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Chosen of Asmodeus
Master of Realmslore
1221 Posts |
 Posted - 16 Jun 2013 : 22:00:24
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quote:
Originally posted by Lilianviaten
Silverwolfer, read his Cycle of Night trilogy: Shadowborn, Shadowstorm, and Shadowrealm. His upcoming novel, The Godborn, is going to build on those.
Dennis, if you read the Mephistopheles excerpt on Kemp's site, it becomes confusing. Kesson Rel was only a demigod (basically a rogue Chosen like Sammaster). Mephistopheles ends up with 1/3 of Kesson's power. In the excerpt, he laments that Asmodeus has become a full god, and plans to kill Drasek Riven and Rivalen Tanthul so he face Asmodeus on equal footing.
We know that Asmodeus is a Greater God these days. How can retrieving the full power of a demigod possibly put Mephistopheles on par with Asmodeus? Kemp is an excellent writer, but I feel like FR's rules about divine power aren't very clear.
Mephistopheles is the living embodiment of delusional pride- contrast to Asmodeus who is the living embodiment of perfectly justified pride.
What Mphistopheles believes he can do and what he actually can do are two very different things. |
"Then I saw there was a way to Hell even from the gates of Heaven"
- John Bunyan, Pilgrim's Progress
Fatum Iustum Stultorum. Righteous is the destiny of fools.
The Roleplayer's Gazebo;
http://theroleplayersgazebo.yuku.com/directory#.Ub4hvvlJOAY |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2013 : 12:42:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Mirtek
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
That is exactly my point above. He would not allow his son to ascend to godhood (no matter how minor) without having the assurance that such move would never endanger his current position as the supreme ruler of Shade.
Or at least believing he has such an assurance.
He wouldn't be the first, especially not the first archmage, to finally find his hubris getting the better of him.
Thinking that his assurance would work when contemplating what might become of Rivalen and later seeing what really became of him are two different cups of tea
The excerpt laid bare his inner thoughts for us and he was anything but sure that he was still in total control.
That still remains to be seen. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2013 : 14:01:17
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I like the idea of Telamont being unsure about Rivalen's power and his ability to handle him. It makes for a more interesting plot. Both are powerful without a doubt but it's nice to see one of the most powerful and self confident archmages being kept on his toes.
Family eh? |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2013 : 14:06:13
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| Btw, having immense power is one thing, using it effectively is another. Sometimes the smallest and weakest spell can bring down a castle wall. This applies to men, gods, archmages and devils all! |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2013 : 14:28:05
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That is sig-worthy.
Telamont is not infallible. But I think he always carefully, meticulously calculates his moves before he even executes them. Remember what he did to Mephistopheles? That was a great risk. The whole city was at risk. But he still proceeded with his plan, having known what he would gain and that Mephistopheles would hardly allow himself to linger in the Prime while his most hated rival plots in conquering his domain. I believe the matter on Rivalen’s (puny) ascension is of the same nature. It was risky, but it’s reasonable to expect his contingencies will protect him from whatever his insolent son throws at him. I’m not saying he can’t and will never be wrong. But past actions have shown him not to gamble for something he has no assurance of winning. (And as I mentioned, this still remains to be seen in The Godborn.) |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2013 : 16:51:16
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Yes but sometimes no matter how much they plan or think they have, they are just plain wrong.
