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barbican
Acolyte

USA
5 Posts

Posted - 03 Apr 2012 :  21:38:39  Show Profile Send barbican a Private Message  Reply with Quote  Delete Topic
I am starting a campaign set in Damara in a few weeks. I would like to use the 4E Cold Lands with Yarin Frostmantle as a paranoid, weak king. Also, the threat of the Warlock Knights of Vaasa, demon-blooded Nar tribesman and Impiltur as a failed state overrun by demons all sound like fun themes.

I am rereading the 3E FR Campaign Setting sections on the Cold Lands and reading Salvatore's 2E Bloodstone Lands supplement so that I can weave cool chunks of lore into the game.

My problem is that I cannot find anything about the recent past. Are there novels or other sources of information about Yarin Frostmantle's assassination of the last Dragonbane heir? Is there anything on the rise of the Witch Knights of Vaasa?

Thanks, Realms Scholars, for helping me make a great game for my players.

Lord Karsus
Great Reader

USA
3746 Posts

Posted - 03 Apr 2012 :  21:45:42  Show Profile Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
-The design philosophy when the new 4e Forgotten Realms was released was to not fill in the 104 year interim period between the last 3e product and when the new campaign guides for 4e debuted. Since then, designers and writers have gone back in game supplements, online articles, and novels, and have begun filling in that history to varying degrees. At this point, there are still massive gaps, though, and the more peripheral areas of Faerūn- which would include Damara- still don't have too much regarding those transitory years. You're more or less on your own in that regard. The only bits I know of regarding the Bloodstone lands are the things presented in the 4e campaign guides and an online article about the Warlock Knights- since you've reference both, though, it seems like you are aware of them, and presumably have already referenced them.

(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)

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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author

USA
4598 Posts

Posted - 03 Apr 2012 :  23:42:56  Show Profile  Visit Erik Scott de Bie's Homepage Send Erik Scott de Bie a Private Message  Reply with Quote
We ran a brief stint through Damara in a campaign I'm playing in, wherein King Frostmantle was actually bound into a contract through an iron ring from one of the Warlock Knights. That's a neat concept to add intrigue to your game: the PCs find a ring that binds multiple people, and they have to hunt them down one by one?

As for the history, alas, no, we don't have a lot of canonical history as yet presented. I suggest you fill in what you need from your own invention, at least until we get an actual DDI article or print product.

Cheers

Erik Scott de Bie

'Tis easier to destroy than to create.

Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars"
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barbican
Acolyte

USA
5 Posts

Posted - 03 Apr 2012 :  23:56:53  Show Profile Send barbican a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie

We ran a brief stint through Damara in a campaign I'm playing in, wherein King Frostmantle was actually bound into a contract through an iron ring from one of the Warlock Knights. That's a neat concept to add intrigue to your game: the PCs find a ring that binds multiple people, and they have to hunt them down one by one?

As for the history, alas, no, we don't have a lot of canonical history as yet presented. I suggest you fill in what you need from your own invention, at least until we get an actual DDI article or print product.

Cheers



Thanks, that Vaasan mind control ring is a great idea. Totally going to use it to get the party to take a tour of the realm and draw way too much attention to themselves.

BTW, I am ordering Ghostwalkers when I get done with all of my campaign prep reading. The synopsis sounded great.
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Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
7989 Posts

Posted - 04 Apr 2012 :  01:37:04  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ghostwalker is a great Realms novel, and 2E FR9: Bloodstone Lands is probably the best source of lore for the area. The 1E H1-4: Bloodstone Series contain only skeletal lore and are entirely optional. I transposed GAZ10: Orcs of Thar (a Mystara product) into my Realms so plenty of orcs, ogres, and goblinoids spill over to my Bloodstone areas; the grim, swarthy people of the region as often have orc blood as fiend blood somewhere in their lineage ... so I have a little difficulty imagining the area any different way.

A century between settings could mean all sorts of fiendish activity unknown to the outside world. Again, I found a non-canon but excellent fit with an unusual (but not ridiculous) density of cambions, alu-fiends, tieflings, githyanki, genasi, and other planar outsiders ... there is just something about the Cold Lands region which seems to attract such activity.

