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Seravin
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1288 Posts |
 Posted - 18 Oct 2011 : 20:32:12
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quote:
In the wake of Szss Tam failing to unmake the world I think he should be brought low by many united forces. But I don't think it will happen because WotC seems to want a lich king just like (AKA to rip off the popularity of) Warcraft / World of Warcraft :(
So true. So sadly true. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11829 Posts |
Posted - 18 Oct 2011 : 22:18:58
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quote:
Originally posted by Seravin
quote:
In the wake of Szss Tam failing to unmake the world I think he should be brought low by many united forces. But I don't think it will happen because WotC seems to want a lich king just like (AKA to rip off the popularity of) Warcraft / World of Warcraft :(
So true. So sadly true.
Ah, I won't give WoW that much credit. Nearly every major fantasy campaign world at one point or another has has some major either fiendish or undead empire (or in some cases both.... after all, Narfell favored Orcus, lord of the undead). What I would have found more interesting is if they started something akin to what was done in the sword & sorcery campaign world. There they had 2 necromantic societies. One was inclined to very "clean" undead which were used to support the society of the living. Disease was worried about and what not, but their laws were very strict... when you died, your body was owned by the government, etc.... That could have been the "new Thay" without Tam (or that could be the reflection of necromancy's role in a new Thay). Then Tam could have been running a necromantic society similar to what he currently has. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Idamar of Thay
Acolyte
19 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 00:07:56
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| My vote would be for Nevron. He has reached unheard of levels of arrogance and overconfidence that just makes me want to root for the guy. He may have been transformed into a mane, but unless Tam did something else to Nevron, that means the Abyss has just welcomed a new small insignificant mane....that happens to control an army of demons. He knows the name of many powerful denizens of the abyss and even as a mane could redo the rituals of binding. Heck, being a master summoner, if anyone knows how to open a breach to return to the Prime Material Plane, it's Nevron. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 01:49:20
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Magic can work differently in the Nine Hells. For all we know, the moment Nevron was translocated to hell, Szass Tam's spell suddenly expired. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 13:24:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Magic can work differently in the Nine Hells. For all we know, the moment Nevron was translocated to hell, Szass Tam's spell suddenly expired.
Knowing Szass Tam's sense of irony, I suspect he planned that spell and tested it beforehand to make sure Nevron got his just deserts for opposing him. |
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 13:27:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Given that some pre-Szass Tam zulkirs just vanished without trace, as I conjectured before, it's possible they have been acting as Hidden Guardians and one day will say enough is enough and kick the lich lord out.
I don't think so personally. But to each his own.
In my world, The one's who disappeared were killed. Zulkir's above all always wanted power and prestige and would not willingly give up their titles. Witness all the remaining Zulkir's spending 90 years just plotting ways to get back to Thay and regain what they have lost.
Those sorts so not strike me as the types to work from the shadows when they have so much more power in Thay out in the open. |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 13:50:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Magic can work differently in the Nine Hells. For all we know, the moment Nevron was translocated to hell, Szass Tam's spell suddenly expired.
Knowing Szass Tam's sense of irony, I suspect he planned that spell and tested it beforehand to make sure Nevron got his just deserts for opposing him.
I did some extensive research and discovered that 1,459,752 Manes are slaughtered each day. I don't think Nevron is coming back  |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
Amazon "KindleUnlimited" Free Trial: http://amzn.to/2AJ4yD2
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 14:59:45
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quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Magic can work differently in the Nine Hells. For all we know, the moment Nevron was translocated to hell, Szass Tam's spell suddenly expired.
Knowing Szass Tam's sense of irony, I suspect he planned that spell and tested it beforehand to make sure Nevron got his just deserts for opposing him.
I did some extensive research and discovered that 1,459,752 Manes are slaughtered each day. I don't think Nevron is coming back
4,572 wizards die/are killed each day. But Aoth lives. [Even though he's always been in the thick of realms-shattering wars.] |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 15:03:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Magic can work differently in the Nine Hells. For all we know, the moment Nevron was translocated to hell, Szass Tam's spell suddenly expired.
Knowing Szass Tam's sense of irony, I suspect he planned that spell and tested it beforehand to make sure Nevron got his just deserts for opposing him.
I did some extensive research and discovered that 1,459,752 Manes are slaughtered each day. I don't think Nevron is coming back
4,572 wizards die/are killed each day. But Aoth lives. [Even though he's always been in the thick of realms-shattering wars.]
