Author |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jan 2013 : 20:44:12
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I was thinking of a prototype automobile, based on a low carriage fitted with a flywheel and windable clockworks.
And perhaps a rocket; a brass tube filled with smokepowder propuslion and a warhead with razors. Some gnome might be devising a small sized rocket-chariot along side it. |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31772 Posts |
Posted - 01 Feb 2013 : 01:27:04
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You might want to look at the "DaRoni's Workshop" section in Aurora's Whole Realms Catalogue. It provides a sampling of various items, curious constructs, siege engines, and other weapons of war that are of a tech-level allowed in the Realms. They're inspired by Leonardo da Vinci's own work on strange contraptions and military siege engines while he was in Florence.
Many of these inventions could be either the result of a hard working member of Gond's clergy, or just the first step in an artificer's work to something greater.
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 01 Feb 2013 : 01:59:13
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Think of a task, then think how a machine could do it, then invent the steampunky Jules Verne (or Rube Goldberg) elaborations, then adorn with brass plates, rivets, handcarved wooden levers, and bulbous glass things. The device must be cantankerous, complex, and incomprehensible ... must be tended by expert operators at all times!quote: 2E Forgotten Realms Adventures (description of Baldur's Gate)
Worshippers of Gond and the curious (who pay a small admission fee) can see many wonders of artifice in the temple's Hall of Wonders. Currently on display are a mechanical scribe (handset-type printing press), a steam dragon (crude steam engine), a pump of gond (bicycle-like man-powered pump for farm irrigation and filling bilges and reservoirs), a system of self-filling oil lamps (fed from a central oil tank), and other wonders. The temple sells specimens of all displayed devices, at very still prices. ... Visitors often remark on the harbor's sheer size and crowding, and the massive cranes, scoops, and cargo carts (which run along the docks on rails of steel!) that can make loading or unloading here a swift, if expensive, process. The dock equipment ... was devised and built by the priests of Gond, who receive a 1-copper fee for every usuage of a cart or crane. (Elminster mutters darkly that divine inspiration in this case came from merely looking at a harbor or two on a certain other world. This may well be true.)
Along this theme, there could be a mechanical smithy (windmill-powered trip hammers, pumps, and bellows, conveyor belts pushing coal and metal objects around), springwound music boxes, Gondish bell-clock towers, Gondish light-beacon towers, a Gondish heliograph system for long-distance communication. |
[/Ayrik] |
Edited by - Ayrik on 01 Feb 2013 02:14:07 |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 01 Feb 2013 : 16:01:20
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Would a optical devices as a huge magnifying glass that focusses light into laser beams be too advanced a tech to exist in the realms anno 1375? Or a ponderously large camera obscura? What is the breakpoint in your campaign for gond-tech. Steampunk renaissance levels? Steampowered automobiles and golems? Or do you allow even higher level exceptions to exist, such as teleportation devices based on transmutations into electricity and transport through wires?
What about 1479? How much have you explored Gondite clergymen equipping the 'man of common birth with no interest in ruling' with easy to use smokepowder weapons rivalling wands in power? I think a logical conclusion to the collapse of mystra's clergy would entail a significant rise in prominance for the church of Gond (the two were fervent rivals), and a rise in availabilty (and perhaps the reliability) of smokepowder weapons. Doublebarreled pistols, muskets and buckshots with a multitude of atachments would be the newest rage going through the clergy in my 4ed campaigns... |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11827 Posts |
Posted - 02 Feb 2013 : 01:01:30
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most of what I can see starting to occur with Gondsmen would be things at the very earliest point in the industrial revolution. For instance, using a clockwork system that would work like a PTO on a tractor (i.e. something that spins, and you put equipment on it, and the spinning might cause the equipment to work.... for instance, like a drill to spin, a saw to spin, a hammer to repeatedly hammer in one spot and you move the metal you're working on underneath the hammer, a fan to spin, a slicing blade to drop, etc....). Conveyor belts might be all the rage. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 02 Feb 2013 : 01:46:09
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Small doses of magic can make all sorts of impossible (and stupidly counter-efficient) things workable. Perpetual motion machines, all those crazy 19th century flying contraptions, steam-powered trebuchets, beholder prism beams (beholder not included), chainmail zippers.
