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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 13 Feb 2014 :  13:40:10  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
So one of my recent questions was about Earth books, and quite some time ago I asked you about (famous?) Earth people who may have wound-up in The Realms. Although you seem to be avoiding giving any info about specific relationships between Earth and FR (aside from yourself and Elminster ), here is yet-another related question.

In times of 'great distress', when large numbers of people are on the verge of dying (Titanic sinking, Vesuvius exploding, etc), has there ever been an occurrence of a deity (Earth, FR, or whatever) answering the pleas of the doomed and dying and shunting at least some of them into The Realms?

This question, BTW, was inspired by another thread where the subject of 'Earth' names came up, and how they wound up in The Forgotten Realms (and of course we know the real answer, but its fun to consider the in-setting possibilities).

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31701 Posts

Posted - 13 Feb 2014 :  14:24:47  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One

BTW, all scribes: if you want a fix of Ed speaking in his mellifluous tones, there are little videos at theedverse.com that show you a glimpse of Ed's writing lair . . .
Neat stuff!

Any chance we can catch some glimpses of what Ed's writing lair was like back when he was creating the early Realms? [Pictures or the like, perhaps.]

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"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31701 Posts

Posted - 13 Feb 2014 :  14:26:02  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Blade of Beregost

I was rereading the 2006 edition of this scroll the other day, and I happened to come across Ed's thoughts on Wonders. Hope it (somewhat) helps.

quote:
The short, simple reply is that no Faerûnian creature would have any “Seven Wonders” list. It’s not something they’d ordinarily think about or speak of, certainly never in terms of a ranking of rival “wonders.” Folk in the Realms DO speak of wonders they’ve seen in distant lands, in taverns (usually when explorers or other far-traveled wayfarers are vying with each other to entertain the locals for some drinks or to seem important or to manipulate someone into investing in a venture). If you asked a particular Faerûnian, his reply would depend on him: if he was a farmer or rural person who’s never traveled far from his home village, he’d probably say so, and disqualify himself from relevant comment on the grounds that “they talk of many wondrous things, but I’ve not been and seen enough to tell you anything useful. I saw a melon as big as a cow once, in yon market, but then I’ve heard tell of bigger melons’n’ that, in bigger markets, see?”
Even alert, informed merchants or soldiers would say some variation on this, recognizing that they’ve hardly seen enough to venture a useful opinion. Priests and devout worshippers of one god above others would list the wonders associated with their deity (“the little stone stop Tharun’s Mount that bears the shape of Eldath’s hand, where she touched it when weeping over the death of a flower”), and that points at the key to Faerûnian attitudes towards wonders, and the reason my answer is taking the shape it is: in the Realms, everything’s slanted by the fact that EVERYONE knows the gods are real, and respects their power even when considering gods they fear, hate, or shun worship of; the knowledge that the gods walk the world (from time to time) and make changes to it colours everything. So various individuals might give you wildly different “seven wonders” lists, if you asked them to pick seven (and why seven? the concept has no significance to them, of course), UNLESS they were stay-at-homes from the same village, and so shared the same life experiences (“well, we’ve both been to Suzail once, and there were some pretty wondrous mansions THERE, let me tell you!”). So, yes, the Waterdhavian and the Thayan would probably give different lists based on different life experiences, NOT on nationalistic (or even cultural) grounds. (By “cultural,” I mean that unless they were more stupid or self-centered than most folk, both would recognize and say that they’ve not seen enough in their travels to be sure they weren’t missing important “wonders,” as a preeminent factor over seeing things as exemplifying a slave-based culture [as good or bad] or a mercantile, cosmopolitan crossroads trading center [as good or bad].)
“The Faerûnian sensibility” is “in general more inclined to be impressed by a natural wonder” than a magical construction, with one caveat: the most awe is evoked by natural wonders for which no explanations are generally known, or no god is directly and clearly attributed as the cause of (so the waterfall or the natural arch NOT “known” to have been created by the god is generally more impressive than the one this or that god altered or created - - except to a devout worshipper of that god, of course. Everyone is impressed by major magical constructions like walking colossi or flying cities, but not as “wonders” UNLESS the means of making them is now unknown or forgotten (i.e. unless they’re now unattainable or mysterious). Yet this sort of “gosh wow” admiration is a step down and to one side of “the great wonders.” It’s more a “How did they DO that?” marveling (which is, to resurrect some very old Realmslore, why folk differentiate between “Marvels” and “Wonders;” the former being man- [or rather, sentient-being-] made items and magics and processes, and the latter being things that occurred naturally or mysteriously.