Ah Aoth, old blue-eyes himself |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
Amazon "KindleUnlimited" Free Trial: http://amzn.to/2AJ4yD2
Try Audible and Get 2 Free Audio Books! https://amzn.to/2IgBede |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 15:03:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Magic can work differently in the Nine Hells. For all we know, the moment Nevron was translocated to hell, Szass Tam's spell suddenly expired.
Knowing Szass Tam's sense of irony, I suspect he planned that spell and tested it beforehand to make sure Nevron got his just deserts for opposing him.
But the lab rat he used to test the spell's effectiveness [or lack thereof] was not Nevron, and therefore didn't possess enough magic that might undo the spell. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 15:04:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Magic can work differently in the Nine Hells. For all we know, the moment Nevron was translocated to hell, Szass Tam's spell suddenly expired.
Knowing Szass Tam's sense of irony, I suspect he planned that spell and tested it beforehand to make sure Nevron got his just deserts for opposing him.
But the lab rat he used to test the spell's effectiveness [or lack thereof] was not Nevron, and therefore didn't possess enough magic that might undo the spell.
Would a polymorphed Nevron still have complete access to the magic he used as an archmage in human form?? |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
Amazon "KindleUnlimited" Free Trial: http://amzn.to/2AJ4yD2
Try Audible and Get 2 Free Audio Books! https://amzn.to/2IgBede |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 15:09:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Given that some pre-Szass Tam zulkirs just vanished without trace, as I conjectured before, it's possible they have been acting as Hidden Guardians and one day will say enough is enough and kick the lich lord out.
I don't think so personally. But to each his own.
In my world, The one's who disappeared were killed. Zulkir's above all always wanted power and prestige and would not willingly give up their titles. Witness all the remaining Zulkir's spending 90 years just plotting ways to get back to Thay and regain what they have lost.
Those sorts so not strike me as the types to work from the shadows when they have so much more power in Thay out in the open.
I would have to disagree. Not all zulkirs possess the same personalities. They may have the same level of haughtiness, selfishness, and avarice, but how they view certain matters differ. Some might have tired of ruling a realm with a bunch of bickering, equally loathsome archmages, or preferred the relative safety of seclusion to a throne that constantly invites assassins. Ed himself said that the first Zulkir of Necromancy, Tarabbas Mroound, disappeared in his own volition soon after being named zulkir. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 15:12:16
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quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Magic can work differently in the Nine Hells. For all we know, the moment Nevron was translocated to hell, Szass Tam's spell suddenly expired.
Knowing Szass Tam's sense of irony, I suspect he planned that spell and tested it beforehand to make sure Nevron got his just deserts for opposing him.
But the lab rat he used to test the spell's effectiveness [or lack thereof] was not Nevron, and therefore didn't possess enough magic that might undo the spell.
Would a polymorphed Nevron still have complete access to the magic he used as an archmage in human form??
Some spells do not require verbally produced words. Some can be triggered by mere exertion of will, which a mane, fortunately, can still manage to do. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 15:17:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Magic can work differently in the Nine Hells. For all we know, the moment Nevron was translocated to hell, Szass Tam's spell suddenly expired.
Knowing Szass Tam's sense of irony, I suspect he planned that spell and tested it beforehand to make sure Nevron got his just deserts for opposing him.
But the lab rat he used to test the spell's effectiveness [or lack thereof] was not Nevron, and therefore didn't possess enough magic that might undo the spell.
Would a polymorphed Nevron still have complete access to the magic he used as an archmage in human form??
Some spells do not require verbally produced words. Some can be triggered by mere exertion of will, which a mane, fortunately, can still manage to do.
Not sure if those Cantrips are going to help much  |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
Amazon "KindleUnlimited" Free Trial: http://amzn.to/2AJ4yD2
Try Audible and Get 2 Free Audio Books! https://amzn.to/2IgBede |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 15:42:15
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quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
Not sure if those Cantrips are going to help much
Oh, I wasn't talking about cantrips, but powerful contingencies. The Simbul has a plethora of them. Druxus Rhym, too. Remember the Prologue of Unclean? He would have cast some contingencies by simply recalling them to mind, but he was so addled to think because his assassin was banging his head to the wall. |
Every beginning has an end. |
Edited by - Dennis on 19 Oct 2011 15:42:55 |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 15:43:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
Not sure if those Cantrips are going to help much
Oh, I wasn't talking about cantrips, but powerful contingencies. The Simbul has a plethora of them. Druxus Rhym, too. Remember the Prologue of Unclean? He would have cast some contingencies by simply recalling them to mind, but he was so addled to think because his assassin was banging his head to the wall.
