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Senbar Flay
Learned Scribe
185 Posts |
 Posted - 15 May 2004 : 16:59:25
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I was looking at some other posts discussing Ao. But what I want to know is does he have a superior is he just another pawn and if so who is Ao's superior. Any info would be appreciated.
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Imagination is more important than knowledge for knowledge is limited imagination encircles the world.- Albert Einstein |
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Narad Bladesinger
Learned Scribe
Finland
170 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2004 : 17:16:56
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DM is my quess  |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2004 : 22:18:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Senbar Flay
I was looking at some other posts discussing Ao. But what I want to know is does he have a superior is he just another pawn and if so who is Ao's superior. Any info would be appreciated.
A Luminous Being. That's all we know, according to Faiths & Avatars. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2004 : 23:07:36
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quote:
Originally posted by kuje31
A Luminous Being. That's all we know, according to Faiths & Avatars.
Describes most DMs I've known, at least in their minds. |
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Purple Dragon Knight
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1796 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2004 : 23:17:35
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I think it's the DM or Ed Greenwood...  |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 05:48:33
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"Luminous beings are we . . . ." 
Seriously, I can't find that entry in F&A. So, the only mention of Ao's superior that I know of is that last page in the book Waterdeep.
Which, by the way, I'd love for Jack to find out about. He'd have a field day with that one . . . . |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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Sarta
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 06:25:23
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Fortunately, Jack's Catholic, so the idea of praying to a lesser entity rather than an overgod won't be completely foreign (St. Jude for example). But I can imagine his frustration when he realizes many people know of Ao, but still don't see the need to worship him/her/it.
Sarta |
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Arivia
Great Reader
Canada
2965 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 06:43:05
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| I have one in my campaigns. She doesn't see that much play in the Realms-she has more influence and is more important in Aslari. I'm not going to say anymore, however. |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 07:08:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
"Luminous beings are we . . . ."
Seriously, I can't find that entry in F&A. So, the only mention of Ao's superior that I know of is that last page in the book Waterdeep.
Page 30, right next to the start of Auril's write up. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 07:27:03
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And from that, I can tell that either you aren't Catholic, or you're lapsed.
That's not meant as an insult of any sort, of course. I'm just pointing out one of the largest misconceptions about Roman Catholics. Most people think that "prayer" and "worship" are the same thing. They aren't -- look 'em up. A prayer is just an entreaty, a request. Catholics only worship God; not the saints, not Mary. Certainly not Saint Jude.
Also, Catholism (or any part of Christianity, Judaism, or Islam) isn't about worshiping God because He's the biggest guy on the block. So Jack won't give a hoot that most people don't worship Ao. In fact, he really won't give any more of a hoot about Ao than he would about any of the other Faerunian powers.
No, what I was referring to was that with the idea of a greater power than the gods, Jack will have an advantage in any theological debate he has with a Realmsian priest. With the idea of a greater power than Ao, he'd have even greater ammunition.
Bottom line is, Jack doesn't know why God's set things up differently here, but he knows that God's the God of all existance . . . or He's not God at all.
This, then, opens the way for the life-on-other-worlds problem of a few centuries ago, where people of the Middle Ages concluded that God must not (note that that was not "could not have") created life on other worlds. Why? Logistics, as one expert put it recently. After all, no one could imagine communicating with other worlds, much less travelling to them. So unless Jesus let Himself be crucified on every inhabited world, then surely God wouldn't create people who couldn't ever be saved, right?
So not only is Jack going to see it as his scientific duty to do what he can to make two-way travel possible, he'll also feel a religious duty as well. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 07:32:40
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quote:
Originally posted by kuje31
quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
"Luminous beings are we . . . ."
Seriously, I can't find that entry in F&A. So, the only mention of Ao's superior that I know of is that last page in the book Waterdeep.
Page 30, right next to the start of Auril's write up.
No, I don't see anything there. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 08:13:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
No, I don't see anything there.
Are you looking at Faiths & Avatars or Faiths & Pantheons? Again page 30 in Faiths & Avatars under AO, left side of the page, right before the Auril write up starts on the same page.
Portfolio: Creation of deities, maintenance of cosmic balance.
Aliases: None
Domain Name: Unknown (if he even has one)
Superior: A luminous being
Symbol: None
Wor Align: Any |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
Edited by - Kuje on 16 May 2004 08:14:32 |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 09:03:29
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Ah. Silly me, I was looking at the text.  |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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The Cardinal
Senior Scribe
Canada
647 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 09:25:52
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| Ah, AO, now there is a being worthy of our worship. But at anyrate, on the subject of AO's superior... a GM... yep.... has to be... ... Or ourselves |
It has to be Certain, the Gods Hate Me. For whatever irrevokable Fate, I have been made the walking Joke. Either that, or Beshaba is overlyfond Of Me.
-Unknown |
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Arion Elenim
Senior Scribe
933 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 16:50:44
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Let's not forget the end of the Avatar Trilogy....in which Ao genuflects before SOME sort of higher being...
I believe he is asked whether or not he has taken care of the little "issue" that is Toril... |
My latest Realms-based short story, about a bard, a paladin of Lathander and the letter of the law, Debts Repaid. It takes place before the "shattering" and gives the bard Arion a last gasp before he plunges into the present.http://candlekeep.com/campaign/logs/log-debts.htm |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 17:26:05
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Yes, that was what I was refering to earlier.
