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Ocule
Acolyte
USA
17 Posts |
 Posted - 08 Feb 2015 : 22:07:28
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So for the longest time ive always dismissed forgotten realms with a sort of disdain for generic settings but for the first time i decided to give forgotten realms a fair read as i realized much of my opinion was shaped by a monty haul style campaign i was subjected to years ago. Like I could go into the magical supermarket and buy a +whatever sword of whatever. So I have been trying to find its good qualities and what makes it interesting as a world. So i just wanted to hear what the fanbase has to say over what makes the realms great. And if i would be incorrect to run them on a lower magic level. Wizards train from masters or secret societies, magic items arent something to find and be discarded for the next biggest shiney. Also the world.Right now the only world similar that i have as a point of comparison that i actually know is Golarion from pathfinder. Its hard to compare planescape or ravenloft to FR.
So what makes Forgotten Realms great?
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JohnLynch
Learned Scribe
Australia
243 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2015 : 23:22:01
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This page has 5 facts about the Forgotten Realms which address some of the most common complaints level led against the Forgotten Realms. It explains how I would run an FR campaign. Basically canon is there to be used as desired but anything can be changed as a result of the actions of the heroes. My campaign is squarely set to place the players as the heroes.
When I write up an adventure for FR I include a synopsis of how events play out if the players do nothing in order to create a vibrant and living world where the players' action (or inaction) makes a real and significant difference. |
DM of the Realms: A blog for my Forgotten Realms adventures. |
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Ocule
Acolyte
USA
17 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2015 : 23:52:41
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| Is it really that high fantasy? Trying to imagine a point of reference. Like has the average person come in contact with an enchanted item or seen a sorcerer cast a spell in their lifetime |
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JohnLynch
Learned Scribe
Australia
243 Posts |
Posted - 09 Feb 2015 : 00:03:41
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I'll go over my thoughts on "What makes Forgotten Realms great" more directly and in detail. But to answer the question it is (or at least can be) if you so desire. WotC use to have a lot of FR content available on it's website, including many 2e sourcebooks, all of which should still be available on the Wayback Machine website.
In Volo's Guide to Cormyr we have Beruintar's Hone Warmer inn which is commonly visited by Minotaurs and Lizardfolk who are allowed in the town of Waymoot but are watched suspiciously nonetheless. In many locations throughout Cormyr you'll find the odd magical item or two in some quiet tow, but it's rare (as in, I can't recall any) that you'll find a Ye Olde Magic Shoppe. |
DM of the Realms: A blog for my Forgotten Realms adventures. |
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Delwa
Master of Realmslore
USA
1271 Posts |
Posted - 09 Feb 2015 : 00:28:36
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The way I've always read it, (and more learned scribes here may feel free to correct me, as I'm not nearly as well read as some) magic in general is relatively common when compared to our world. The average commoner may have at least seen a cantrip or orison cast, but may not have seen a mage cast a fireball, though they have heard that mages are capable of things like fireball, just as I'm aware that a F-22 is a real weapon of warfare. I've never seen one, but if I lived near an Air Force base, I'm more likely to have seen one fly overhead. The average adventurer, on the other hand, is likely to come across potions of healing, spell scrolls, and +1 weapons in his travels.
Commoners living in a big city like Waterdeep can certainly enter a shop where more powerful items are on display or for sale, but a Commoner will likely never be able to afford such things. That's what makes adventuring so alluring. It's the get fast rich scheme of the world. The downside is the high attrition rate of adventurers. Anyone can go down to Undermountain to make their fortune. Only the luckiest come out alive. Most die. They might die with their hands wrapped around a Holy Avenger, but they die. |
- Delwa Aunglor
I am off to slay yon refrigerator and spoil it's horde. Go for the cheese, Boo!
"The Realms change; seldom at the speed desired of those who strive, but far too quickly for those who resist." - The Simbul, taken from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Conspectus |
Edited by - Delwa on 09 Feb 2015 00:35:16 |
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Ocule
Acolyte
USA
17 Posts |
Posted - 09 Feb 2015 : 01:09:25
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| Any particular regions you guys recommend to look at? |
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Aldrick
Senior Scribe
909 Posts |
Posted - 09 Feb 2015 : 02:55:01
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The amount of magical items and magic depends heavily on the current rules for D&D. Honestly, a lot of the setting is flavored by the rules.