I know, i was just being silly |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
Amazon "KindleUnlimited" Free Trial: http://amzn.to/2AJ4yD2
Try Audible and Get 2 Free Audio Books! https://amzn.to/2IgBede |
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 19:32:24
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quote:
Originally posted by entreri3478
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Magic can work differently in the Nine Hells. For all we know, the moment Nevron was translocated to hell, Szass Tam's spell suddenly expired.
Knowing Szass Tam's sense of irony, I suspect he planned that spell and tested it beforehand to make sure Nevron got his just deserts for opposing him.
But the lab rat he used to test the spell's effectiveness [or lack thereof] was not Nevron, and therefore didn't possess enough magic that might undo the spell.
Would a polymorphed Nevron still have complete access to the magic he used as an archmage in human form??
Did He polymorph Nevron? In the book, he killed him and mutated his spirit into a mane. His body was left lying there. Not sure how, if any, that affects his spellcasting. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 19:56:15
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You have the right of it. Szass Tam separated Nevron's spirit from his body and shrank it into a mane. It would surely affect his spellcasting, but as we all know, it's the mind that counts most in working magic. Despite the disadvantages, I think he'd manage to save himself. As I previously noted, he could simply trigger a contingency that does not require a verbal command. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 19 Oct 2011 : 23:19:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
You have the right of it. Szass Tam separated Nevron's spirit from his body and shrank it into a mane. It would surely affect his spellcasting, but as we all know, it's the mind that counts most in working magic. Despite the disadvantages, I think he'd manage to save himself. As I previously noted, he could simply trigger a contingency that does not require a verbal command.
Contingencies require conditions to activate however. They are not quickened spells that you can set off by a command word or gesture.
For instance, you could set a contingency teleport on your person to go off when you reach a certain amount of physical damage to your body. Or a contingency heal spell that would instantly heal all damage done to you. But the conditions of the spell going off are specific, and you can only have a small amount of contingency spells before they start to interfere with each other.
What makes high level "Elminster's Evasion" such a powerful teleport spell is that he designed the spells to have 6 different possible triggers(most contingencies only have 1 trigger. Nevron is not exactly Elminster). Trying to think of triggers is the tough part. If you are in a situation in which you can"t afford to leave and have to see through, you would not want a contingency teleport going off unless it was absolutely necessary. I am assuming the triggers would be along the lines of a certain lethal amount of physical damage, being paralyzed, rendered unconscious, being turned to stone, Put to sleep, etc
I don"t know if anywhere along the lines he was going to think "If my spirit gets wrenched from my body". Which would not get considered by the contingency as "physical damage" and would not set it off.
In any case, from reading that part over a few times, Nevron was in the middle of casting a spell, and Szass Tam used a quickened spell of his own, merely making a clutching gesture, beating Nevron to the spell, and instantly separating his soul from his body. Nevron's spirit was absolutely dumbfounded as Szass cast his next spell within seconds to change him and get rid of him. Even if he had a quickened teleport ready with a thought, would it transport his body which he was separated from? Hard to say. |
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Idamar of Thay
Acolyte
19 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2011 : 00:55:52
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But there are other things to consider besides contingency spells.
If I recall, Nevron had already planned to one day leave the Prime Material Plane to enter the lower planes as a conqueror. Obviously is current situation is different, but my point is he has to have made some sort of preperation as well as doing research. I'm still not willing to believe Nevron is dead yet. |
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MrHedgehog
Senior Scribe
688 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2011 : 01:37:46
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But if Nevron has gone to the lower planes, why would he return to rule thay? He wants to rule in the lower planes if I recall. If as a Mane he still has power (I don't think he does...I think he is a Mane like any other spirit transformed into a mane) he would just ascend the ranks of the Tanar'ri/Demons and not bother with the material world.
Once he was a Mane I don't think he'd have his magic or control over powerful demons, etc. |
Edited by - MrHedgehog on 20 Oct 2011 01:46:38 |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2011 : 04:17:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Idamar of Thay
But there are other things to consider besides contingency spells.
If I recall, Nevron had already planned to one day leave the Prime Material Plane to enter the lower planes as a conqueror. Obviously is current situation is different, but my point is he has to have made some sort of preperation as well as doing research. I'm still not willing to believe Nevron is dead yet.