Our industrial age was largely concerned with inventing the industrial machinery itself, lots of belt-driven factory stuff driving mills and tools (which mostly mass-produced other tools). Wrought iron and steel had to be hand forged, and (easier to work but weaker) brass and bronze saw a lot of use until the Bessemer process made "mild steel" cheap and plentiful ... then the rails and bridges and ironworks and mass production began.
Wars gave impetus to all sorts of wonderful military machines, the more wars a nation fought the more access it had to "field test" and develop technological advantages in weaponry and logistics.
Peacetimes and capitalism tended to stimulate refinements and machinery which replaced labour. Cotton-gins, automatic looms, washing machines, refrigeration, standardized taps and dyes and bits ... little things to make life easier.
So I'd guess the best way to direct the creativity of your Gondsmen depends on their immediate and long-term goals, or those of some political/government authority to which they align. If war seems to be brewing then clockwork catapults and gatling crossbows and smokepowder-propelled battering rams might be dominant projects. If Lantan is undergoing a pseudo-Renaissance then flywheel-driven university escalators, clockwork hydroponic farms, and experimental mechanical calculating machines might be proudly demonstrated. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Quale
Master of Realmslore
1757 Posts |
Posted - 03 Feb 2013 : 21:47:30
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from my pc's notes (artificer), devices that he's heard of
devotional engine antigravity inducer autopantograph synaestesiagraph soothing pendulum alchemechanical brewery magic dampening matrix alembic of creation thaumometer detoxifier autocaltrops traps arcane flux detector arcane pulse disruptor stylus of arcane mimeography kinetic barrier-layer orgonic field perturbation inducer Babbage engine optical illusion device cogworm cable ancient schema ethereal needles etheroscope planar resonator device analyzer pneumatic potion infuser codebreaker hydraulic hammer imaskari spellcircuit ectopic solidifier waterglass pool voxbox vitrificator chaositech purifier elemental emitter oard's head mnemonic scribe kamerel room of mirrors self destruct system tempest progonsticator steamwork orrery astral perspective vortex |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 01:07:17
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Wow. Those are magnificent.
Lets focus on a single one for a second: the synaestesiagraph.
Synaestesiagraph
Price 2250 gp; Weight 120 lbs.
Synaestesiagraphs are used to "scribe sound". A synaestesiagraph is a series of complex devices working in tandem to write sound into cypher. The most common one has a large earshaped brass horn that collects the sounds into a wooden box, where sound sentivitve wires connect a variety of forms made of polished wood and fine metals. At one end, a roll of parchments or metal sheets is slowly pulled through the scribing tools, making the parchments arive enscribed with the imprinted soundcypher.
It was probably invented on commision for a bard to record his greatest performances. |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 02:18:16
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Or the unstable vehicle the autopantograph.
Autopantograph
Price 300 000 gp; Weight 9500 lbs.
Autopantographs are usually railed metal carriages driven by a lightning engine and magnetic conductors fitted on the roof. These coaches can only house a single rider, but a fully charged vehicle is capable of great speed (120 ft with clumsy maneuverability) and drag power (str 40), but are quickly exhausted (losing 30ft speed and 10 str power each hour). They are tentatively used to quickly transport wagons of goods along railtracks in gnomish mines with dangerous conditions. Most tend to explode in a violent shower of electric balls and superheated metals after a few years of service. Miniature autopantographs are rumored to have been designed to make use of this unstableness. Handcrosbow fitted, spiderlegged and wheeled autopantographs are gnomish inventions serving as mobile sentries with an electric suicide bomb attack. |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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The Masked Mage
Great Reader
USA
2420 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 02:37:22
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i like the tempest prognosticator - very amusing |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 05:13:12
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What is a vitrificator ... an alchemical petrification/mummification substance? a dessicating weapon/device? a superior kind of kiln/forge? |
[/Ayrik] |
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Quale
Master of Realmslore
1757 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 07:55:58
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it can transform certain alchemical substances (fluids) into glass |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 08:18:57
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lol, I sort of expected that it turns things into (al)chemically hardened glassy ceramics, sure. I meant what form does it take? Is it a powder, liquid, grenade, seige weapon, wand, sword, cannon, wagon, ship, castle, kiln, trap, monster, symbol, power word, ritual, curse, spell, furry garment? |
[/Ayrik] |
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Quale
Master of Realmslore
1757 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 08:31:31
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I don't know, I just listed the devices my artificer pc has heard of so far. I think it's a wand that channels energy from the paraplane of magma. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31772 Posts |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 16:45:08
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I want them all explained!
