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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
 Posted - 07 Mar 2004 : 16:53:52
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Alaundo in another thread http://www.candlekeep.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=90&whichpage=2
asked that any future discussion of moonblades take place in a new scroll. Thus, when I saw the following, I decided to create this thread:
From an ENWorld thread:
quote:
On another note, anyone know if the Dwarven Kingdom of Besilmer existed during the time of the Elven Kingdom of Earlann (sp?) (The kingdom that had the citadel that became Hellgate Keep).
I'm trying to come up with a storyline where a Sun Elf clan from this period and in this area, was on good terms with another dwarven clan, and worked together to create a "moonblade". The "moonblade" was completed, but before the exchange could be made, calamity fell upon both nations. (The rise of Hellgate Keep, the Fey'ri, etc.)
An exchange? So, dwarves were able to create a moonblade and then were going to exchange it with sun elves? Correllon himself, decided to bless the dwarves with the knowledge of how to create a moonblade?! I know it's this person's game, but I feel like Simon on that commercial for American Idol after one bad performance:
"What? Why? Just get out!"
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 08 Mar 2004 : 17:30:53
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First of all . . . you know that watching such shows destroys brain cells as well as (in this case) causing permanent auditory damage, right? 
Second, I think the quotation marks show that what this person was referring to was a weapon that worked like a moonblade, and would look just like one. Remember, the gold elves don't like moonblades, because they seem to unfairly favor moon elves. (Well duh -- moon elves are the best for the job.  )
Perhaps a gold elf wanted to make it look like he'd actually been chosen by a real moonblade. This would, as I said, look exactly like one, and would have some certain "special" powers (as moonblades gain). I doubt it would hold up for very long, but sometimes gold elves act like they don't have that +2 Int bonus. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 08 Mar 2004 : 18:16:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
First of all . . . you know that watching such shows destroys brain cells as well as (in this case) causing permanent auditory damage, right?
I did say it was a commercial. Hard to avoid them sometimes. It's not like I'd actually watch a show with a vitrolic person who seems to hate everyone. Oh wait, that description sounds familiar...
quote:
Second, I think the quotation marks show that what this person was referring to was a weapon that worked like a moonblade, and would look just like one. Remember, the gold elves don't like moonblades, because they seem to unfairly favor moon elves. (Well duh -- moon elves are the best for the job. )
Looking at a further description of the thread, no. It really looks like he thinks this is a moonblade, created by dwarves with sun elves showing them how. I think it goes back to the popularity of Elaine's novels triumphing over most DMs creating a magical sword with a history all of their own.
Still, it's that person's game and moonblade or "moonblade," as long as they are having fun with it that's the main thing. Still, by all the posts I've seen, it seems the only ones not using moonblades anymore are moon elves. |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 08 Mar 2004 : 18:24:49
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| Okay -- in that case, that's simply stupid. If I'm recalling correctly, the only way to make a moonblade is with Correllon's blessing. There's no way he'd be giving that to some stupid, earth-eating dwarves. ( Okay, so maybe that's a bit harsh, but Correllon's sort of an elven purist, as much as he can be while still being Good.) |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 08 Mar 2004 : 18:27:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
Okay -- in that case, that's simply stupid. If I'm recalling correctly, the only way to make a moonblade is with Correllon's blessing. There's no way he'd be giving that to some stupid, earth-eating dwarves. ( Okay, so maybe that's a bit harsh, but Correllon's sort of an elven purist, as much as he can be while still being Good.)
Correllon must be asleep at the switch for some FR games. I've seen posts about: Fey'ri, Sun Elves, Dwarves, Drow, etc., all having or handling moonblades like cheap swap meet items.
Ad seen in an FR newspaper:
"Have Moonblade. Willing to trade for one of Drizzt's scimitars." |
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The Cardinal
Senior Scribe
Canada
647 Posts |
Posted - 08 Mar 2004 : 20:07:27
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| What is the big deal about a moonblade anyways? If one has it it has to CHOOSE the wielder?!?! Bah, just break the accrused blade to thy will and be done with it, says we. |
It has to be Certain, the Gods Hate Me. For whatever irrevokable Fate, I have been made the walking Joke. Either that, or Beshaba is overlyfond Of Me.
