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Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

The other guy abruptly stopped coming here, though, so it never got very far.

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Originally posted by shades of eternity

I'm going to subvert the idea.

There is the Great Gnome Conspiracy.

They are sneakier than the Harpers.

They are sneakier than the Twisted Rune.

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Originally posted by shades of eternity

If I had better skills, I'd do a revisionist history where it shows where the Gnomes are pulling the string.

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Originally posted by shades of eternity

This is exactly why making the Gnomes the forgotten folk rubs me the wrong way.
So much potential that isn't being used.

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Originally posted by shades of eternity

I really like the idea you presented, but got a feeling it will run head long into the "no guns" in the forgotten realms dogma they've been pushing since 5e.

I actually did a bit of stewing on gnomes a while back and here it is:

http://breadthofpopsanity.blogspot.com/2016/08/thoughts-about-gnomes.html

This is exactly why making the Gnomes the forgotten folk rubs me the wrong way.

So much potential that isn't being used.

edit:

Netheril fell mainly because the Phaerimm are actually a Gnomish contraction.

They built giant sock puppets and waited for the Netherese to overreact. :p

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Originally posted by Wrigley


The idea of golem-like mech sounds fun as long as there is no army of them.

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Originally posted by shades of eternity

Well Gnomes were supposed to be masters of illusions in earlier editions.

It's kinda a pity they have their own gods, because I could see an entire belief system for Gnomes based on Leira on that alone.

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Originally posted by BadLuckBugbear

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Originally posted by shades of eternity

Well Gnomes were supposed to be masters of illusions in earlier editions.

It's kinda a pity they have their own gods, because I could see an entire belief system for Gnomes based on Leira on that alone.

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There could easily be gnomes that do worship Leira.
It's a big world, and even after all the filling in done by designers since 1987, I'm sure there's room for another group of gnomes.

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Originally posted by FR0 Cyclopedia of the Realms, p.46

The Forgotten Folk
The Gnomes are called the Forgotten Folk of the Forgotten Realms, for despite the fact they seem an everyday sight in major cities, and have good-sized communities of their own, they seem unbothered by the world and similarly only rarely become involved with it.

Gnomes are among the most common-sense beings in a world filled with all manner of magical things. Their natural tendency towards illusion-craft, instead of making them more crafty, has given them a wisdom to look beyond the fancy trappings of speech and appearance to find out what is really there.

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Originally posted by Ed Greenwood Presents Elminster's Forgotten Realms, p.11

The Quiet Folk
Urban-dwelling gnomes in the Realms usually seek to be the quiet collectors and refiners of good ideas from all cultures, keep low profiles, and make good livings trading useful items.

This "quietly, quietly" manner has led gnomes to being the truly forgotten folk of the Realms, but also tends to make almost everyone view them as harmless, helpful, and friendly.

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I’m not a fan of tinker gnomes in the Realms except as VERY rare, comic-relief individuals (or families). The folk of Lantan and other Gond-worshippers fill the necessary ‘Professor Branestawm/Rube Goldberg’ mad inventor niche quite capably, and I see individual, urban-dwelling (in predominantly human trading cities) halfling and gnome families as the source of small, clever inventions (intricate double locks, fold-down doorstops, removable boot scrapers that double as other useful implements, heat-reflecting stove hoods and fans whose blades are turned by the heat of cooking-fires, and so on).

I see the native gnomes of the Realms (except for the ‘deep gnomes’ of the Underdark) as being the quiet collectors-and-refiners of good ideas from all cultures, who keep low profiles, and make good livings through trading useful items. For instance, I think the majority (and the best) of spectacles, magnifying glasses, spyglasses, and other devices involving glass lenses in the Realms are made by gnomes. Gnomes have perfected the most practical intricate non-magical locks and hinges, long ago mastered industrial-output papermaking and bookbinding, are experts on waterproofing (garments and portable containers for scrolls and flat paper), and are working on building bigger and better looms for “everyday” cloth. Many gnomes are working to perfect wire, and fashion everyday items from wire.
[ Candlekeep, Ask Ed '04, 06 May 2004 ]

steam engines (monstrous “rolling-beam” stationary types, akin to those found in Cornish tin mines and elsewhere AND tiny ‘using a fire one builds in a bowl’ sorts) are in common use all over Lantan, but remain “dangerous” curiosities elsewhere (although many Faerunians know about harnessing the hot gas from a fire collected through a hood-and-pipe apparatus). As several posters have mentioned, Gond rules such pursuits, and copious prayers to him will be a part of any steam-work. What the Realms DOESN’T yet have is reliable steam propulsion (locomotives, that is -- although miners’-sweatwork and donkey- or mule-drawn mining railways, with little ‘tip’ ore cars, ARE used here and there, and are known to all dwarves and gnomes). Distillation and other simple steam-related procedures are widely known if not widely understood.
[ Candlekeep, Ask Ed 04, 31 Jul 2004 ]

