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Jeremy Grenemyer
Great Reader
USA
2717 Posts |
 Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 17:27:14
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What would you say the median age of the typical Forgotten Realms fan is, if we define "typical Forgotten Realms Fan" as someone who owns at least one Realms sourcebook or one Realms novel and has an active interest in the setting, whether that interest is expressed through talking about the setting online, playing the video games, demonstrated by a desire to continue buying Realms products or by the person running a D&D game set in the Realms?
Do you think the Realms fan base is both large enough and old enough to have the kind of disposable income and purchasing power to justify a $100 price tag for dense, Realmslore filled products?
You can probably guess I’m envisioning an encyclopedic series of books comprised of Ed’s home notes—and to a degree you’d be right, but the seed for my questions came from a stray thought I had at work: what if WotC went and published one of the many books written by NPCs in the Realms (quotes from which are used as chapter headers in any number of Forgotten Realms novels)?
WotC could ask Ed to write such a book, then print and bind it in the Realmsian fashion so it looks like something that could be inserted right into a future Realms movie or TV show as a prop (thus making it look totally awesome on your bookshelf) and be completely readable.
Would you be interested in something like that? How about if it cost $100?
EDIT: cleaned up the questions and wording of this post
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Look for me and my content at EN World (user name: sanishiver). |
Edited by - Jeremy Grenemyer on 11 Apr 2012 06:09:05
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6666 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 18:05:47
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I'd pay that and more for quality realmslore.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Hawkins
Great Reader
USA
2131 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 18:09:51
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| $50 is really the cap for me on any book. And if I am paying that much, I would like to have something akin to the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook in length. Also, I can only afford something like that once or twice a year. |
Errant d20 Designer - My Blog (last updated January 06, 2016)
One, two! One, two! And through and through
The vorpal blade went snicker-snack!
He left it dead, and with its head
He went galumphing back. --Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking-Glass
"Mmm, not the darkness," Myrin murmured. "Don't cast it there." --Erik Scott de Bie, Shadowbane
* My character sheets (PFRPG, 3.5, and AE versions; not viewable in Internet Explorer)
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My game design work:
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* Compendium Arcanum Volume 2: 1st-Level Spells (PFRPG, designer; d20pfsrd.com Publishing)
* Martial Arts Guidebook (forthcoming) (PFRPG, designer; Rite Publishing)
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Aulduron
Learned Scribe
USA
343 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 18:18:09
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| I'm 45 and now only buy novels. I wouldn't spend that much on a source book that's just going to be obsolete in a couple more years. |
"Those with talent become wizards, Those without talent spend their lives praying for it"
-Procopio Septus |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36802 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 19:09:11
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I've paid $75 or more for 2, maybe three game books (non-FR... One of them was Ptolus).
If it was good, quality Realmslore, with little crunch and not set in the 4E era, then I could see doing that for Realms books every 3-4 months.
I'd prefer, however, a lower price point and something more frequent.
I don't think the average age of the fanbase would support $100 sourcebooks, though. Yeah, there are a fair number of us with steady jobs and decent pay, but there's also a lot of high schoolers and 20-somethings just getting started. And even for those of us more established, there are still going to be other expenses that will take priority -- like mortgages, spouses, kids, car insurance, etc. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 10 Apr 2012 19:11:57 |
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Seravin
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1286 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 19:31:32
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The average age is probably someone who was in their teens in the 90s at some point, is my guess.
As for the expensive source material, I'd pay that and more for quality source books with great art and made from solid material for bindings/pages/etc.
Disclosure for statistical purposes of realms fans: me = age 35, started FR with Pool of Radiance on my Commodore in 86 or 87?, unmarried in ltr/childless/money to burn atm.
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 20:26:58
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| I'm 34 and own all of the source books I will ever buy (2nd Edition stuff), and now i just buy novels and am very selective about that. |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
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Delwa
Master of Realmslore
USA
1271 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 21:04:58
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I'm in my late 20's, and I'll pay about $20-30 once every three months for a good Realms book. My personal goal is all the pre-spellplague novels eventually, and source books that have more fluff, less crunch (like Volo's Guides.)
If a book is soley by Ed, I'll buy it regardless, but if it's a co-opperative work, the jury is out until I can thumb through it at my local game store.
As has been mentioned, most Realms fans I know either grew up in the 90's or are only Drizzt fans. They wouldn't know Elminster or Baldur's Gate if it were mentioned.
Most of that base in my circles are married in middle-class jobs. Spending more than $30 on something better be important, like a volume of the Realms version of Britanica. They might want the book otherwise, but affording it would be another question.
Hope my ramblings help.
Perhaps a poll would aid your query? |
- Delwa Aunglor
I am off to slay yon refrigerator and spoil it's horde. Go for the cheese, Boo!
