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Alystra Illianniis
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USA
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Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  01:12:43  Show Profile Send Alystra Illianniis a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Yeah, I know. I was just tossing out some ideas of who might have used it before him. It might have changed meaning when he took the name.

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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31701 Posts

Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  01:43:45  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Icelander

Can't place it now. Stormstar Requiem is a 4e thing, I think it comes from Brian R. James' or Gray Richardson's notes, from which I may have gotten Stormstar.

It's a reference from Brian's "Hall of the Frostmaiden" article in DRAGON #367.

Specifically, we're told:- " ... Stormstar Requiem—where Talos was revealed as the orc god Gruumsh and banished from Fury’s Heart."

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Dennis
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9933 Posts

Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  01:57:13  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage

There's been speculation in the past as to whether Mask was a mortal before his divine ascension.

I've not read it, but I have learned that Shadowrealm suggests that Mask was actually not a mortal, but someone with a rather unexpected pedigree.


It wasn't mentioned at all in that book whether Mask was a mortal (or half-mortal) or not. What was mentioned (by Shar herself) is that she's his mother and that his name is Lessinor.

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Aes Tryl
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Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  03:03:34  Show Profile  Visit Aes Tryl's Homepage Send Aes Tryl a Private Message  Reply with Quote
@Dennis & Sage

More specifically as I have mentioned, the book explicitly states that he is the result of Shar forming/incarnating an avatar for the express purpose of giving birth to a herald.
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Dennis
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9933 Posts

Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  03:07:45  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote

I'm away from my books right now, but I'll get back later to post the passage from the said novel. Mask was more than a herald, not exactly an avatar.

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Galuf the Dwarf
Senior Scribe

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533 Posts

Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  03:35:44  Show Profile Send Galuf the Dwarf a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Alright, back to the original topic, I meant to right down Valkur, but I 'm very certain I was rather tired at that point, so I probably wasn't quite thinking straight.

The only deities that I at least mentioned that nobody seems to be able to confirm are Gwaeron Windstrom and Torm. Any insights?

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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
31701 Posts

Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  03:52:30  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Galuf the Dwarf

Alright, back to the original topic, I meant to right down Valkur, but I 'm very certain I was rather tired at that point, so I probably wasn't quite thinking straight.

The only deities that I at least mentioned that nobody seems to be able to confirm are Gwaeron Windstrom and Torm. Any insights?

Powers & Pantheons notes that Gwaeron " ... roamed the North as a mortal ranger many centuries ago ... "

We don't really know much about Torm's mortal origins, other than to suggest that he might have ascended in the period between -230's DR and -200's DR. I do recall a tidbit from Gray noting that "Torm ascended within a few years after Tyr arrived in Faerun in the procession of Justice in -247 DR, and after Ilmater paired with Tyr."

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The Sage
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Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  04:02:22  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus

quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

The only way that errant entry in that short story could be possible is that the 'Black Archer' is a recurring Elven deity. A mortal who arises to the position when needed. There may have been a first 'Back Archer' that was truly one of the Seldarine, but there had to be at least two to hold that title, to make everything work.

-Could have also theoretically reference Eilistraee, since her schtick used to be a bow and she is a huntress. It's still problematic since she forsook the bow after accidentally shooting Corellon Larethian circa -30,000 (where the myth is dated), but it's something.



It could be that Black Archer was a title/office held by another member of the Seldarine, who either lost it or passed it on to Shevarash when he had his bad day. So not as much a recurring deity, as a position that can be filled by whoever is needed.

It's been a while since I've read Shevarash's entry in Demihuman Deities, but I seem to recall it stating that his "Black Archer" title was something he possessed before his apotheosis.

In other words, it might not have been a specific deity-title used among the Seldarine. Instead, we're told that he become the Night-Hunter and the Arrow-Bringer.

[This is, of course, assuming I'm remembering things correctly.]

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Galuf the Dwarf
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Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  04:11:16  Show Profile Send Galuf the Dwarf a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage

Powers & Pantheons notes that Gwaeron " ... roamed the North as a mortal ranger many centuries ago ... "

We don't really know much about Torm's mortal origins, other than to suggest that he might have ascended in the period between -230's DR and -200's DR. I do recall a tidbit from Gray noting that "Torm ascended within a few years after Tyr arrived in Faerun in the procession of Justice in -247 DR, and after Ilmater paired with Tyr."