Vanguard, a few pages back (48, to be precise), you asked about the advancement of science in the Realms. I’ve discussed this informally with Ed, and here’s a sort of general reply: science is quite advanced, but aside from ongoing Lantanna ‘tinkering engineering,’ which tends to be quite organized (via the Church of Gond, ideas are shared, or rather, one inventor of Lantan often gets a chance to examine the work of another), almost all scientific knowledge is held by individuals, or passed on verbally as ‘folklore’ and inevitably distorted in the process. In other words, sages write incomplete, opinionated, and often quite skewed books, but aside from short, just-the-basics chapbooks sold in Waterdeep and by wagon-merchants and peddlers elsewhere, there are no generally-available ‘textbooks’ or commonly-accepted body of knowledge. This keeps the ‘advance’ of science at a slow, unpredictable pace: the wild acceleration seen in our real world through improvements in communications hasn’t happened and shows no signs of happening. Temple libraries, of course, from Candlekeep to the private collections of priests of other deities who just “have to know the Inner Truths and Great Secrets,” help to preserve knowledge (and misinformation, too), but there’s no way to access most of it except by busting in and stealing the books. Now THAT would make for a fascinating campaign.
[ Candlekeep, Ask Ed 04, 10 Sept 2004 ]

Everything I say here is a generalization, with many local exceptions that DMs should feel free to invent as enthusiastically as they see fit, okay?
In the 1370s, in Faerűn, screws and threaded bolts are “holy secrets of Gond,” and pretty much limited to temples and to furniture and special devices built, guarded, and used only by priests of that god.
Bolts ARE known to dwarf and gnome smiths, and human smiths up and down the Sword Coast and around the shores of the Shining Sea, but they’re of the (lacking threads) “rod pierced by hole that’s filled with a wedge or pin [[‘cotter pin’ in modern North American real-world parlance]]” sort, where the rod is run through a hole in a timber or stone block, and the pin applied to the hole on its far side to keep the rod from being pulled back through, shim-wedges being used if necessary to make the fastening secure and rigid rather than loose and with ‘play’ in it.

“Strap” hinges with simple, single pivot pins are known and widely used, right across the known Realms, as are rigid angle-braces of the same design (lacking a hinge, but having instead a bent right angle of metal) used to protect and strengthen the corners and sides of carry-chests and strongchests. Hook-and-eye catches are known but not so widely used, being mainly restricted to small-sized, interior uses (seasonal freezing problems make larger and exterior usages rare in the North). Nails, spikes, and wedges (wooden, metal, and stone) are known everywhere, though only dwarves and gnomes make and work with stone ones, and wooden ones are less and less popular due to weathering/short-life problems). Delicate work such as needles and wire tend to be rare and expensive, more known-of in Calimshan and the Tashalar than elsewhere.

You’re correct in surmising that the majority of mongery production among humans is smiths hand-making what is pressingly needed "plus a few extra for sale.” Apprentices are often kept busy making nails and spikes, so successful smiths tend to build up a fairly impressive inventory of nails and spikes of all sizes, as well as hooks and “eye” spikes (spikes made for driving into tree-trunks or wooden walls, with a long shaft made for then fashioning into a ring suitable for fastening ropes to).
However, there ARE mass makers of such mongery, including surface human foundries in Waterdeep, Amn (several), Tethyr, Sembia, Turmish, Calimshan (many), and the Tashalar (many). In Cormyr, there are five very busy local smiths but no mongery-only foundries.
However, there is one in Arabel, that sells much of its wares either in Suzail, and to the wider Realms through the docks of Suzail (a smaller flow goes the other way, through the Dales to the Moonsea). It’s known as Garthen’s Hammer (after the now-aging smith Askarl Garthen, a human whose family came from Everlund; his own numerous sons and grandchildren work and run it), and (if you have access to the detailed maps of Arabel) is the complex of connected buildings on the north side of the street that runs right through the city, JUST inside The High Horn Gate (south of the row of House of Thond rental warehouses). It was formerly across the street, due south of its current location, but expanded into the premises of a decaying old inn, and Garthen then sold his former location to a wealthy and ambitious Suzailan merchant, one Handren Tharmarklor, who tore down the old smithy and built on its site a mixed-shops complex that he rents out, himself inhabiting the uppermost three floors of “Tharspire,” the tower that rises from the northwesternmost building of Tharmarklor’s Doors (the complex). Garthen more or less permanently rents the southernmost House of Thond warehouse for his inventory of nails, spikes, axe-heads, hooks, eye-spikes, door-plates (both kickplates and lockplates), and strap hinges, from which traders’ wagons run constantly to Suzail and elsewhere (Garthen himself takes no part in marketing his wares, restricting himself to selling from his premises in Arabel).
[ Candlekeep, Ask Ed 09, 01 Oct 2009 ]

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Guys, please don't go overboard on applying real-world history (as we foggily understand it, looking back) to the Realms (where magic works, remember?)

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Originally posted by shades of eternity
Gnomes are a burrowing species.

Could they have a series of tunnels not unlike groundhogs (or perhaps gummi bears) that are sized for them for easy, quick and stealthy transportation?

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Originally posted by shades of eternity
ha if they are going to be the quiet unassuming folk, should they be experts in the hospitality industry?

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