"The Realms change; seldom at the speed desired of those who strive, but far too quickly for those who resist." - The Simbul, taken from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Conspectus |
Edited by - Delwa on 10 Apr 2012 23:05:00 |
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Jeremy Grenemyer
Great Reader
USA
2717 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 21:14:53
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quote:
Originally posted by Delwa
Hope my ramblings help.
Yes they do. 
quote:
Originally posted by Delway
Perhaps a poll would aid your query?
Hadn't thought of structuring it that way. Hrm....
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Look for me and my content at EN World (user name: sanishiver). |
Edited by - Jeremy Grenemyer on 10 Apr 2012 21:15:38 |
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Hawkins
Great Reader
USA
2131 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 21:57:30
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| BTW, for statistical purposes, I am 31 years old, married, have a 6 month old son, and way to much in the way of student loans to pay back. Also, my wife is working on getting into a nursing program. |
Errant d20 Designer - My Blog (last updated January 06, 2016)
One, two! One, two! And through and through
The vorpal blade went snicker-snack!
He left it dead, and with its head
He went galumphing back. --Lewis Carroll, Through the Looking-Glass
"Mmm, not the darkness," Myrin murmured. "Don't cast it there." --Erik Scott de Bie, Shadowbane
* My character sheets (PFRPG, 3.5, and AE versions; not viewable in Internet Explorer)
* Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document (PFRPG OGL Rules)
* The Hypertext d20 SRD (3.5 OGL Rules)
* 3.5 D&D Archives
My game design work:
* Heroes of the Jade Oath (PFRPG, conversion; Rite Publishing)
* Compendium Arcanum Volume 1: Cantrips & Orisons (PFRPG, designer; d20pfsrd.com Publishing)
* Compendium Arcanum Volume 2: 1st-Level Spells (PFRPG, designer; d20pfsrd.com Publishing)
* Martial Arts Guidebook (forthcoming) (PFRPG, designer; Rite Publishing)
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Fellfire
Master of Realmslore
1965 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 21:58:42
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| I'm in my mid-thirties. I happily paid cover price for the PF Core book and dropped a hundred and change for the leather bound 3.5 PHB. |
Misanthorpe
Love is a lie. Only hate endures. Light is blinding. Only in darkness do we see clearly.
"Oh, you think darkness is your ally? You merely adopted the dark. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn't see the light until I was already a man, by then it was nothing to me but.. blinding. The shadows betray you because they belong to me." - Bane The Dark Knight Rises
Green Dragonscale Dice Bag by Crystalsidyll - check it out
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36802 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 22:20:53
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| To add my stats... 38, married, and I have a baby boy coming up on his 1st birthday. My available funds for gaming are not nearly as copious as I should prefer. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 22:49:27
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I am 28, married with cats (and a dog), and live in Seattle proper. Disregarding necessary research expenses (i.e. books that I need to buy because I'm writing a novel in that setting or doing some design work), my disposable income/conservatism regarding funds basically limits me to a $20-30 game book every few months. I will pay $50 for a major thing every so often, but that's rare.
I don't think a $100 price point is at all feasible for a gaming sourcebook, even one with universal acclaim (which doesn't seem all that likely) or 1000 pages (which I personally would not buy, just because I can't imagine lugging something that huge around with me). But break that up into a 10 x 100 page sourcebooks for $10-$15 each, or 20 x 50 pagers for $8-$10, and you have a sustainable model.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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Jeremy Grenemyer
Great Reader
USA
2717 Posts |
Posted - 10 Apr 2012 : 23:29:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
I don't think a $100 price point is at all feasible for a gaming sourcebook, even one with universal acclaim (which doesn't seem all that likely) or 1000 pages (which I personally would not buy, just because I can't imagine lugging something that huge around with me).
I wouldn’t think so either.
However I recall (dimly—swiss cheese memory and all that) there was some recent (last year or so) success with one RPG publisher releasing a limited run of a very thick, very expensive book.
They'd promised to only sell that first print and were blown away by the fact that they’d sold all their copies. The last I heard they were still agonizing over whether to offer another print run or not.
I just wonder if WotC couldn’t do the same thing with the Realms.
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Look for me and my content at EN World (user name: sanishiver). |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36802 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 00:20:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Jeremy Grenemyer
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
I don't think a $100 price point is at all feasible for a gaming sourcebook, even one with universal acclaim (which doesn't seem all that likely) or 1000 pages (which I personally would not buy, just because I can't imagine lugging something that huge around with me).
I wouldn’t think so either.
However I recall (dimly—swiss cheese memory and all that) there was some recent (last year or so) success with one RPG publisher releasing a limited run of a very thick, very expensive book.
