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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
 Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 03:40:36
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Lets go get some non evil drow females to dance nekid in a ring of dread and have some male drow rogues steal their clothes.
Namely Eilistraee and Vhaerun.
Presume for a moment that Vhaerun only was tricked by either himself or his sister and she stole his divinity and his portfolios reducing the MAsked Lord to an archfey and Eilistraee at the end of the game just gave up her divinity to Lolth and became an archfey as well.
both of them would be in the feywild. what if they fassioned two rods to the ring of dread similiar to the one in the hands of whats her name the crazy elf lich and then use them inside the ring of dread outside Neverwinter and steal back their divinity and portfolios. Assume they succede and become deities again.
would such a thing be feesable to help repair the rift for 5e realms?
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why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 03:46:16
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here's the dread ring reason
the dark three.... the dead three
Bane Bhaal and MYrkul.
Bhaal is gone, Myrkul is in Skullport still kicking back in his crown of horns( really old man, go posses Cyric and while the realms will still hate you, they will toast you for murdering the god of murder whil he's sitting on his ultimate torliet.)
Bane is still here. Bane would know that when he told it to Sass TAnn that there might need to be more than just one trying to vie for power of godhood this way.
Assuming Vhaerun and Eilistraeee are archfey, they could manufacture the rods attuned to the dread ring. use it to steal their divinity back.
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why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 03:49:39
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Szass Tam would stop at nothing to prevent the 'theft' of his Dread Rings. Besides, no other being knows how they operate, except Malark Springhill, who's already dead. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3745 Posts |
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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 04:26:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
-What is a Dread Ring exactly, to begin with?
It is the monolithic structure that Szass constructed in Thay to become a god and failed whiping out most if not all of the THayan population.
IIRC he activated it right as the spell plague hits or around the time it hit and EPIC FAIL happened.
He has since had a second one contructed and was using it to syphon power from the sleeping primordial in the glauntaglymm mines.
Read RAS Neverwinter series for details. |
why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
Edited by - sfdragon on 26 Mar 2012 05:50:53 |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3745 Posts |
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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 04:30:29
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asuming they are truly dead LK... it wouldnt.
raising them from archfey back to deity status is all it would do.....
I think my keyboard sticks...... |
why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
Edited by - sfdragon on 26 Mar 2012 04:30:54 |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 04:36:52
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quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
-What is a Dread Ring exactly, to begin with?
To quote myself:
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Thelonius
I'm actually reading Gauntlgrym and I've seen references to something called "Dread Rings" I don't know what are they and what is it's purpose, though I think It has to be with achieving godhood. As I read novels with no order maybe this is explained in some source I haven't seen. I also used the forums search tool but found nothing, besides the godhood reference by ESB in a 4E thread. Could someone give a quick explanation of what they are?
As Arik noted. In addition, the Dread Rings are not just the stone walls and bastions. They are more like a focus point. The real Dread Rings are the complex webs of inexhaustible power. Here's an explanation from the novel Unholy:
quote:
Last but most clearly of all, she discerned the Dread Ring itself like a festering wound in the earth. Like a well of unnatural and inexhaustible power. Arcing away from it were lines of force linking it to other such talismans, defining an immense dark circle of death on the face of the land.
That was the Dread Ring that Jhesrhi and her allies had to destroy. Not the stone walls and bastions, although some of those might crack and crumble as an incidental effect of their assault, for battlements and towers could be rebuilt. They had to attack the concept, the potential of the Ring. If they could obliterate that, it would spoil the whole pattern, and none of the similar castles scattered across Thay would serve its intended purpose anymore.
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Every beginning has an end. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 04:39:40
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quote:
Originally posted by sfdragon
IIRC he activated it right has the spell plague hit and EPIC FAIL happened.
Not quite. The Dread Rings' failure has nothing to do with the Spellplauge. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 05:12:04
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I'd have to re-read, but I recall Malark's apparent death was not absolutely certain. Still, even if he did certainly die, the dead of the Realms are able to answer questions and volunteer information. They can even be conversed with on the Fugue Plane (or wherever they might be), they can be reanimated as undead, they can be resurrected or reincarnated back to life. So there's always a chance at any point in the future that Malark and his knowledge of the ritual can be restored ... unless his eternal soul has somehow been eternally and irrevocably destroyed.
And of course Malark learned this information from extensive direct contact with Szass Tam, it's not utterly impossible for others to do the same.