In 3E the reliance on magic items was encouraged by the rules, and so as a result the Realms experienced a glut of uninspired, non-unique magic items, and of course, Thaymart. Yes, it was horrible. However, this type of play is influenced heavily by the rules you use.
Another thing you need to be aware of is perspective. If you read the novels then you are likely to get a skewed perspective of what the Realms is really like for most people. The novels primarily deal with very high level characters, typically spell casters, at the center of major Realms Shaking Events (RSE's).
The Realms can easily accommodate low magic play, though some regions are going to have more magic than others. Thay, for example, is a land ruled by wizards. As a result, there is a lot of magic used there. The Bloodstone Lands by contrast, is pretty skeptical of magic in general, and therefore there are fewer wizards there.
What makes the Realms unique compared to other settings is its depth and detail. This can be a good thing or a bad thing, depending on how you use it. The best way to use it is a guideline or for inspiration. Use what you like, and change what you don't. However, one of the things that I find unique about Realmslore, is simply reading it fills me with inspiration and ideas. That is one of the things that I really love about the setting, its a place where you can set a near limitless number of stories.
As for a region... it depends on what you are looking for. Personally, starting out, I would recommend the Silver Marches. There is a good bit of lore out there for it, and it is fairly wild and untamed over all. When it comes to powerful magic in the region, it is mostly focused in and around Silverymoon. However, even there it is mostly subdued and in the background if you want it to be.
You could probably run a game there right out of the gate without feeling like you have to make any serious changes to the setting. |
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JohnLynch
Learned Scribe
Australia
243 Posts |
Posted - 09 Feb 2015 : 03:35:05
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It's worth noting that high fantasy and high magic aren't synonymous. It also depends on what edition's campaign books your using. I tend to use 2e books as my guide as they're the ones I've got most of and the era I like to play in (so I can then make use of those books). If you're using 4th ed or even 3.5e books as your guide then they may say there's a lot more magic shops then other edition's books may suggest. If you read 5e books then you might find there's no magic item shops detailed. It all depends on your sensibilities and which edition you pick and choose from.
So what makes the Forgotten Realms great? Here's my thoughts.
NOTE: These are my impressions of the Realms. Someone else might read the same paragraph and interpret it differently. Or they might have read a different sourcebook to me which contradicts my interpretation. I also can't remember what I've read and what I've made up based on a few hints here and there, but never actually detailed.
1. There's a place for everything
Whether it's talking elephants (Loxo), hulking intelligent insects (thri-kreen) or even a psionics campaign (Jhamdath), there's a place for everything in the Forgotten Realms. If you want to play a "any race goes" campaign and not be treated as parriahs, play in Calimshan. Want to play in an area where exotic races are allowed, but are treated as potentially dangerous? Play in Cormyr. Want to play in an area where only the most common races are allowed and even half-orcs are arrested or driven away? Play in the Dalelands.
The Forgotten Realms is a pretty big place and it's designed to not only be able to handle all races and classes, but enhance and enrichen the game by having them included.
If you're a 5e fan then go look at my scroll on Warforged (Gondsman) and Shifters (Lythari). This is a canon way to incorporate those non-FR races and I even cite my references for the Gondsman (Lythari are mentioned in a variety of books, none of which (AFAIK) have a definitive write up of them).
2. It's highly detailed, but none of the detail is mandatory
There's a ton of material out there on the Realms from past editions (specifically 2nd ed and 3rd ed). The Volo's Guide books are great in that they go into microscopic detail of the regions they cover, whereas other books provide you with a greater overview at the macro level and necessarily aren't as detailed.
You can obviously make use of this detail as written in the book (or adapt it to your group's preferences). The Grand History of the Realms has an enormous amount of detail on the Realms between 1357 and 1385 DR. You can set it any time you want in that range (from 1372 DR onwards it goes into even more detail). This book is 160 pages long and in reading it you should get at least 160 ideas for adventures, if not many more.
However there's a number of ways to not include it. Why would you want to? A common complaint is that there's "too much lore" on the Realms. What people actually mean is "I don't want to use all of that lore" and it's by no means mandatory. Ed (like most if not all creators of D&D settings) regularly reminds people that they should use and discard the lore as it suits their group.