Steven Schend contributed a reply to that side-discussion as well, as I recall, listing a few structures he thought might qualify for such a listing in the Realms.

I'll check my archives.

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paladinnicolas
Seeker

92 Posts

Posted - 13 Feb 2014 :  15:12:08  Show Profile Send paladinnicolas a Private Message
Dear Ed and THO, I would like to know if in Ed's campaigns Lantan, the gnomes or any other group has managed to produce somewhat advanced technology, even one qualifying as 'steampunk' (I must confess that I love steampunk), or if lost civilizations in the Realms achieved it, including mass transportation vehicles. Thanks!

Edited by - paladinnicolas on 13 Feb 2014 15:13:06
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Milith holder of HB8
Seeker

USA
63 Posts

Posted - 13 Feb 2014 :  17:10:49  Show Profile  Visit Milith holder of HB8's Homepage Send Milith holder of HB8 a Private Message
I know this is a bit of an off-question, but I'm not sure if the Infinity Gauntlet from Marvel counts as an artifact or not in Realmspace. Would Ed have an opinion on that either way?

Hey, babe, see my shiny teeth as I smile my very best wolf smile- Ed Greenwood.

Edited by - Milith holder of HB8 on 13 Feb 2014 17:11:51
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore

Australia
6653 Posts

Posted - 13 Feb 2014 :  22:55:08  Show Profile Send George Krashos a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by paladinnicolas

Dear Ed and THO, I would like to know if in Ed's campaigns Lantan, the gnomes or any other group has managed to produce somewhat advanced technology, even one qualifying as 'steampunk' (I must confess that I love steampunk), or if lost civilizations in the Realms achieved it, including mass transportation vehicles. Thanks!



It's one of the great misconceptions of the Realms that Lantan has a sizable population of gnomes. During the ToT, an avatar of Gond in the guise of a gnome washed up on the island's shore. This did lead to an influx of gnomes for a time to the island - not sure the Lantar would have been too happy about that - but there shouldn't be an instant association between Lantan and gnomes.

-- George Krashos

"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus

Edited by - George Krashos on 13 Feb 2014 22:55:29
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31701 Posts

Posted - 14 Feb 2014 :  03:07:52  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos

quote:
Originally posted by paladinnicolas

Dear Ed and THO, I would like to know if in Ed's campaigns Lantan, the gnomes or any other group has managed to produce somewhat advanced technology, even one qualifying as 'steampunk' (I must confess that I love steampunk), or if lost civilizations in the Realms achieved it, including mass transportation vehicles. Thanks!



It's one of the great misconceptions of the Realms that Lantan has a sizable population of gnomes. During the ToT, an avatar of Gond in the guise of a gnome washed up on the island's shore. This did lead to an influx of gnomes for a time to the island - not sure the Lantar would have been too happy about that - but there shouldn't be an instant association between Lantan and gnomes.

-- George Krashos

Indeed.

Despite all the gnomish-ness... Lantan still has/had a notable and significant human presence, who are/were mostly quite intuitive and capable of innovative technogical design on their own as members of Gond's faithful.

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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 14 Feb 2014 :  13:43:05  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
Perhaps after/during the Spellplague, the Lantanese used their knowledge of 'strange magiks' to alter their forms, to better survive. Now they are small, furtive folk who prefer to dwell beneath the ground of their former cities...

You know... kinda like gnomes.

EDIT: And a question, so I don't get in trouble. Have there been any major 'holy wars' in FR's past?

