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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
 Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 20:48:27
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Aha, well other races might still have physical appeal. The moblins in Legend of Neil are definitely unromantic and unattractive (by human standards) and yet they apparently have certain anatomical advantages.
Half-elves, and to a lesser extent half-orcs (and other halfies) seem to have been adapted into the mainstream and seen as less liminal creatures than before ... so obviously there's less intolerance about unions between their parent races. Of course even a controversial elf-dwarf crossbreed is unlikely to raise many eyebrows in a land peopled by real freaks like tieflings, genasi, and dragonborn. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 20:56:50
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| Not to mention that fact that the only real lore examples I know of with half-elves being looked down at were in Middle-Earth, and Krynn, respectively. Arwen's father disapproved of her staying with Aragorn because she would no longer be immortal. Tanis Half-elven was only frowned on by the (more-so than normal) snooty elves of Krynn, and he was the product of a rape. Arilyn is a possible case, but only with certain elves. Humans didn't care, and the only elves who did were mostly her mother's family- and only because she ran off with a human after she was already estranged from her family. Apparently, the only elves who would give a damn are all in the anti-human hate group. (Or just REALLY closed-minded, but these seem to be less common in Faerun.) |
The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.
"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491
"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs
Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469
My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188
Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u |
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Chosen of Asmodeus
Master of Realmslore
1221 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 20:59:00
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In regards to orcs and goblinoids, have you ever seen the show Spartacus: Blood and Sand? There's a character there, rich roman woman, very attractive, who's got a rather good looking husband. She takes a fancy to the gladiators, and I praphrase;
"My mind turns to baser thoughts. Images of brutish hands being laid upon me in a manner...quite lacking in my husband's touch." |
"Then I saw there was a way to Hell even from the gates of Heaven"
- John Bunyan, Pilgrim's Progress
Fatum Iustum Stultorum. Righteous is the destiny of fools.
The Roleplayer's Gazebo;
http://theroleplayersgazebo.yuku.com/directory#.Ub4hvvlJOAY |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 21:05:20
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I think a lot of the snooty elven hate was sunk with the rest of Evermeet.
Recent D&D (and thus the Realms setting) is far more cosmopolitan now than was old 1E. Half-elves are so blandly unspectacular these days that I wouldn't even be surprised to see them (initially) removed from the list of player races when 5E comes out. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Chosen of Asmodeus
Master of Realmslore
1221 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 21:15:03
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| I know in Warcraft, half-elves were supposed to face a lot of racial prejudice, to the point that some would actually defect from the Alliance to the Horde because it was easier for them to find acceptance among orcs & trolls than among humans and elves. Never really featured because there were literally only two half elves ever shown in the story and they had extremely minor roles. |
"Then I saw there was a way to Hell even from the gates of Heaven"
- John Bunyan, Pilgrim's Progress
Fatum Iustum Stultorum. Righteous is the destiny of fools.
The Roleplayer's Gazebo;
http://theroleplayersgazebo.yuku.com/directory#.Ub4hvvlJOAY |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 21:37:53
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It's a bit ironic, though.
In 1E:
A tiefling walks into a village, her flaming eyes openly defiant of all challengers. The superstitious peasants nervously peer outwards from their shuttered and bolted homes, fervently praying that a hero will come to rid them of this fiend.
A dragonborn walks into a village and demands the village leaders assemble before him. The villagers fearfully approach and offer a tribute of money and virgins, hoping their lives and homes will be spared.
In 4E:
The tiefling warlock and dragonborn paladin form a small party, immediately find the nearest tavern, and announce they're the heros of the story. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 21:51:42
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Read Mary Gentles 'Grunts' years ago. It had a halfling and an orc going at it with no probs. Mind you, the female halfling was the head of a house of ill repute!
Same book has one of my all time favourite orc lines- "Pass me another elf sergeant, this one's split!" |
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Chosen of Asmodeus
Master of Realmslore
1221 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 21:53:49
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More player attitude than anything else; prior edition tieflings could, depending on their characteristics, pass for a full human with a cloak.
These days, a tiefling is going to cause a stir. They apparently face prejudice even in major cities such as Waterdeep(I remember reading something about a tiefling being placed in public office in Waterdeep being considered a major step in civil rights or something).
