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Barastir
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1600 Posts |
 Posted - 25 Jun 2012 : 13:52:39
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Fellow sages,
In the 2e Ruins of Myth Drannor boxed set, specifically in the adventure "The Wyrm Below", there is a mention to temple of a human cult to some "Aumrathar the Greater Dragon". I've already asked Ed and the lady THO about details over this cult, but I wanted to ask if someone here knows if there is anything else published or revealed about this cult, any details that I missed.
Was Aumrathar actually a dragon, an archetypical dragon, or a divine manifestation? Was it good, evil or neutral (after all, its cult was hidden, right)? If it was a dragon, to which race/color it belonged to? Was it a manifestation a Bahamut, Tiamat, or other known deity/entity? Was it a he or a she? Hope anyone can help...
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"Goodness is not a natural state, but must be
fought for to be attained and maintained.
Lead by example.
Let your deeds speak your intentions.
Goodness radiated from the heart."
The Paladin's Virtues, excerpt from the "Quentin's Monograph"
(by Ed Greenwood) |
Edited by - Barastir on 25 Jun 2012 20:14:08
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Barastir
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1600 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jun 2012 : 17:02:41
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No one can help in this? Markustay made some conjectures in Ed's scroll, but what about the other sages? There's nothing any of you can add?  |
"Goodness is not a natural state, but must be
fought for to be attained and maintained.
Lead by example.
Let your deeds speak your intentions.
Goodness radiated from the heart."
The Paladin's Virtues, excerpt from the "Quentin's Monograph"
(by Ed Greenwood) |
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xaeyruudh
Master of Realmslore
USA
1853 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jun 2012 : 19:18:34
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I'm intrigued and waiting on Ed's answer too.  |
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Barastir
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1600 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2012 : 16:45:29
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Fellow scribes, and xaeyruudh, I don't know if you noticed the answer to this question that the Lady THO brought from Ed this week:
"Aumrathar was an elder male gold dragon to whom something “happened” that his worshippers believe was ascension to divinity (but might have been empowerment by literally stumbling into ancient magic that transformed him, as some sages suggest, or the meddlings of Bahamut, Tiamat, or another draconic deity or dragon-interested god, as yet other sages have postulated).
To put it simply, it seems Aumrathar gained the ability to become any dragon type and age or either gender at will, shapeshifting as often as desired and gaining all powers and abilities of “his” assumed form (except perhaps - - mortals debate this - - not being able to gain the powers of ancient wyrms older than Aumrathar was when he “Changed”), while retaining the powers, memories, and capabilities he had before his Change. Aumrathar became a wanderer, hidden in many forms, visiting other dragons for the apparent aim of making lots of dragon babies and repopulating the Realms with dragons (of all sorts).
Some sages think this is mere meddling, or intended to break the power of human civilizations, while others think some dark deity is behind this, desiring to gain dragons as steeds, attack forces, and long-term servitors. Still others believe Aumrathar is the herald of a new age (or cycle) among dragons, and that this has nothing to do with other beings in the Realms at all (except as they’re inevitably affected by there being more hungry, power- and wealth-seeking dragons around).
Aumrathar’s cult in Myth Drannor is small, controversial, and something many don’t even want to think about, because they need to think about more immediate threats to the status quo.
The truth behind all this? Yet to be revealed, and I’d say up to individual DMs, because I can’t see the published Realms getting to addressing this anytime soon. However, I control not the Realms and see the future but poorly, so snatch up thy proverbial grains of salt and be ready, grasshopper . . . :} "
The answer, of course, brings some other questions, some of which I dared asking despite of possible NDAs. Anyway, it's a great answer, and brings some additional material to enrich our campaigns. Thanks and praises to Ed for that, and kind and warm thanks to the lady, always so gentle in bringing us those wonderful bits of lore. |
"Goodness is not a natural state, but must be
fought for to be attained and maintained.
Lead by example.
Let your deeds speak your intentions.
Goodness radiated from the heart."
The Paladin's Virtues, excerpt from the "Quentin's Monograph"
(by Ed Greenwood) |
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xaeyruudh
Master of Realmslore
USA
1853 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2012 : 17:24:52
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I did notice this, and it sounds great, though I haven't decided yet how to develop it. I rather like the idea of the cult still being around, still very "small, controversial, and something many don’t even want to think about."
I like the idea of a dragon cult (many dragon cults, actually) that's not the Cult of the Dragon. It creates an opportunity for obfuscation and misguided rumors, all increasing the insidious danger of the Cult of the Dragon.
I don't see Aumrathar's cult being evil, but perhaps not entirely good either. From a design angle it needs to be distinct from a cult of Bahamut (which also must exist in the Realms, even if just to counter the cult of Tiamat) so that neither is redundant. So I'm looking (in between lots of other things of course) for things to distinguish them from each other.