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 15 Feb 2014 19:51:37
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Barastir
Master of Realmslore

Brazil
1600 Posts

Posted - 14 Feb 2014 :  14:07:51  Show Profile Send Barastir a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Have their been any major 'holy wars' in FR's past?


Maybe the Draconic Holy Wars? Were they detailed somewhere after 2e Draconomicon? Can Ed provide us more details?

"Goodness is not a natural state, but must be
fought for to be attained and maintained.
Lead by example.
Let your deeds speak your intentions.
Goodness radiated from the heart."

The Paladin's Virtues, excerpt from the "Quentin's Monograph"
(by Ed Greenwood)

Edited by - Barastir on 14 Feb 2014 16:13:29
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Kris the Grey
Senior Scribe

USA
422 Posts

Posted - 14 Feb 2014 :  22:13:31  Show Profile Send Kris the Grey a Private Message
Markustay,

I love your focus on all the Earth questions lately there chum - you are speaking the language I like to hear! Lol.

Are you thinking something specifically Earthy of late? I'd happily chatter back and forth with you about anything there you might have on your mind...

Kris the Grey - Member in Good Standing of the Watchful Order of Magists and Protectors, the Arcane Guild of Silverymoon, and the Connecticut Bar Association
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31701 Posts

Posted - 15 Feb 2014 :  08:19:40  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message
Kind of a quick query for Ed, depending on how he would like to answer it... Hehe. *wink*

Ed, I'm presently re-reading the old 2e adventure module, The Runes of Chaos, from the Spellbound boxed set. In the earliest sections, we are, as DM's, told ...

And I should probably note that this is potentially SPOILER-related for the adventure. I'm covering my posterior here, even though this is a very old adventure, just to be sure.

...

...

...

...

...

As I was saying above, we're told, early in the adventure's setting, that Szass Tam made some "unspecified deals" with Larloch. Now, aside from you possibly being able to channel into designer Anthony Pryor's mind, I'm curious about what your thoughts would/could be about the nature of these "unspecified deals" made between Tam and Larloch? What do you think may have been agreed upon/exchanged/provided between these two great archmages? Could Tam have possibly [and unknowingly, from his own perspective] figured into one of Larloch grand and far-reaching plans for the Realms?

Basically, I'm just looking for your own take on this interesting and forgotten little tidbit of Realmslore.

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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist

USA
11742 Posts

Posted - 15 Feb 2014 :  15:14:32  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message
Ed (or anyone else that can point me to where these are),

Hey, I know we have heraldic symbols either spelled out or drawn for certain city-states and/or countries. However, I was wondering if we had any for certain other countries yet... and if so where... and if not, what would you think they'd be.

The ones I don't think I've seen are
The Kingdom of Bloodstone (i.e. new Damara under Gareth)
Rashemen (and if there's a special symbol for the iron lord or the wychlaran or the Durthans)
Mulhorand
Unther
Mulmaster

Also, certain old Empires. Raumathar, Narfell, Jhaamdath, and Imaskar in particular.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5056 Posts

Posted - 15 Feb 2014 :  16:20:03  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all.
Sage, I've never known any details (because after dealings with a certain Tharchioness, we Knights avoided Thay like the plague), but when you post this: "Could Tam have possibly [and unknowingly, from his own perspective] figured into one of Larloch grand and far-reaching plans for the Realms?" I know you're right in this speculation, because we did on two occasions eavesdrop on Larloch (he knew it, BTW, and was allowing it so as to "leak" certain information via us, as we figured out later), and I know Szass Tam was Larloch's unwitting tool in this. I believe it had to do with curbing some zulkirs' tendencies to send Red Wizards out across the Realms to seize magic and magical lore and then destroy the owners they'd just taken it from (Larloch didn't want such wholesale slaughter of wielders-of-the-Art).
Anthony Pryor did work from Ed's (not very extensive) notes on Thay to write this product, and I know that little notation was among them (from seeing some of said notes, myself).
love,
THO

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Marco Volo
Learned Scribe

France
201 Posts

Posted - 19 Feb 2014 :  09:38:57  Show Profile Send Marco Volo a Private Message
Hi all,

I know Eilistraee has some worshippers dwelling in the surface of the Realms, but I was wandering if such followers "proselytize" or do things for the clergy of the Dark Maiden to be known ?
One of my PC in the Promenade, getting back to Waterdeep in a few days, wants to ask a priestess of Eilistraee if the clergy needs someone to proselytize or introduce people or other clergies to this dogma.