Dragonborn, having just shown up less than a century ago, are going to cause a stir walking into a village away from where they've established themselves; the North, for instance. I wouldn't be surprised if most people in the Silver Marches have never seen a dragonborn, or if many of them didn't even believe they existed. |
"Then I saw there was a way to Hell even from the gates of Heaven"
- John Bunyan, Pilgrim's Progress
Fatum Iustum Stultorum. Righteous is the destiny of fools.
The Roleplayer's Gazebo;
http://theroleplayersgazebo.yuku.com/directory#.Ub4hvvlJOAY |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 16 Feb 2011 : 22:03:22
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| "But I don't wanna eat dis elf, momma! He's yucky." |
[/Ayrik] |
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Aryalómë
Senior Scribe
USA
666 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 01:04:42
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| I've always had the feelings that Sun Elves and Star Elves (maybe even Wild Elves) were prejudiced against the half hreeds beccause both the Sun and Star Elves were wronged and ad VERY bad relations to humans ad some other races. Plus, like what I said before, they probably want to keep heir blodlines ad gees pure to their race (especially Star Elves because they are low in population) so as to keep tre to themselves. |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 02:33:17
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Welcoming your new dragon overlord and paying regular tribute ain't so bad anyhow. First, the dragon doesn't eat your village (outside of randomly snacking on slow-moving cows and peasants). Second, the dragon actually profits from protecting your village against intruders and competitors, other dragons, and even royal tax collectors. Third, the dragon is a handy way to dispose of awkward virgins.
Why hire an adventuring group to remove the dragon? They disrupt the status quo and as often as not actually incur greater expenses through collateral damage than the dragon does. If they succeed in killing the dragon they create a power vacuum that will eventually be filled by some other economic predation. If they fail in killing the dragon then they were a waste of money, and worse, the dragon is angered.
Given this logic, I think every village should have a dragon overlord. Rather than grumbling and muttering about tribute while fearfully looking skyward they should instead proudly bedeck the streets with dragon emblems, costumes, mascots, and piñatas. They should observe special festival days to celebrate their draconic servitude.
Stupid peasants. |
[/Ayrik] |
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althen artren
Senior Scribe
USA
780 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 03:52:46
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Dragonborn. Imagine the scene in Aliens where the Queen(now picture a dragon) is surrounded by hundreds of
eggs and they start to hatch with sharp claws rocketing out of eggshells. |
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Laerrigan
Learned Scribe
USA
195 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 04:30:26
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Heh, harkening back to the OP so I can chime in behind the times....
Not icky, IMO---my first thought was practicalities (physically speaking) in certain situations. Of course that can be gotten around with magic, if they have access to it. I personally wouldn't think pedophilia at all---it's not like they look anything like kids in terms of proportions/features, they're just smaller than humans. Though I'd imagine there would be those obnoxious onlookers who'd have to have their snicker on the matter of "small = childlike," however contrived. Or perhaps among halflings, obnoxious snickers about "Like 'em BIG, do you?" [weg weg]
I liked "three-quarterling"....but I'm odd like that.  |
"Your 'reality,' sir, is lies and balderdash, and I'm delighted to say that I have no grasp of it whatsoever." (Baron Munchausen)
"If I find in myself a desire which no experience in this world can satisfy, the most probable explanation is that I was not made for this world." (C.S. Lewis, "Surprised by Joy") |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 15:46:50
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I'm right now thinking of a halfling rake who leaves a string of "converts" in his wake. That, I think, would be funny. 
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 17:37:40
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Reminds me of a VERY bad joke about a Leprecaun.
And NO, DON'T PM me - its doesn't work unless in-person (but ask me at a Gencon - so I can add the Irish brogue) 
Amazing a thread about predjudism has gone on for so long without being closed - people, give yourselves a round of applause.
And BTW, ever since I read the very first D&D sourcebook, I have thought that the Halfling fell-in with the 'Half-Elf' and 'Half-Orc', as in it's a 'Half-Ling'. People have just forgotten about the elusive race of 'Ling'. 