[/Ayrik]
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sfdragon
Great Reader

2285 Posts

Posted - 04 Apr 2012 :  01:55:07  Show Profile Send sfdragon a Private Message  Reply with Quote
ws there not a ddi article on the warlock knights.... where the last dragonbane heir is listed???

why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power


My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
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barbican
Acolyte

USA
5 Posts

Posted - 04 Apr 2012 :  02:03:17  Show Profile Send barbican a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by sfdragon

ws there not a ddi article on the warlock knights.... where the last dragonbane heir is listed???




There is. It is by Brian James whose work I like a lot. Great threads in there. He makes the last heir of Dragonsbane a Warlock Knight that does not know his ancestry and sketches out a lot of NPC's on the Vaasan side of the border that have inspired me.

[The article is from Dungeon 177]
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Diffan
Great Reader

USA
4471 Posts

Posted - 04 Apr 2012 :  04:58:11  Show Profile Send Diffan a Private Message  Reply with Quote
While the novels in Richard Baker's series "Blades of the Moonsea" trilogy don't necessarily focus on Damara, it definitly has Warlock Knight's as antagonists and focuses around some of their plots in the series. Basically they want to expand their regions into the Moonsea and are willing to play both sides and do whatever under-handed things to get it. This series is set in 1479 DR (or post-Spellplague).

Also, R.A. Salvatore's "Sellswords Trilogy" is set 2/3 in Damara (the first book isn't). While it's set pre-Spellplague (1370's I believe), It does give a person a good idea of some aspects of Damaran life and other possible tid-bits into that region.

But really, there isn't much on the recent past do what what Lord Karsus mentions, it's done so in a way that allows you to make up whatever you want to fullfill your campaign needs. But a better question is, how can we help fill in those gaps to make it awesome for you?

Diffan's NPG Generator: FR NPC Generator
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Ayrik
Great Reader

Canada
7989 Posts

Posted - 04 Apr 2012 :  05:26:18  Show Profile Send Ayrik a Private Message  Reply with Quote
One character in Troy Denning's Return of the Archwizards trilogy is from Vaasa and sometimes describes small patches of it in her recollections. I'm hesitant to recommend the trilogy, even though it heralded the return of the Shadovar (and the phaerimm) it still ended up being an overall disappointment to me. Darksword (also by Troy Denning) from the Realms of Shadow anthology is a much better telling of a related tale set in Vaasa.

[/Ayrik]
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Brimstone
Great Reader

USA
3290 Posts

Posted - 04 Apr 2012 :  23:50:23  Show Profile Send Brimstone a Private Message  Reply with Quote
The Chosen of Nedawen is set in Narfel. It has some lore for the region. I enjoyed the series myself.

"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader

USA
3746 Posts

Posted - 05 Apr 2012 :  01:41:47  Show Profile Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
-Parts of it. Huge chunks have been in the Plane of Faerie in my reading, so far. Have to admit, it's annoying.

(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)

Elves of Faerūn
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 05 Apr 2012 :  21:51:47  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I applaud what Rich Baker was doing there - the Warlock Knights were his creation (and one of the best things to come out of 4e) - and the idea that Vassa wanted a port on the Moonsea makes so much sense... I'm almost embarrased I never thought of that myself - its bloody brilliant (and very realistic). If I were to run a 4e (5e?) FR campaign, I would give them Sulasspryn, and allow them to use the already-existing (canonically) tunnels beneath the mountain range. I'd also make the city have 'drow ghetto', just because that would be kewl, and make sense (the drow had to have given permission - and made some deal- with the knights to rebuild the place). I'd also leave-in some of the thing RB did to it (don't go out at night!)

quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik

One character in Troy Denning's Return of the Archwizards trilogy is from Vaasa and sometimes describes small patches of it in her recollections. I'm hesitant to recommend the trilogy, even though it heralded the return of the Shadovar (and the phaerimm) it still ended up being an overall disappointment to me. Darksword (also by Troy Denning) from the Realms of Shadow anthology is a much better telling of a related tale set in Vaasa.
There was short-story based around the a character from the RotAW series, who travelled in early Vassa (having just beenn released from the glacier around that time), with some bizarre mud-swimmers living in the bogs (I've connected them to the batrachi in my own campaign - some ancient eggs that hatched, and they are now a very primitive, savage culture, nothing like their glorious past). If I had to guess, I'd say that short-story was in Realms of Infamy*