Indeed. He always emphasized that Thay's Civil War was like a good practice for him to someday become a lord in the Abyss. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2011 : 04:20:29
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quote:
Originally posted by MrHedgehog
But if Nevron has gone to the lower planes, why would he return to rule thay? He wants to rule in the lower planes if I recall. If as a Mane he still has power (I don't think he does...I think he is a Mane like any other spirit transformed into a mane) he would just ascend the ranks of the Tanar'ri/Demons and not bother with the material world.
Once he was a Mane I don't think he'd have his magic or control over powerful demons, etc.
I don't think he'd bother going back to Thay. What's the point? But most definitely he would either transform himself back to his original form or possess a fiend's body. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2011 : 04:25:57
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quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
You have the right of it. Szass Tam separated Nevron's spirit from his body and shrank it into a mane. It would surely affect his spellcasting, but as we all know, it's the mind that counts most in working magic. Despite the disadvantages, I think he'd manage to save himself. As I previously noted, he could simply trigger a contingency that does not require a verbal command.
Contingencies require conditions to activate however. They are not quickened spells that you can set off by a command word or gesture.
For instance, you could set a contingency teleport on your person to go off when you reach a certain amount of physical damage to your body. Or a contingency heal spell that would instantly heal all damage done to you. But the conditions of the spell going off are specific, and you can only have a small amount of contingency spells before they start to interfere with each other.
I don"t know if anywhere along the lines he was going to think "If my spirit gets wrenched from my body". Which would not get considered by the contingency as "physical damage" and would not set it off.
In any case, from reading that part over a few times, Nevron was in the middle of casting a spell, and Szass Tam used a quickened spell of his own, merely making a clutching gesture, beating Nevron to the spell, and instantly separating his soul from his body. Nevron's spirit was absolutely dumbfounded as Szass cast his next spell within seconds to change him and get rid of him. Even if he had a quickened teleport ready with a thought, would it transport his body which he was separated from? Hard to say.
Well, it is not entirely improbable for the contigency to work under this condition: “extreme harm to myself that it’s impossible to cast a spell.” Or something like that. He’s a Zulkir, privy to some arcane knowledge no ordinary Red Wizard knows or can hope to comprehend. I can imagine such ingenuity in crafting that kind of contingency is within his grasp. One doesn't become and stay a zulkir without a shred of ingenuity in his/her blood. |
Every beginning has an end. |
Edited by - Dennis on 20 Oct 2011 06:07:15 |
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Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2011 : 05:56:59
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Conditions for contingencies must be clear and simple when placed with the spell to activate. Complex conditions, those that require a judgment, often fail because the contingency spell might have trouble determining the presence of the specified condition. So they have to be something fairly obvious and unquestionable.
"When it's impossible for me to cast a spell" would be a complex judgment call, which the spell has no way of determining or verifying. As Firestorm said, it must be a condition affecting the mage, not a verbal statement, physical movement, or the like.
Here's a list of appropriate conditions: http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/conditions.htm
Disabled, helpless, dying, pinned, etc... all of those are appropriate conditions for a contingency.
It would seem rather strange for a mage of high level to NOT have contingencies for many of those conditions, particularly a zulkir. Teleporting to a safehouse or to a friend's or loyal minion's home, something on that order.
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Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
Edited by - Therise on 20 Oct 2011 06:02:57 |
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2011 : 06:35:10
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
You have the right of it. Szass Tam separated Nevron's spirit from his body and shrank it into a mane. It would surely affect his spellcasting, but as we all know, it's the mind that counts most in working magic. Despite the disadvantages, I think he'd manage to save himself. As I previously noted, he could simply trigger a contingency that does not require a verbal command.
Contingencies require conditions to activate however. They are not quickened spells that you can set off by a command word or gesture.
For instance, you could set a contingency teleport on your person to go off when you reach a certain amount of physical damage to your body. Or a contingency heal spell that would instantly heal all damage done to you. But the conditions of the spell going off are specific, and you can only have a small amount of contingency spells before they start to interfere with each other.
I don"t know if anywhere along the lines he was going to think "If my spirit gets wrenched from my body". Which would not get considered by the contingency as "physical damage" and would not set it off.
In any case, from reading that part over a few times, Nevron was in the middle of casting a spell, and Szass Tam used a quickened spell of his own, merely making a clutching gesture, beating Nevron to the spell, and instantly separating his soul from his body. Nevron's spirit was absolutely dumbfounded as Szass cast his next spell within seconds to change him and get rid of him. Even if he had a quickened teleport ready with a thought, would it transport his body which he was separated from? Hard to say.