They'd promised to only sell that first print and were blown away by the fact that they’d sold all their copies. The last I heard they were still agonizing over whether to offer another print run or not.
I just wonder if WotC couldn’t do the same thing with the Realms.
That sounds like the reprinted Tome of Horrors. Somethign like that is a rare excecption, though... In this case, IIRC, it was a limited edition single volume collection of three out of print books.
Other than that, the only massive, $100+ tomes I know of are Ptolus, and I believe The World's Largest Dungeon. The latter was more of a gimmick, I think, but Ptolus could have been broken into maybe three books without issue.
I think Paizo's current business model of many smaller books is an effective one. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 01:11:00
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Im in my thirties.... and old enough to know that its easier now to look in what catches my eye book wise, and if I don't like it, I dont get it.
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why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
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http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 01:31:47
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For me: age 40, wife, children (ages: 10, 8, 6, 6, 5, 4, 4 currently), and recently back to college; $100 is woefully more than I would like to pay.
I like the idea of breaking something like that up into smaller volumes for a lesser price. |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31763 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 01:57:49
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I'm coming up on my thirty-fourth birthday next month, I've a long-time lady friend, and a seven-and-a-half year old daughter.
I routinely set aside at least an extra $100 from my usual gaming budget for any significant gaming-related purchases for every quarter period. That averages around an allotment of $400 a year for one single expensive gaming-related purchase every three months.
Sometimes, if there aren't any expensive purchases for a specific quarter, I'll either assign that amount over to the next quarter, or break it up and spend this extra amount on sundry gaming purchases.
So, yes, I could easily see justification for a $100 price tag on Realmslore filled products released quarterly.  |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
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Shemmy
Senior Scribe
USA
492 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 05:11:20
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33, not-single, college loans paid off, but my mortgage owns me.
There's a very true bit from the Cosby Show back in the 80's when Cosby is talking to his son, explaining to him how the real world and budgeting your income each month works. Each time he asks a question and gets an answer, he takes some of the money that Theo has, and then Theo goes a bit cheaper and takes some back. After Cosby is done, Theo holds up a handful of money and says all proudly that it's the end of the month and he still has money left. Cosby then asks, 'You plan on having a girlfriend?'. Theo says 'Well yeah, of course!'. Cosby grins and promptly takes all of the money.
Suffice to say, I have little income left over. ;)
I've purchased remarkably few books in the past few years, and no FR products since GHotR. Outside of Pathfinder and Eclipse Phase, no hardcopy RPG anything in a few years now, though a decent number of pdf copies of various games. I'd be loathe to drop more than around $50 on pretty much anything at this point. |
Shemeska the Marauder, King of the Crosstrade; voted #1 best Arcanaloth in Sigil two hundred years running by the people who know what's best for them; chant broker; prospective Sigil council member next election; and official travel agent for Chamada Holiday specials LLC.
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Old Man Harpell
Senior Scribe
USA
495 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 05:43:30
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46, married, one child (19 year old college student, also a gamer/DM), only major expense that is non-negotiable is about $4,000 of yearly property tax on our house just south of Seattle (might be less...I am barred from opening county and state tax documents).
I have tried to get my hands on 'All Things Realms', including the 4th Edition duo. My last purchase was a $15.00 supplement for Airship Pirates this last weekend at a local SF/Fantasy convention, as I already had anything Realms-related the merchants had on display.
Can they justify a $100.00 price tag? I have no idea. But I'd buy it, certainly, if it didn't completely destroy my sense of Realms lore and continuity.
- OMH |
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Jeremy Grenemyer
Great Reader
USA
2717 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 06:07:06
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Just turned 38, engaged and I've my share of debt. Other than subscribing to DDI I don't actively purchase D&D books anymore, though I'll shell out for a current Realms novel.
For me to pay $100, the book would just have to be really awesome: dense with pages, thick as two core rulebooks stacked on top of each other and written from the authentic points of view as found in a lot of the quotes in all the novel chapter headers. Some of the NPCs listed as authors seem like they'd be really cool to read more about. |
Look for me and my content at EN World (user name: sanishiver). |
Edited by - Jeremy Grenemyer on 11 Apr 2012 06:07:45 |
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Thauranil
Master of Realmslore
India
1591 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 07:41:56
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| Well I am just a 23 year old college student so I am pretty much dependent on the good graces of my parents for any purchases so p a 100$ book is just not going to get get past the approval board. |
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xedrick
Seeker
82 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 10:12:31
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I'm a [anonymous] college graduate, and I would definately buy the book you're mentioning. It would be hefty to lug around, but I would really just need it for game preparation, no reason to bring it to the gaming table. Also, its too valuable to leave my house, EVER.