At the end of the story, the main character is using at least one local tribe (likely an offshoot of the proto-Netherse barbarian culture, related to the barbarians of The Ride) to help him forge a bunch of swords, which has something to do with the RotAW trilogy, if I'm not mistaken (I own it, but have never read it). Not sure if it was something I got from the story, or something I came up with on my own, but I spun-it (in my personal musings) that there was something in the area he needed for the forging (a rare mineral, perhaps? Maybe some of that stuff - Ironfel - the Warlock Knights later became known for?)


*I stand corrected, it was indeed in Realms of Shadows.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 05 Apr 2012 21:59:01
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader

USA
3746 Posts

Posted - 05 Apr 2012 :  21:54:13  Show Profile Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
-That is the story in Realms of Shadows.

(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)

Elves of Faerūn
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Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 05 Apr 2012 :  21:56:53  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ahh, okay.

That was another of the "Realms of..." titles I owned - thanks for the correction (and I must have missed Ayrik's pointing of it out).

EDIT: Now that I think about it, I actually DON'T think I ever owned Realms of Shadows - it must have appeared in one of the 'best of' anthologies as well.

EDIT2: It was also in The Best of the Realms, which is where I must have seen it. I avoided the RotAW series, so I knew I also would have avoided the accompanying anthology.

I'm not a Denning fan.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 05 Apr 2012 22:04:51
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader

USA
3746 Posts

Posted - 05 Apr 2012 :  22:22:41  Show Profile Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
-That was in Best of the Realms? Not that it was a bad story or anything, but I really don't consider it among the best short stories that the novel-line had to offer. I don't have Best of the Realms since I have most of the individual anthology collections: Does the book, would you and anyone else consider, really include the best short stories that were available at the time of the book's publishing, or is it more...political, with every author who was employed/contracted with WotC getting an entry, and basically acting as a showcase for their best, as opposed to just the best?

(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)

Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
15724 Posts

Posted - 05 Apr 2012 :  23:02:19  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Its more of a "who's who" of favorite company authors, to be honest. Dennings stories make it into many anthologies, and I can't for the life of me figure out why (not that they are bad stories - its just that nothing he writes feels like it takes place in the Realms).

The only annoying thing was that there were 3 stories I had already paid for in other books, but whatever. I would still highly recommend the anthologies - all of them - because of the 'small' feel of them. You get to view the Realms in little glimpses, without a moon falling on your head, or an army of elves, or an ancient city reappearing, etc, etc, etc...

The anthologies makes you realize that everyone in the Realms has a story, not just the 'movers & shakers'.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 05 Apr 2012 23:03:07
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader

USA
3746 Posts

Posted - 06 Apr 2012 :  17:41:37  Show Profile Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

The only annoying thing was that there were 3 stories I had already paid for in other books, but whatever. I would still highly recommend the anthologies - all of them - because of the 'small' feel of them. You get to view the Realms in little glimpses, without a moon falling on your head, or an army of elves, or an ancient city reappearing, etc, etc, etc...

-That's why I never got the original Best of the Realms book. I have most of the other books, so I have most of the other stories. Elaine Cunningham's anthology of short stories, I had about half of the ones that were printed, but that one was worth buying, just for the stuff I didn't. For those into Ed Greenwood's fiction, his anthology too, I am sure.

quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

The anthologies makes you realize that everyone in the Realms has a story, not just the 'movers & shakers'.


-That's exactly why I like the Realms of... books. We get to see places or timelines that we generally wouldn't get to see in such an 'intimate' way (ancient history, specific events, obscure places, etc.), and we get to see characters that generally otherwise probably wouldn't be strong enough to carry their own stand-alone book or series. One of my favorite Forgotten Realms short stories was the one in Realms of the Dragons about the Dragon Turtle. How often do we see Dragon Turtles, and it'd take a pretty good author to turn a Dragon Turtle into a main character who could carry an entire book or series.