Yeah, I remember reading that in his entry. Was hoping there was more, but I guess not. I also remember hearing that reference on Torm's ascension somewhere, but I can't quite remember.

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Marc
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Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  07:08:30  Show Profile Send Marc a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Faiths and Pantheons and Champions of Valor have information about mortal Torm and Chalsembyr

.
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Quale
Master of Realmslore

1757 Posts

Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  14:56:03  Show Profile Send Quale a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I think Bane was first immortal (Druaga), only lost his powers for a few centuries after arriving on Toril.
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Lord Karsus
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Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  18:47:19  Show Profile Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage

It's been a while since I've read Shevarash's entry in Demihuman Deities, but I seem to recall it stating that his "Black Archer" title was something he possessed before his apotheosis.

In other words, it might not have been a specific deity-title used among the Seldarine. Instead, we're told that he become the Night-Hunter and the Arrow-Bringer.

[This is, of course, assuming I'm remembering things correctly.]


-Before he was killed and was elevated to divinity, Shevarash was, in effect, a Drow crusader who had been on a decades-long feud with the Drow. He had killed enough of them to amass infamy and notoriety among a generally infamous and notorious race.

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Markustay
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Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  18:51:37  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Bane seems more like a half-Orc to me, but illustrations really don't mean anything in terms of deities.

Bane seems more like Orcus, if anything (just IMO).

I think all the Toril-specific (and D&D) deities are ascended mortals, but the RW interlopers not so much (although, technically, the Mulan pantheons are NOT the same beings as the Pharonic pantheon - they've had quite an influx of human blood since coming to Faerun). In order to trace them back to mortals, we'd have to dissect the RW myths (and some are, but most aren't).

Would the offspring of a giant and a god still be considered a mortal?

In mythology, normally this combination 'breeds true' to the deific side of things.
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus

-Before he was killed and was elevated to divinity, Shevarash was, in effect, a Drow crusader who had been on a decades-long feud with the Drow. He had killed enough of them to amass infamy and notoriety among a generally infamous and notorious race.
Which is why I/we feel that the appellation "The Black Archer" is something that was used in the past (obviously from that story), and it could have applied to a now-dead member of the Seldarine, or to a current member who no longer uses it (I like Eilistraee though... that makes a lot of sense.)

Or it could have applied to past mortals who have ascended before (when their was a need), but this would be the same as my first scenario above, and I don't really love that idea.

Either way, we now have proof (GHotR) that Elves worshiped the Fey deities (Yuir Totems?) originally, and that the Seldarine were atually late-comers (which helps back-up my onw hypothesis that the Seldarine are ascended Eladrin). After all, where were they when Elves only worshiped Fey? This messes-up some of their creation story though (although there are ways of fudging that as well - there are MANY creation-myths for the realms).

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 07 Mar 2012 22:58:21
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Lord Karsus
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Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  19:12:33  Show Profile Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

Either way, we now (GHotR) have proof that lves worshiped the Fey deities (Yuir Totems?) originally, and that the Seldarine were atually late-comers (which helps back-up my onw hypothesis that the Seldarine are ascended Eladrin). After all, where were they when Elves only worshiped Fey? This messes-up some of their creation story though (although there are ways of fudging that as well - there are MANY creation-myths for the realms).


-AGHotR says that the Wood Elves who were sent to Realmspace via portals in -27,000 worshiped Fey deities, and that the Seldarine were unknown to them. The Elven immigrants from Tintageer who arrived a millennium later, we know worshiped the Seldarine.

-In terms of creation, they're all myths since we don't have canon dates that say, "X created X", like we do with other races, so once can believe whichever they want. I, personally, don't like the Corellon vs. Gruumsh creation myth that Elves have, but it's the primary one.

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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

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Posted - 07 Mar 2012 :  23:11:08  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Heres the problem - it establishes ELVES worshiped Fey deities (back then), and the ELADRIN worshiped the Seldarine (that part is retroactive lore, since we now know those were Eladrin in Elaine's novel).