It might take me a month or two to save up to buy it, but I would definately do it.
I should note, though, that it would have to be old-style lore, 2nd ed style. I personally play 3.5, but you absolutely can NOT beat the way those 2nd edition books were written. |
Edited by - xedrick on 11 Apr 2012 10:33:27 |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4688 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 10:22:11
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Well 1000 pages does not scare me, I read phone books. As to paying 100 that might be a problem, it would have to be very good. Also as another indicated it could quickly become out dated in a few years as a source book.
Age, between 8 and 80, standard answer I have provided for the last 10 or 15 years. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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xedrick
Seeker
82 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 10:41:48
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And I would want to see PURELY flavor-text style fluff. I don't want to see dice rolls or charts (other than perhaps d100s to generate random buildings, etc). This way the book doesn't go out of date, it's purely meant as intellectual stimulation along the road to game creation.
Give me maps of cities, the big ones and the small ones. Maps that I can use in my game regardless of year or edition. Maps, stores, merchants, rumors, nearby adventure sites.
I recently used the AD&D Calimport supplement to outline the city in my 3.5e game. I had everything I needed to outline everything my players ended up doing, plus way, way more. Enough more to easily come back to Calimport and have more to explore and more suprises to use to fluff my own story.
If the supplement were done in the style of these older supplements, and as large as you're talking about, as nicely produced as you're talking about, I would definately buy it.
But rest assured, I would be sitting in the armchair in the bookstore reading it for many hours before I dropped that kind of cash, especially with what's been released lately. |
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WalkerNinja
Senior Scribe
USA
575 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 12:53:23
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32 years old, married, one child, full time professional
I buy novels only since my game time has been reduced to virtually nill. |
*** A Forgotten Realms Addict since 1990 ***
Treasures of the Past, a Second Edition Play-by-Post game for and by Candlekeep Sages--http://www.rpol.net/game.cgi?gi=52011 |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 12:58:29
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I can afford it, but I am not sure it is something I would appropriate over some old LP's or something like that. I would pay that price for Greenwood, but honestly not much else by now, and even then probably only for something close to the pre-published version. One note though, I will pay extra for sturdy binding and good paper quality, but not for some "limited edition" in leather, medieval binding etc. Preferably without glossy paper or screaming colour art.
But a book "written" by a Faerunian. No I wouldn't buy that. I don't like the 1st. person form in rpg materials. |
No Canon, more stories, more Realms. |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4438 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2012 : 14:09:28
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Typical age is probably late 20's and older. I'm 29 and have only been a Realms fan for a short span (approx 12-15 years) when compared to people who've grown up with the setting, starting at the OGB. I don't even own that supplement, but nor would I want to *shrugs*.
I think a price tag that high isn't something the majority of people are going to buy, even your typical Realms fan. There are some who love collectables and would buy it in an instant, but overall if something is over $50.00 for one product then I think people might only buy it if it's greatly useful for their campaign. I know I wouldn't but it just for detailed Realmslore. |
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Darsson Spellmaker
Seeker
56 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2012 : 07:32:14
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I'm 31, in a LTR, childless, my money goes mainly to paying off student loans and splitting the monthlies on a $1700 apartment. Started playing AD&D at age 15, and stuck with it through 3.5 D&D and Pathfinder. FR has always been near and dear to my heart, I'll admit.
That said, I would buy a $100 FR sourcebook, but that would be my one and only RPG-related purchase for the next 6 months to a year.
Not sure if WoTC would consider that a sustainable business model or not. |
"Know, O mages, that there is learning, and there is wisdom, and they are very far from being the same thing."--Azuth the High One, Utterances from the Altar: Collected Verbal Manifestations of the Divine and Most Holy Lord of Spells (holy chapbook, assembled by anonymous priests of Azuth circa 1358 DR)
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11822 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2012 : 15:53:05
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| 40, divorced, no kids. Been "playing" since I was 12, though I freely admit that about the last 5 years has been dead. If the sourcebook were edition independent(i.e. realms LORE, not necessarily crunch) and dealt with pre-spellplague stuff, I'd be interested. The Grand History of the Realms is a perfect example of the kind of information, though I'd prefer a layout more along the lines of something focusing on X topic from start to finish, then Y topic, etc..... (i.e. the Grand History is a great research piece, but its not the kind of sourcebook that I'd like to see everything follow). I would however like to see the individual timelines for X topic preceding each topic like used to be done. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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gomez
Learned Scribe
Netherlands
254 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2012 : 16:26:28
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45, married, no kids, two cats.
We use euros, but I could buy a $40 book once every few months. Thiose would be sourcebooks, as I generally buy pockets for novels, which is much cheaper.
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Topic |
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How aged is the Realms fan base?