(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)

Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium

Edited by - Lord Karsus on 06 Apr 2012 17:42:51
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barbican
Acolyte

USA
5 Posts

Posted - 07 Apr 2012 :  03:18:45  Show Profile Send barbican a Private Message  Reply with Quote
So I have the 2nd Ed Bloodstone Lands supplement. I really would like to use some of the ideas about the competition between the barons and dukes as well as their adversarial relationship with the Damaran king.

I understand that there may be nothing written about the political situation during the reign of King Yarin Frostmantle. However, I was hoping that some of you might have good ideas about how to draw those threads from the 2E supplement to the 4E campaign guide.

About 120 years have passed, so 5-6 generations of rulers in peaceful realms or 10-20 successions and coups could have taken place in more chaotic ones. Still, I want the feeling of each barony and duchy to stay close to what it was before.

Some ideas: (comments would be appreciated)

-Barony of Bloodstone is now the Vaasan Sunderland so that can be set aside.

-Arcata has a mixed legacy of loyalty and rebellion, but I would like to have the Bloodstone refugees there stiffen Damaran patriotism. They work to defend the land and oppose the king without hurting the kingdom.

-I imagine Morov to be the source of King Yarin's wealth and power. The cities of Helgabal and Morov are interested in money and privilege so they support the openhanded king while the borders are insecure.

-Baroness Sylvia of Ostel is still in power. A 14th level magic user appointed by Zhengyi himself, she got her hands on a lesser version of the Witch King's ritual for lichdom. She has subverted the Church of Ilmater in her land to become a corrupt, money-grubbing mockery of what it should be. She is one of the pillars propping up the king who turns a blind eye to her necromancers and undead armies. She is trying to weaken Damara just enough to take it over without handing it over to a Vaasan invasion.

-In Soravia, Olwen Forrestfriend became the Duke. His dynasty is strong. A great-great-great-granddaughter who is an accomplished ranger is the Duchess. The region has good relations with the wilder races and the Fey. They are the most openly hostile region against the kings as the rural area is a bastion of traditional Damaran values.

-Brandiar suffered the worst in the wars against Zhengyi, and now it is on the frontier with Vaasa. Also, maintaining the Damaran gate falls to them. I think all of the pressure would cause even a good leader to overstep. The Duke of Brandiar is now a totally military man who taxes and conscripts his lands to the breaking point. He does not like the king, but Yarin is an occasional source of manpower and funds so the Duke will put up with anything. A good man goes bad by thinking that the ends justify the means.

-Carmathan suffered the chaos of a pretender to the throne over a century ago and as a result rejected hereditary rulers altogether. It operates as a rudimentary and limited republic within the framework of the Damaran kingdom. It is a wealthy region that is not much threatened, but it is also not very motivated to turn over its considerable resources to help the rest of Damara.

-Polten was brought down by the evil adviser Zorth. The problems of Impiltur have flooded into Polten with cults of demon worshipers, fiends, and thieves guilds terrorizing the populace. King Yarin has appointed a Baron/governor who is a glorified tax collector. Dunlevy the 27th is a sort of Robin Hood/Impilturan Demonslayer living in the Dunswood fighting a guerilla war against the Baron, the king, the demons, the cults, and the thieves.
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist

USA
12096 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2012 :  19:30:05  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
One thing I didn't realize until just recently was how much the Damara of FR resembles George R.R. Martin's Seven Kingdoms in Game of Thrones (there's the wall, above which are the wild people and undead, then below the noble northmen, then the "southerners" are mostly schemers in cahoots). Both came out around the same time, so I'm not sure if there's influence between the two or not. For 4th edition, it wouldn't help as much, but if you were running a Damara from 3rd edition, I'd recommend reading the Song of Fire & Ice series.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist

USA
12096 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2012 :  19:58:34  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by barbican

So I have the 2nd Ed Bloodstone Lands supplement. I really would like to use some of the ideas about the competition between the barons and dukes as well as their adversarial relationship with the Damaran king.