And I don't know what I'm supposed to tell him because I don't know the way by which the clergy of Eilistraee wants to be known at the surface and in Waterdeep (if it wants to).

Edited by - Marco Volo on 19 Feb 2014 14:08:16
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Blueblade
Senior Scribe

USA
804 Posts

Posted - 20 Feb 2014 :  16:39:10  Show Profile  Visit Blueblade's Homepage Send Blueblade a Private Message
Just wanted to tell Ed how much I've been enjoying the Forging articles on the Wizards website. And a heads up to Markustay: remember you asked Ed here about Kormul? You might want to check out the latest Forging!!!
BB
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 21 Feb 2014 :  20:49:16  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
Great article - now I feel inspired to get back to my Shar/Border Kindoms/Elsir Vale map!

Question: We've noted over the years that 'great changes' have happened to the Realms from time to time. Some of the more noteworthy ones get recorded and are 'remembered' despite the passage of time (in some case 30K+ years!). However, there are plenty of examples of things changing that don't seem to be recorded - even major climate, cultural, or geographic changes, in some cases happening almost over-night. Yet, it almost seems if people's 'consciousness' of the events got dimmer (like the way a dream fades). Does this in-fact happen like that? in similar manner to how it works in Ravenloft? That when swaths of terrain and/or peoples (and whatever else) got swapped-around between worlds (or are drastically changed by some sort of temporal anomaly), that the 'common folk' of Faerûn just sort of forget-about-it?

Or like the Gap-Chasm in the Xanth series (which I am certain Ed is familiar with). The further removed from the event/site, the more your recollections of it become vague. Come to think of it - are their places in Faerûn like that? Either purposely caused by magic, or by some sort of (super)natural phenomena?

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 21 Feb 2014 21:03:47
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31701 Posts

Posted - 22 Feb 2014 :  03:11:07  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

Great article - now I feel inspired to get back to my Shar/Border Kindoms/Elsir Vale map!
Eh... Border Kingdoms map?

*Drums fingers on tabletop in a somewhat expectant manner*


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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com
-- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct

Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)

"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood

Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage
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Blueblade
Senior Scribe

USA
804 Posts

Posted - 22 Feb 2014 :  16:52:58  Show Profile  Visit Blueblade's Homepage Send Blueblade a Private Message
Dear Ed and THO,
Is there any truth to a rumor that I've heard twice now: that a certain Ed of the Greenwood is writing Dr Who lore?
Thank you,
BB
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 22 Feb 2014 :  17:57:40  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage

quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

Great article - now I feel inspired to get back to my Shar/Border Kindoms/Elsir Vale map!
Eh... Border Kingdoms map?

*Drums fingers on tabletop in a somewhat expectant manner*
Its on MY 'to do' list.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone

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keeperofthefountain
Acolyte

USA
1 Posts

Posted - 23 Feb 2014 :  00:10:52  Show Profile Send keeperofthefountain a Private Message
Are there any rangers, or groups of rangers, within The Snakewood? How about The Reaching Woods? If so, what reason, if any, would they have for being there?

Thanks!
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HardKano
Learned Scribe

Canada
158 Posts

Posted - 25 Feb 2014 :  12:17:47  Show Profile  Visit HardKano's Homepage Send HardKano a Private Message
Hi, I would like to know if there exist a website or somewhere i can purchase books autographed by Ed ? I don't want to use resellers, and i would like to encourage IP by buying new books for my personal collection that count more than 200 FR books by now.

