
264 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2004 : 08:49:27
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| Hmmm. I wonder where I got the caster level part from... Oh well, thank ye Wyrm of the Book :) |
silm.pw - A Neverwinter Nights Persistent World |
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Multiclassed Mages