Thaumometer
Price 1300 gp; Weight 3 lbs
This wooden and mithril device can detect the exact quantities of metals in (metamagically enhanced) alloys. The percentages of volume of bronze and copper could be measured from a electrum alloy, for example. Most have a pair small antenna that penetrate up to 5ft of earth, 1 ft of alloyed metal or an inch of copper. Holding it in place for a couple of rounds, it can reveal the amount of metals, the total mass of the sample and finally the volume percentages of each detected metal on three scalelines fitted in the handle. It can be tuned to specific alloys, such as bronze (copper and tin), brass (copper and zinc), steel (iron and carbon) and mithril (iron and mithral), usually to detect imperfections in constructs. |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 17:02:40
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Wait... Perhaps the Thaumometer is the same device used in Pratchetts Discworld:
Thaumometer
Price 375 gp; Weight - lbs
This wooden and mithril cube can detect exact locations and quantities of magic. Most detect magic through a complex tangle of antenna inside the cube that penetrate up to 5ft of earth, 1 ft of alloyed metal or an inch of copper. Eight dials of each magic school point towards the strongest auras of their repective school of magic in a 30 foot radius. Otherwise it functions like a wand with 100 uses of detect magic. It overloads (2d6 electricity damage, refles save for half) when more than 5 strong magic auras are detected at once. |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
Edited by - Bladewind on 04 Feb 2013 17:06:44 |
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Quale
Master of Realmslore
1757 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 19:44:08
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quote: Originally posted by The Sage
Any chance you can elaborate on the function of both 'ancient schema' and 'Babbage engines' in terms of *your* campaign, Quale?
Babbage engine is on display in the Hands of Time shop in Sigil. Designed by a Mathematician and built by the Teknists (homebrew sect), it's their response to the celestial etheroscope and planology (they consider it pseudoscience). The engine is not yet fully operational at its highest functions. Timekeepers at the shop are searching for a suitable gear spirit to increase its efficiency, or even a moigno that could be lured to enhance the calculations.
Ancient schema is a thinaun tablet, the cornerstone of the Hyper House (homebrew post-Faction War Cipher HQ). It can't be deciphered. Master of the spirit who placed it there, said that one symbol resonates the word ''gyoxchuggi''. But he turned Anarchist and disappeared (retired pc actually).
Autopantograph I think is like a copy machine, something between Grundlethum's Automatic Scribe and Halavar's Universal Pantograph. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 20:26:53
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Haha "gyoxchuggi" is awesome ... I've encountered analogues of your ancient schema in my gaming, bearing cryptic markings (lost names of Abyssal lords?) like "G7GAX" and "robnard". Perhaps ancient schema were scattered across countless alternate Primes, and can only be properly deciphered once scholars have painstakingly gathered all the pieces from gaming tables across the multiverse? |
[/Ayrik] |
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Quale
Master of Realmslore
1757 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 21:59:25
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I've considered that as one possibility. A cosmic competition, who discovers the dark, becomes a new power of the game. Organized by a sect called the Fool's Guild (who really wanted to attract high-ups to their ranks). Inspired by the comic in the last issues of Dungeon. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 22:29:04
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I must admit I've never thought of D&D settings going meta to the point of recursive self-reference within strange loops.
Perhaps the inhabitants of D&D worlds could learn the secrets of our world by piecing together the fragmentary ancient schema "clues" scattered throughout their universe? Architects-of-the-universe sorts of stuff. Or if not the actual creator(s) then at least all the subcontractors and inspectors (like Ao?) who've appeared to enforce local ordinances and bylaws. |
[/Ayrik] |
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MrHedgehog
Senior Scribe
688 Posts |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 23:34:40
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I think a lot of inventions would be destroyed by gods' clergy who don't like new things or change. Shar, Talos, Grumbar.... otherwise the world wouldn't remain medieval perpetually. If Gondites invented something unbalancing like guns good and neutral gods might want it snuffed out too. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 05 Feb 2013 : 00:05:08
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Another possible reason for perpetually-medieval civilization could be wizards and magic. The common belief held by everybody - except for some crazed adventurers and minority populations of insanely reckless gnomish inventors - is that magic offers the solution to all problems, magic can accomplish anything, magic is the art and science of Toril. Steam engines and clockworks and smokepowder have merits, indeed might be seen as a few outstanding examples of otherwise fruitless tinkering, but technology in general is seen as something of an idle curiosity with very little useful potential.