There is only one thing that will never change : Evolution
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Barastir
Master of Realmslore

Brazil
1600 Posts

Posted - 25 Feb 2014 :  19:06:11  Show Profile Send Barastir a Private Message
Dear Ed and THO,

I have a 2e campaign running in the cities of the North, currently in 1368 DR, near to Silverymoon. My question is about the defenses of the city, more specifically about the fabled "Knights in Silver".

I've read about them in 2e and 3e sourcebooks, but there is one question that remains unanswered to me, especially for its practical reasons: are the knights (and the spellguard) the only official defenders of the city? I mean, are there regular soldiers, gate keepers, archers, pikemen, and so, or only the knights defend the city? If there are soldiers, are the knights detached from them, or they work as hierarchic superiors to the regular troops?

If there are not "lesser" soldiers, do knights in silver use polearms, bows or crossbows, keep the gates, guard entrances to some official buildings... Resuming: are they there for the "dirty" guard work? I always thought of them as "shining knights" that would not do some tasks or use some weapons, like old edition cavaliers.

Thank you in advance for any answer.

"Goodness is not a natural state, but must be
fought for to be attained and maintained.
Lead by example.
Let your deeds speak your intentions.
Goodness radiated from the heart."

The Paladin's Virtues, excerpt from the "Quentin's Monograph"
(by Ed Greenwood)
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createvmind
Senior Scribe

490 Posts

Posted - 27 Feb 2014 :  16:11:13  Show Profile  Visit createvmind's Homepage Send createvmind a Private Message
Hello All,

Not sure if asked before but does cancer exist in your realms Ed?
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rodrigoalcanza
Seeker

Brazil
67 Posts

Posted - 28 Feb 2014 :  18:07:56  Show Profile Send rodrigoalcanza a Private Message
Hello! Ed Geenwood or someone who knows the answer, could tell me how Ed to use healing magic in their campaigns? The D&D system is too abstract in this field. A 1st-level cleric can completely heal any other low-level characters, but could not completely heal a high-level characters. We know that it is the rules of D&D, but as this is explained in the game world?
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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore

USA
1446 Posts

Posted - 03 Mar 2014 :  16:08:47  Show Profile Send Eilserus a Private Message
Hi THO and Ed,

In Ed's novel Bury Elminster Deep, there is a passage where Elminster is talking about the "Many Manshoons" with Arclath Delcastle. He makes mention of two places: Ombraldar and far Shanooth. I'm guessing these are two cities that a Manshoon clone rules or is active in? Is there anything that can be said about these places or their locations?

Thank you both! :)
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The Arcanamach
Master of Realmslore

1845 Posts

Posted - 05 Mar 2014 :  02:47:57  Show Profile Send The Arcanamach a Private Message
Dear Ed/THO: In another thread we've been discussing economic issues in DnD. Basically, the prices put forth in the PHB (and frankly in all other systems I've seen) are very unrealistic. As examples...

1. A 3lb. wooden longbow costs 75gp whereas a 4lb. steel longsword costs only 15gp (3.5 PHB).
2. Likewise, the money earned for the Profession skill seems off.
3. The money earned by the average commoner seems low as well. Granted, they eat from their own harvests and barter goods...but it still seems low.

My question is how was this handled in your homebrew game? Did you just 'roll with it' as is or did you work up a more realistic system? If so, can you share the particulars on your homebrew economy?

I have a dream that one day, all game worlds will exist as one.
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore

5056 Posts

Posted - 05 Mar 2014 :  18:54:13  Show Profile  Visit The Hooded One's Homepage Send The Hooded One a Private Message
Hi again, all. I can answer that one, Arcanamach: when playing with Ed as DM, EVERYTHING is roleplayed, so aside from "paying the posted price" in the few shops where prices are posted, everything is haggled for, and there's more barter than coin-buying in rural areas...and prices fluctuate wildly with shortages, seasonal demand, and overhead (an item in a high-end North Ward shop in Waterdeep costs a LOT more than the exact same item bought in a rundown stall in Dock Ward). Most prices in the PHB reflect a "have to have it" TOP price, not a daily or buy in bulk price (always buy your swords in bulk; great barter item!).
love,
THO

Edited by - The Hooded One on 05 Mar 2014 18:54:27
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6357 Posts

Posted - 12 Mar 2014 :  08:43:57  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message
Dear Ed/THO,

I've been sifting through Prayers From the Faithful and i noticed something that is either very intriguing, or a typo.