-Unknown |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 08 Mar 2004 : 22:07:29
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| There's a certain attraction to having a moonblade, of course. After all, it shows that the weilder is honorable, good-hearted, and has access to a racial heirloom with tremendous prestige. But it only has that prestige if it's rare; not only rare in number, but rare in the amount of people who can use it. Once they're handed out like candy, it's lost everything it had going for it, and has simply become a sword with a bunch of unique powers. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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The Cardinal
Senior Scribe
Canada
647 Posts |
Posted - 08 Mar 2004 : 23:23:59
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| You've got us thinking, Bookwyrm. Is there any opposite to the moonblade? We mean, as Moonblades are Good, is there a... a... umm.. A Sunstaff, or something as equal for evil. Something that perhaps only chooses the truer representation of evil could wield. We guess the whips of Lolth (the snake-whips) could work... but only females seem to be able to wield such things. We like a balance, an equilibrium, if there are moonblades for good then there should be an opposite some where. We remember hearing that in some cultures a particularly good sword would warrent the smith to create an exact duplicate. We wonder if such things could be possible in the realms. Scales must be balanced... |
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Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2004 : 00:49:15
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There is a such thing called The Starym Moonblade, located in Volo's Guide to All Things Magical, starting on page 114.....
Speaking of moonblades, the elven moonblade, and the spell Moon Blade, are two completely different things! Sorry, but someone kept pestering me about that.... |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
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The Cardinal
Senior Scribe
Canada
647 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2004 : 02:14:32
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| There's that name again... Starym... |
Edited by - The Cardinal on 09 Mar 2004 02:16:40 |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2004 : 03:41:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
There's a certain attraction to having a moonblade, of course. After all, it shows that the weilder is honorable, good-hearted, and has access to a racial heirloom with tremendous prestige. But it only has that prestige if it's rare; not only rare in number, but rare in the amount of people who can use it. Once they're handed out like candy, it's lost everything it had going for it, and has simply become a sword with a bunch of unique powers.
Exactly, how many in current FR time do we know of? Three to my count:
Arilyn's blade, Elaith's blade, and the one possessed by Queen Amlaruil.
I think I saw more moonblades than that mentioned in games in one week of postings on the WOTC board. All wielded by, yep, every subrace but a moon elf. Maybe I got the definition mixed up, maybe it's called a moonblade because moon elves are the only ones that can't wield such weapons. |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2004 : 15:50:46
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quote:
Originally posted by Shadowlord
There is a such thing called The Starym Moonblade, located in Volo's Guide to All Things Magical, starting on page 114.....
Speaking of moonblades, the elven moonblade, and the spell Moon Blade, are two completely different things! Sorry, but someone kept pestering me about that....
Volo puts out as much misinformation as information, which necessitates the occasional footnote from Elminster to contradict some of his claims. I treat Volo's work as entertaining tavern tales, some of which may be true. It is my opinion that the Starym Moonblade is one of the more fanciful tales, and that this sword does not, in fact, exist. The notion of a gold elf blade "gone bad" is simply too contradictory to ring true. |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 09 Mar 2004 : 16:07:32
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quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
There's a certain attraction to having a moonblade, of course. After all, it shows that the weilder is honorable, good-hearted, and has access to a racial heirloom with tremendous prestige. But it only has that prestige if it's rare; not only rare in number, but rare in the amount of people who can use it. Once they're handed out like candy, it's lost everything it had going for it, and has simply become a sword with a bunch of unique powers.
Exactly, how many in current FR time do we know of? Three to my count:
Arilyn's blade, Elaith's blade, and the one possessed by Queen Amlaruil.
I think I saw more moonblades than that mentioned in games in one week of postings on the WOTC board. All wielded by, yep, every subrace but a moon elf. Maybe I got the definition mixed up, maybe it's called a moonblade because moon elves are the only ones that can't wield such weapons.
No, you're right: the original creators of the moonblades had the moon elf race in mind. Nearly every wielder of these swords has been a full-blooded moon elf. The exception is Arilyn, a half-elf. A possible future exception is Azariah Craulnober, who takes after her mother, a gold elf and who may or may not be able to claim the sword Elaith holds in trust for her.
Of course anyone may change Realmslore to suit his or her campaign, but the following reflects my understanding of moonblades.
No new moonblades will ever be created, with or without the blessing of the elven gods. They have served their purpose; their time is past. This doesn't mean that new swords with similar powers can't be created, but they will not be moonblades.
Sirius is correct in saying that only three swords have been named. (Keep in mind that I'm discounting the Starym moonblade as apocryphal lore.) So, how many moonblades are still out there?
When Zaor was chosen as king, there were twenty-five living moonblades. That was quite some time ago, and I doubt there are more than eight or nine in active use. Its possible that a few others retain their magic, but have become so powerful that any attempt to claim them is virtually suidical. It seems likely that these too-powerful swords will go dormant in time. Each sword that retains its powers probably has a significant role to play in the history of the People.
It is impossible for an adventurer to find a living moonblade in a treasure trove and add it to his weapon collection. Anyone who is not of the direct family line will be slain when he attempts to draw the sword.