The gods needn't work to suppress and destroy anything their followers can barely imagine. And they'd have to wait in line behind the wizards, nobility, guilds, and other social orders who would oppose any technologies which challenge the status quo.
Things might change since literacy is apparently now widespread and the Realms seem poised at the brink of a Renaissance age. I desperately hope we don't see Faerūn turned into yet another trendy-generic Steampunked magitech world. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Darkmeer
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 07 Feb 2013 : 04:40:31
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I have lots of notes, and here's what I have in my notes from the So Saieth Ed:
quote: So Saieth Ed
Lantan is of course 'on the list' of places to deal with, eventually (watch upcoming Realmslore columns for more about a different thus-far-neglected island), but in general I see two factors at work governing what fantastic gadgets from Lantan get into circulation: price (how many folk in the Realms will pay serious coin for, say, a clockwork toy, or even a clock when the sun and local religious observances govern daily events, and in daily society no one makes or keeps appointments "by the minute" or "on the hour"? palaces and temples have their own timekeeping, and no one else lives that way) and self-control: really powerful weapons (beyond individual battlefield firearms and the printing press, which have already found their ways onto the mainland) are probably either kept on Lantan, or are sent out of Lantan only under strict conditions (like having a Lantanna "minder" with them at all times, under the fiction that the gadget in question is so complex that it will only keep working under the continuous supervision and maintenance of a trained Lantanna. In other words, young maverick inventors of Lantan are going to be restricted in what they can export by their long-seeing seniors (who thanks to the religion of Gond have the moral authority to do so).
If you're at all interested in steampunk, a within-Lantan campaign might be the way to go, and I'd put it on two levels: secret inventions of sophistication being kept within families (just as the noble houses of Waterdeep show off some things at revels, but keep others as dark secrets), and a public (that is, openly within Lantan) mechanization that's about at the level of what Phil and Kaja Foglio have depicted in their marvellous GIRL GENIUS comics, with machines known as "clanks" and whatnot.
Whether or not the published Lantan ends up looking like this or not, Lantan is the "sleeping giant" on the Realms scene, with the potential to rise to become an alternative to magic, but easily kept down to the status of "oddity" if players and DMs don't want technology to play that large a role in their games.
And even more, not from Ed. From Here we have the 2e Clockwork Gondsman, something I'm currently experimenting with to do some horrible fun things with a group of PC's soon.
So, Lantan has the current proto-rennaissance tech, even into some proto-industrial revolution tech plus magic (makes me think of the Iron Kingdoms, personally), but there is a perpetually medieval civilization as Ayrik says. Remember Gond is the god of invention, under Oghma, who limits what Gond is able to show his followers/give someone an epiphany. Oghma lets Gond have Lantan as a testing ground, once it survives there, it can survive anywhere, thus the rate of change is really slow on the mainland, but can be excruciatingly fast or proceed moderately on Lantan, dependent on the GM.
And my Gond Bit comes Faiths and Avatars, shown thusly:
quote: Originally printed in Faiths and Avatars on Page 62 Gond is always making new things. He often presses Oghma for their release into the mortal world without thinking through completely the impact they will have. He is fascinated with making the theoretical real and either does not consider or often does not care about the implications for the use of his inventions and discoveries.
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"These people are my family, not just friends, and if you want to get to them you gotta go through ME." |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 07 Feb 2013 : 06:03:30
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Not to decry Ed, but I have trouble accepting Gond-the-God being so naive and unconcerned about the consequences of his inventions, especially if he takes them as seriously as we (people who regularly witness the power of science and technology) would expect. Surely Gond must realize the (destructive) potential of things like smokepowder howitzers and clockwork soldiers wearing steam-powered assault armor ... and the (destructive) potential of his own worshippers? Moreover, Gond is but one god, and not all the other gods (or their followers) would be blind to the possible applications of Gond's work. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 07 Feb 2013 : 23:54:27
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Gond would only see the elegance with which the tools of war achieve their goals, their consequences are fully in the hands of those that have the intent to use them. Negative consequences are to be observed and seen as opportunities to improve the usefullness of the initial design.