If the Eladrin are Elves (and vice-versa) before some sort of split (weather you go with my lore or not), this means that the Elves - who were presumably created by the Seldarine - do NOT worship the Seldarine, and the more-powerful branch of the same race (the Eladrin) DO worship the Seldarine.

What that means is that the branch that split form the original group worship a set of beings who somehow allowed them greater magical power, which makes sense considering that Corellon is their 'god of magic'. We can also assume that this group rose to power after the split (between the Elves and Eladrin), but maybe not after the Elves were sent by the Fey to Toril. Both groups came from Faerie, but we have a direct reference to the Elves being ordered around by fey, which means the other group - the Eladrin of Tintageer - were already distanced from their fey heritage (but still living within the realm of Faerie, according to the novel).

So the 'new' pantheon either started before the split (unlikely, given their "unknown" status), was the reason for the split, or came into being sometime in that 1600 year period between the two arrivals.

EDIT:
I just had a random thought - what if the story of the Eladrin (Elven) creation happened on Toril? It doesn't fit so well with the info in Elaine's novel, but that could be fudged. Whats important is that maybe the second (Tintageer) group weren't really created, but rather, changed by the the blood of Corellon and the tears of the moon (and note, the 'Moons Tears' seems to be a recurring theme in FR).

What if "the blood of Corellon" is metaphorical? What if it was something about the Moon that was the catalyst?

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 07 Mar 2012 23:17:56
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Aulduron
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Posted - 08 Mar 2012 :  00:33:36  Show Profile Send Aulduron a Private Message  Reply with Quote
FWIW, Lolth had never heard of Toril until Kethryllia Amarillis chased Haeshkarr to the Demon Web Pits. The rest of the Seldarine may not have known about it until Tintageer. It's probably hard to worship gods who don't even know about your world.

"Those with talent become wizards, Those without talent spend their lives praying for it"

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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High

Australia
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Posted - 08 Mar 2012 :  01:16:53  Show Profile Send The Sage a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

Bane seems more like a half-Orc to me, but illustrations really don't mean anything in terms of deities.

Bane seems more like Orcus, if anything (just IMO).
An abnormally large Orcish tyrant, maybe. I like the sound of that.

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Lord Karsus
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Posted - 08 Mar 2012 :  03:05:20  Show Profile Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

If the Eladrin are Elves (and vice-versa) before some sort of split (weather you go with my lore or not), this means that the Elves - who were presumably created by the Seldarine - do NOT worship the Seldarine, and the more-powerful branch of the same race (the Eladrin) DO worship the Seldarine.

What that means is that the branch that split form the original group worship a set of beings who somehow allowed them greater magical power, which makes sense considering that Corellon is their 'god of magic'. We can also assume that this group rose to power after the split (between the Elves and Eladrin), but maybe not after the Elves were sent by the Fey to Toril. Both groups came from Faerie, but we have a direct reference to the Elves being ordered around by fey, which means the other group - the Eladrin of Tintageer - were already distanced from their fey heritage (but still living within the realm of Faerie, according to the novel).

So the 'new' pantheon either started before the split (unlikely, given their "unknown" status), was the reason for the split, or came into being sometime in that 1600 year period between the two arrivals.


-AGHotR does not say that the Wood Elves were commanded to go to Realmspace. It says that they opened portals from Faerie to Realmspace, allowing them to enter Realmspace. In my own work, I assign more sinister and capricious motives to the leShay/Fey Creator Race, saying that they tricked the Wood Elves into leaving Faerie and going to Realmspace. All in all, though, to what we're talking about, that much- whether they were ordered, tricked, or something else entirely- is inconsequential. I just felt compelled to point this out.

-If we want to assume that Corellon Larethian (or any other Fey power, really; doesn't matter too much) created Elvendom (as in all Elven subraces, not the 4e terminology defining simply Wood Elves), we then know that they were not all created equally. Avariel have wings, Star Elves have their 'twilight powers', Aquatic Elves have gills and can breathe water, Lythari are shape-changers, among other Elven subraces described in D&D books over the years that have other powers/attributes. So, unless you want to follow logically and say that every Elven subrace was created by a different group/entity, possibly at different times, it doesn't matter that Wood Elves have a more nature oriented society, while Sun Elves might be more magically inclined. So, if Corellon Larethian, if we go by those myths, created Sun Elves with X attributes, that doesn't mean that he didn't created Moon Elves with Y attributes.