The easiest way to exclude something is to use 4 magic words "not in my realms." Don't want the Time of Troubles to have happened? Simply say it didn't in your Realms. Don't like the Spellplague? Again all you have to say is it didn't happen. Want all of the canonical events to have occurred (or will occur) but don't want the gods constantly stomping around in the Realms? Simply say it was/will be the churches that do everything ascribed to the gods and say events unfolded largely as written (my current take. Previously I'd said the Time of Troubles will not occur in my realms. I've changed my mind and intend to have it happen, but no gods actually die. The worship of those gods simply stops due to the churches getting eradicated by other people. This means the players don't have to be epic level to engage in the storyline and also that if a player ever wants to bring back the worship of a particular deity, it's easy to have that happen).
Another way to exclude some of it without going against published canon is to set your campaign in the Border Kingdoms or Sembia (I believe that's the right name). Both of these areas have very little detail designed specifically so DMs can detail them as best enhances their campaign.
Yet another way is to set it in the 4e era of Forgotten Realms set 100 years in the Realms's future. In 4e only 3 books were ever published for it, the Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide, Forgotten Realms Player's Guide and the Neverwinter Campaign Setting. Read those and that's all the canon there is for the 4e era of Forgotten Realms. Want to incorporate more of the pre-4th ed lore? Set it in the 5e era where very little is detailed, but we do know many gods and kingdoms that were lost in the 4e books are coming back.
3. It's different to other settings
Forgotten Realms (in my view) has a very high fantasy playstyle. There's lots of races and they have their own lands but much like in Eberron they can also be found in human-centric nations. However unlike Eberron magic isn't as pervasive (outside of Halruaa). All of the major nations do take magic into account when setting up the defences for their kingdom, and most towns will have at least one magic user, but people aren't riding around in horseless carriages or using everburning torches to light up their house at night or riding along railway carriages.
4. It's got a great community both amongst fans and developers
The people here at candlekeep are pretty great. Regardless of whether they play in the era you're talking about or use the edition you're talking about, they can still engage you in what ideas your throwing around and offer their own thoughts. The creators (past and present) will also engage in you directly, answer any questions, discuss elements of the Realms and generally just be a good bunch of people.
I can't think of anything else off the top of my head. That's the main things in my opinion. Not all of it is unique to the Realms. But in my view the campaign world certainly feels unique.
As for regions to look at? It depends on what resources you have and what ones you're willing to acquire. If you must have physical books then you're likely looking at 3.5e books that should be locatable at gaming stores, amazon (2nd hand) or ebay. For physical books the only one I'll recommend is Waterdeep: City of Splendors and Halls of Undermountain.
I haven't read either of these books, but Eric L. Boyd wrote the Waterdeep book so I'm trusting in him as I've liked his other work. Waterdeep is a cosmopolitan city so you're if you stick to canon then it's a great candidate for having almost any race available for play (although by no means is it mandatory to make it so if you're happy to deviate from canon). It's got lots of intrigue and secrets for players to get caught up in with it ruled by a secretive council of lords whose identities are unknown to most. It's also home to the famous Undermountain super dungeon of which there was a 4th ed take (still available on Amazon) called Halls of Undermountain. It seems to have gotten good reviews (I personally haven't read it). Note that both books are for different eras of the Forgotten Realms Waterdeep is for 1374, Halls of Undermountain is for 1479). However they should both be fairly adaptable.
Other books available (but I haven't read) are Lost Empires of Faerun (explores the ancient kingdoms whose ruins you may crawl through), Silver Marches (in Forgotten Realms's "North" region which i've read the 2e books for and quite enjoyed). The Shining South which covers the magical nation of Halruaa (think Eberron), Luiren the nation of halflings, and the Shaar which is a plains region. I haven't read this book though.
If you're willing to use online resources and go hunting for them, find them here. Using the wayback machine you might also be able to get copies of the PDF it once had.