And - considering the fate of the entire Realms might be at risk - it would be foolish to assume that Szass is the only wizard with sufficient patience, focus, power, and resources to be able to learn the ritual. Whatever sources of information he used could be found and deciphered by others.
Drow wizards have enough longevity, arrogance, and potential alliances or patronage of extraplanar powers to be likely candidates for divining this ritual. Likely a different version more suited their own agenda. Although I really doubt any group of non-evil drow would be very interested in the Dread Rings, outside of devising a ritual to destroy or deactivate them. Considering that Szass (and all of Thay) would oppose them, they'd need a very compelling reason to dedicate so much time to the effort. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 05:29:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
Considering that Szass (and all of Thay) would oppose them, they'd need a very compelling reason to dedicate so much time to the effort.
Precisely. Not even Shade, with their eternally mobile army, nor the Chosen, with their Mystra-given gifts and countless allies always ready to answer their call, dare confront Thay and its brilliant but mad ruler. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 05:39:47
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| Drow aren't the only group who might be interested. Dragons. Other liches. And let's face it - if the Dread Ring Ritual is really potent enough to do everything Szass expects (ie: destroy/reformat the entire world) then why hasn't any of the Realms deities worked to seize the ritual's power for themselves, or destroy the dread rings (or Szass) before this power could be abused? Why hasn't Ao interfered? Why hasn't some predatory power-hungry extraplanar entity gotten involved? I expect Szass is no match for a god or other being of godly power, so I must conclude that either the ritual just ain't great enough to hold their attention or that they've already implemented mechanisms which conspire to prevent it from ever actually succeeding. |
[/Ayrik] |
Edited by - Ayrik on 26 Mar 2012 05:41:57 |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 05:44:43
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Most people think as the Simbarchs of Aglarond did when Aoth told them about it---that it's bound to fail. Despite how high they think of Szass Tam in terms of magical might, for them, such Ritual is way beyond him...
But of course, Szass Tam hardly cares what others think... |
Every beginning has an end. |
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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 05:50:15
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Likely even as BAne could have and likely witheld infomation about it...
and it says has it susposed to be as.. |
why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3807 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 09:38:45
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It looks like (from what I've gathered around) that they have already found a way to get Eilistraee and Vhaeraun back to the Realms, in the next Menzoberranzan book.
I don't think it is related to having them regaining their divinity from a Ring of Dread in any way, though; and I don't even know if they will be back as deities or archfeys/exarchs... |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 26 Mar 2012 09:41:21 |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4690 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 10:10:01
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So many things strike me, not sure which should come first.
Novels are canon if having FR logo, at times I that find distressing as novels sometimes conflict greatly with source materials.
The Ring of Dread appears to be something like a Stone Henge, however built for evil purpose.
Eilistraee coming back to power because of Evil construct sounds so wrong to me. Even Vhaeraun coming back because of a Szass construction does not sound right to me.
Oh yes there are rumors that at least a few are coming back in 5th, however I have not yet seen confirmation. Also not sure either was totally killed in the first place, just taken off the game board for a time. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3807 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 10:41:51
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Well, one of the freelance designers that worked on the book posted about their return on the Eilistraee.com forums, so I have high hopes for it.
However, as you said, it isn't official yet. So, alas, I can just wait and see.
quote:
Eilistraee coming back to power because of Evil construct sounds so wrong to me. Even Vhaeraun coming back because of a Szass construction does not sound right to me.
Yes, I wouldn't like to have them coming back in that way neither. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 26 Mar 2012 11:26:11 |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3745 Posts |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3807 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 14:43:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
-I have a basic understanding of what they are, but I still don't see how they would be relevant to resurrecting Eilistraee and/or Vhaeraun, and/or empowering them if you want to believe that they aren't dead.
He assumed that they gave up their divine status after losing the Save game, becoming archfey. His suggestion would be having them using the rings, which are supposed to be able to grant godhood, to get their 'divinity' back, reascending to actual deities. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 26 Mar 2012 14:43:47 |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 15:38:59
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The Dread Ring Ritual is basically the big red history eraser button of the Realms. If you reject certain canon or you want something important changed (like bring back your dead sexy goddess) then you beat up Szass Tam and press the ritual button, simple as that.
Of course we don't know what it will really do ... maybe something good, maybe something bad, maybe just a spectacular fizzle, maybe 5E. |
[/Ayrik] |
Edited by - Ayrik on 26 Mar 2012 16:02:00 |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3807 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 16:59:55
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If I wanted some canon changed, I'd just have the events happen the way I like in my game. I wouldn't bother to go after some super powerful lich to steal his plan of ascension to absolute power... unless it was the goal of my campaign.