I understand that there may be nothing written about the political situation during the reign of King Yarin Frostmantle. However, I was hoping that some of you might have good ideas about how to draw those threads from the 2E supplement to the 4E campaign guide.

About 120 years have passed, so 5-6 generations of rulers in peaceful realms or 10-20 successions and coups could have taken place in more chaotic ones. Still, I want the feeling of each barony and duchy to stay close to what it was before.

Some ideas: (comments would be appreciated)

-Barony of Bloodstone is now the Vaasan Sunderland so that can be set aside.

-Arcata has a mixed legacy of loyalty and rebellion, but I would like to have the Bloodstone refugees there stiffen Damaran patriotism. They work to defend the land and oppose the king without hurting the kingdom.

-I imagine Morov to be the source of King Yarin's wealth and power. The cities of Helgabal and Morov are interested in money and privilege so they support the openhanded king while the borders are insecure.

-Baroness Sylvia of Ostel is still in power. A 14th level magic user appointed by Zhengyi himself, she got her hands on a lesser version of the Witch King's ritual for lichdom. She has subverted the Church of Ilmater in her land to become a corrupt, money-grubbing mockery of what it should be. She is one of the pillars propping up the king who turns a blind eye to her necromancers and undead armies. She is trying to weaken Damara just enough to take it over without handing it over to a Vaasan invasion.

-In Soravia, Olwen Forrestfriend became the Duke. His dynasty is strong. A great-great-great-granddaughter who is an accomplished ranger is the Duchess. The region has good relations with the wilder races and the Fey. They are the most openly hostile region against the kings as the rural area is a bastion of traditional Damaran values.

-Brandiar suffered the worst in the wars against Zhengyi, and now it is on the frontier with Vaasa. Also, maintaining the Damaran gate falls to them. I think all of the pressure would cause even a good leader to overstep. The Duke of Brandiar is now a totally military man who taxes and conscripts his lands to the breaking point. He does not like the king, but Yarin is an occasional source of manpower and funds so the Duke will put up with anything. A good man goes bad by thinking that the ends justify the means.

-Carmathan suffered the chaos of a pretender to the throne over a century ago and as a result rejected hereditary rulers altogether. It operates as a rudimentary and limited republic within the framework of the Damaran kingdom. It is a wealthy region that is not much threatened, but it is also not very motivated to turn over its considerable resources to help the rest of Damara.

-Polten was brought down by the evil adviser Zorth. The problems of Impiltur have flooded into Polten with cults of demon worshipers, fiends, and thieves guilds terrorizing the populace. King Yarin has appointed a Baron/governor who is a glorified tax collector. Dunlevy the 27th is a sort of Robin Hood/Impilturan Demonslayer living in the Dunswood fighting a guerilla war against the Baron, the king, the demons, the cults, and the thieves.




I think you should change around Baroness Sylvia of Ostel a bit. Don't have her be a lich, but let her still be around. Maybe she found a way to steal youth. Maybe she swaps bodies. But, keep her alive, and don't let the players know HOW she's alive. Also, don't tie her to the undead. Her key to power was that she was liked by the nobility of Ostel, and no nobility is going to like some necromancer who is creating undead. Make her an enchanter of some sort (I don't speak 4E, in 3E I'd make her a bard/mage mix who uses her bard's healing and her enchantment magic to endear her to her people). Make her just as scheming and political as she ever was. Then, perhaps she's taken in Thayan refugees from the schools of enchantment and illusion.

Also, I'd statt'd up Myrrdin Viligoth (the renegade red wizard turned follower of Ilmater) for 3E, but his story itself makes for a great NPC. I don't see him alive in the year you propose, BUT I could see him as possibly an interesting "ghost" NPC. The fact that he summoned sunhorses from the last rays of the sun each night and then rode around with the twilight riders defending the people of Damara from the evils of the night... well, he'd be a perfect NPC down in Polten. He was minorly written up in bloodstone lands, but I gave him more history which you can read at the link below. The visual imagery of a ghostly rider on the back of a flaming horse at night would be sure to throw your players for a loop, especially when they realize he's come to their aid.

http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=7576

http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=7576

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader

USA
3746 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2012 :  21:48:17  Show Profile Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas

One thing I didn't realize until just recently was how much the Damara of FR resembles George R.R. Martin's Seven Kingdoms in Game of Thrones (there's the wall, above which are the wild people and undead, then below the noble northmen, then the "southerners" are mostly schemers in cahoots). Both came out around the same time, so I'm not sure if there's influence between the two or not.