In the section about the Balance of Belaros; a holy book of Tyr, it states that it was created by Belaros around 4,000 years ago in the mountains north of Turmish and it is rumoured that Belaros met Grimjaws himself.

The problem is that Tyr's first appearance in the realms (that we know of) was in -247 DR with the procession of justice. (although i did find reference to a dragon being slain by Anachtyr's worshippers in -284 DR.


So the question is; is this a typo and where it stated 4,000 years old it should actually be 400 years old (this would fit with the date of the destruction of the temple that held the Balance of Belaros around 1100 DR).

Or is the reference to Tyr actually referring to another deity called Tyr or maybe Anachtyr that may have later merged with Tyr (or been conquered by him).

Or even more outlandish theories could be that Tyr was originally a mortal or divine servant that frequented Toril that later amassed enough power to lead the procession of justice and ascended to godhood in the aftermath of that procession.

My personal favourite is time travel which we just dont see enough of in the realms (probably with good reason because it just makes things complicated) and Belaros travelled into the distant past to make the Balance of Belaros before returning to the future to meet old Grimjaws himself.

Anyway, we would love to hear your take on things.

Thanks in advance

Gary

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Kris the Grey
Senior Scribe

USA
422 Posts

Posted - 12 Mar 2014 :  16:10:26  Show Profile Send Kris the Grey a Private Message
Dazzlerdal,

Great question!

I too am a huge fan of time travel mixed in with my fantasy. So much so that it is a huge component of my home game (the PCs are not only from Earth, they are in a Realms set 1369+ with their present knowledge of events to come). I too noticed a somewhat lack of things time travel related in the Realms stories (undoubtedly owing to the difficult rules for it in the Realms and the mess it can make of story lines).

My follow up question to yours would be:

Are there any particular events/years (owing to the 'there at most for a year' rule) that seem to serve as a particular draw for high level time traveling wizards/beings in Realms history?

Kris the Grey - Member in Good Standing of the Watchful Order of Magists and Protectors, the Arcane Guild of Silverymoon, and the Connecticut Bar Association
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist

USA
11742 Posts

Posted - 12 Mar 2014 :  23:16:29  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message
Daz, I gotta thank you for that. So, Tyr was around 4000 years ago possibly. Fits my theories that he was just a forgotten and/or dead deity for a long time.

Even moreso, it says that "he lived near the lake of steam" and that he retreated with a lot of other priests of Tyr to the mountains north of Turmish where he met the Grimjaws himself. So, 4000 years ago in that general area what culture was dominant? Jhaamdath. I think we have enough information to place Tyr in the Jhaamdathi pantheon (and possibly Valigan Thirdborn).

Also, just a further note to support that this was indeed Tyr. The GHOTR has Tyr showing up for the procession of justice in this exact same area. Granted, I know Ed can easily say its not the case, but the facts do seem to support it.... and a lawful deity like Tyr fits an orderly civilization. Also around 4000 years ago is roughly when Jhaamdath was "falling into stagnation"... which might be read as corruption creeping into their society and possibly people turning from the worship of Tyr. I'd imagine that this is also when "Valigan Thirdborn" (a lesser deity of anarchy) began to gain more power. Perhaps Valigan even had something to do with Tyr's multi-century demise (I'm kind of picturing Valigan as a Loki type deity).


FROM GHOTR

–247 DR to –238 DR
Procession of Justice: Tyr, god of war and justice, bursts forth from a portal near modern-day Alaghôn in Turmish, then leads a force of two hundred archons across the Vilhon Reach in an effort to pacify the remnants of ancient Jhaamdath, which had fallen into lawlessness. Tyr’s host slays Valigan Thirdborn, a lesser deity of anarchy.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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