-And, their mythological origins aside, worship is a separate matter. Drow worshipers of Corellon Larethian exist. Avariel worshipers of Labelas Enoreth exist. Worship, in the general sense, stems from environment and circumstance. Just because, going back into those mythological days, Corellon Larethian (or whomever) created a certain group of Elves doesn't mean that they have to worship him. In my own setting, the myth of Elven creation involves Corellon Larethian planting magical seeds in the soil of Faerie. From those seeds sprang up (as they are called in my setting) Faerie Elves and Wood Elves. Corellon Larethian was around to tend to the newly born Faerie Elves, but was attacked by Lolth when the newly born Wood Elves sprung from the ground. Nature itself reared them, explaining their veneration of spirits over the formal deities of the Seldarine. That's not Forgotten Realms, mind you, but it demonstrates that although created by X, a race doesn't have to necessarily worship X, or even know of their existence. For all we know, Mankind was created by some alien race and sent across the universe to "seed", as some of those Ancient Alien myths say. Mankind currently is completely unaware of our alien creators. If those myths were true, we still would have been created by them, despite our not knowing of their existence.

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Markustay
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Posted - 08 Mar 2012 :  03:56:37  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I just find it REALLY strange that Corellon could have created them, but they worshiped a completely different set of powers. Is it possible? Of course... anything is possible. It just doesn't seem right, especially in regards to the Elves.

Ergo, my own fix - that Corellon is Fey (an Archfey, actually). That fixes everything - the 'Fey Powers' that sent the Elves to Toril were the Fey Pantheon, which included some of the members of the modern-day Seldarine. A group of them broke-off from the rest (leaving the Feywild behind), created Arvandor, and became the Seldarine. That leaves all the lore intact (that the Elves were created by, and worshiped, Corellon).

I figure it this way - all modern fey (and there are gazilions of sub-species) - are all descendents of those first Fey (LeSahy) who fled Toril. The Eladrin are literally "of Corellon's Blood". Each subrace can probaly trace their heritage back to one (or more) fey Powers. Avariel from Aerdrie Faenya, Lythari from Erevan Ilesere, Green (wood) Elves Fenmarel Mestarine, etc, etc...

But Eladrin were literally "of the blood of Corellon" . The goddess of the Moon bathed them in her tears (baptizing them into their bloodlines), and the many races of FR elves were created. She did not "heal his wounds", but rather, 'healed' (empowered) his bloodline.

And FR's Moon Goddess is THE Moon Goddess. Call her what you want, but she is the same power - Sehanine, Selune, Hecate - she embodies the very 'magical essence' of the universe.

I prefer less mythological explanations for things - I'm more of a 'crunchy' designer, even when going back to creation theories.

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Edited by - Markustay on 08 Mar 2012 15:57:33
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Lord Karsus
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Posted - 08 Mar 2012 :  04:01:35  Show Profile Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
-The myth is that Corellon's blood created them, after Gruumsh cut him and he started bleeding. For all we know, he might not have known about those specific Elves. If my blood went splashing all across the cosmos, and things started springing up from it, I might not be able to account for all my blood splatter. I can't say I ever say it as being problematic. I also look at the myth as just that, so keeping in the back of my mind that that exact story might (and possibly probably) isn't completely correct probably helps, too.

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Edited by - Lord Karsus on 08 Mar 2012 04:03:25
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Aulduron
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Posted - 08 Mar 2012 :  04:02:10  Show Profile Send Aulduron a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:

-If we want to assume that Corellon Larethian (or any other Fey power, really; doesn't matter too much) created Elvendom (as in all Elven subraces, not the 4e terminology defining simply Wood Elves), we then know that they were not all created equally. Avariel have wings, Star Elves have their 'twilight powers', Aquatic Elves have gills and can breathe water, Lythari are shape-changers, among other Elven subraces described in D&D books over the years that have other powers/attributes. So, unless you want to follow logically and say that every Elven subrace was created by a different group/entity, possibly at different times, it doesn't matter that Wood Elves have a more nature oriented society, while Sun Elves might be more magically inclined. So, if Corellon Larethian, if we go by those myths, created Sun Elves with X attributes, that doesn't mean that he didn't created Moon Elves with Y attributes.