However, I guess the OP was talking about having it happen as a canonical event, which I, personally, wouldn't see as very fitting. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 26 Mar 2012 17:00:47 |
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Aulduron
Learned Scribe
USA
343 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 17:00:57
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The rings are part of a ritual to unmake and reform the multiverse.
Vhaerun's corpse was seen floating in the Astral Plane. |
"Those with talent become wizards, Those without talent spend their lives praying for it"
-Procopio Septus |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3745 Posts |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3807 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 17:27:29
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quote:
-That sucks, because it seemingly hints that Vhaeraun and Eilistraee's fusion wasn't permanent.
To be honest, I'd be happier this way. As I wrote in another topic, their permanent fusion would take away good part of the feeling of Eilistraee and Vhaeraun, because they're too different to be entirely included in a single being.
If they are back, however, I think the reason because of they might be perceived as a bit off as single entities (namely, their gender bias) will be gone. And that would be the only good outcome of the LP series even though it could've been achieved in many more different ways. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 26 Mar 2012 17:28:46 |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3745 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 17:29:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Irennan
To be honest, I'd be happier this way. As I wrote in another topic, their fusion would take away good part of the feeling of Eilistraee and Vhaeraun, because they're too different to be entirely included in a single being.
-That single being being more realistic to the two individual separate entities, the reason I liked the Masked Lady over Eilistraee and Vhaeraun individually! |
(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)
Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4690 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 17:33:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
quote:
Originally posted by Aulduron
Vhaerun's corpse was seen floating in the Astral Plane.
-What source, might I ask?
-That sucks, because it seemingly hints that Vhaeraun and Eilistraee's fusion wasn't permanent.
It was in the third book IIRC, that his body moaning and twisting, I believe was first chapter which is (or was) a free down load. In many ways the deaths of either of the children appeared to be final. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3807 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 17:34:30
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I see what you mean. The Masked Lady's ways will likely be more successful than brother's and sister's ones. Still, as I said, the reason I like Eilistraee is that she's an idealist and the Masked Lady darkened her, ruining (at least to me) her feeling.
Anyway this is just a matter of personal tastes and discussing it wouldn't bring us anywhere. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 26 Mar 2012 17:41:35 |
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Aulduron
Learned Scribe
USA
343 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 18:36:54
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Storm of the Dead, Page 3:
"Patience, daughter." Her chiding voice reverberated with the echoes of her other seven aspects. "Patience. Just look what where your brothers rash actions brought him to."
Lolth gestured. A window opened onto the Astral Plane. In the distance of that silver void, moldering fragments drifted: the body of a god, sliced to pieces by Elistraeee's swords. A fragment that might have been a head groaned faintly, then stilled.
Lolth feigned sadness as she stared at the corpse. "No redemption for him. Not now."
"Sacrifices are sometimes necessary," she said> Vhaeraun gave me no choice." |
"Those with talent become wizards, Those without talent spend their lives praying for it"
-Procopio Septus |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3807 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 19:21:02
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quote:
Originally posted by Aulduron
Storm of the Dead, Page 3:
"Patience, daughter." Her chiding voice reverberated with the echoes of her other seven aspects. "Patience. Just look what where your brothers rash actions brought him to."
Lolth gestured. A window opened onto the Astral Plane. In the distance of that silver void, moldering fragments drifted: the body of a god, sliced to pieces by Elistraeee's swords. A fragment that might have been a head groaned faintly, then stilled.
Lolth feigned sadness as she stared at the corpse. "No redemption for him. Not now."
"Sacrifices are sometimes necessary," she said> Vhaeraun gave me no choice."
Eew... Things like that are one of the reasons I'll never read those books.
Eilistraee would've never given up redeeming her brother, not to mention slicing him into pieces.
WTH?! Slicing someone into pieces means taking pleasure in blood-letting, not just defending from an assault and that is totally out of her character.
Just like Vhaeraun charging like a madman against Eilistraee, or she not doing anything about the strongly gender biased attitude of her clergy.
Bah... |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 26 Mar 2012 19:24:53 |
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3745 Posts |
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Aes Tryl
Learned Scribe
181 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2012 : 19:55:16
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I do think that many of the things that took place in that novel stretched canon to its limits and tore it in some places  |
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Female drow dancers dancing in a ring of dread