-You know, I never noticed that either. Icy lands, undead savages, bastions of civilization around them, they're pretty common fantasy tropes, but that's an interesting observation.

(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)

Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist

USA
12096 Posts

Posted - 12 Apr 2012 :  21:53:15  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus

quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas

One thing I didn't realize until just recently was how much the Damara of FR resembles George R.R. Martin's Seven Kingdoms in Game of Thrones (there's the wall, above which are the wild people and undead, then below the noble northmen, then the "southerners" are mostly schemers in cahoots). Both came out around the same time, so I'm not sure if there's influence between the two or not.

-You know, I never noticed that either. Icy lands, undead savages, bastions of civilization around them, they're pretty common fantasy tropes, but that's an interesting observation.



Yeah, well, when I saw Hodor carrying Bran.... and I thought about the gnome that rides around on a barbarian's back.... I think Martin may have slightly influenced the product, even if the author didn't realize it. There were a couple other things that came to mind as I read it. Could be wrong, but there were some similarities.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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coach
Senior Scribe

USA
479 Posts

Posted - 25 May 2012 :  03:58:38  Show Profile Send coach a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

I applaud what Rich Baker was doing there - the Warlock Knights were his creation (and one of the best things to come out of 4e) - and the idea that Vassa wanted a port on the Moonsea makes so much sense... I'm almost embarrased I never thought of that myself - its bloody brilliant (and very realistic). If I were to run a 4e (5e?) FR campaign, I would give them Sulasspryn, and allow them to use the already-existing (canonically) tunnels beneath the mountain range. I'd also make the city have 'drow ghetto', just because that would be kewl, and make sense (the drow had to have given permission - and made some deal- with the knights to rebuild the place). I'd also leave-in some of the thing RB did to it (don't go out at night!)

quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik

One character in Troy Denning's Return of the Archwizards trilogy is from Vaasa and sometimes describes small patches of it in her recollections. I'm hesitant to recommend the trilogy, even though it heralded the return of the Shadovar (and the phaerimm) it still ended up being an overall disappointment to me. Darksword (also by Troy Denning) from the Realms of Shadow anthology is a much better telling of a related tale set in Vaasa.
There was short-story based around the a character from the RotAW series, who travelled in early Vassa (having just beenn released from the glacier around that time), with some bizarre mud-swimmers living in the bogs (I've connected them to the batrachi in my own campaign - some ancient eggs that hatched, and they are now a very primitive, savage culture, nothing like their glorious past). If I had to guess, I'd say that short-story was in Realms of Infamy*

At the end of the story, the main character is using at least one local tribe (likely an offshoot of the proto-Netherse barbarian culture, related to the barbarians of The Ride) to help him forge a bunch of swords, which has something to do with the RotAW trilogy, if I'm not mistaken (I own it, but have never read it). Not sure if it was something I got from the story, or something I came up with on my own, but I spun-it (in my personal musings) that there was something in the area he needed for the forging (a rare mineral, perhaps? Maybe some of that stuff - Ironfel - the Warlock Knights later became known for?)


*I stand corrected, it was indeed in Realms of Shadows.



in the real story he actually DID need something from the area. The tribe itself.

He made the darkswords but they were lacking the final step, which was the essence of an individual tribe member who freely chose to use the sword

The tribe was used somewhat because they had a need (to fight against the dragonborn/dragonmen) and Melevaunt offered the swords as a way they could finally fight back

he built a tower, i believe called the Granite Tower

i'll have to check my notes

and the chick's name in RotA is Vala ... a descendant from the original tribe from the short story

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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
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Posted - 25 May 2012 :  14:32:18  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'm reading RotAW now, so I finally know who this 'Melvaunt' guy is. Damn shame he got got killed - I really liked him (better then any of the other Shades). And he died in such a useless manner....