Which means that a Halfling is already at least half something else; mostly human, but the original three sub-groups - Tallfellows and Stouts - had some Elf and Dwarf blood (respectively). 'Hairfoots' is just the outcome of a human mating with a very small, furry-legged humanoid (like a faun).
Just my way of looking at it, is all.
Oh... and you know what happens when you mix a Halfling and a Gnome?
KENDER 
And god(s) help us all......  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 17 Feb 2011 17:40:45 |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 20:53:44
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| Kender are vermin. My players tolerate them even less than kobolds. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Arcanus
Senior Scribe
485 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 21:10:10
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| The realms could use some more kender. |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 22:38:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
And BTW, ever since I read the very first D&D sourcebook, I have thought that the Halfling fell-in with the 'Half-Elf' and 'Half-Orc', as in it's a 'Half-Ling'. People have just forgotten about the elusive race of 'Ling'.
If you cross a half-elf and a half-orc, do you come back around to human?
I take as evidence that humans (or other races) can have *some* blood from another race but still be human (i.e. six of the Seven Sisters being about a quarter or less elvish but still considered "human"). So this child would be a quarter elf, a quarter orc, and half human. Would that just be a human (albeit with some interesting heritage)?
But this has NOTHING to do with the topic at hand.
quote:
Amazing a thread about predjudism has gone on for so long without being closed - people, give yourselves a round of applause.
I can put an end to that if you like. I give you . . .
Kobold x human. Icky? Discuss!
Cheers
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Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 22:55:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
Kobold x human. Icky? Discuss!
Once you go scaly, you'll come back for it daily.
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Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 23:06:00
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quote:
Originally posted by Therise
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
Kobold x human. Icky? Discuss!
Once you go scaly, you'll come back for it daily.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 23:45:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Arcanus
The realms could use some more kender.
Huh. I thought the definition of kender was: "a race of creatures varying about 3 ft in height, of which no world needs more."
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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Chosen of Asmodeus
Master of Realmslore
1221 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 23:55:02
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Well, he didn't say they need more, just that they can use more. Which is true.
You can always use more target practice. |
"Then I saw there was a way to Hell even from the gates of Heaven"
- John Bunyan, Pilgrim's Progress
Fatum Iustum Stultorum. Righteous is the destiny of fools.
The Roleplayer's Gazebo;
http://theroleplayersgazebo.yuku.com/directory#.Ub4hvvlJOAY |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4688 Posts |
Posted - 17 Feb 2011 : 23:55:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Therise
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
Kobold x human. Icky? Discuss!
Once you go scaly, you'll come back for it daily.
They only became scaly somewhere between 2nd and 3rd Edition. Dragon-kin, IIRC, appeared in 3.0 or 3.5, before that they were humanoid. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 18 Feb 2011 : 00:11:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
Yup! I'll second that! Kender are just half-gnomelings.....
No, they're more than that. A thorough reading of DRAGONLANCE lore proves that.  |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 18 Feb 2011 : 00:13:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Arcanus
The realms could use some more kender.
Unfortunately, with the individual separation of planar frameworks for each setting, now, the possibilities of new kender finding their way to Realmspace has been heavily reduced.
Of course, that doesn't stop the kender who have already found their way to the Realms, from reproducing. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Therise
Master of Realmslore
1272 Posts |
Posted - 18 Feb 2011 : 01:28:19
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quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
quote:
Originally posted by Therise
quote:
Originally posted by Erik Scott de Bie
Kobold x human. Icky? Discuss!
Once you go scaly, you'll come back for it daily.
They only became scaly somewhere between 2nd and 3rd Edition. Dragon-kin, IIRC, appeared in 3.0 or 3.5, before that they were humanoid.
Actually, in 1974 they were goblinoids.
Then in the 1980s a Dragon article grouped them with humanoids.
Once 3E came out (~1999), they were revamped and became scalykind.
Maybe they get killed so often they're evolving before our eyes! 
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Female, 40-year DM of a homebrew-evolved 1E Realms, including a few added tidbits of 2E and 3E lore; played originally in AD&D, then in Rolemaster. Be a DM for your kids and grandkids, gaming is excellent for families! |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Halfling x Human Romance: Icky? Discuss!