It is possible to use a dormant moonblade as if it were any other well-made elven sword. Those who contemplate this course of action, however, should keep in mind that elves would consider this a mortal offense. He should expect to be challenged by the first elf he encounters. If he relinquishes the blade willingly, the matter might -- MIGHT -- be resolved without bloodshed. No elf would carry a dormant blade belonging to another clan -- that's extremely taboo. Few elves would carry their family's dormant blade, for obvious matters of pride. Elaith carried his in Elfsong, and this revealed both his resolve and his sense of estrangement from elven proprieties.
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2004 : 03:54:04
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quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham
No, you're right: the original creators of the moonblades had the moon elf race in mind. Nearly every wielder of these swords has been a full-blooded moon elf. The exception is Arilyn, a half-elf. A possible future exception is Azariah Craulnober, who takes after her mother, a gold elf and who may or may not be able to claim the sword Elaith holds in trust for her.
I seem to recall a charming, friendly, talented author once on the WOTC novel board mentioning something about a Craulnober moonblade having a dual personality? I don't suppose, since we are all friends here you'd give even the smallest of small hints about what this mystery aspect of the Craulnober moonblade might be? Or what caused the moonblade to develop a dual personality?
Please Corellon let me make a good Gather Information check here although I think the DC is high. |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2004 : 04:06:13
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quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
I don't suppose, since we are all friends here you'd give even the smallest of small hints about what this mystery aspect of the Craulnober moonblade might be? Or what caused the moonblade to develop a dual personality?
I'm not sure "dual personality" is quite the right way to describe the Craulnober blade. More accurately, Elaith is capable of handling every power but one.
I can't really get into that power right now, mostly because I haven't completely defined the Craulnober moonblade, and I'd like to leave that open in case the opportunity to tell Elaith's story arises.
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2004 : 04:11:57
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quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham
I'm not sure "dual personality" is quite the right way to describe the Craulnober blade. More accurately, Elaith is capable of handling every power but one.
I can't really get into that power right now, mostly because I haven't completely defined the Craulnober moonblade, and I'd like to leave that open in case the opportunity to tell Elaith's story arises.
I hope you know my thoughts on you having that opportunity. Elaith can handle every power but one? Veddy interesting....thank you Mrs. Cunningham. |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2004 : 06:42:38
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Sirius Black - Gather Information check: 1d20 + 16 = 29
DC = 1,750 (flattery modifier included)
Sirius Black - Gather Information check: FAILURE
Blessing of Correllon: Reroll for teaser information
Sirius Black - Gather Information check: 1d20 + 16 = 36
DC = 35
Sirius Black - Gather Information check: PARTIAL SUCCESS
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Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2004 : 15:13:20
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One of the many projects I'd love to do but have little hope of seeing come to fruition is a history of a particular moonblade.
This could be told as a "historical novel" in the style of the Rutherford books (Sarum, London, etc.) It would also lend itself to an anthology, with various authors telling stories of the pivotal events which led to each wielder establishing a new power. This wielder-by-wielder approach would also work well with graphic novels.
Yes, I know -- ain't gonna happen.  |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2004 : 15:24:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
Sirius Black - Gather Information check: 1d20 + 16 = 29
DC = 1,750 (flattery modifier included)
Sirius Black - Gather Information check: FAILURE
Blessing of Correllon: Reroll for teaser information
Sirius Black - Gather Information check: 1d20 + 16 = 36
DC = 35
Sirius Black - Gather Information check: PARTIAL SUCCESS
LOL!  |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2004 : 15:36:50
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quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham
One of the many projects I'd love to do but have little hope of seeing come to fruition is a history of a particular moonblade.
This could be told as a "historical novel" in the style of the Rutherford books (Sarum, London, etc.) It would also lend itself to an anthology, with various authors telling stories of the pivotal events which led to each wielder establishing a new power. This wielder-by-wielder approach would also work well with graphic novels.
Yes, I know -- ain't gonna happen.
I'm sure there are quite a number of people who would enjoy such a work. However, you are right, it's very unlikely to happen. The products that are being produced seem to focus solely on the present. Additionally, as current products show, FR lore is not as important as prestige classes, statistics on Gods so your players can fight them, etc. Indeed, even the upcoming Lost Empires gaming book that's coming out this year apparently focuses less on the history of these locations than what await current explorers who visit these ancient sites. At least that's the impression I got from Richard Baker on the WOTC board. I hope I'm wrong there.