One of my favorite things about the Realms... there's so many neat things that it's impossible to ever "finish" anything. It's a great kind of impossible. |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2067 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2012 : 17:41:39
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| It also fits with the ideas of dragon cults in the 1eintro draconomicon. (And dragons of faerun). |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11809 Posts |
Posted - 18 Aug 2012 : 00:51:19
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| Interesting concept. He could be seen as the dragon fertility god, running around "preserving" certain breeds from extinction by becoming their appropriate mate. Interesting idea. Would be interesting if he didn't approve of half-dragons (as it dilutes the race). |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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xaeyruudh
Master of Realmslore
USA
1853 Posts |
Posted - 18 Aug 2012 : 01:31:58
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quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
He could be seen as the dragon fertility god
Would his cult then have ideals aimed at hastening/improving draconic procreation? More frequent matings, larger numbers of eggs, maybe increasing the number of twins or viable mutations such as two-headed dragons or more robust specimens?
Do they work for the betterment of all dragons, or just metallic dragons? Or just gold dragons? Or all reptilian things, or just dragons and dragonblood creatures?
Not trying to answer anything yet, just throwing questions out like a sloppy card dealer.
Flipside of how the cult is perceived by humans/elves/whoever... how is this cult perceived by dragons? Certainly, if there's a group of humans sincerely and successfully working toward the betterment of all/some dragons, then some dragons are going to know about it. If they only favor some dragons, it seems all other species would logically regard the cult as an enemy. Does that logic hold, or is there some overpowering reason for a different viewpoint? |
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xaeyruudh
Master of Realmslore
USA
1853 Posts |
Posted - 18 Aug 2012 : 07:43:35
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So... yea, this all got me thinking about my own sorta grist mill, and how to employ Aumrathar in a lore-generating capacity. Plunking it down in my game takes it in a different direction than the questions in my last post. None of this comes from official sources. Also, this is what might be called a rough experimental first tentative draft-idea.
In my own campaign, Aumrathar may have relevance to the last prismatic dragon still tethered to Toril.
The Alurierenthedl
According to my story, the prismatics (specifically the Alurierenthedl family) were the royalty among all dragons before the rise of the humanoid races, and as the dracorage mythal pulled their society apart these cultured titans began to lose their sense of purpose (of what value is an emperor, when there is no empire, or even a kingdom?) and they gradually faded from their tangible existence. (1)
As the Rages repeatedly tore their communities asunder, and draconic civilization seemed to be ending in an escalating series of massive bloodbaths, the Alurierenthedl crafted one final binding --an artifact, sages of today would call it-- which took the form of an enormous diamond. They never named it, or even revealed its existence, to other dragons but they did sow rumors of a time of rebirth. It would come to pass, after the time of darkness, that dragons would once more be wise and powerful, once more ruled by the benevolent and nigh-omnipotent Alurierenthedl. They gave a name to that day, which translates into many humanoid tongues as Destiny, or Fate. The event that heralds the beginning of this time, they named The Fulfillment.
The Fulfillment
Draconic scholars have been pondering and debating the Fulfillment for these many millennia. Some dragons, mostly rebellious youths, claim that the Alurierenthedl, if indeed they ever existed, are obviously no more... making Destiny and the Fulfillment so much gibberish invented by old lawful dragons to quell the young and strong and exuberant. Others assert with the quiet assurance born of faith-crystallized-by-experience that the Fulfillment is most certainly real.
When the Alurierenthedl faded from Toril, they left no decaying corpses, no great hoards of ancient coins that modern dragonkillers seek... but they did leave a legacy: gemstones of unusual size and clarity, scattered across (and under) the surface of the world. Every hue found in natural stones, and some that neither dwarves nor elves have seen in Faerun. Some say there are hundreds of these gems; others, thousands.
The Prophecy Stones
A few dragons have rediscovered prophecies that may have been ancient even in the "golden age" of draconic rule. These prophecies were found in exceptional gemstones, lying at the bottom of a deep mountain lake or buried beneath a hundred centuries of glacial deposits or glittering in the sun fastened by ignorant humans to the top of a minaret on some pitiful Caliph's palace. Many of these stones, the dragons have since learned, were discovered at various points in time and promptly locked in the vaults and treasuries of various humanoid nations. To a human, or dwarf, or elf, a gem is just a gem. However, a dragon touching one of these "prophecy stones" suddenly sees, hears, and feels another time and place. Sometimes it's a glimpse of the past; other times, it's the future. Sometimes, but only sometimes, the visions include dragons. The same vision repeats each time any dragon touches a particular stone.