I don't have the book myself, it being one of those I borrowed from my brother. However, I believe it involved a voice asking how Ao's "cosmos" was faring. To which Ao responded "The Realms are now secure." Or something to that effect. It's been several years since I read it, anyway. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 17:29:52
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
I don't have the book myself, it being one of those I borrowed from my brother. However, I believe it involved a voice asking how Ao's "cosmos" was faring. To which Ao responded "The Realms are now secure." Or something to that effect. It's been several years since I read it, anyway.
Without getting up and retrieving my copy, which would cut down on my sitting in front of the computer time, that is the gist of the final passages within the novel. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 18:15:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
"Luminous beings are we . . . ."
Lurue's Horn, you're right! Ao's superior is none other than Yoda!  |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 18:30:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Lurue's Horn, you're right! Ao's superior is none other than Yoda!
LOL! I totally missed that reference.
Ao reporting to Yoda which means in the end....George Lucas is in charge of the Realms?  |
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Sarelle
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
508 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 19:56:32
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quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Lurue's Horn, you're right! Ao's superior is none other than Yoda!
LOL! I totally missed that reference.
Ao reporting to Yoda which means in the end....George Lucas is in charge of the Realms?
No, no, no! You've got it all wrong.
George is YODA's puppet! How else would he have been given the audacious battle scene in Attack of the Clones!? ...
Okay. I'll stop.  |
Chair of the The Rightful Return of Monster Deities to FR Society (RRMDFRS)
My character, drawn by Liodain: Sarelle / Sarelle (smaller) |
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Sarta
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 20:35:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
And from that, I can tell that either you aren't Catholic, or you're lapsed.
That's not meant as an insult of any sort, of course. I'm just pointing out one of the largest misconceptions about Roman Catholics. Most people think that "prayer" and "worship" are the same thing. They aren't -- look 'em up. A prayer is just an entreaty, a request. Catholics only worship God; not the saints, not Mary. Certainly not Saint Jude.
Actually, if you read the exact phrasing that I used you would realize that I didn't mix up the use of prayer and worship. My choice of words was very intentional.
To get more personal, let me explain my religious background: I was brought up Catholic, was an altar boy for 7 years, trained altar boys for 3 years, worked in the rectory of my church as a secretary for 2 years, taught CCD, and taught summer bible school. I double majored in Phil of Religion and English Lit, considered getting a masters in feminist theology, and very seriously considered becoming a Jesuit.
I am a "lapsed" Catholic for political reasons, but feel that I'm pretty in tune with both the current dogma and the Baltimore catechism that is unfortunately no longer in use.
My original point was merely that many other sects of christianity find the idea of praying to any lesser being to be completely pointless and blasphemous.
Sarta
p.s. It is hard to read tone into things posted over a message board. I enjoy discussing this stuff. This was not meant to be an attack, but a friendly response. If others find this to be offensive or off-topic, I'll also happily stop or edit this out. |
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Sarta
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2004 : 20:37:41
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More in topic: I believe that the knowledge of Ao is not very widespread amongst mortals. The existence of a superior to Ao is probably not known at all by mortals and very probably not known by many deities.
Sarta |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 17 May 2004 : 07:40:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Sarta
My original point was merely that many other sects of christianity find the idea of praying to any lesser being to be completely pointless and blasphemous.
[...] It is hard to read tone into things posted over a message board. I enjoy discussing this stuff. This was not meant to be an attack, but a friendly response. If others find this to be offensive or off-topic, I'll also happily stop or edit this out.
Don't worry -- I didn't read any hostility into that.
My point was more to the nature that worshiping "lesser" deities wasn't the issue. It's paganism either way. The way Jack (and I) would see it is that none of them are God, so they aren't worthy of worship. (Think Socrates.)
Oh, and another word objection: you can't have blasphemy unless you're doing opposition teaching. So, teaching that Satan is the misunderstood one would be blasphemy, but even pagans going about their own pre-Christian business wouldn't be. I doubt Jack will ever think that about the Faerunians. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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Sarta
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 18 May 2004 : 02:23:05
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Perhaps I should have said Idolatrous.
Sarta |
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Urlithani
Acolyte
USA
19 Posts |
Posted - 22 May 2004 : 23:43:57
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quote:
Ao reporting to Yoda which means in the end....George Lucas is in charge of the Realms?
Oh no! Forgotten Realms: Special Edition!
I can see it now...it will be remade so the bad guys will look even badder: Shar, now with Shadow Weave! Bane, reborn and just as powerful as before! Talos, with lightning bolt hurling action!
Oh yes, and Drizzt attacks Artemis first(You know, Han vs. Greedo editing style). |
Biggest. Selûne. Fanboy. Ever! :)
"The only reward of Virtue is Virtue." -Ralph Waldo Emerson
"The time is always right to do what is right. "
- Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 23 May 2004 : 01:08:46
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quote:
Originally posted by Urlithani
Oh no! Forgotten Realms: Special Edition!
Oh yes, and Drizzt attacks Artemis first(You know, Han vs. Greedo editing style).
There's a Jar Jar joke just itching to get out here. But, I will be polite. |
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Ao's Superior