I may take on that sig suggestion lol. |
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Razz
Senior Scribe
USA
749 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jun 2013 : 22:50:03
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| This is why I stopped reading Forgotten Realms novels. They're all inconsistent and, yes it does matter to me, they never line up correctly with game mechanics. I don't want it to be exact (since rules change with each edition) but if these designers ever do stats from anything in the novels they need to do the game mechanics right. If Szass Tam had magic to bind a god like Bane, can a DM get the mechanics to that in case he wants an NPC, or even a group of PCs, to work their way to such a goal? That's just an example. |
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jerrod
Learned Scribe
157 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2013 : 00:37:47
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I believe years ago there were method by which a mortal could kill a deity. Demigods could be slain with artifacts.demigods cluld slay lesser
God without artifact but intermidiates with artifacts but no chance of slaying greater.in other words they can slay gods of thier own rank without help |
I haven't been here in years but I used to be DARKFLAME MILLITHOR(DROW ARCHMAGE of wildmagic |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jul 2013 : 16:37:51
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Invincibility is boring, not to mention a dead end story-wise. Gods are already boring in themselves, IMO, that is. Making them indestructible would just make them far more boring than they already are. That doesn’t mean they have to be easily defeated, which I think is not the case with Bane. As I and others pointed out regarding Bane’s “imprisonment” and agreement to the bargain, he could have reasons mortals might not understand. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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jerrod
Learned Scribe
157 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jul 2013 : 22:48:59
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| My point was if mephisto gets enough divine power,it coupled with the powers of being an arch-devel can raise him to lesser or intermediate level.at which point he CAN stand a chance of killing asmodeus with a weapon of artifact level or epic level magic. |
I haven't been here in years but I used to be DARKFLAME MILLITHOR(DROW ARCHMAGE of wildmagic |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 14:19:29
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What Mephistopheles gained was just one-third of the essence of a godling who was even below the rank of a lesser god. Asmodeus stole the whole essence of a lesser god—a god who had affinity to magic. And magic is power. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 15:02:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
What Mephistopheles gained was just one-third of the essence of a godling who was even below the rank of a lesser god. Asmodeus stole the whole essence of a lesser god—a god who had affinity to magic. And magic is power.
Magic may be power but Asmodeus didn't get the portfolio of magic, all he got was essence of a lesser deity. Makes no odds what god you kill, if you don't get their portfolio you only get their divine essence. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 15:27:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Arcanus
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
What Mephistopheles gained was just one-third of the essence of a godling who was even below the rank of a lesser god. Asmodeus stole the whole essence of a lesser god—a god who had affinity to magic. And magic is power.
Magic may be power but Asmodeus didn't get the portfolio of magic, all he got was essence of a lesser deity. Makes no odds what god you kill, if you don't get their portfolio you only get their divine essence.
Perhaps. But Azuth (whose essence Asmodeus took) was still beyond Kesson Rel (from whom Mephistopheles got a third of divine essence). |
Every beginning has an end. |
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silverwolfer
Senior Scribe
789 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 16:42:39
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| I really want some God to fall in the lap of the Gnoll God and start up the blood war through an arms race rather then a spotless reset. |
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Chosen of Asmodeus
Master of Realmslore
1221 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 18:25:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Arcanus
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
What Mephistopheles gained was just one-third of the essence of a godling who was even below the rank of a lesser god. Asmodeus stole the whole essence of a lesser god—a god who had affinity to magic. And magic is power.
Magic may be power but Asmodeus didn't get the portfolio of magic, all he got was essence of a lesser deity. Makes no odds what god you kill, if you don't get their portfolio you only get their divine essence.
Perhaps. But Azuth (whose essence Asmodeus took) was still beyond Kesson Rel (from whom Mephistopheles got a third of divine essence).
Among the numerous versions of Amsodeus' origins is that he was, at one point in the past, a true deity before being cast down and rising as an archdevil. 4e seemed to run with this(in the Realms, anyway. In Points of Light he was a deity all along), and the thinking was not that Asmodeus assumed Azuth's divine power, but rather that he used it to reignite his own divine spark and resume his former godhood.
quote:
I really want some God to fall in the lap of the Gnoll God and start up the blood war through an arms race rather then a spotless reset.
Yeenoghu? Why him? He's a bit of a one trick hyena. If it should happen to anyone it should happen to Demogorgon or Orcus. |
"Then I saw there was a way to Hell even from the gates of Heaven"
- John Bunyan, Pilgrim's Progress
Fatum Iustum Stultorum. Righteous is the destiny of fools.
The Roleplayer's Gazebo;
http://theroleplayersgazebo.yuku.com/directory#.Ub4hvvlJOAY |
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silverwolfer
Senior Scribe
789 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 23:09:24
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| Tired of undead and only the other one if it wakes up uthgar because he uses his jungles energy to fight your chosen one. |
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silverwolfer
Senior Scribe
789 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2013 : 23:09:44
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| Tired of undead and only the other one if it wakes up uthgar because he uses his jungles energy to fight your chosen one. |
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Topic |
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how did Mephistopheles benefit from Mask Div Shard