Vassa & Damara: The wall thing (from both) are taken from the RW Hadrian's Wall, and all the lore - both folklore and accurate - surrounding it, including the cold climate.

As for the rest - FR authors have been known to borrow liberally from other stories all the time (The Watercourse trilogy, Mage in the Iron mask, Obsidian Ridge, etc) - I just didn't realize RAS did it too. I guess if you are going to steal ideas, might as well steal from the best (although Obsidian Ridge was based on the movie Krull, which wasn't exactly a classic).

Ohhhh... and then there was the Headless Zhent.

quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus

-Parts of it. Huge chunks have been in the Plane of Faerie in my reading, so far. Have to admit, it's annoying.
Is that series 4e?

Mark Sehestedt seems to love tackling the same exact subject matters I love most about FR (must be the name), and this trilogy looks interesting, but I'd really rather not bother with any more 4e stories - the era simply holds no interest for me.

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 25 May 2012 14:40:03
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coach
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USA
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Posted - 30 May 2012 :  22:12:40  Show Profile Send coach a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone

The Chosen of Nedawen is set in Narfel. It has some lore for the region. I enjoyed the series myself.



The main area in the books is centered around a Damaran outpost fortress called Highwatch

it is in the Giantspire Mountains on the Narfell side

th etrilogy does go back and forth between Faerun and Feywild

the hobgoblin tribes in the area come into play also

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coach
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USA
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Posted - 30 May 2012 :  22:20:14  Show Profile Send coach a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

I applaud what Rich Baker was doing there - the Warlock Knights were his creation (and one of the best things to come out of 4e) - and the idea that Vassa wanted a port on the Moonsea makes so much sense... I'm almost embarrased I never thought of that myself - its bloody brilliant (and very realistic). If I were to run a 4e (5e?) FR campaign, I would give them Sulasspryn, and allow them to use the already-existing (canonically) tunnels beneath the mountain range.


I ran a campaign in the 1990's and had King Dragonsbane extending and widening the tunnels for a hybrid overland/underground caravan route from Bloodstone Pass through Darmshall to Sulasspryn. It was my players main goal to ensure that that commerce route came to be. Gareth wanted a seaport city in his Kingdom. Neat campaign stuff when the powers that be got concerned about the power of another regional power wanting access to the Moonsea (especially back in pre-spellplague time when the powers that be on the Moonsea meant something)

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coach
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Posted - 30 May 2012 :  22:30:37  Show Profile Send coach a Private Message  Reply with Quote
barbican,

i have mapped and labeled the first floor of the Vaasan Wall if you want that

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barbican
Acolyte

USA
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Posted - 30 May 2012 :  22:56:57  Show Profile Send barbican a Private Message  Reply with Quote
That would be great. Should I send you my email through PM or is it in the forums somewhere?

Campaign Update...

The players are 4th level. They have tangled with the lowest tier of the coalition of Citadel of Assassins and Banite faction of Warlock Knights. They got their hands of an Ironfell Ring that has many Damaran nobles bound to it. They are about to go off hunting these people down thinking that they are killing spies who are providing intel for the Vaasan invasion. After they have taken out half a dozen, they will find out that all of the people in the ring worship Orcus. Hopefully, they will think that it is all one big conspiracy for a few sessions before they learn that Bane has inspired the Vaasan invasion of Damara simply to oppose Orcus' big move to get revenge on the Damarans for the loss of his wand by opening dozens of gates from the Abyss all over the region. The nobles bound to the ring have been turned by the Vaasans to provide information about the activities of their cults.

Notes:

1. I know that the Citadel of Assassins was part of Team Orcus in the 2nd Ed supplement, but I wanted them to evolve into a Lawful Evil philosophical/mercenary guild that plays puppet master with the region's politicians and criminals.

2. A smaller invasion of a devil-worshiping tribe of Nars has just started in the east. When the PC's get back to Ironspur, they will see the first wave of refugees fleeing Steppenhall. After the party stabilizes the situation, I want to give them a few levels to pursue their own interests. Then, one big army from Vaasa besieges the Damaran wall while Vaasan commandos come over the mountains to harass behind the lines. PC's will be asked to be among the commandos going the other way.