But did they always have those attributes, or did they evolve differently? It is to my understanding that surface elves migrated under water to get away from wars.

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Dennis
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Posted - 08 Mar 2012 :  04:43:10  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Aes Tryl

@Dennis & Sage

More specifically as I have mentioned, the book explicitly states that he is the result of Shar forming/incarnating an avatar for the express purpose of giving birth to a herald.


It appears like Mask is some sort of a demi-human. Below is a passage from Shadowrealm, p. 332. (Highlight is mine.)

quote:

The frailties endemic to his one-time humanity resurfaced. His body shook. He did not wish to end.

[.....]

He could not bring himself to name her his mother. She had possessed a vessel to birth a herald, nothing more.


Every beginning has an end.
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Quale
Master of Realmslore

1757 Posts

Posted - 08 Mar 2012 :  15:06:35  Show Profile Send Quale a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Wasn't Telamont's wife an avatar?
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire

USA
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Posted - 08 Mar 2012 :  16:02:38  Show Profile Send Markustay a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus

-The myth is that Corellon's blood created them, after Gruumsh cut him and he started bleeding. For all we know, he might not have known about those specific Elves. If my blood went splashing all across the cosmos, and things started springing up from it, I might not be able to account for all my blood splatter. I can't say I ever say it as being problematic. I also look at the myth as just that, so keeping in the back of my mind that that exact story might (and possibly probably) isn't completely correct probably helps, too.
But that's supposed to be mythic creation story.

While I am trying to dig beneath the myth for 'the truth', you continue down the mythic path and even add to it (the seed thing).

I am not saying your way is wrong - everyone should run their campaigns however they want. In my version, I am just trying to find some semi-logical explanation for the myth, without all the allegorical clap-trap. As Elven folklore, I think the story the Elves have is great - I just think there is more to it then that, and it's been convoluted by 35,000+ years of history.
quote:
Originally posted by Aulduron

But did they always have those attributes, or did they evolve differently? It is to my understanding that surface elves migrated under water to get away from wars.
Correct

Which backs-up my theory that Deep Sashelas is an even more ancient fey Power (and possibly the same as Njord/Poseidon/Mana Mac Lir/Ukko), and that Elves are mortal fey, and through 'divine intervention' (prayer/magic) they can tap-into their heritage and change form.

Elves do not evolve like natural creatures - their evolutionary process is 'internalized' (they can change themselves individually, if great need arises, and therefor thy do not evolve as a species).
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis

It appears like Mask is some sort of a demi-human. <snip>
Great quote - I'd love to know who that 'mortal vessel' was!

quote:
Originally posted by Quale

Wasn't Telamont's wife an avatar?
Was she big & blue, or a little bald kid?

{if she was the second one, Telemont has some 'splainin to do.}

"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone


Edited by - Markustay on 11 Mar 2012 17:14:03
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader

USA
3738 Posts

Posted - 08 Mar 2012 :  16:59:50  Show Profile Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Aulduron

But did they always have those attributes, or did they evolve differently? It is to my understanding that surface elves migrated under water to get away from wars.


-Not in the Forgotten Realms. Your are probably thinking of the -17,000 DR entry in the AGHotR which mentions that Elves from Eillur, Syorpiir and Thearnytar began emigrated to realms in the Inner Sea. We know this wasn't the genesis point of Aquatic Elves because they existed nearly some 10,000 years before that date, existing in Elaine Cunningham's short story "Secrets of Blood, Spirits of the Sea" from Realms of the Arcane[i/]. The entry presumably describes one of two things: Aquatic Elves already living in these realms leaving for the Inner Sea, or Elves making use of the Akh’Faen’Tel’Quess/Life of Duty, Form of the People’s Need Elven High Magic ritual.

quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

While I am trying to dig beneath the myth for 'the truth', you continue down the mythic path and even add to it (the seed thing).