As for a history of a particular moonblade. The best thing perhaps might be a web enchancement especially in support of a novel that comes out. For example, since Elaith is a supporting, note I did not say minor, character in the upcoming Waterdeep novel, perhaps the WOTC staff would be willing to have a few web enchancements where the history of the moonblade he holds onto is detailed for the fans.
It certainly appears that the web enhancements are where the lore part of the Realms now appears. Case in point, My Slice of Silverymoon, Dawntree, and Alustriel's Consort series. All give good background information from the Realms minus any prestige classes, feats, or statistics on avatars. I just do not see such details making it into current products. But, apparently interest is high enough that WOTC knows there is some audience for the lovely details that, to me, make the Realms unique. |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2004 : 16:26:23
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quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
For example, since Elaith is a supporting, note I did not say minor, character in the upcoming Waterdeep novel, perhaps the WOTC staff would be willing to have a few web enchancements where the history of the moonblade he holds onto is detailed for the fans.
Ms. Cunningham did say she wanted to leave Elaith's moonblade open, lore-wise, to give her elbow room in later books . . . . |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2004 : 16:45:58
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
Ms. Cunningham did say she wanted to leave Elaith's moonblade open, lore-wise, to give her elbow room in later books . . . .
Ah, yes, thank you for the reminder. Although, I still think such web enchancements supporting a novel would be an ideal place to release some FR lore about the past be it character or item. Of course, as the author so desires.  |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2004 : 21:35:27
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quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
It certainly appears that the web enhancements are where the lore part of the Realms now appears.
True enough. I've read several of Ed Greenwood's columns, and they're gems.
That said, I don't plan to write new material for the WotC website. My 2004-2005 schedule simply won't allow it. (Keep in mind that no mere mortal is as prolific as EG...) I consider online time an important part of writing in a shared world, but my budgeted time will be spent on 1) email, 2) website construction, and 3) Candlekeep.
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2004 : 23:31:48
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What!? Candlekeep in third place!? Never!!!  |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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The Cardinal
Senior Scribe
Canada
647 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2004 : 00:16:33
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* Puts a hand on Bookwyrms shoulder*
Better third than not at all. |
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Shadowlord
Master of Realmslore
USA
1298 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2004 : 01:58:50
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Well, you've peaked my curiosity, too bad you don't plan to tell us what any of those powers are....
Bookwyrm care to roll for me, with a blessing of Vhaeraun this time? |
The Chosen of Vhaeraun
"Nature is governed by certain immutable rules. By virtue of claw and fang, the lion will always triumph over the goat.Given time, the pounding of the sea will wear away the stone. And when dark elves mingle with the lighter races, the offspring invariably take after the dark parent. It is all much the same. That which is greater shall prevail. Our numbers increase steadily, both through birth and conquest. The dark elves are the dominant race, so ordained by the gods." Ka'Narlist of the Ilythiiri. |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2004 : 04:44:15
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quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham
I consider online time an important part of writing in a shared world, but my budgeted time will be spent on 1) email, 2) website construction, and 3) Candlekeep.
Boy, the parting with the WOTC board really did not go well did it? Sorry to hear that and that is their loss. Thanks for any time spent here, in this thread, especially answering my questions. |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2004 : 04:46:00
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quote:
Originally posted by Bookwyrm
What!? Candlekeep in third place!? Never!!!
Yeah, what's with email first? Like who could you be emailing?
Another scribe whispers in Sirius' ear. "Ed who? Athans who? Never heard of them are they important?"
Seriously, for second place, I do believe the web site construction is to include the drow gallery that I think Mrs. Cunningham mentioned once. So, all you dark elf fans out there....are there any? will be happy with that. |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2004 : 04:47:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Shadowlord
Well, you've peaked my curiosity, too bad you don't plan to tell us what any of those powers are....
Bookwyrm care to roll for me, with a blessing of Vhaeraun this time?
Well, I think you can surmise that resistance to fire is one of the powers in the Craulnober moonblade. Gee, wonder what race helped us figure that out? <stares hard at Shadowlord> |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2004 : 13:54:12
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quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham
I consider online time an important part of writing in a shared world, but my budgeted time will be spent on 1) email, 2) website construction, and 3) Candlekeep.
Boy, the parting with the WOTC board really did not go well did it? Sorry to hear that and that is their loss.
The above-quoted post was not intended as a comment about the WotC forums. In fact, my pattern of online involvement is fairly consistent: I seldom participate in more than one message board at any one time, and right now, that board is Candlekeep. I don't understand how a working writer can be active on four or five boards and still do any actual writing. |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2004 : 16:11:37
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In the interest of saving time, I'm going to focus on my designated thread in the FR Novels forum. Anyone who wishes to continue this discussion can find me there.
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What is it about Moonblades?