Edited by - barbican on 30 May 2012 22:59:33
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist

USA
12096 Posts

Posted - 25 Jun 2012 :  02:32:22  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by barbican

That would be great. Should I send you my email through PM or is it in the forums somewhere?

Campaign Update...

The players are 4th level. They have tangled with the lowest tier of the coalition of Citadel of Assassins and Banite faction of Warlock Knights. They got their hands of an Ironfell Ring that has many Damaran nobles bound to it. They are about to go off hunting these people down thinking that they are killing spies who are providing intel for the Vaasan invasion. After they have taken out half a dozen, they will find out that all of the people in the ring worship Orcus. Hopefully, they will think that it is all one big conspiracy for a few sessions before they learn that Bane has inspired the Vaasan invasion of Damara simply to oppose Orcus' big move to get revenge on the Damarans for the loss of his wand by opening dozens of gates from the Abyss all over the region. The nobles bound to the ring have been turned by the Vaasans to provide information about the activities of their cults.

Notes:

1. I know that the Citadel of Assassins was part of Team Orcus in the 2nd Ed supplement, but I wanted them to evolve into a Lawful Evil philosophical/mercenary guild that plays puppet master with the region's politicians and criminals.

2. A smaller invasion of a devil-worshiping tribe of Nars has just started in the east. When the PC's get back to Ironspur, they will see the first wave of refugees fleeing Steppenhall. After the party stabilizes the situation, I want to give them a few levels to pursue their own interests. Then, one big army from Vaasa besieges the Damaran wall while Vaasan commandos come over the mountains to harass behind the lines. PC's will be asked to be among the commandos going the other way.




I forget what exactly happened, but at some point in his novels in the area, the Jarlaxle ends up making some deals with the citadel of Assassins. Might be worth scanning for that.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist

USA
12096 Posts

Posted - 25 Jun 2012 :  02:32:53  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by barbican

That would be great. Should I send you my email through PM or is it in the forums somewhere?

Campaign Update...

The players are 4th level. They have tangled with the lowest tier of the coalition of Citadel of Assassins and Banite faction of Warlock Knights. They got their hands of an Ironfell Ring that has many Damaran nobles bound to it. They are about to go off hunting these people down thinking that they are killing spies who are providing intel for the Vaasan invasion. After they have taken out half a dozen, they will find out that all of the people in the ring worship Orcus. Hopefully, they will think that it is all one big conspiracy for a few sessions before they learn that Bane has inspired the Vaasan invasion of Damara simply to oppose Orcus' big move to get revenge on the Damarans for the loss of his wand by opening dozens of gates from the Abyss all over the region. The nobles bound to the ring have been turned by the Vaasans to provide information about the activities of their cults.

Notes:

1. I know that the Citadel of Assassins was part of Team Orcus in the 2nd Ed supplement, but I wanted them to evolve into a Lawful Evil philosophical/mercenary guild that plays puppet master with the region's politicians and criminals.

2. A smaller invasion of a devil-worshiping tribe of Nars has just started in the east. When the PC's get back to Ironspur, they will see the first wave of refugees fleeing Steppenhall. After the party stabilizes the situation, I want to give them a few levels to pursue their own interests. Then, one big army from Vaasa besieges the Damaran wall while Vaasan commandos come over the mountains to harass behind the lines. PC's will be asked to be among the commandos going the other way.




I forget what exactly happened, but at some point in his novels in the area, the Jarlaxle ends up making some deals with the citadel of Assassins. Might be worth scanning for that.

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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coach
Senior Scribe

USA
479 Posts

Posted - 11 Jul 2012 :  06:55:24  Show Profile Send coach a Private Message  Reply with Quote
yeah i didn't like how the novels treated Knellict of the CoA

he was an epic wizard and the drow just popped in on him and said do it this way and like it

RAS himself labeled Knellict as perhaps "the most dangerous man in the Realms" and then just slapped him around in the novel

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