I am not saying your way is wrong - everyone should run their campaigns however they want. In my version, I am just trying to find some semi-logical explanation for the myth, without all the allegorical clap-trap. As Elven folklore, I think the story the Elves have is great - I just think there is more to it then that, and it's been convoluted by 35,000+ years of history.


-The myth is truth enough, given it's the only 'correct' information we have.

-The 'seed' myth was an example from my own setting, not the Forgotten Realms, in response to wondering how something can be created (the Elven race) but not be aware of their creators (whoever you want to attribute with their creation).

quote:
[i]Originally posted by Quale


Wasn't Telamont's wife an avatar?

-Alashar created a living simulacrum to report back to her master that she killed Lord Shadow (who she was hired to assassinate)was executed shortly after reporting back to whoever hired her.

(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)

Elves of Faerūn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerūn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium

Edited by - Lord Karsus on 08 Mar 2012 17:07:57
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Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 11 Mar 2012 :  05:50:56  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Quale

Wasn't Telamont's wife an avatar?


No. She's quite mortal, killed by her own son.

quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

quote:
Originally posted by Dennis

It appears like Mask is some sort of a demi-human. <snip>
Great quote - I'd love to know who that 'mortal vessel' was!



My guess is either some random thief or her own high priest. [Probably a good question for Paul.]

quote:
Originally posted by Markustay

Was she big & blue, or a little bald kid?


Telamont does not like blue. And hates naughty children. So it's neither.

Every beginning has an end.

Edited by - Dennis on 11 Mar 2012 06:26:27
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist

USA
11762 Posts

Posted - 12 Mar 2012 :  17:59:56  Show Profile Send sleyvas a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Malyk (alias that Talos subsumed)

Mellifleur (deity of liches that Velsharoon subsumed as an alias)

Alavairthae, may your skill prevail

Phillip aka Sleyvas
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Dennis
Great Reader

9933 Posts

Posted - 12 Mar 2012 :  23:02:47  Show Profile Send Dennis a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas

Malyk (alias that Talos subsumed)

Mellifleur (deity of liches that Velsharoon subsumed as an alias)



HB?

Every beginning has an end.
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Galuf the Dwarf
Senior Scribe

USA
533 Posts

Posted - 13 Mar 2012 :  01:38:47  Show Profile Send Galuf the Dwarf a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Okay, so here's the thing: The ones I suspected of being former mortals are confirmed. Between that, Kelemvor and Uthgar, why did they only get around 40 class HD as deities and not around 60 like Azuth, Bane, Cyric and Mystra? That doesn't make sense to me, because I don't remember reading in either Deities & Demigods or Faiths & Pantheons that divine rank affected how many HD former mortals got.

Galuf's Baldur's Gate NPC stats: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8823
Galuf's 3.5 Ed. Cleric Domains: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14036
Galuf's Homebrew 4th Edition Races: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=13787
Galuf's Homebrew Specialty Priest PrCs: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=14353
Galuf's Forgotten Realms Heralds and Allies thread: forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8766
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Bakra
Senior Scribe

628 Posts

Posted - 13 Mar 2012 :  14:22:40  Show Profile Send Bakra a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Galuf the Dwarf

Okay, so here's the thing: The ones I suspected of being former mortals are confirmed. Between that, Kelemvor and Uthgar, why did they only get around 40 class HD as deities and not around 60 like Azuth, Bane, Cyric and Mystra? That doesn't make sense to me, because I don't remember reading in either Deities & Demigods or Faiths & Pantheons that divine rank affected how many HD former mortals got.



They didn't think it was necessary to create their avatars with 60 HD.



I hope Candlekeep continues to be the friendly forum of fellow Realms-lovers that it has always been, as we all go through this together. If you don’t want to move to the “new” Realms, that doesn’t mean there’s anything wrong with either you or the “old” Realms. Goodness knows Candlekeep, and the hearts of its scribes, are both big enough to accommodate both. If we want them to be.
(Strikes dramatic pose, raises sword to gleam in the sunset, and hopes breeches won’t fall down.)
Enough for now. The Realms lives! I have spoken! Ale and light wines half price, served by a smiling Storm Silverhand fetchingly clad in thigh-high boots and naught else! Ahem . .
So saith Ed. <snip>
love to all,
THO
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