Well, it is not entirely improbable for the contigency to work under this condition: “extreme harm to myself that it’s impossible to cast a spell.” Or something like that. He’s a Zulkir, privy to some arcane knowledge no ordinary Red Wizard knows or can hope to comprehend. I can imagine such ingenuity in crafting that kind of contingency is within his grasp. One doesn't become and stay a zulkir without a shred of ingenuity in his/her blood.
Contingencies almost work like wish spells tho. You need to be extremely specific, or the spell may be a perversion of your intent, so you have to keep it simple. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2011 : 06:50:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
Contingencies almost work like wish spells tho. You need to be extremely specific, or the spell may be a perversion of your intent, so you have to keep it simple.
One possible condition of Neveron's contingency: Possess a vessel [a pre-prepared body of a bound fiend/Red Wizard] if my spirit is ripped out from my body. How is that for specific?
It wasn’t mentioned that his transformation to a mane completely addled his mind/spirit; so it’s still possible that he held vestiges of his former personality, which means he may be able to wrest control of some of his spells. For all we know, given that a zulkir's mind is too difficult to trample, it's likely that while Szass Tam succeeded in transmuting Nevron into a mane, the Zulkir of Conjuration nevertheless was able to keep his mind intact. As I noted previously, even if Szass Tam already tested his spell to be foolproof, his "lab rat" was not Nevron himself and so might work differently on him. |
Every beginning has an end. |
Edited by - Dennis on 20 Oct 2011 08:35:11 |
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Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2011 : 08:00:00
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
Contingencies almost work like wish spells tho. You need to be extremely specific, or the spell may be a perversion of your intent, so you have to keep it simple.
One possible condition of Neveron's contingency: Possess a vessel [a pre-prepared body of a bound fiend/Red Wizard] if my spirit is ripped out from my body. How is that for specific?
Assuming that the disengaged spirit still has a will and can act once it's "ripped out", what contingent spell would you use to accomplish this "possession" act? Contingent spells can be no higher than 6th level if you're using 3E/d20 rules. You'd also need to explain how a "ripped out soul" doesn't cause instant death and transition to the fugue plain.
(And by the way, manes are rendered "nearly mindless" with their transition to the afterlife, dropping to an Int 3 and Wis 3. Even if they had a tiny flash of memory of their former existence, they could not cast spells or act with any real intended will.)
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Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
Edited by - Therise on 20 Oct 2011 08:21:51 |
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2011 : 14:00:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Firestorm
Contingencies almost work like wish spells tho. You need to be extremely specific, or the spell may be a perversion of your intent, so you have to keep it simple.
One possible condition of Neveron's contingency: Possess a vessel [a pre-prepared body of a bound fiend/Red Wizard] if my spirit is ripped out from my body. How is that for specific?
It wasn’t mentioned that his transformation to a mane completely addled his mind/spirit; so it’s still possible that he held vestiges of his former personality, which means he may be able to wrest control of some of his spells. For all we know, given that a zulkir's mind is too difficult to trample, it's likely that while Szass Tam succeeded in transmuting Nevron into a mane, the Zulkir of Conjuration nevertheless was able to keep his mind intact. As I noted previously, even if Szass Tam already tested his spell to be foolproof, his "lab rat" was not Nevron himself and so might work differently on him.
But the thing is, why would anyone have a contingency like that? People can only have 1 or two contingency spells cast upon themselves at a time and unlike Elminster, most people can only have 1 or two triggers to the contingency. I doubt the first thing they think might happen is the most unlikely scenario of their spirit being forcefully ripped out. Most people are going to set their contingencies to things like lethal physical damage.
Second, most of the Zulkir's were largely taxed of their spells by this point from both battling Malark, and then Szass Tam. When taxed, they need to relearn their spells through spellbooks(Well, Wizards do, not sorcerers). He was separated from his body, and thus, his spell components, books, magical items and well, his body. Any spells he had prepared through trigger words left would probably not function due to, well, the specific cadence required since manes can only produce incoherent shrieking babble. If he tried to cast a verbal spell and failed, that spell is immediately lost to him and he must relearn it. Same applies to somatic spells(Spells requiring gestures) if he fails to do the gesture properly he loses the spell, which is very likely given that he is now in a completely different slower bloated little body. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 20 Oct 2011 : 16:09:54
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A wizard can only have one or two contingency spells cast upon themselves at a time? That may be the rule in the games, however, do remember that novels, while they retain a certain semblance of the game rules, do not necessarily adhere to them, and can most definitely scrap the rules in preference to the plot's needs.
I am not saying that what I suggest is exactly the most logical thing that Nevron had done, but it is plausible. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Favorite Zulkir