The Seekers
There is a sect among the dragons, known to all but dismissed by most as doomsayers and freedom-haters. They come from all species and all ages, unified only by their faith in the eventual Fulfillment, and the subsequent Destiny of all dragons. (2) They call themselves the Seekers of Alurierenthedl, but they have many names among the unbelievers... few of them flattering.
The Seekers believe, based on the experiences of discovering and studying some of these prophecy stones, that such gems are shards of the diamond crafted by the Alurierenthedl in their most ancient of legends. The central tenet of this loose organization is that these shards must be gathered and assembled, and that when the last gem is put in place the original diamond will be reformed, and that this will constitute the Fulfillment. How that will then lead to Destiny, and exactly what consequences Destiny may have for dragons (particularly those in physical proximity to the diamond when it's completed) and for the other races of Toril is still unclear, but their resolve is unshakeable. Rather than dominating a piece of Faerun and acquiring a hoard, these dragons focus on cultivating contacts among all the races of the world... contacts who know about exceptional gemstones appearing in marketplaces and private collections.
The Seekers are hindered by the same fact that the Alurierenthedl in all their wisdom simply did not anticipate... not all dragons want to live in a glorious civilization of unity, and many dragons are strongly opposed to being ruled by anyone... particularly by a family of dragons that are so powerful no chromatic or metallic dragon could hope to defeat one, let alone bring down the entire clan and elevate himself to power. Lawful dragons tend to share the prophecies among their kind, and these shards are usually quickly found and peacefully obtained by the Seekers. Chaotic dragons, on the other hand, hide the shards after discovering that they cannot be destroyed, and attempt to slay any Seekers who inquire into the presence of a prophecy stone. (3)
Sacchaerrus, The Lastborn
Sacchaerrus is the last of the prismatic dragons, and his purpose (announced by his grandsire; the aged dragon's last words before fading out of existence) is not to rule Toril like his ancestors but to preserve the lore surrounding the original civilizations of the dragons --their languages, their history, their magic, their culture, the knowledge of their ancestral homes in the planes-- until The Fulfillment. Though he survived the vanishing of the other prismatics, his purpose was cause for much sorrow among his kin. They could not conceive of a worse curse than existing alone with no one to rule, for an unknowable time. He carries their sadness, and his grandsire's rough whisper, along with all the knowledge ever gathered by the emperors of all dragons on Toril. He remains dormant most of the time, to evade the effects of time and (until recently, depending on the timeframe under discussion) the dracorage mythal as well as those who would inevitably seek to despoil what was essentially the dragons' hope that they might once again rise to power when someone/something permanently quelled the madness that felled their ancient civilization and humbled them from philosophers and crafters to "mere" wyrms.
Aumrathar
So, for my own campaign I think perhaps Aumrathar is/was a Seeker. The powers his cult believes or has observed him to have could, in my campaign, suggest to dragons who knew of the prophecies that one had stepped beyond merely trying to assemble the prophecy stones to actually discovering and absorbing some of the lost power of the Alurierenthedl. This would make Aumrathar a target of aggression both from chaotic dragons working to suppress the Seekers and jealous Seekers hoping to steal some of his "thunder". His allies would be few, and reluctant to openly aid him.
It's also possible that Aumrathar is not changing into other dragon types/ages... but rather his identity is being used by various Seekers for some/various purpose(s). Perhaps Aumrathar rose to prominence, and then fell afoul of something, or perhaps he merely hid among his peers by encouraging others to act in his name. The Seekers may include dragons of any/all types, allowing "him" to appear all over the world and perform various tasks that might have been more difficult for him to complete in his true form.
Or, perhaps, this Aumrathar isn't a dragon at all, but is some other entity getting far too interested in draconic matters, and using a Seeker's name to lay a very compelling trap. Such a being would be a threat to all dragonkind, and would be hunted as such.
Notes
(1) I decided that the lifespan of a prismatic dragon is tied to its sense of purpose and worth, rather than an arbitrary number of years. The purpose of a prismatic dragon is announced at birth, generally by the eldest living family member. As long as its purpose burns bright, the dragon is strong. When it loses clarity, it weakens, and when there is nothing left for it to do, or if it ever deliberately and willfully rejects its purpose, it ceases to exist.
(2) Because of this, they maintain alliances with each other that defy the observed habits of their species. A silver dragon defends the lair and young of a red dragon while the red hunts for food for both of them, for example, and blue dragons converse with brass dragons openly and without malice.
(3) The shards are said to contain the essence of the positive energy plane (the source of their brilliance and clarity, according to the legends) and even if it were possible to shatter a shard, the consequences would likely be dire for the individuals(s) involved.
Thoughts? |
Edited by - xaeyruudh on 18 Aug 2012 08:02:29 |
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Aumrathar the Greater Dragon