Gond is a curious diety. The ritual Sacred Unmaking, where the clerics have to build all things in two's so they can wreck their newewst inventions, is an example of his destructive side. Some engineering can only be commenced after you demolish all obstacles on the projectgrounds (blow up a tower to build a new better one).
Just because I had so much fun using the inventions last session I'll prepare another one for the next:
Orgonic field perturbation inducer
Price 12000 gp; Weight 1200 lbs
This huge brass box is usually carried about on a cart or placed in the center of a flower garden. It allows plantlife within a radius of 100 feet to interact with creatures as if using a reversed speak with plants spell. Most plants are docile and rarely speak, but some flowers (especially carnivorous ones) have bad mouths and foul tempers. Plants also get more vigorous, essentially gaining a movement speed ranging from 5 to 20 ft dependant on their form as long as they stay in the perturbation field. They gain a slam attack (usually for 1d2 damage as a tiny plant). Some jungle plants under influence of an orgonic perturbation field inducer are rumored to have gained enough intelligence to allow the plants spellcasting, so beware of placing one near exotic looking plants. |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2013 : 14:44:23
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Vitrificator
Price 785 gp; Weight 8
The Vitrificator is a box weared as a backpack. It's attached with two flexible tubes that follow the arms. As a full round action, one end can absorb and suck in (semi)fluid alchemical substances (acid, entangling goo, liquor) while the other end spit out glass in various colors a round later. The user can shape the glass into useful objects if he has any skill in craft(glassblowing), profession(brewer) or has the brew potion feat.
Soothing Pendulum
Price 5 gp; Weight -
This jewelry is made with special electrum - thinaum alloy and soothes the mind when in motion. As a full round action, everyone within 10ft of the wielder gets a +2 to will saves and concentration checks as long as the motion of the pendulum is not interrupted. Some temples of Gond have enormous versions of Soothing Pendulums in perpetual motion in their grand halls (5000 gp; 80 lbs). |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2013 : 23:56:43
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How about dragon summoning bells?
Large cast gong bells which reverberate on nearly subsonic frequencies perceptible to dragons (and a few other creatures) but not to most people (aside from making them feel mildly angry and nauseated). Attach said bells to a steam-powered metronome device which can beat them regularly and ceaselessly for weeks at a time.
Insert fuel, turn device on, wait for dragon to appear. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 14 Feb 2013 : 14:21:28
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That version would be perfect for my current campaign. I'm using the Cult of the Dragon, and a dragon attracting device would be highly desirable for them. They'd use it to easily contact dragons, confiscate hoards and blackmail them into service with it. As undead they'd be immune to the draconic resonance effect. Excellent.
Liquid Ether Vial
Price 100 gp; Weight -
This semiliquid ethereal stuff is collected or conjured by intrepid planewalkes and conjurers in crystal vials. When imbibed the user is able to maintain larger summoning gates and can summon an extra extreplanar creature whenever casting a summon or calling spell in the next minute.
Etheroscope
Price 750 000 gp; Weight 15 000 lbs
This gargantuan glasssteel and brass optical device, consisting of turnable platform with multiple adjustable lenses and antennae fitted on mountaintop towers, is meant to pierce the phlogiston and see through the ethereal into distant spaces. It effectively works as a scry device with a casting time of eight hours that can cross planar boundaries, but it can provide only extremely distant views (as if at least 5 miles away from the intended target) of the ethereal landscapes it projects on its central projection surface. The device is constantly haunted by lost souls when active. |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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Calrond
Learned Scribe
USA
118 Posts |
Posted - 23 Feb 2013 : 21:59:22
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I'd imagine Gond's opinion of the use of his devices would be similar to the Lawful Neutral Mystra's opinion on the use of magic. Namely, they don't particularly care how you use it as long as you are advancing its use and not limiting others' use of it. Even in magical or mechanical "arms races", Mystra/Gond would be given more power by the overall use of the contents of their portfolios being expanded. So it's not too much of a stretch to think that Gond is not overly concerned with the implications of his inventions. The gods are playing a long game, and if one city gets obliterated by one of Gond's inventions, it would probably still lead to more reverence and more power for Gond in the long term. (Nuclear weapons being a reasonably accurate RL analogy.) |
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