If you're happy with PDFs you can also find a bunch of them at the DND Classics website. Of those I can recommend the Savage Frontier. This explores the Spine of the World region including Neverwinter, Silverymoon and a bit on Waterdeep. This is for the 1e era but could easily be used for the 2e-era or 3e-era. You could also adapt it (breaking canon a bit) for 4e or 5e. This is a frontiers land where you're players can easily go to dungeons and still get caught up in the politics of the region. It's on a smaller scale then Waterdeep so they'll be able to influence things more easily.
The Volo's Guide books are my favourite, and his guide to Cormyr is very useful. It's got that Swords and Knights feel to it with frontier lands for some dungeon-delving as well. Each locale should have at least 1 plothook for you to develop into an adventure with plenty of colourful characters.
Volo's guide to the Dalelands is also suitably good. Much of the same strengths of the Cormyr book are found here, although it's more frontier land with smaller settlements working together rather than a kingdom with it's own navy and army.
That's it from me. If you want a city that's extremely detailed, go with Waterdeep. If you want frontier lands, then go with the Silver Marches/Savage Frontier or the Dalelands. If you want a bit of both, go Cormyr. If you want an area that's detailed but you can have custom made antagonists/allies, go with Cormyr or the Dalelands as they surround Sembia, a region that has little detail for you to put your own stamp on.
I can't recommend just one place, because it depends on so much on what you want out of it. If I had to pick one, I'd probably go Cormyr. and finally, that's the Forgotten Realms greatest strength in my opinion. Whatever you want from frontier land with no magic users to Eberron's feel where magic is technology, the Forgotten Realms has it and so much more. |
DM of the Realms: A blog for my Forgotten Realms adventures. |
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Jayson_Neverstop
Acolyte
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - 11 Feb 2015 : 09:02:54
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@JohnLynch: Great write-up. This is why I always believed FR to be one of the greatest fantasy campaign settings ever created. In the process of converting my campaign to 5e, I have my own examples of FR customization:
Monks: Unless you are from the Shou, you cannot play one. If you want to play one, you better give me one great excuse why you are so far west....
Dragon Born: Don't ask; they are not here.
Eladrin: Elves, boy; just Elves. The High Elf variant from the 5e PHB. Deal with it.
Other Elves: Wood elves are around, of course. Jungle Elves are a simple off-shoot of the wood elf. A change in "paint job" and you have the Jungle Elf. Drow cannot be played by players.
Eldritch Knight:Only High Elves may play them. Others, if you want to be a fighter and cast spells, mulit-class.
Lore: What was said earlier: whatever I, the Dm, allow.
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"Monks have tails, you idiot! It's the apes that don't!" ~ Clueless Player
Neverwinter MMO Character: Jayson Neverstop, Human, Ranger, Level 3. |
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Ocule
Acolyte
USA
17 Posts |
Posted - 14 Feb 2015 : 18:48:07
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| I have to ask, why only elves can be eldritch knights? |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2015 : 17:19:41
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| My favorite thing about the Realms is the diversity and detail put into each and every geographical area ... some more than others (Dalelands). |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
Amazon "KindleUnlimited" Free Trial: http://amzn.to/2AJ4yD2
Try Audible and Get 2 Free Audio Books! https://amzn.to/2IgBede |
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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 03 Mar 2015 : 17:32:04
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most likely until something for the bladesinger comes outm is why he wont allow any other race to become a EK.
the bladesinger is orignally from 2e iirc, and from there up to 4th was Elf and half elf only.
it was also only melee and wizard only for the most part, even though in 3.x, it said arcane spells which meant bards and sorcerers, warlocks, warmages etc.
taht all said, could be wrong in that regard as to why he wont allow the EK to anyone outside th elves |
why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
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Jayson_Neverstop
Acolyte
USA
10 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2015 : 23:07:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Ocule
I have to ask, why only elves can be eldritch knights?
For my campaign, it is because elves are around arcane magic all their lives. That doesn't mean other races aren't, but elves are known for it.
It also makes me think about the original D&D from the 1970's - where playing an Elf was not only a race, but a class (Fighter/Magic-User) as well.
I also allow other races to become EK's, if they came from magocracies (i.e. Thay, Halruua, etc...) of course, these usually are not the good guys.....
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"Monks have tails, you idiot! It's the apes that don't!" ~ Clueless Player
Neverwinter MMO Character: Jayson Neverstop, Human, Ranger, Level 3. |
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Just getting into FR
